Goethals Bridge Replacement

[roadman65]

I was noticing on the panynj site that work already has started on the new Goethals Bridge replacement is currently underway and subject for a 2018 completion.  For those of you who saw my earlier posts, you will know that I was skeptical and considered it a project that will never get done until I see it for certain.  Now its official on the panynj website with photos of the piles and clearing just to the south of the existing crossing.

I know longer live in New Jersey, and have not been a resident there for over 24 years, however if I was still there I would be checking out the work being done as I did when the Watchung Reservation section of I-78 took place from 1982 to 1986.  I used to live in Union County, which is where the work is being done here, and where it was done for I-78 as well.  Even when I moved to Fords in Middlesex County, I still was close enough to all the action and even drove over 50 miles one way to see the final I-287 work progress north of Montville.

In addition to wanting to hear the gossip on our end here, I thought this would be a site to chat about the Bridge just as we have threads for the GSP, NJT, and NYT (The Thruway) to that for those roads, why not have one for this bridge. 

Anyway, my reaction to this is not only cool, but amazed that a two roadway structure is being implemented with two dual bridges instead of one wide one.  Also, its about time that bikes and pedestrians are considered as a wide walkway will be built on one of the two spans.  I just hope that they leave room for a future transit line that could be built later on, which I think there is, as I believe I read somewhere that engineers are being proactive on this one.

[Zeffy]

Here's the link for more information on the project: http://www.panynj.gov/bridges-tunnels/goethals-bridge-replacement.html

When I'm traveling into Brooklyn (or Staten Island for that matter), I usually take one of two routes: one is taking I-287 up to the Turnpike and riding that to Exit 13 and hopping on the Goethals Bridge from there. The only bad part about this route is, well, it literally stinks. The second option, is to stay on I-287 and take NJ 440 into NY 440 via the Outerbridge Crossing and continue on from there. However, even though I'd rather avoid I-278's fuckyness for as much as possible, I find it much more convenient to utilize the Goethals and not have to endure the merge of the West Shore and the Staten Island Expressway.

Both of the bridges I believe are very outdated, and the replacement for the Goethals will be a welcomed project for the NJ-NY commuters. The OBX I believe is due for a replacement as well, but I guess they figure the Goethals is used more (being a connector to the Turnpike and such) and went with that first. Either way, I can't wait to see what the new bridge looks like in a few years. Being as I make a decent amount of trips to Brooklyn to meet up with family members I'll see if I can grab pictures of the construction.

[Roadrunner75]

If you want to see some interesting bridge construction, check out the Bayonne Bridge with the raising of the roadway within the existing truss arch.  I occasionally cut through Staten Island as a really expensive traffic bypass of the Turnpike/Hudson Extension, when traveling to and from Jersey City.  I get my bridge fix with the Bayonne construction, as well as the Outerbridge.  Even for occasional travel to NYC via the Verrazano, I usually go with the Outerbridge.  Goethal's reconstruction may change that.  However, they really need a complete overhaul of the Staten Island Expressway as well.

[Pete from Boston]

The current rebuilding of the SIE should be done in the not-too-distant future.  That will be about the right time to start over.

I generally get to Staten Island from here via the NJ Turnpike and Goethals, but if construction slows up traffic, this may make the Verrazano worth another look. 

(I know, stop laughing.  I realize you can't slow stopped traffic further.)

BTW, how did George Washington Goethals's name come to be pronounced differently for the bridge bearing his name?

[roadman65]

 To respond to Zeffy, I believe that both bridges onto Staten Island across the Arthur Kill were not intended for modern interstate freeway traffic.  The Goethals Bridge might of been undivided giving two or three feet more of travel lanes without the jersey wall.  Built long before the interstates it was able to handle the traffic at that particular time.

[J Route Z]

Both bridges opened on the same day, same year..June 29, 1928. Over 85 years old, it's time for a replacement. Wonder which has more traffic, the Outerbridge or Goethals? Well regardless, I am happy to see that the Goethals is being replaced with a much more updated, wider, safer bridge span. Cable-stayed, nonetheless. With Bike/Ped access?! If you travel the Parkway northbound, and you want to get into Staten Island or Brooklyn, it would probably be more convenient to take the Outerbridge. When I heard this project, along with the Bayonne Bridge being raised, and even the Outerbridge getting a deck makeover (which I can't tell if it is finished), and also the Verrazano Bridge deck replacement (http://www.silive.com/news/index.ssf/2014/06/verrazano_bridge_upper_deck_re.html) I am noticing that government agencies are finally coming to their senses.

[SteveG1988]

I think they are both equally used, just the outerbridge is in better shape, or at least could be rehabilitated without much effort. Since more truck traffic uses the goethals bridge (i am thinking on the lines of, the outerbridge is connected via 440 to 287, but mostly is connected to the parkway/9) it is harder to shut down for any sort of remedial action. Plus the thinking may be that  the new Goethals bridge will reduce traffic on the outerbridge, extending the life of that span.

Also, they both see approx 78-80k cars a day. According to wikipedia's cited NY traffic study.

https://www.dot.ny.gov/divisions/engineering/technical-services/hds-respository/Traffic%20Data%20Report%202010%20Appendix%20C%20-%20AADT%20Values%20for%20Select%20Toll%20Facilities.pdf

[lepidopteran]

The current rebuilding of the SIE should be done in the not-too-distant future.  That will be about the right time to start over.

For the record, you know that infamous, never-used 3-tiered T-interchange on the SIE, the one where the Richmond Parkway (now Korean War Vets Pkwy) would have ended?  That was finally demolished about 2 years ago.  Perhaps that was to, ahem, pave the way for reconstruction?

[Pete from Boston]

Actually, some of it was still there a couple of months ago.  The dismantling occurred amid the ongoing, neverending reconstruction of the SIE.   

[Zeffy]

Actually, some of it was still there a couple of months ago.  The dismantling occurred amid the ongoing, neverending reconstruction of the SIE.

Hey, it takes a lot to fix such a clusterfuck that should've been designed properly in the first place.

Also, they both see approx 78-80k cars a day. According to wikipedia's cited NY traffic study.

I could see it. A lot of commuters use both of the bridges if they are trying to get to/from anywhere that isn't Manhattan. Or maybe some of them use them to avoid the traffic on the GWB.

[Alps]

Goethals and Outerbridge may have similar volumes, but I bet you anything Goethals has MUCH heavier truck traffic, what with the ports right there.

[Mergingtraffic]

So if the bridge is being widened to 6-lanes how are they going to phase that into the rest of the highway? Are they going to widen I-278 from the NJ Tpke to the toll plaza?

[NJRoadfan]

The NJ side already widens to 3 lanes with 2 going to the NJTP.

[roadman65]

The eastbound Frontage Road on Staten Island will have to be relocated as well as both a new toll plaza and railroad bridge. 

It will be interesting to see the Turnpike connection.  Hopefully they will smooth out the 180 degree curve from the Goethals Bridge to the NJ Turnpike in the process.

[D-Dey65]

I can't wait to see it on my next trip up north. I may skip the Outerbridge Crossing just to check out the progress of the bridge construction.


UPDATE; December 23, 2014: I saw no evidence of it whatsoever. It was too dark to see as I was going up, and I just didn't see any evidence of it when I was going down in the daylight.

[Alps]

The eastbound Frontage Road on Staten Island will have to be relocated as well as both a new toll plaza and railroad bridge. 

It will be interesting to see the Turnpike connection.  Hopefully they will smooth out the 180 degree curve from the Goethals Bridge to the NJ Turnpike in the process.

There are some minor Turnpike ramp modifications, including (sadly) further elimination of the NJ 81 ramp stubs. A few of the curves are getting smoothed out. Thing is, I'm not sure whether those are part of this contract, or a separate one wholly overseen by the NJTA. I'd hope for the latter, because the PANYNJ being involved would just complicate it.

[Roadrunner75]

Speaking of Goethals Bridge access ramps:
http://www.nj.com/traffic/index.ssf/2014/10/hearing_to_examine_options_to_get_turnpike_and_bri.html#incart_m-rpt-1
This is a no brainer and should have been done long ago.

[Zeffy]

Speaking of Goethals Bridge access ramps:
http://www.nj.com/traffic/index.ssf/2014/10/hearing_to_examine_options_to_get_turnpike_and_bri.html#incart_m-rpt-1
This is a no brainer and should have been done long ago.

Agreed, but it when has NJDOT actually made smart decisions when it comes to building ramps? At least they are being proactive now it seems with construction projects.

[roadman65]

I think they might of been waiting for the never built Union County Expressway to construct those movements. 

However, after being raised by my dad who was a traditional person, he did not mind driving surface streets to make connections between two major routes.  I guess cause his generation was not used to freeways being around and the fact that arterials were much easier to travel due to less amount of cars and traffic lights.  That might of been the logic behind that planning in the late 60's.  Not many would object to cutting through the streets of Bayway to get from the Bridge to US 1 & 9.  Plus considering that going on US 1 & 9 further south and then heading back somewhat as I-278 does not go in straight line from the Goethals Bridge to the interchange with US 1 & 9.  If you look at the map it is a hook being made, while NJ 439 is a straight turn.

Plus WB to NB can also use South Broad Street as well, even with the new planned ramps.   SB to EB cannot use Broad Street because of the typical NJ left turn prohibition at US 1 & 9 and South Broad, so there making the hook would be feasible.

[Pete from Boston]

I think they might of been waiting for the never built Union County Expressway to construct those movements.

That might of been the logic behind that planning in the late 60's.

The might of the locals' opposition might have been to blame for those ramps not already being there.  Catch my drift?

[motorway]

Do the renderings for the new Goethals Bridge look an awful lot like the new Tappan Zee Bridge to anyone else? So much for NYS's insistence that the design of the new TZB be something iconic (or whatever the related term was that they used when they commissioned the design).

Personally, I don't think either one is particularly attractive. Or forward-thinking in terms of incorporating the potential for rail travel over the new spans.

[lepidopteran]

Regarding the access ramps, see also: 
http://www.panynj.gov/bridges-tunnels/goethals-bridge-missing-links.html

As for rail transport, note that there already is access for freight rail.  The Arthur Kill Lift Bridge was rehabilitated several years ago to provide rail service to the Howland Hook Marine Terminal on the island.  (This is that railroad bridge which sits just to the north of the Goethals Bridge.  It was recently painted blue.  Like many movable rail spans, its "default" is in the up position, and is only lowered when a train is coming.  With the rehab, a rail connection was made to the "Chemical Coast" line, those tracks that parallel the NJTP on the NB side.  Originally, the tracks continued to a rail bridge over the Turnpike; the overpass is still there -- it's easy-to-miss among the exit ramps and such -- but I think the trackage is out of service at present.)

[vdeane]

For some reason "iconic" or "signature span" appear to mean "generic cable-stayed bridge" these days.

I like the new ramps.  Should make it easier for roadgeeks who need to clinch I-278.

[Roadrunner75]

As for rail transport, note that there already is access for freight rail.  The Arthur Kill Lift Bridge was rehabilitated several years ago to provide rail service to the Howland Hook Marine Terminal on the island.  (This is that railroad bridge which sits just to the north of the Goethals Bridge.  It was recently painted blue.  Like many movable rail spans, its "default" is in the up position, and is only lowered when a train is coming.  With the rehab, a rail connection was made to the "Chemical Coast" line, those tracks that parallel the NJTP on the NB side.  Originally, the tracks continued to a rail bridge over the Turnpike; the overpass is still there -- it's easy-to-miss among the exit ramps and such -- but I think the trackage is out of service at present.)

I've wondered about that railroad bridge over the Turnpike - You can see bushes/small trees growing on it from below.  I was looking at the aerial recently when looking at the ramps for the Goethals and it looks like that track is definitely out of service if not completely missing tracks entirely across the Turnpike bridge.

[J Route Z]

Any progress?