Potential uses for reserved Light Blue color

Started by Pink Jazz, March 14, 2016, 07:11:53 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Pink Jazz

Currently, the MUTCD specifies two reserved but unassigned colors: Coral and Light Blue.  I don't see Coral being used anytime soon since it can be confused with both Orange and Fluorescent Pink (Coral was one of the original proposals for incident management signs, but the FHWA latter settled on the pinker Fluorescent Pink in the 2003 MUTCD to make them more distinctive from Orange).  However, Light Blue is distinctive enough to warrant its own use (clearly different from the blue used for logo signs).

So, I was wondering, what would be your ideas for potential uses for Light Blue?

One of my ideas for a potential use would be for variable speed limit signs, where the light blue color can give extra emphasis to such signs.

What potential uses does anyone here think?


noelbotevera

I think Coral (rather than Light Blue) could be used for historical monuments. Such as the Bunker Hill memorial, Old North Church, etc. or major Civil War sites and campaigns (Battle of Chancellorsville, Sherman's March to the Sea, etc.).

Light Blue could be used for emergency signs. For example, there's a pileup and thus signs in light blue could say "Crash Site - Do Not Rubberneck". These would be obviously temporary.

Pink Jazz

Quote from: noelbotevera on March 14, 2016, 07:44:54 PM

Light Blue could be used for emergency signs. For example, there's a pileup and thus signs in light blue could say "Crash Site - Do Not Rubberneck". These would be obviously temporary.

That is basically what Fluorescent Pink is for.

Jet380

#3
I guess the next big thing we'll be seeing on the roads will be driverless cars, so perhaps a colour might end up being used for special lanes or other facilities that relate to those.

The only other emerging thing I can think of is electric cars - as they become more mainstream a colour could be used to denote charging stations etc?

Also, in Australia a special colour scheme is used for directional signage to make it clear when a toll applies:


It's such an assault on the eyes that you can't miss that you're about to enter a tollway! Perhaps a new reserved colour could be used in the USA for a similar purpose.

Brian556

I have always thought that signs that are for truck drivers only should have a unique color so that drivers of private vehicles know that they don't need to pay attention to them. I have always had purple in mind for these, however.

This includes:
Clearance
Truck Route
No Trucks
Weight Limit

That's a lot of signs that private vehicle drivers have to look at unnecessarily.

Pete from Boston


Quote from: noelbotevera on March 14, 2016, 07:44:54 PM
I think Coral (rather than Light Blue) could be used for historical monuments. Such as the Bunker Hill memorial, Old North Church, etc. or major Civil War sites and campaigns (Battle of Chancellorsville, Sherman's March to the Sea, etc.).

Brown is already in use for tourist attractions.  Getting so specific as to the nature of the attraction's significance is beyond a road sign's calling.

paulthemapguy

Coral, light blue, and purple were used to distinguish different types of tolling lanes at toll booths.  Signs with banners in these three colors were used on Illinois tollways to indicate different lanes for different payment options, when electronic express tolling was more of an option than a perceived necessity.  This was common around, say, 2000-05.  A google search turned up this image:
http://c8.alamy.com/comp/AJMJF6/toll-boothschicago-illinois-usa-directional-signs-for-traffic-flow-AJMJF6.jpg

The three payment options were

-Manual (interact with a human)--------Coral
-Automatic (throw coins in a basket)----Purple
-Electronic I-Pass/EZ-Pass----------------Light Blue

Perhaps something in an old MUTCD from the early 2000s might show this?
Avatar is the last interesting highway I clinched.
My website! http://www.paulacrossamerica.com Now featuring all of Ohio!
My USA Shield Gallery https://flic.kr/s/aHsmHwJRZk
TM Clinches https://bit.ly/2UwRs4O

National collection status: 361/425. Only 64 route markers remain

Pink Jazz

I'm not sure if Coral will ever be used, since it can be confused with both Orange and Fluorescent Pink.  After all, Coral was originally supposed to be the color for Incident Management, but after numerous tests, the FHWA found that the pinker shade of Fluorescent Pink was more effective than Coral for such application, leaving Coral unassigned.  This means that Coral is largely a remnant of an earlier proposal.

jeffandnicole

Quote from: paulthemapguy on March 15, 2016, 10:30:07 AM
Coral, light blue, and purple were used to distinguish different types of tolling lanes at toll booths.  Signs with banners in these three colors were used on Illinois tollways to indicate different lanes for different payment options, when electronic express tolling was more of an option than a perceived necessity.  This was common around, say, 2000-05.  A google search turned up this image:
http://c8.alamy.com/comp/AJMJF6/toll-boothschicago-illinois-usa-directional-signs-for-traffic-flow-AJMJF6.jpg

The three payment options were

-Manual (interact with a human)--------Coral
-Automatic (throw coins in a basket)----Purple
-Electronic I-Pass/EZ-Pass----------------Light Blue

Perhaps something in an old MUTCD from the early 2000s might show this?

The Garden State Parkway in NJ uses Red for Cash & Receipts, Blue for Exact Change, and Green for EZ Pass (with the white on purple EZ Pass logo).

Electronic tolling was in its infancy prior to 2000, and even within the 2003 MUTCD a color had not been chosen yet.

The colors any toll agency used prior to 2009 were simply colors the toll agency or state DOT preferred to use, as there was no standard at the time.  While today Purple is the sign color for electronic tolling, there's still no standardized color for cash, mixed mode and exact change lanes.  White lettering on a green background (typical BGS) and black lettering on a white background are commonly used for the various payment methods. 

authenticroadgeek

Light Blue should be the custom signs, such as "$750 fine for littering" or "Welcome to Alanland". Coral should be the color of non-crucial road work signs (lane shifts) and leave the complete abominations (such as what's going on between Utah County and Salt Lake county) for the orange signs.

roadfro

I think light blue could be used for general informational signs–some of what's currently in Chapter 2H of the national MUTCD. Currently, these types of signs use a mix of green and blue, but they're not really guide signs or motorist service signs. I'm thinking of "non-essential" signs, which could just as simply not be posted and wouldn't have adverse impact on road operations. So things like:
  • state/county/city line
  • river crossing
  • mountain summits/passes
  • memorial designations
  • the "Signals Set For xx MPH" sign
  • "Sponsor A Highway" signs
  • other miscellaneous information signs, such as a time zone crossing
  • possibly mileposts (although a case can be made to leave these green)
Roadfro - AARoads Pacific Southwest moderator since 2010, Nevada roadgeek since 1983.

Pink Jazz

#11
Quote from: roadfro on March 20, 2016, 03:12:13 PM
I think light blue could be used for general informational signs—some of what's currently in Chapter 2H of the national MUTCD. Currently, these types of signs use a mix of green and blue, but they're not really guide signs or motorist service signs. I'm thinking of "non-essential" signs, which could just as simply not be posted and wouldn't have adverse impact on road operations. So things like:
  • state/county/city line
  • river crossing
  • mountain summits/passes
  • memorial designations
  • the "Signals Set For xx MPH" sign
  • "Sponsor A Highway" signs
  • other miscellaneous information signs, such as a time zone crossing
  • possibly mileposts (although a case can be made to leave these green)
The first three seem to be guide signs, as well as the time zone crossings and mileposts, since they aid in letting a driver know where they are, thus green is perfectly appropriate for such signs.  I would think that white (or black with white text) would actually be more appropriate for Signals Set For xx MPH signs. 

However, there is really no standardized color for Adopt/Sponsor A Highway signs.  Blue seems to be the most widely used color for such signs, even though they are not service signs, however, green, brown, and white are also in use by some DOTs.  Perhaps this may be a potential use for Light Blue if there is ever a need to standardize the color of such signs.  This could potentially be useful for DOTs that place a logo of the sponsor on such signs (such as Arizona) to make them clearly distinguishable from logo service signs from a distance (even though logo signs are much larger).

roadfro

Quote from: Pink Jazz on March 20, 2016, 07:39:13 PM
Quote from: roadfro on March 20, 2016, 03:12:13 PM
I think light blue could be used for general informational signs–some of what's currently in Chapter 2H of the national MUTCD. Currently, these types of signs use a mix of green and blue, but they're not really guide signs or motorist service signs. I'm thinking of "non-essential" signs, which could just as simply not be posted and wouldn't have adverse impact on road operations. So things like:
  • state/county/city line
  • river crossing
  • mountain summits/passes
  • memorial designations
  • the "Signals Set For xx MPH" sign
  • "Sponsor A Highway" signs
  • other miscellaneous information signs, such as a time zone crossing
  • possibly mileposts (although a case can be made to leave these green)
The first three seem to be guide signs, as well as the time zone crossings and mileposts, since they aid in letting a driver know where they are, thus green is perfectly appropriate for such signs.  I would think that white (or black with white text) would actually be more appropriate for Signals Set For xx MPH signs. 

However, there is really no standardized color for Adopt/Sponsor A Highway signs.  Blue seems to be the most widely used color for such signs, even though they are not service signs, however, green, brown, and white are also in use by some DOTs.  Perhaps this may be a potential use for Light Blue if there is ever a need to standardize the color of such signs.  This could potentially be useful for DOTs that place a logo of the sponsor on such signs (such as Arizona) to make them clearly distinguishable from logo service signs from a distance (even though logo signs are much larger).

You can argue it either way. A state/county/city line sign or a river/summit sign might let a driver know where they are, but do they really aid in navigation? Time zone crossing is not something that aids in navigation, but just information that the driver may need to adjust his watch.

Signal speed sign isn't regulatory, it's informational. So black on white or white on black isn't necessarily the right scheme.

While the MUTCD doesn't specify the color or design of the sponsored highway signs, the examples it shows use blue backgrounds.
Roadfro - AARoads Pacific Southwest moderator since 2010, Nevada roadgeek since 1983.

realjd

Quote from: Jet380 on March 14, 2016, 11:30:16 PM
I guess the next big thing we'll be seeing on the roads will be driverless cars, so perhaps a colour might end up being used for special lanes or other facilities that relate to those.

The only other emerging thing I can think of is electric cars - as they become more mainstream a colour could be used to denote charging stations etc?

Also, in Australia a special colour scheme is used for directional signage to make it clear when a toll applies:


It's such an assault on the eyes that you can't miss that you're about to enter a tollway! Perhaps a new reserved colour could be used in the USA for a similar purpose.

Like this? Houston at one point (maybe still does) uses purple guide signs for toll roads.



That purple color has been standardized as the color for cashless tolls in the US. I haven't seen it used on guide signs outside of Houston though. Most of the places I see it use it for the transponder lanes at toll booths, or as a backdrop to the transponder logo, like this:


Pink Jazz

Quote from: roadfro on March 22, 2016, 02:40:09 AM

Time zone crossing is not something that aids in navigation, but just information that the driver may need to adjust his watch.


What about yellow then?  Yellow signs are advisory, and crossing a time zone would advise the driver to change his watch.

spooky

Quote from: Pink Jazz on March 22, 2016, 03:22:51 PM
Quote from: roadfro on March 22, 2016, 02:40:09 AM

Time zone crossing is not something that aids in navigation, but just information that the driver may need to adjust his watch.


What about yellow then?  Yellow signs are advisory, and crossing a time zone would advise the driver to change his watch.

Yellow signs are warning, not advisory.

CNGL-Leudimin

I would make light blue the color for freeway/expressway-related signage, leaving current green for regular roads/highways. Here in Europe we do that way, different colors for freeways and regular roads.
Supporter of the construction of several running gags, including I-366 with a speed limit of 85 mph (137 km/h) and the Hypotenuse.

Please note that I may mention "invalid" FM channels, i.e. ending in an even number or down to 87.5. These are valid in Europe.

vdeane

Quebec used it back in the day to distinguish toll roads, similar to how ON 407 is now, but their current toll bridges use normal signage.  Ontario also uses it for the express/collector system on ON 401
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

roadfro

Quote from: spooky on March 22, 2016, 03:30:31 PM
Quote from: Pink Jazz on March 22, 2016, 03:22:51 PM
Quote from: roadfro on March 22, 2016, 02:40:09 AM

Time zone crossing is not something that aids in navigation, but just information that the driver may need to adjust his watch.


What about yellow then?  Yellow signs are advisory, and crossing a time zone would advise the driver to change his watch.

Yellow signs are warning, not advisory.
And the yellow is meant to warm of a particular road condition (alignment, intersection, ped crossing, stop ahead, etc). Time zone change does not fall in to this.
Roadfro - AARoads Pacific Southwest moderator since 2010, Nevada roadgeek since 1983.

MisterSG1

Quote from: roadfro on March 22, 2016, 02:40:09 AM
Quote from: Pink Jazz on March 20, 2016, 07:39:13 PM
Quote from: roadfro on March 20, 2016, 03:12:13 PM
I think light blue could be used for general informational signs–some of what's currently in Chapter 2H of the national MUTCD. Currently, these types of signs use a mix of green and blue, but they're not really guide signs or motorist service signs. I'm thinking of "non-essential" signs, which could just as simply not be posted and wouldn't have adverse impact on road operations. So things like:
  • state/county/city line
  • river crossing
  • mountain summits/passes
  • memorial designations
  • the "Signals Set For xx MPH" sign
  • "Sponsor A Highway" signs
  • other miscellaneous information signs, such as a time zone crossing
  • possibly mileposts (although a case can be made to leave these green)
The first three seem to be guide signs, as well as the time zone crossings and mileposts, since they aid in letting a driver know where they are, thus green is perfectly appropriate for such signs.  I would think that white (or black with white text) would actually be more appropriate for Signals Set For xx MPH signs. 

However, there is really no standardized color for Adopt/Sponsor A Highway signs.  Blue seems to be the most widely used color for such signs, even though they are not service signs, however, green, brown, and white are also in use by some DOTs.  Perhaps this may be a potential use for Light Blue if there is ever a need to standardize the color of such signs.  This could potentially be useful for DOTs that place a logo of the sponsor on such signs (such as Arizona) to make them clearly distinguishable from logo service signs from a distance (even though logo signs are much larger).

You can argue it either way. A state/county/city line sign or a river/summit sign might let a driver know where they are, but do they really aid in navigation? Time zone crossing is not something that aids in navigation, but just information that the driver may need to adjust his watch.

Signal speed sign isn't regulatory, it's informational. So black on white or white on black isn't necessarily the right scheme.

While the MUTCD doesn't specify the color or design of the sponsored highway signs, the examples it shows use blue backgrounds.

This is interesting, I never thought of it that way, but signs at county/city lines here in Ontario are indeed blue, and that is a question, is there a need for such a sign to be green? As it's not really guidance in that sense, just letting you know you are in a new city or county:



One could argue that this sign could be green as this also shows a bit of guidance as well, for instance, the MUTCD equivalent of this sign should be:

"Brampton Next 7 Exits"



This is a simple county line, or in this case region line sign.



Now you could easily say that this sign should be green, as this sign is definitely guidance in my opinion.

But anyways, let's get to the point, the Coral Blue sign could be used in lieu the way the yellow on blue signs are used in Ontario. They are used here for Safety Messages, such as this example on the Gardiner Expressway:



Quote from: vdeane on March 23, 2016, 12:48:18 PM
Quebec used it back in the day to distinguish toll roads, similar to how ON 407 is now, but their current toll bridges use normal signage.  Ontario also uses it for the express/collector system on ON 401

You forgot about the express/collector system on ON 427, ON 400, ON 403, ON 404, and the Gardiner Expressway  :D Those ones, even the 404 example use blue signs despite how short it is.

The only thing really unusual about Quebec signage is that they don't use exit tabs, but rather the exit number appears on the BGS on a yellow trapezoid.

vdeane

Quote from: MisterSG1 on March 24, 2016, 08:27:15 PM
You forgot about the express/collector system on ON 427, ON 400, ON 403, ON 404, and the Gardiner Expressway  :D Those ones, even the 404 example use blue signs despite how short it is.
I don't recall those roads having express/collector systems.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

MisterSG1

Quote from: vdeane on March 24, 2016, 11:10:35 PM
Quote from: MisterSG1 on March 24, 2016, 08:27:15 PM
You forgot about the express/collector system on ON 427, ON 400, ON 403, ON 404, and the Gardiner Expressway  :D Those ones, even the 404 example use blue signs despite how short it is.
I don't recall those roads having express/collector systems.

In my video that I took a few days ago, I ride the 427 and Gardiner downtown, at 4:30 you can see the point where the 427 Collector Lanes exist (Highway 27 becomes the 427 Collectors south of the 401) and at 4:45 you can see my "bounce" over to the 427 collectors just for the hell of it, similarly you can see at 5:40, the Gardiner Collectors with blue signs, I of course stay in the core lanes in this case.



Here is one on ON 403:



The one on ON 404, notice the HOV signs as well:



The one on ON 400, there is blue signage in the express for the 407ETR as you can see:


Dustin DeWinn

I think Coral will be used for some sort of warning or alert. Perhaps it will replace Detour (for emergency situations) to differentiate it from construction.

The color is so close to others used in this type of signaling. They're all in the same family


Or maybe this. I don't know what it's called...its a kind of detour in see in North Carolina when you have to go over the median during construction. It's different than regular orange construction signs



Had to make a bad mockup in paint, sorry.

Pink Jazz

Quote from: Dustin DeWinn on June 20, 2017, 04:22:05 PM
I think Coral will be used for some sort of warning or alert. Perhaps it will replace Detour (for emergency situations) to differentiate it from construction.


Had to make a bad mockup in paint, sorry.

I really don't think Coral will ever be used.  It was originally supposed to be used for Incident Management, however, Fluorescent Pink was found to be more effective.  Since Coral is too similar to other MUTCD-approved colors, there really isn't a use case where it would be effective.  It is just a remnant of an old proposal that the FHWA is simply hanging onto for some unknown reason.

mapman1071




Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.