United Airlines Pilot kicks girl with autism and her family off the flight

[roadman65]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3075752/It-s-fear-autism-Fellow-passenger-says-SUPPORTS-plane-decision-kick-little-girl-family-United-refuse-apologize-mother-calls-action.

It looks like a personal fear of a pilot constitutes an emergency landing while in flight at an off scheduled airport.  This one here over a 15 year old's refusal to eat cold airline food to prematurely land the plane in Salt Lake rather then continue on to Portland.  Yes she ranted some, but was it enough to be afraid of?

[jakeroot]

Pilot's ultimately have complete control of their vessel. If he felt that she was a threat (her parents said she might start "scratch[ing]" passengers), then by all means he has complete authority to remove her from the flight. Pilot's can even tell federal marshals to take a hike.

[roadman65]

However, the mom had it under control as she bought another meal for her daughter.

[jakeroot]

However, the mom had it under control as she bought another meal for her daughter.

Well, the pilot disagreed, and he has 100% say in where the plane goes. I will concede that he may have over-reacted, but an under-reaction resulting in the injury of a passenger would have worse consequences.

[NE2]

If I become a pilot I'll make sure no hepcats get to fly.

[SP Cook]

Pilot: 100% right.

[vdeane]

Pilot: 100% wrong
This is just another instance on someone being discriminated against because they're not "normal".  It has to stop.  Simply giving this girl a hot meal, as would be the common sense, decent, and moral thing to do, would have prevented the problem in the first place.  But then most people are too rigid to think of that, aren't they?  They just sit back in the cushy lives and fear/hate anyone different from them.

[formulanone]

What a sack of mishandled crap.

There wasn't much need for parents to request a flight attendant to cater exclusively to a 15-year-old of any stripe. Buy your own hot food at the airport, and don't "threaten" the staff with your, or anyone else's actions. And sending the staff to some sort of "autism training class" is kind of absurd, since there's not one type of autism - that's like saying they have to keep any possible thing in the plane in case of an outburst.

Landing the plane over a really minor (and stupid) misunderstanding costs the airline a bunch of time, money for  rescheduling the other passengers who might have missed their connections.

[Billy F 1988]

Ooooh. This one's a bit chewy for me. I myself am autistic, I had this diagnosis since around age 2. What you have here in my point of view as a 27 year old autistic adult is really some bad apples! Should the autistic girl not have behaved the way she did resulting in getting kicked off the plane? Oh, absolutely. But, I am not excusing the actions of the pilot, nor United Airlines. And yes. As formulanone aptly points out, it is a sack of mishandled crap that needs to stop. I just think this is a load of bunk. This kind of "entitlement" society we live in is the kind of society that's killing off what's most important. I mean, what the heck was the big deal about anyway? Sure, the girl is autistic, and I am autistic. But just because you have this diagnosis of autism or altruism doesn't excuse the bad behavior exhibited by all parties. Other passengers are now pissed that they didn't make their connections, they miss their meetings, they miss their other activities they planned on doing after supposedly making their original connection, which they didn't, all this happening thanks to the girl misbehaving on the plane! Dude, no! No! No! No! you don't act like a fool on the plane threatening the staff or hitting fellow passengers who are trying to enjoy a nice flight to their next destination! Good grief! Wouldn't it have been better if they took a bus? Oh, wait. No, because they'd probably have the same problem with that likewise with the plane. Man. I even took a few plane rides with Horizon Airlines and I NEVER acted a fool unlike the girl. I'm sorry. I going with the majority saying this is just stupid. The family of the autistic girl needs to do a better job parenting her. They're letting her get her way (or not, in this case) and are not showing some form of disciplinary restraint. Now I'm not advocating slapping the girl silly to the point of bruising, oh hell no! What I am point out is show some doggone restraint on your girl! Shit! Teach her what is not acceptable and what is! Good grief! Did she not get the memo in elementary school?! I don't know. Like I said, just nothing but a bunch of bad apples in the wrong place at the wrong time for the wrong reasons. I'm actually embarrassed as an autistic adult that something like that had to happen and this girl has the same condition I have and is doing that! That's just shameful in my opinion.

[NE2]

I'm kicking Billy out of this thread for too many exclamation points.

[Billy F 1988]

Wait, what?

[oscar]

ISTM that what the mother said, about her daughter's "scratching" people if she didn't get her away, is what escalated the situation. Had the mother not gone overboard to wheedle hot food from first class for her daughter, but rather just told her daughter "hey, we're in steerage, that hot food you're smelling is a perk reserved for first-class, so you can't have it", the daughter might've just sullenly put up with the cold food her parents brought, with no drama.

What would've happened if the flight had no food service at all, and the only hot food on board was brought by other passengers?

[jeffandnicole]

If the parents knew that the one thing to calm the daughter down would be hot food, why didn't they bring it on board in the first place?  I doubt there's anyone that thinks they get a hot meal in coach anymore.  The one time I was able to upgrade to First Class, there was 12 seats.  There were 12 meals.  There was no extra.  So the fact that they were able to find a meal for this person probably was fortunate luck that First Class wasn't filled.

It certainly seemed like mom had plenty of time to record her daughter though.

As far as other passengers 'supporting' this family and daughter (Inside Edition had a story that said the same thing); that seemed to be an exaggeration as well.  On IE, the 'supporting passengers' were recording the family leaving the plane, and stated "Oh, that's going to be a lawsuit".  Not sure how that is supporting the family.  No one else on the plane seemed to be saying anything that could be translated as supporting the family as well.

[empirestate]

As usual, I can't really begin to debate the merits of this case because I can't get beyond the journalism. There's not enough information in the article, and too much in the headline, to know whether the pilot acted appropriately. We don't know if and when he ever even knew the girl had autism, so we can't know whether he was discriminating on that basis. And so forth.

Like the article about the Times Square billboards being removed (they're not), this is just a write-up of uninvolved people's opinions about something, not what actually happened. The news these days is little more than a YouTube comments thread with a credential.

[roadman65]

Yes, the media exaggerates for either profit or political reasons.  They do not go beyond the headline which is why people judge so fast especially when it comes to the events between the cops and those who die in their hands.   The media puts a headline in the news and we prematurely react to the situation not knowing all the facts.

Another headline that people reacted to was that of George Zimmerman getting shot at yesterday!  People thought that it was Zimmerman again at it, before the facts came out that Zimmeran was the victim this time that I will bet that some still have not heard the truth and spreading around false information.

That is why I never got involved in that ordeal with Trevon Martin  a few years back as I felt it should be up to the prosecuters to take care of it, and the same with Casey Anthony.  I feel that if the media never got involved in either ordeal to offer their commentary on the subjects, maybe better justice would have been served.

[freebrickproductions]

Our media is all about sensationalism though. I was watching CNN in a restaurant a couple days ago when the tornadoes were hitting Oklahoma, and CNN was giving much more airtime to "deflategate" (which probably harmed literally no-one) than the tornadoes (which were actively injuring and killing people).

[Pete from Boston]

The news these days is little more than a YouTube comments thread with a credential.

Well put.

[SP Cook]

If you bring your mentally handicapped teenager on an airplane, or in any other such context, and she scratched me, you knowing that she lacked the ability to refrain from doing so, I am going to sue you and ask that enough $$ to teach you to conform to the basic rules of society. 

Memo:  Parents.  You drew a short straw.  I'm sorry for you.  You have a child that cannot ride public transportation.  I'm sorry.  I wish her illness, like all illnesses, could be cured.  I wish ice cream were free and baseball was played 365 days a year in 60 degree weather.  It isn't.   Have some basic courtesy.

[roadman65]

Absolutely frederick, the media focuses on the stories they know that will get a response from their audience then what really needs to report.  A tornado which is killing people, is not something that people gossip about so they only report the facts real fast, and move on where a case like whether or not Tom Brady should be punished for deflating a football, which hurts no one physically is being played out right now as well because they know people love to gossip about heroes as that keeps their audience glued to the set.

[Pete from Boston]

If you bring your mentally handicapped teenager on an airplane, or in any other such context, and she scratched me, you knowing that she lacked the ability to refrain from doing so, I am going to sue you and ask that enough $$ to teach you to conform to the basic rules of society. 

Memo:  Parents.  You drew a short straw.  I'm sorry for you.  You have a child that cannot ride public transportation.  I'm sorry.  I wish her illness, like all illnesses, could be cured.  I wish ice cream were free and baseball was played 365 days a year in 60 degree weather.  It isn't.   Have some basic courtesy.

(Never mind that federal law requiring that places of public accommodation make provision for people of disability, nor that simple decency that dictates those with the "long straw" bend a little or a lot for those with the short.)

People of disability used to be shut out of quite a lot of society because "able" people were inconvenienced by them.  "Able" people have fortunately been learning to get over their feeling of entitlement to quiet, pleasant comfort free of the sounds, the smells, and the sights of those who aren't as lucky.  Most, anyway. 

The girl probably wasn't going to scratch people, and if there was a simple way to avoid that, it should have been exercised.  Any organization where customer care was a real priority would take that approach, by extending extra care to those who need more.  But we're dealing with an airline versus someone who's apparently not a Valued Starways Alliance Affiliate Club Rewards Member.  So humanity be damned, Charlie in aisle 8 is trying to quietly enjoy his final issue of SkyMall and he's entitled to the illusion that this is what matters.

[formulanone]

I get that airline tickets are expensive, schedules are less than perfect, parking is an additional fee, lines are long at major airports, security is a nuisance, waiting is no fun, confusion of an unfamiliar place is nerve-wracking, and every convienence comes with a price tag (some by repeating the above seemingly ad infinitum). But common courtesy comes into play because everyone else has to deal with those same hurdles as well; you're a special snowflake...just like everyone else.

[jeffandnicole]

(Never mind that federal law requiring that places of public accommodation make ***REASONABLE*** provision for people of disability...)

Usually, we're talking about requirements that allows a person to be in the same area as everyone else.  Wheelchair ramps, elevators, doorways, crossing the street, etc.  I doubt that making sure hot food is available is what this had in mind.  In fact, an actual requirement would probably be the opposite - making sure cold food is available so someone doesn't scald themselves.

The parents apparently tried to encourage the child to eat a hot meal beforehand but she didn't want to eat. 

If the parent had made a phone call to the airline prior to the flight and mentioned the circumstances, reasonable accommodations could have been put in place.  And maybe taking a hot meal to go (asking the restaurant to heat up the meal she didn't eat probably would've been fine) may have worked out.  But waiting until you're on the plane to ask for favors - especially those that aren't provided to anyone else in the coach section of the plane - is a bit over the boundary of a reasonable accommodation.

[NE2]

Don't feed the Sippy Kook.

[corco]

(Never mind that federal law requiring that places of public accommodation make ***REASONABLE*** provision for people of disability...)

Usually, we're talking about requirements that allows a person to be in the same area as everyone else.  Wheelchair ramps, elevators, doorways, crossing the street, etc.  I doubt that making sure hot food is available is what this had in mind.  In fact, an actual requirement would probably be the opposite - making sure cold food is available so someone doesn't scald themselves.

The parents apparently tried to encourage the child to eat a hot meal beforehand but she didn't want to eat. 

If the parent had made a phone call to the airline prior to the flight and mentioned the circumstances, reasonable accommodations could have been put in place.  And maybe taking a hot meal to go (asking the restaurant to heat up the meal she didn't eat probably would've been fine) may have worked out.  But waiting until you're on the plane to ask for favors - especially those that aren't provided to anyone else in the coach section of the plane - is a bit over the boundary of a reasonable accommodation.

This is exactly right, in my mind. I'm all for allowing reasonable accommodations to make it easier for disabled folks to fly, but those need to be declared in advance. If you want a wheelchair at the gate, you request that in advance. This is no different.

A hot meal could potentially be a reasonable accommodation, though I would want to see documentation from a doctor (that specifically states hot meal as opposed to just meal) before providing one at cost, otherwise a cold meal with a reasonable service charge like those usually available for fee on longer flights would probably be acceptable. I would also want to see that the flight is more than a couple hours long, so that the parents couldn't reasonably bring one themselves.

As far as how the situation was handled, I'd agree both parties did poorly.

The mother off the child said ‘How about we wait for her to have a meltdown, she’ll be crying and trying to scratch in frustration. I don’t want her to get to that point."

That is a threat. You absolutely do not threaten the physical harm of anyone on an airplane - that is a no-brainer. Frankly, if i were the airline i would say i booted the mother off the plane for threatening the flight crew, not the kid. From what I can see, that looks accurate, and if that is the case, I think it's justified and support the pilot.

That being said, if they were able to be ethically rebooked into another carrier, an emergency landing was probably overkill. There's no reason why you'd be fit  to fly on Airline A but not Airline B- if an emergency landing for behavior is warranted, you shouldn't be allowed to get on another plane! You should pretty much be banned from flying immediately at that point. The fact that they were able to get on another plane the same day makes me concerned that the initial landing was unnecessary. Alternatively, it was an excessive form of accommodation- she wanted hot food so the pilot took her somewhere with hot food. I hope she got a hot meal to her liking in Salt Lake.

[Pete from Boston]

But waiting until you're on the plane to ask for favors - especially those that aren't provided to anyone else in the coach section of the plane - is a bit over the boundary of a reasonable accommodation.

I understand what you're getting at, but first of all no kid should be punished for having lousy parents, and secondly no person born with inherent disadvantages like this autistic girl should be forced to subordinate to others' supposed right to convenience because of it. This to me is common decency, something that should trump even the ADA.  When I read people's interpretation of courtesy being to keep the difficult autistic kid off the plane, it strikes me as a really messed-up way to organize the hierarchy of needs in society.