News:

Thank you for your patience during the Forum downtime while we upgraded the software. Welcome back and see this thread for some new features and other changes to the forum.

Main Menu

New York State Thruway

Started by Zeffy, September 22, 2014, 12:00:32 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

amroad17

Quote from: upstatenyroads on May 08, 2017, 05:41:39 PM
Quote from: amroad17 on May 08, 2017, 03:15:35 PM
Also notice the NY 332 shield is not in Series F?  :nod:

That's the new design as of the adoption of the 2009 MUTCD. New York standardized the appearance of the NYS Route Marker on guide panels so they are a much closer resemblance to what you find along roadways. They also standardized the route marker so that they are much closer in appearance, regardless of who installed it. Before then, state route markers could vary quite a bit in appearance depending on who or what company manufactured the sign.
That is great to hear!
I don't need a GPS.  I AM the GPS! (for family and friends)


empirestate

Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 12, 2016, 12:38:26 PM
Quote from: Buffaboy on August 12, 2016, 01:51:35 AM
If upstate still had a solid manufacturing base, it could function as the BARGE canal.

I once heard (might have been at TRB) that the New York State canal system does carry some freight traffic, though I do not know how much.

Apropos to this otherwise-mummified side thread:
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/2017/05/02/new-genesee-beer-tanks-coming-via-erie-canal/101229898/

Buffaboy

Quote from: empirestate on May 10, 2017, 08:43:51 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 12, 2016, 12:38:26 PM
Quote from: Buffaboy on August 12, 2016, 01:51:35 AM
If upstate still had a solid manufacturing base, it could function as the BARGE canal.

I once heard (might have been at TRB) that the New York State canal system does carry some freight traffic, though I do not know how much.

Apropos to this otherwise-mummified side thread:
http://www.democratandchronicle.com/story/news/2017/05/02/new-genesee-beer-tanks-coming-via-erie-canal/101229898/

Well that's quite interesting.
What's not to like about highways and bridges, intersections and interchanges, rails and planes?

My Wikipedia county SVG maps: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Buffaboy

cl94

Yeah, the Erie Canal will be seeing quite a bit of additional traffic in the coming years. GE will be using it to ship turbines from the Schenectady plant to the Port of Albany. Things are too big for standard trucks or railcars and it's a lot easier to just use a barge.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)

cl94

Quote from: webny99 on May 11, 2017, 11:10:16 PM
Not sure if this has been discussed in this thread, but what are your thoughts on 6-laning the thruway, or at least portions of it?
It seems to be getting more and more impossible to travel at a consistent speed on weekends, and don't even mention holiday weekends  :banghead:
At least from Buffalo to I490 would be nice, but can't speak for downstate...

Nothing at this time that I know of. Issue is funding. Tappan Zee and a few upcoming major bridge projects (that have been needed for 15-20+ years) are taking everything and Cuomo won't let NYSTA raise tolls to generate funds. Widening is in the long-range plans, but that'll require stable funding and the failing bridges to be fixed.

And as far as out here, the Thruway could use an extra lane in each direction south/east of Exit 25. Backups are disturbingly common in Ulster County.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)

kalvado

Quote from: webny99 on May 11, 2017, 11:10:16 PM
Not sure if this has been discussed in this thread, but what are your thoughts on 6-laning the thruway, or at least portions of it?
It seems to be getting more and more impossible to travel at a consistent speed on weekends, and don't even mention holiday weekends  :banghead:
At least from Buffalo to I490 would be nice, but can't speak for downstate...
Well, 23 to 24 was widened a few years ago. was a long and expensive project - I believe old highway was removed down to dirt and rebuilt from there.

seicer

Quote from: cl94 on May 11, 2017, 11:37:22 PM
Quote from: webny99 on May 11, 2017, 11:10:16 PM
Not sure if this has been discussed in this thread, but what are your thoughts on 6-laning the thruway, or at least portions of it?
It seems to be getting more and more impossible to travel at a consistent speed on weekends, and don't even mention holiday weekends  :banghead:
At least from Buffalo to I490 would be nice, but can't speak for downstate...

Nothing at this time that I know of. Issue is funding. Tappan Zee and a few upcoming major bridge projects (that have been needed for 15-20+ years) are taking everything and Cuomo won't let NYSTA raise tolls to generate funds. Widening is in the long-range plans, but that'll require stable funding and the failing bridges to be fixed.

And as far as out here, the Thruway could use an extra lane in each direction south/east of Exit 25. Backups are disturbingly common in Ulster County.

I had the (un)fortunate pleasure of driving the Thruway from Exit 42 west to Buffalo and it was just jam-packed with traffic. I could rarely get above 70 MPH as trucks frequently clogged the left lane, going no more than 60 to 65 MPH, causing very extensive queueing. The Rochester area provided a bit of relief when it became six lanes but still.

froggie

QuoteI could rarely get above 70 MPH

By the book, you're not supposed to.

Most of the weekend issues I've noted on the Thruway are south of Kingston.  But you don't typically spend tens or hundreds of millions of dollars just for an occasional weekend problem....it's just not cost effective.  That said, that segment is amongst a few where I could potentially see widening at some point in the future, after NYSTA gets their finances back in order as cl94 alluded to.

I may do a more detailed analysis at some point (like I did for I-95 SC/NC/VA), but a quick look at traffic and truck volumes suggests these locations as future Thruway widening candidates:

- Exit 50 (I-290) to Exit 49
- Exit 44 to Exit 43
- Exit 23 (I-787) to Exit 21A (Berkshire Spur)
- Exit 19 (NY 28) to Exit 16 (Harriman)

Based strictly on traffic volumes, top priority should go to these segments, in order:  1)  50 to 49; 2) Harriman to Newburgh; 3) Berkshire Spur to I-787.

seicer

This was a weekday. And if you think the 85th percentile is 65 MPH or less... then you lie in the bed of those revenue cops. There is no rationale why it can't be 75 MPH.

froggie

Well aware of what 85th percentile is.  I also know that it isn't the end-all-be-all that some of you think it is.  Furthermore, my earlier comment was in reference to the fact that you legally shouldn't be going more than 65 MPH.  What we all think the limit should be (and yes, I'd agree with something above 65) is moot in a legal sense.

seicer

Thanks, mom!

I'll be sure to stop doing all of the other illicit activities in my life, too.

Duke87

With regards to widening, the segment from exits 11-14A might even be a higher candidate. It's six lanes currently, but could stand to be eight.

16-19 can be a bit crowded, but for the most part it remains at free flow speeds except sometimes on weekends. 11-14A has daily congestion during evening rush hour. And once the new Tappan Zee opens, that section will become the new choke point.
If you always take the same road, you will never see anything new.

cl94

Quote from: Duke87 on May 12, 2017, 08:47:36 PM
16-19 can be a bit crowded, but for the most part it remains at free flow speeds except sometimes on weekends.

Disagree. There's a major slowdown somewhere in Ulster County a few times a week. I've yet to figure out a pattern here, but I'm always getting stuck in something, usually near New Paltz. I'm fine with crowded, I'm not fine with traffic moving 50-55 if I could be doing the same speed for free.

11-14A definitely needs to be widened regardless. That's a nightmare.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)

cpzilliacus

Quote from: froggie on May 12, 2017, 11:09:27 AM
I may do a more detailed analysis at some point (like I did for I-95 SC/NC/VA), but a quick look at traffic and truck volumes suggests these locations as future Thruway widening candidates:

- Exit 50 (I-290) to Exit 49
- Exit 44 to Exit 43
- Exit 23 (I-787) to Exit 21A (Berkshire Spur)
- Exit 19 (NY 28) to Exit 16 (Harriman)

Based strictly on traffic volumes, top priority should go to these segments, in order:  1)  50 to 49; 2) Harriman to Newburgh; 3) Berkshire Spur to I-787.

I don't know what percentage of Thruway traffic is "turnpike doubles" (a tractor pulling two 48' (not 53') trailers), but while their drivers do tend to stay in the right lane, they also impact traffic perhaps more than "normal" tractor-trailer combinations.

Harriman to Newburgh seems to have a lot of recurring congestion, in part because the six-lane non-ticket system becomes the four-lane ticket system at Harriman, and queues southbound can be rather long in part because of cash toll collection (this may cease to be a problem if NYSTA decides to go all-AET in the future). 

But if the Thruway is going to keep collecting cash, then there's a need to make that barrier-separated lane for E-ZPass patrons much longer.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

RobbieL2415

Quote from: cpzilliacus on June 13, 2017, 03:22:37 PM
Quote from: froggie on May 12, 2017, 11:09:27 AM
I may do a more detailed analysis at some point (like I did for I-95 SC/NC/VA), but a quick look at traffic and truck volumes suggests these locations as future Thruway widening candidates:

- Exit 50 (I-290) to Exit 49
- Exit 44 to Exit 43
- Exit 23 (I-787) to Exit 21A (Berkshire Spur)
- Exit 19 (NY 28) to Exit 16 (Harriman)

Based strictly on traffic volumes, top priority should go to these segments, in order:  1)  50 to 49; 2) Harriman to Newburgh; 3) Berkshire Spur to I-787.

I don't know what percentage of Thruway traffic is "turnpike doubles" (a tractor pulling two 48' (not 53') trailers), but while their drivers do tend to stay in the right lane, they also impact traffic perhaps more than "normal" tractor-trailer combinations.

Harriman to Newburgh seems to have a lot of recurring congestion, in part because the six-lane non-ticket system becomes the four-lane ticket system at Harriman, and queues southbound can be rather long in part because of cash toll collection (this may cease to be a problem if NYSTA decides to go all-AET in the future). 

But if the Thruway is going to keep collecting cash, then there's a need to make that barrier-separated lane for E-ZPass patrons much longer.
Or, if you're coming from east of the Hudson, use the Taconic and the Berkshire extension, the "back way", if you will.

vdeane

I read an article a few weeks ago that said the Thruway was having discussions about eventually converting everything, ticket system included, to AET, but there's nothing concrete except next year's conversion of the Harriman barrier.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Buffaboy

Newer, wider and taller gantries are being installed between NY-33 and I-290. The signs and hardware are located against the base of the I-290 to I-90W ramp.

Meanwhile the sound barrier is going up. That whole little stretch looks like the NJ Turnpike in the northern part of that state. I'd like to see that setup from Lackawanna to Williamsville.

With respect to widening, it's been like 15 years since the Thruway was widened from Exit 54 and Exit 53. I'd have to imagine they're planjing to do it between both toll barriers at some point in the future.
What's not to like about highways and bridges, intersections and interchanges, rails and planes?

My Wikipedia county SVG maps: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Buffaboy

Flyer78

http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2017/06/effort_to_make_thruway_free_for_syracuse_commuters_gains_traction_with_ny_state.html#incart_river_home

Quote
DeFrancisco's bill creates a commuter pass for drivers traveling on exits between 34A and 39 on the New York State Thruway. The price of that pass would be only as much as the administrative costs to issue it. The Thruway Authority could, however, charge a higher fee if it demonstrates "significant" loss of revenue.

A review of publicly available data showed the bill could cost the Thruway Authority as much as $1.2 million per year -- a small fraction of the $658 million it collected in tolls in 2014, the most recent year for which data is available.

This is a slight variation on an idea I've heard most of my life (approaching 40 years). I guess this setup would let longer-distance travelers continue to pay a toll, and would seem to be a variation of the Thruway's Annual Permit plan.

kalvado

Quote from: Flyer78 on June 16, 2017, 09:35:21 AM
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2017/06/effort_to_make_thruway_free_for_syracuse_commuters_gains_traction_with_ny_state.html#incart_river_home

Quote
DeFrancisco's bill creates a commuter pass for drivers traveling on exits between 34A and 39 on the New York State Thruway. The price of that pass would be only as much as the administrative costs to issue it. The Thruway Authority could, however, charge a higher fee if it demonstrates "significant" loss of revenue.

A review of publicly available data showed the bill could cost the Thruway Authority as much as $1.2 million per year -- a small fraction of the $658 million it collected in tolls in 2014, the most recent year for which data is available.

This is a slight variation on an idea I've heard most of my life (approaching 40 years). I guess this setup would let longer-distance travelers continue to pay a toll, and would seem to be a variation of the Thruway's Annual Permit plan.
I don't know Syracuse specifics, but my impression was that wait at toll booth - at least slowing down - is a bigger issue than cost of commuter pass. Especially at highway to highway interchanges , and there are 3 within the area if i remember correctly..

Next step would be Thruway asking for a share of federal/NYSDOT dollars to compensate for the free rides, since those are supposed to be paid by gas tax anyway...

Buffaboy

We know the South Grand Island bridges need to be replaced sometime in the future. Will they maintain the same 93-foot clearance that exists today, or will it likely be something closer to the surface?
What's not to like about highways and bridges, intersections and interchanges, rails and planes?

My Wikipedia county SVG maps: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Buffaboy

okc1

Quote from: Buffaboy on June 20, 2017, 01:22:21 AM
We know the South Grand Island bridges need to be replaced sometime in the future. Will they maintain the same 93-foot clearance that exists today, or will it likely be something closer to the surface?
What clearance is under the Peace Bridge?  Shouldn't have to be more than that.
Steve Reynolds
Midwest City OK
Native of Southern Erie Co, NY

Alps

Quote from: Buffaboy on June 20, 2017, 01:22:21 AM
We know the South Grand Island bridges need to be replaced sometime in the future. Will they maintain the same 93-foot clearance that exists today, or will it likely be something closer to the surface?
I wouldn't be surprised if those bridges can be maintained for another 50 years. They're not used THAT heavily, especially by large trucks, and there is an increasing trend of maintaining over replacing in the Northeast. (Goethals and Tappan Zee are used heavily, Bayonne is not, for example.)

cl94

Quote from: Alps on June 20, 2017, 07:16:30 PM
Quote from: Buffaboy on June 20, 2017, 01:22:21 AM
We know the South Grand Island bridges need to be replaced sometime in the future. Will they maintain the same 93-foot clearance that exists today, or will it likely be something closer to the surface?
I wouldn't be surprised if those bridges can be maintained for another 50 years. They're not used THAT heavily, especially by large trucks, and there is an increasing trend of maintaining over replacing in the Northeast. (Goethals and Tappan Zee are used heavily, Bayonne is not, for example.)

I have heard rumblings that NYSTA wants to replace those. They're on the MPO's medium-range plan.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)

Rothman

Wasn't there a major rehab on a couple of the Grand Island Bridges, say, seven years ago or so?  I thought they did a band-aid so the replacement could be delayed.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

cl94

Quote from: Rothman on June 20, 2017, 10:04:07 PM
Wasn't there a major rehab on a couple of the Grand Island Bridges, say, seven years ago or so?  I thought they did a band-aid so the replacement could be delayed.

They've been redecking them for a few years. People in the know I have spoken with said that they'd still like to have a replacement within 15-20 years.
Please note: All posts represent my personal opinions and do not represent those of my employer or any of its partner agencies.

Travel Mapping (updated weekly)



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.