Unnecessary control cities

[dvferyance]

Why do they us Coeur d Alene ID as a control city for I-90? Just use Spokane makes far more sense. Way bigger and only 40 miles farther anyways. I also think the use of St Cloud MN on I-94 doesn't make sense either. I would just use Fargo. Any other examples of control cities being used but probably shouldn't.

[froggie]

Assuming you meant "unnecessary" in the title.  As for the two cities you cite, both are over 50K population and are major regional centers.  I see nothing wrong with using them.

[dvferyance]

Assuming you meant "unnecessary" in the title.  As for the two cities you cite, both are over 50K population and are major regional centers.  I see nothing wrong with using them.

Ok your entitled to your opinion that's perfectly fine. There is no right answer or wrong answer I just wanted to discuss how any one felt about control cities they personally thought should not be used.

[SSOWorld]

Why do they us Coeur d Alene ID as a control city for I-90? Just use Spokane makes far more sense. Way bigger and only 40 miles farther anyways. I also think the use of St Cloud MN on I-94 doesn't make sense either. I would just use Fargo. Any other examples of control cities being used but probably shouldn't.

The way states set up control cities goes beyond the minimums that FHWA declares on its documents.  Illinois uses categories when it comes to this - primary and secondary.  Primary ones are listed on through placards and freeway junctions while secondary ones are listed on signs directing to the freeway from local roads.  Other states use next major city - definition of major is a matter of perspective.

[-NCX75-]

"Denton" on I-35E and I-35W in the Dallas area; it's a moderately big city and regional center, yes, but the fact that Oklahoma City is not mentioned until the very edge of the metroplex is ... strange.

[Brandon]

"Denton" on I-35E and I-35W in the Dallas area; it's a moderately big city and regional center, yes, but the fact that Oklahoma City is not mentioned until the very edge of the metroplex is ... strange.

Denton is where the two come together.  It makes sense in that context.

[kphoger]

"Denton" on I-35E and I-35W in the Dallas area; it's a moderately big city and regional center, yes, but the fact that Oklahoma City is not mentioned until the very edge of the metroplex is ... strange.

I agree.

[roadman65]

Fort Collins on I-25 in Denver always bothered me as you have Cheyenne just a little further.

Then Easton, PA now on I-78 instead of Allentown which is PA's third largest city and Easton, although a good sized city, is not nowhere near it in population.  Its left over from when US 22 was the main route between the states as the US highway crossed the state border there and actually goes through its center.  I-78 does not even go near its core.

Mahwah on I-287 in NJ is one that should use Suffern for or even Albany, NY.  One is a place where two interstates meet and the other is the first major city on another joining interstate.

Many of us here, although not exactly me, consider New York in Maryland on I-95 to be totally unnecessary as Wilmington or Philadelphia could be either or both used instead.

[inkyatari]

The ultimate..

I-180, Hennepin IL

[hbelkins]

West Virginia's have always bugged me. Huntington, Charleston, Beckley and Morgantown all make plenty of sense, as they are either large cities or interstate junctions (or both). But Parkersburg, Clarksburg, Fairmont, Lewisburg and Bluefield are, to me, nonsensical in the bigger scheme of things. I-77 north at Charleston should be Cambridge, Oh. (intersection of I-70) and south at Bluefield should be Wytheville, Va. (intersection of I-81). I-64 east at Beckley should be Lexington, Va. (intersection of I-81) if not Richmond, which is listed as a supplemental (as is Charlotte for I-77 where the routes split). I-79 north at Charleston should be Morgantown (intersection of I-68).

[Brandon]

The ultimate..

I-180, Hennepin IL

Where else does it go?  You could use Peoria, but I-180 makes that annoying turn to the east to cross the Illinois River and end in.....Hennepin.

[SSOWorld]

When I-39 was signed in WI, the Cascade split had its control cities changed to Wausau and Merrimac. The first is I-39's north end, the second is for WIS-78 SB.  Portage and Stevens Point were posted on a secondary sign saying use Exit 108B.  Word has it Portage officials bitched about it since Portage was the original cc when it was signed as WIS-78 NB (US-51 doesn't go to I-90/94 at Portage).  Compromise?  Add Portage to the lane sign nearly making the down arrow fall off California style.  At 39's north end, they kept Point when 39 was added, but (appropriately) also added Madison.

Portage's size doesn't justify their name as a control point.

For 3-way interchanges, WisDOT has listed a local point and a major city.  For WIS-29's expressway, the west end uses Chippewa Falls (nearby) and Green Bay (major city - though didn't they forget Wausau????), the East end uses Wausau (no Shawano though).  This seems true for most part if the local destination had been there already.  in Wausau, the 29-West interchange added Chippewa Falls to an already existing Abbotsford (no room before since 52 had been connected previously before the reconstruction.)  The 29-East is a bit different, since the village of Weston is new (late 90s) but it got it's name placed on the signs.  The collective signage has Chippewa Falls and Green Bay as the two cities.

[jp the roadgeek]

Using Netcong and Delaware Water Gap as control "cities" west of Paterson on I-80 is unnecessary.  While I-80 doesn't pass directly through them, using Morristown from Paterson to I-287, and Scranton/Wilkes Barre from I-287 to I-380, and Williamsport west of I-380 makes more sense.  PA should just use Scranton/Wilkes Barre from I-180 to I-81, and New York east of I-81 (Stroudsburg is way too small). New Jersey should use Paterson from the Delaware River east.

[PHLBOS]

Then Easton, PA now on I-78 instead of Allentown which is PA's third largest city and Easton, although a good sized city, is not nowhere near it in population.  Its left over from when US 22 was the main route between the states as the US highway crossed the state border there and actually goes through its center.  I-78 does not even go near its core.

  I just did a quick check on GSV and I-78 eastbound is signed for Allentown up to and including the PA 100 interchange (Exit 49).  East of the Lehigh Valley, most of the I-78 westbound signage either reads Pennsylvania or Penna for short or Phillipsburg.

[Chris]

Poland signs the remote focal point on its highways. In case of highways reaching a border, they sign the border town along the entire length of a route. So that means Jędrzychowice, a village with a population of 670, is signed across the country from hundreds of miles away...



In the other direction, they sign Korczowa, population 660, located at the Ukrainian border.

[1995hoo]

Benson and Dunn in North Carolina. I get it, they'd rather sign the I-40/95 junction and so just used the two nearest towns, but they're weak.

[inkyatari]

The ultimate..

I-180, Hennepin IL

Where else does it go?  You could use Peoria, but I-180 makes that annoying turn to the east to cross the Illinois River and end in.....Hennepin.

Point taken, but I guess my comment is more about the semi-unnecessary state of the highway in general.  I am aware of the iron mill / defense contractor history of the highway.

[CNGL-Leudimin]

Poland signs the remote focal point on its highways. In case of highways reaching a border, they sign the border town along the entire length of a route. So that means Jędrzychowice, a village with a population of 670, is signed across the country from hundreds of miles away...

In the other direction, they sign Korczowa, population 660, located at the Ukrainian border.

I remember a photo with a sign of Korczowa 654 (406 for most forumers here) near Jedrzychowice or whatever is written. But the record-holders are the ends of DK8, Budzisko (at the Lithuanian border) and Kudowa-Slone (at the Czech one), there are signs over 800 km (500 miles) away!

[kphoger]

Poland signs the remote focal point on its highways. In case of highways reaching a border, they sign the border town along the entire length of a route. So that means Jędrzychowice, a village with a population of 670, is signed across the country from hundreds of miles away...

Yes, but mileage signs are a different beast from control cities.  Is Jędrzychowice used on any guide signs at junctions any farther east than Gliwice?  I can't find any on GSV.  That is to say, it isn't used as a control city until less than 200 miles from the border, at which point it's reasonable to think more motorists would want guidance to the German border (although I still probably wouldn't use it until west of Wrocław).

[dfwmapper]

Why do they us Coeur d Alene ID as a control city for I-90? Just use Spokane makes far more sense. Way bigger and only 40 miles farther anyways. I also think the use of St Cloud MN on I-94 doesn't make sense either. I would just use Fargo. Any other examples of control cities being used but probably shouldn't.

Coeur d'Alene is there because "US 95" isn't a city.

I-10 in much of the southwest is pretty bad. California's "other Desert Cities", New Mexico's Lordsburg and Deming, and Texas's Fort Stockton (and random use of even more meaningless towns like Ozona and Sonora) are all terrible. Arizona is not included here since they do it properly, using only LA, Phoenix, Tucson, and El Paso.

[LM117]

At the split of US-70/US-70 Bypass (Future I-42) east of Goldsboro in NC, "TO La Grange" is used for westbound US-70 while Goldsboro is used for US-70 Bypass. Using La Grange is stupid because when you reach that split going westbound, you had already passed La Grange and it's NC-903 interchange. Goldsboro should be used for US-70 since it actually goes through Goldsboro and Smithfield should take Goldsboro's place on the US-70 Bypass sign.



Goldsboro should also be used on the sign for US-70 West here since La Grange is east of this point.

[1995hoo]

Why do they us Coeur d Alene ID as a control city for I-90? Just use Spokane makes far more sense. Way bigger and only 40 miles farther anyways. I also think the use of St Cloud MN on I-94 doesn't make sense either. I would just use Fargo. Any other examples of control cities being used but probably shouldn't.

Coeur d'Alene is there because "US 95" isn't a city.

I-10 in much of the southwest is pretty bad. California's "other Desert Cities", New Mexico's Lordsburg and Deming, and Texas's Fort Stockton (and random use of even more meaningless towns like Ozona and Sonora) are all terrible. Arizona is not included here since they do it properly, using only LA, Phoenix, Tucson, and El Paso.

I've seen several things over the years referring to "the other Desert Cities" in reference to various other "cities" located in the general region around Indio, so maybe that sign isn't as stupid as it seems to most of us if it's a recognized expression out there?

[roadman65]

Then Easton, PA now on I-78 instead of Allentown which is PA's third largest city and Easton, although a good sized city, is not nowhere near it in population.  Its left over from when US 22 was the main route between the states as the US highway crossed the state border there and actually goes through its center.  I-78 does not even go near its core.

  I just did a quick check on GSV and I-78 eastbound is signed for Allentown up to and including the PA 100 interchange (Exit 49).  East of the Lehigh Valley, most of the I-78 westbound signage either reads Pennsylvania or Penna for short or Phillipsburg.

I was referring to it in New Jersey.  Yes PennDOT has "Allentown" from I-81 all the way to PA 100.  For years NJDOT did not use Easton at all until the mid 1990's on I-287's updated signs.  Sure a few existed on the 1986 opened Watchung Reservation stretch as one is on CR 527 in Summit and the other on Diamond Hill Road SB in Berkley Heights, but that was it as most ramps to I-78 never used control cities at all.  NJ 31 always, and still has from last visit, used Phillipsburg.

The 1990 opening of I-78 into PA from NJ yes uses Penna for the control city for whatever reason.  So its really more mixed up than using Easton over Allentown.

Anyway, from I-287 it should be now Allentown or revert back to Clinton as it was before 1994 circa.  Clinton and Phillipsburg I have no quarrels with, but in Union County the Easton signs should be changed to "Clinton" and those annoying "Springfield" signs on the Garden State Parkway should be either Clinton or heck  even use Allentown from there.

[dfwmapper]

I've seen several things over the years referring to "the other Desert Cities" in reference to various other "cities" located in the general region around Indio, so maybe that sign isn't as stupid as it seems to most of us if it's a recognized expression out there?

The region is primarily referred to as the Coachella Valley, or if you're in LA, "the desert". I've never heard the phrase "other desert cities" used in any context that isn't a reference to the signs. In any case, it doesn't start appearing as a control city until the CA 111 exit in Palm Springs, and it comes beneath Indio on the sign, so whatever the "other" cities are, they would have to be beyond Indio.

[PHLBOS]

For years NJDOT did not use Easton at all until the mid 1990's on I-287's updated signs.  Sure a few existed on the 1986 opened Watchung Reservation stretch as one is on CR 527 in Summit and the other on Diamond Hill Road SB in Berkley Heights, but that was it as most ramps to I-78 never used control cities at all.  NJ 31 always, and still has from last visit, used Phillipsburg.

The 1990 opening of I-78 into PA from NJ yes uses Penna for the control city for whatever reason.  So its really more mixed up than using Easton over Allentown.

Anyway, from I-287 it should be now Allentown or revert back to Clinton as it was before 1994 circa.  Clinton and Phillipsburg I have no quarrels with, but in Union County the Easton signs should be changed to "Clinton" and those annoying "Springfield" signs on the Garden State Parkway should be either Clinton or heck  even use Allentown from there.

Interestingly, while the I-78 westbound ramp signage from I-287 list Easton, Pa; the pull-through BGS along I-78 westbound at the same interchange lists Phillipsburg (assuming the BGS wasn't changed since the last GSV).