Rename Denali Nat'l Park for Pres. McKinley?

Started by oscar, September 19, 2015, 09:49:02 AM

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empirestate

Quote from: roadman65 on September 28, 2015, 12:23:08 AM
JFK probably was a good man, no doubt as his life span was before mine, so I was not around to witness his term in office.  However, I am just asking why some people get named for things with absolutely no influence on us.

Understood. My point, simply, is that I think few people would argue that JFK (or MLK) was such a person. He had undeniable influence over–"importance to" is probably a better phrase–the entire country.

Quote from: davewiecking on September 28, 2015, 12:32:35 AM
Bobby Kennedy was a Senator from New York at the time of his assassination, and prior to that was a prosecutor in District Court in Brooklyn. That being said, it is a bit odd that the Triborough Bridge was named for him 40 years after his assassination.

Yes, it's the timing that's odd in RFK's case. Of course, I wasn't around when he was a NY senator, but I imagine it was similar to how Clinton was a NY senator: she had no particular roots in the state and wasn't anyone you'd ever consider to be an authoritative mouthpiece for the state's interests.


hbelkins

And to be bipartisan, there's a crapload of stuff named after Ronald Reagan in areas where he never visited and had no particular influence. I don't know, for example, why the new road from the AA Highway to KY 8 in Lewis County, built to access an industrial park, is named after him.


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

SD Mapman

Quote from: 1995hoo on September 20, 2015, 03:06:02 PM
I don't mind if it's part of a naming theme–for example, a series of streets all named after presidents, or naming schools after former governors of the state where the schools are located, etc. Of course, off the top of my head I can't think of anyplace that uses either of those particular themes!
Pierre uses the presidents on the eastern side of town... but then no one really thinks of Pierre of off the top of their head either.
The traveler sees what he sees, the tourist sees what he has come to see. - G.K. Chesterton

Pete from Boston

I didn't know it had been forgotten that Robert Kennedy was a senator from New York.  Isn't this why they named the bridge after him during the Time When All Crossings Suddenly Needed Persons' Names?

Regarding the fame of either Kennedy or MLK versus that of a William McKinley, fame and notoriety were different by the 1960s from how things were in 1900.  These folks were on TV.  People knew their faces, mannerisms, and personalities.  When it was talked about that their deaths were like losing members of one's family, this was a concept that didn't exist in McKinley's day because almost no citizen had that intimate familiarity with McKinley.

We have much more emotional attachment to people we will never know today.

oscar

Quote from: hbelkins on September 28, 2015, 03:51:09 PM
And to be bipartisan, there's a crapload of stuff named after Ronald Reagan in areas where he never visited and had no particular influence. I don't know, for example, why the new road from the AA Highway to KY 8 in Lewis County, built to access an industrial park, is named after him.

There was an organized campaign, after Reagan's death, to get something (respectable) named for him in every U.S. county. That might explain some of the more random renames. 

Good luck with that in Hawaii's five counties, which name hardly anything for mainlanders, except military facilities are sometimes named for admirals or generals.
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empirestate


Quote from: hbelkins on September 28, 2015, 03:51:09 PM
And to be bipartisan, there's a crapload of stuff named after Ronald Reagan in areas where he never visited and had no particular influence. I don't know, for example, why the new road from the AA Highway to KY 8 in Lewis County, built to access an industrial park, is named after him.

I was actually thinking of this last night: was Reagan as admired in his time as he is now? During his presidency, I only remember him being an object of ridicule (or at least teasing), but then again, I was a kid, for whom everything's worthy of ridicule or else we don't notice it. :-D

Anybody who was an adult at the time have a different recollection?


iPhone

realjd

Quote from: roadman65 on September 28, 2015, 12:23:08 AM
JFK probably was a good man, no doubt as his life span was before mine, so I was not around to witness his term in office.  However, I am just asking why some people get named for things with absolutely no influence on us. Correct we should feel free to choose whomever we pick, and that is not what I am mad about nor I am not even mad at the mountain, the bridge, the airport, or whatever comes along with it.

Was JFK a good man? It depends on your definition. He was a great president and really did work hard for the American people. He would have done great things for our country had he not been killed IMO. On the other hand, he was a drug addicted womanizer who makes Bill Clinton look like a saint when it comes to his sex life. He certainly wasn't a good husband.

The point is that people are complicated on both sides. Regardless of political views, people will be people. Good presidents can be bad people (JFK) and good people can be bad presidents (Carter).

jakeroot

Quote from: empirestate on September 28, 2015, 11:01:12 PM
Anybody who was an adult at the time have a different recollection?

My mother grew up as a military brat during the 80s. She consistently ranks Reagan as her favorite president. If I'm not mistaken, this was because of how well Reagan funded the military. She moved houses every year growing up (she has no friends from school except college) and his services made those moves easier for her and her family.

Rothman

Quote from: empirestate on September 28, 2015, 11:01:12 PM

Quote from: hbelkins on September 28, 2015, 03:51:09 PM
And to be bipartisan, there's a crapload of stuff named after Ronald Reagan in areas where he never visited and had no particular influence. I don't know, for example, why the new road from the AA Highway to KY 8 in Lewis County, built to access an industrial park, is named after him.

I was actually thinking of this last night: was Reagan as admired in his time as he is now? During his presidency, I only remember him being an object of ridicule (or at least teasing), but then again, I was a kid, for whom everything's worthy of ridicule or else we don't notice it. :-D

Anybody who was an adult at the time have a different recollection?


iPhone

I do, even though I was in bluer-than-blue Massachusetts during his term. 

Remember that Reagan was re-elected in a landslide and, despite perhaps being doddering more behind the scenes, he was excellent at preparing for photo ops and public appearances, as well as his PR victory at Reykjavik (although some historians claim Gorbachev outwitted Reagan to the point where Reagan's aides had to rein him him before he agreed to nuclear arms cuts more severe than were politically feasible).

Anyway, although he certainly had his detractors, my perspective was that he was indeed quite popular.

Of course, the real fun thing about the time was the democratic majority in Congress!
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

mrsman

Quote from: oscar on September 19, 2015, 08:11:05 PM
Bring back the $500 bill, with Pres. McKinley's face on it (but with a more creative reverse, please).

On the back, there should be picture of the Denali mountain.

kkt

RFK was a Senator from NY, but more important when he was Attorney General in JFK's administration he fought many civil rights cases in the courts - desegregating the schools etc.  The Surpreme's Brown vs. Topeka Board of Education had been on the books for a decade, but largely ignored until he started bringing the cases.

RFK's death was just after he won the California primary leading up to the 1968 election.  Winning California made his nomination extremely likely and with a charismatic candidate like him he would probably have won the presidency in 1968.  It's not much of a stretch to think he would have done a better job than Nixon.

hbelkins

Quote from: oscar on September 28, 2015, 05:11:24 PM
Quote from: hbelkins on September 28, 2015, 03:51:09 PM
And to be bipartisan, there's a crapload of stuff named after Ronald Reagan in areas where he never visited and had no particular influence. I don't know, for example, why the new road from the AA Highway to KY 8 in Lewis County, built to access an industrial park, is named after him.

There was an organized campaign, after Reagan's death, to get something (respectable) named for him in every U.S. county. That might explain some of the more random renames. 

They haven't been terribly successful in Kentucky. I can't think of a whole lot of things that are named for him, even in Republican counties in the old 5th Congressional District.

The first public appearance Richard Nixon made after his resignation from the presidency was in Hyden, Ky. (Leslie County) where the new high school gym and local civic/activity center was named after him. Nixon attended the dedication ceremony. I remember the story about why the gym was named for him, but can't recall it off the top of my head. It's probably available online somewhere.


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

Pete from Boston

Nixon moved into a very elite suburb in New Jersey in the 1980s.  I remember seeing his photo in a lot of local businesses.  He grew into this sort of grandfatherly presence in the area, with people even taking their kids trick-or-treating over there.  This was probably the best his post-presidency reputation ever was, and not even they named anything after him.

Scott5114

The reason why so much random stuff is named after JFK/RFK and William McKinley is actually pretty much the same. All three of them were assassinated, and the country reacted to the sudden shock of losing a leader by naming stuff after the deceased. The wheels started turning on getting JFK on the half-dollar hours after his death.
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empirestate

Quote from: Scott5114 on October 03, 2015, 04:53:30 AM
The reason why so much random stuff is named after JFK/RFK and William McKinley is actually pretty much the same. All three of them were assassinated, and the country reacted to the sudden shock of losing a leader by naming stuff after the deceased. The wheels started turning on getting JFK on the half-dollar hours after his death.

Well, the mountain was first named for McKinley before he was even elected, and I can't think of a spate of other renamings for him after his assassination. So I'm not sure that theory's as true for McKinley as it is for the Kennedys. (I also can't think of much named for Garfield.)



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