Interstate 11

[roadfro]

(blink) I've never seen proposed alignments on Google Maps before. I-11 is shown only at close zoom levels.

Are any other proposed routes shown like this?

The future alignment of the final phase of the I-580/Carson City Bypass has been shown on Google Maps for some time.
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.1214915,-119.7657081,17z

[707]

With all this argument over numbers, just renumber I-15 from Vegas to San Diego as I-11 and make the new Interstate I-15. Problem solved.

[Billy F 1988]

I really don't know a whole lot about Interstate 11's projected path. What's the current highway between Las Vegas and San Diego? Is that I-40?

[TheStranger]

What's the current highway between Las Vegas and San Diego?

Interstate 15 (ever since it was extended to San Diego, from its old south terminus in Colton, in 1969).

[Brandon]

With all this argument over numbers, just renumber I-15 from Vegas to San Diego as I-11 and make the new Interstate I-15. Problem solved.

Then extend it over I-19 (concurrent with I-10), and I-15 finally makes it to the Mexican border.

[KG909]

With all this argument over numbers, just renumber I-15 from Vegas to San Diego as I-11 and make the new Interstate I-15. Problem solved.

It would be super costly and San Diego / Inland Empire is bigger than Phoenix / Tucson areas, so the main route (I-15) will go there.

[NE2]

Then extend it over I-19 (concurrent with I-10), and I-15 finally makes it to the Mexican border.

If your aim is making I-15 go to Mexico rather than an actual worthy goal, it's easier to take it down I-805 and overlap it the final 1/2 mile on I-5. I don't think I-19 quite makes it to the border anyway (but it does officially extend beyond the at-grade with West Street).

[andy3175]

Article on the completion of the Arizona I-11 Study on Oct 22, 2014:

http://www.eacourier.com/news/interstate-and-intermountain-west-corridor-study-now-complete/article_a01c09e6-5996-11e4-8347-23b6c80bdd3f.html

More than two years ago, Arizona and Nevada set out on a study to determine the possibilities and benefits of developing a new interstate corridor to connect Phoenix and Las Vegas, while extending south to Mexico and north through Nevada, potentially reaching as far as Canada. The goal of the study was not just to find a way to directly connect these two major metropolitan areas by building a new highway, but to develop a plan and the necessary infrastructure to position the two states for broader success in the global marketplace. The Interstate 11 and Intermountain West Corridor Study is now complete and points to the need for a new multimodal freight corridor and a manufacturing belt that will drive trade, commerce, job growth and economic development for the two states and facilitate strong connections to other major regional markets.

Friday, the state Transportation Board reviewed and accepted the recommendations documented in the Corridor Concept Report, the final element in this initial two-year feasibility study. This report, along with all the study's documents and information, can be found at i11study.com.

The recommended I-11 corridor would likely follow U.S. Highway 93, from the Hoover Dam Bypass Bridge south to Wickenburg, running west of the Phoenix metropolitan area, and then generally following I-10 and I-19 through southern Arizona to the Mexican border. I-11 is envisioned as a continuous high-capacity trade corridor, extending from Nogales to Las Vegas and potentially north toward Canada, that will support a high proportion of large-scale manufacturing operations located throughout the corridor, with a major focus on reliable movement of freight traffic. As a multimodal corridor, it also has the potential to include freight and passenger rail, energy transmission and other high-tech facilities. There is currently no schedule or funding to build Interstate 11. The next phase of the study process – the environmental impact statement – is also not funded

[andy3175]

The Interstate 11 study is linked from http://i11study.com/wp/ and can be found directly at http://i11study.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/I-11CCR_Report_2014-11-05.pdf or http://issuu.com/danders4/docs/i-11ccr_report_2014-11-05/0. The report calls for an interim I-11 and a full build out I-11. The interim corridor does not specify Interstate standards as much as continuous four-lane divided highway:

In whole, the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor has the potential to be over 530 miles long between the southern Arizona border and the Las Vegas Metropolitan Area–and double that length to the northern Nevada border. A phased implementation strategy is required to achieve the full build condition that fulfills the vision of a multimodal I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor.
- The "Interim Corridor"  assumes implementation of targeted improvements to create a continuous 4-lane divided highway from Nogales to Las Vegas. The goal of implementing this interim condition is to facilitate trade movements between Mexico, Arizona, and Nevada — until such a time as the ultimate trade corridor is deemed needed (as depicted in Figure 7 on page 19).
- The "Full Build Corridor"  completes build-out of a multimodal transportation corridor that will match the needs of future demands for the movement of people and goods. The full build condition is the long-term vision for the Corridor.

Of interest are the maps showing the segments of independent utility; the report divides I-11's corridor into 18 such SIU's (note that several of these are in metro Las Vegas, which means that various potential segments are being considered for the final route of I-11 and that not all SIU's will end up being part of the final route of I-11):

SIU 1. Preferred alignment, corridor plan, and right-of-way requirements for SR-189; additional study of international freight movement needs at Nogales port of entry
SIU 1: Arizona-Sonora Border to I-19

SIU 2-4. Preferred alignment (existing or new corridor segment) and ultimate corridor plan for I-11, including intercity passenger rail between Phoenix and Tucson and interconnected freight rail
SIU 2: I-19 to I-10/I-8 (Casa Grande)
SIU 3: I-10/I-8 (Casa Grande) to I-10 (Buckeye)
SIU 4: I-10 (Buckeye) to US 93 (Wickenburg)

SIU 5-7. Completion of capacity enhancements to upgrade US 93 to a four-lane divided highway, including improvement of I-40 system interchange
SIU 5: US 93 (Wickenburg) to I-40
SIU 6: US 93 co-location with I-40
SIU 7: US 93, Kingman/I-40 to Mike O'Callaghan-Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge

SIU 8. Design-build contract to be awarded in the fall of 2014, with construction immediately following
SIU 8: US 93/Boulder City Bypass, Mike O'Callaghan-Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge to I-515/Foothills Grade Separation

SIU 9-18. Selection of one corridor route for I-11 and determination of other system improvements and modes to be accommodated:
SIU 9: New Eastern Corridor (Boulder City Bypass [I-515 and Foothills Grade Separation] to I-15)
SIU 10: I-15, Eastern Corridor to CC-215/Northern Beltway
SIU 11: CC-215/Northern Beltway, I-15 to US 95
SIU 12: US 95, CC-215/Northern Beltway to SR-157
SIU 13: I-515/US 93, Foothills Grade Separation to I-215
SIU 14: I-215, I-515 to I-15
SIU 15: CC-215, I-15 to Future Sheep Mountain Parkway
SIU 16: Future Sheep Mountain Parkway, CC-215 to US 95
SIU 17: I-515, I-215 to I-15 (includes Spaghetti Bowl)
SIU 18: US 95, I-15 to CC-215/Northern Beltway

The report specifies a southern terminus at the international border, and it appears as if I-11 will overlap a portion of I-19. The most complete section appears to be between Wickenburg and Boulder City, but plenty remains to be done in all areas.

Page 39 of the report gives describes the "brand" created by "marketing" an Interstate corridor such as I-11:

Fostering the "I-11 brand" for the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor will create a distinct identity for the corridor; generate interest among the trade and logistics industry, the traveling public, and the economic and community development industry; and create a clear and positive public recognition of the new multimodal corridor. In addition to creating or enhancing public acceptance, a successful branding and marketing campaign delivers the following benefits:
- Enhanced commitment to the implementation of the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor
- Enhanced outreach efforts
- Potential for attracting community and economic development activity

Page 40 lists "critical improvements" needed for the corridor:

Improve SR-189 to provide free-flowing and direct access to the Mariposa land port of entry.
Complete environmental clearance and then initiate design for SR-189/Mariposa Road to determine improvements from I-19 to the Mexican border.
Initiate environmental clearance and design process for the area between Nogales and Casa Grande to determine the I-11 corridor alignment.
Initiate environmental clearance and design process for the Phoenix metropolitan area to determine the I-11 corridor alignment between Casa Grande and US 93 (Wickenburg).
Finish improvements to US 93 for completing a 4-lane divided highway between Wickenburg and I-40.
Complete environmental studies, design, and right-of-way acquisition, and construction where required.
Complete construction of the Boulder City Bypass.
Determine preferred corridor and system-wide improvements in the Las Vegas metropolitan area.

As for the corridor north of Las Vegas, two sections on page 41 offer insight:

Several potential corridor connections were studied and two were found to meet the goals and objectives of the Corridor (Figure 22). The US 95 corridor options in the western part of the state are seen as viable options for an I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor, connecting the two largest economic activity centers in the state–the Las Vegas and Reno/Sparks/Carson City metropolitan areas. The US 93 corridor has statewide significance, connecting the growing rural communities in the eastern part of the state.  While it does not meet the goals and objectives of the highway portion of the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor, the US 93 corridor could provide an opportunity to close a north-south gap in the intermountain rail network.

Coordination with adjacent states must continue to determine the longer-range vision for connection north of Nevada to Canada. Current corridor options could connect from Northern Nevada to California, Oregon, Idaho, and/or Utah. Understanding the preferred routing through the Northwest U.S.–and other states' commitments to implementing such a corridor–is critical to further defining a preferred alternative and implementation steps.

The report contains a generalized map (page 18 Figure 6) that seems to show I-11 continuing north of Reno along the US 395 route into NE California, eastern Oregon, and eastern Washington. That appears to be conjecture at this point.

I'm sure there's more to come on this project.

[NE2]

Future Sheep Mountain Parkway

Nice.

Efficient transportation links with Mexico create significant opportunities for specialized manufacturing in the U.S., supported by Mexican production, where components cross the border multiple times during production.

Holy inefficiency.

[Henry]

Seems like it's taking a page from I-69, what with its using existing Interstate routes for its own network. At least we can take comfort in the fact it's not I-13!

[vdeane]

I don't get why they feel the need to take I-11 down to Mexico.  I-19 to I-10 is good enough, and people should know how to navigate trips that include multiple route numbers.  The only thing I'd do is build a connection between I-19 and MX 15D.

[Rover_0]

The Interstate 11 study is linked from http://i11study.com/wp/ and can be found directly at http://i11study.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/I-11CCR_Report_2014-11-05.pdf or http://issuu.com/danders4/docs/i-11ccr_report_2014-11-05/0. The report calls for an interim I-11 and a full build out I-11. The interim corridor does not specify Interstate standards as much as continuous four-lane divided highway:

In whole, the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor has the potential to be over 530 miles long between the southern Arizona border and the Las Vegas Metropolitan Area–and double that length to the northern Nevada border. A phased implementation strategy is required to achieve the full build condition that fulfills the vision of a multimodal I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor.
- The "Interim Corridor"  assumes implementation of targeted improvements to create a continuous 4-lane divided highway from Nogales to Las Vegas. The goal of implementing this interim condition is to facilitate trade movements between Mexico, Arizona, and Nevada — until such a time as the ultimate trade corridor is deemed needed (as depicted in Figure 7 on page 19).
- The "Full Build Corridor"  completes build-out of a multimodal transportation corridor that will match the needs of future demands for the movement of people and goods. The full build condition is the long-term vision for the Corridor.

Of interest are the maps showing the segments of independent utility; the report divides I-11's corridor into 18 such SIU's (note that several of these are in metro Las Vegas, which means that various potential segments are being considered for the final route of I-11 and that not all SIU's will end up being part of the final route of I-11):

SIU 1. Preferred alignment, corridor plan, and right-of-way requirements for SR-189; additional study of international freight movement needs at Nogales port of entry
SIU 1: Arizona-Sonora Border to I-19

SIU 2-4. Preferred alignment (existing or new corridor segment) and ultimate corridor plan for I-11, including intercity passenger rail between Phoenix and Tucson and interconnected freight rail
SIU 2: I-19 to I-10/I-8 (Casa Grande)
SIU 3: I-10/I-8 (Casa Grande) to I-10 (Buckeye)
SIU 4: I-10 (Buckeye) to US 93 (Wickenburg)

SIU 5-7. Completion of capacity enhancements to upgrade US 93 to a four-lane divided highway, including improvement of I-40 system interchange
SIU 5: US 93 (Wickenburg) to I-40
SIU 6: US 93 co-location with I-40
SIU 7: US 93, Kingman/I-40 to Mike O'Callaghan-Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge

SIU 8. Design-build contract to be awarded in the fall of 2014, with construction immediately following
SIU 8: US 93/Boulder City Bypass, Mike O'Callaghan-Pat Tillman Memorial Bridge to I-515/Foothills Grade Separation

SIU 9-18. Selection of one corridor route for I-11 and determination of other system improvements and modes to be accommodated:
SIU 9: New Eastern Corridor (Boulder City Bypass [I-515 and Foothills Grade Separation] to I-15)
SIU 10: I-15, Eastern Corridor to CC-215/Northern Beltway
SIU 11: CC-215/Northern Beltway, I-15 to US 95
SIU 12: US 95, CC-215/Northern Beltway to SR-157
SIU 13: I-515/US 93, Foothills Grade Separation to I-215
SIU 14: I-215, I-515 to I-15
SIU 15: CC-215, I-15 to Future Sheep Mountain Parkway
SIU 16: Future Sheep Mountain Parkway, CC-215 to US 95
SIU 17: I-515, I-215 to I-15 (includes Spaghetti Bowl)
SIU 18: US 95, I-15 to CC-215/Northern Beltway

The report specifies a southern terminus at the international border, and it appears as if I-11 will overlap a portion of I-19. The most complete section appears to be between Wickenburg and Boulder City, but plenty remains to be done in all areas.

Page 39 of the report gives describes the "brand" created by "marketing" an Interstate corridor such as I-11:

Fostering the "I-11 brand" for the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor will create a distinct identity for the corridor; generate interest among the trade and logistics industry, the traveling public, and the economic and community development industry; and create a clear and positive public recognition of the new multimodal corridor. In addition to creating or enhancing public acceptance, a successful branding and marketing campaign delivers the following benefits:
- Enhanced commitment to the implementation of the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor
- Enhanced outreach efforts
- Potential for attracting community and economic development activity

Page 40 lists "critical improvements" needed for the corridor:

Improve SR-189 to provide free-flowing and direct access to the Mariposa land port of entry.
Complete environmental clearance and then initiate design for SR-189/Mariposa Road to determine improvements from I-19 to the Mexican border.
Initiate environmental clearance and design process for the area between Nogales and Casa Grande to determine the I-11 corridor alignment.
Initiate environmental clearance and design process for the Phoenix metropolitan area to determine the I-11 corridor alignment between Casa Grande and US 93 (Wickenburg).
Finish improvements to US 93 for completing a 4-lane divided highway between Wickenburg and I-40.
Complete environmental studies, design, and right-of-way acquisition, and construction where required.
Complete construction of the Boulder City Bypass.
Determine preferred corridor and system-wide improvements in the Las Vegas metropolitan area.

As for the corridor north of Las Vegas, two sections on page 41 offer insight:

Several potential corridor connections were studied and two were found to meet the goals and objectives of the Corridor (Figure 22). The US 95 corridor options in the western part of the state are seen as viable options for an I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor, connecting the two largest economic activity centers in the state–the Las Vegas and Reno/Sparks/Carson City metropolitan areas. The US 93 corridor has statewide significance, connecting the growing rural communities in the eastern part of the state.  While it does not meet the goals and objectives of the highway portion of the I-11 and Intermountain West Corridor, the US 93 corridor could provide an opportunity to close a north-south gap in the intermountain rail network.

Coordination with adjacent states must continue to determine the longer-range vision for connection north of Nevada to Canada. Current corridor options could connect from Northern Nevada to California, Oregon, Idaho, and/or Utah. Understanding the preferred routing through the Northwest U.S.–and other states' commitments to implementing such a corridor–is critical to further defining a preferred alternative and implementation steps.

The report contains a generalized map (page 18 Figure 6) that seems to show I-11 continuing north of Reno along the US 395 route into NE California, eastern Oregon, and eastern Washington. That appears to be conjecture at this point.

I'm sure there's more to come on this project.

Interesting points. It may seem as though US-93 north of I-15 may have plans for any future rail networks.

I don't get why they feel the need to take I-11 down to Mexico.  I-19 to I-10 is good enough, and people should know how to navigate trips that include multiple route numbers.  The only thing I'd do is build a connection between I-19 and MX 15D.

I find that a separate freeway all the way down to Nogales would be far too redundant. However, here's another thought: Maybe they're planning to renumber most of (if not all of) I-19 as I-11, with giving I(/AZ)-x11 I(/AZ)-x10 to any remaining pieces of I-19 that are not part of I-11.

[kkt]

What a ridiculous bunch of marketing fluff.  If they put enough not-quite-relevant glossy photos, maybe nobody will notice there's not any traffic counts or cost projections in it.

[kkt]

I find that a separate freeway all the way down to Nogales would be far too redundant. However, here's another thought: Maybe they're planning to renumber most of (if not all of) I-19 as I-11, with giving I(/AZ)-x11 I(/AZ)-x10 to any remaining pieces of I-19 that are not part of I-11.

Maybe, but if they plan to number the corridor as one interstate number, why not keep I-19 for all of it?  Save renumbering the part that already exists, and would fit the grid better for the Nogales-Las Vegas portion (probably all that will ever be built).

[roadfro]

I find that a separate freeway all the way down to Nogales would be far too redundant. However, here's another thought: Maybe they're planning to renumber most of (if not all of) I-19 as I-11, with giving I(/AZ)-x11 I(/AZ)-x10 to any remaining pieces of I-19 that are not part of I-11.

Maybe, but if they plan to number the corridor as one interstate number, why not keep I-19 for all of it?  Save renumbering the part that already exists, and would fit the grid better for the Nogales-Las Vegas portion (probably all that will ever be built).

If the route really goes north of Las Vegas and beyond Reno, then most of I-11 will better fit the grid. I am really curious to see what future corridor studies look like for north of Las Vegas...with the announcement of the Tesla gigafactory near Reno, I wonder if there will be movement to try and bring the route in that direction.

[vdeane]

I find that a separate freeway all the way down to Nogales would be far too redundant. However, here's another thought: Maybe they're planning to renumber most of (if not all of) I-19 as I-11, with giving I(/AZ)-x11 I(/AZ)-x10 to any remaining pieces of I-19 that are not part of I-11.

I still don't see the need, unless Arizona wants to use it as an excuse to shove mileage-based numbers onto I-19.  As you can probably tell, I'm not interested in what the Canamex crowd wants.  I believe we already have transcontinental interstates and that we don't need to shove in more as a symbolic gesture to make it look like we're actually doing something for NAFTA.

[kkt]

I find that a separate freeway all the way down to Nogales would be far too redundant. However, here's another thought: Maybe they're planning to renumber most of (if not all of) I-19 as I-11, with giving I(/AZ)-x11 I(/AZ)-x10 to any remaining pieces of I-19 that are not part of I-11.

Maybe, but if they plan to number the corridor as one interstate number, why not keep I-19 for all of it?  Save renumbering the part that already exists, and would fit the grid better for the Nogales-Las Vegas portion (probably all that will ever be built).

If the route really goes north of Las Vegas and beyond Reno, then most of I-11 will better fit the grid. I am really curious to see what future corridor studies look like for north of Las Vegas...with the announcement of the Tesla gigafactory near Reno, I wonder if there will be movement to try and bring the route in that direction.

IF it goes north of Reno.  I think the chances of it going to Reno are fairly small, and the chances of it going north of Reno pretty much nonexistent.  From the Tesla factory to any of the west coast major cities and most of the east coast major cities will be via I-80.

[Rover_0]

I find that a separate freeway all the way down to Nogales would be far too redundant. However, here's another thought: Maybe they're planning to renumber most of (if not all of) I-19 as I-11, with giving I(/AZ)-x11 I(/AZ)-x10 to any remaining pieces of I-19 that are not part of I-11.

Maybe, but if they plan to number the corridor as one interstate number, why not keep I-19 for all of it?  Save renumbering the part that already exists, and would fit the grid better for the Nogales-Las Vegas portion (probably all that will ever be built).

You know, I had that same thought...and even made a map!



I also took the question of merging I-11 and I-19 (and a border-to-border I-11) to the I-11 study representatives. This is my question:

Hello I-11 Study Representatives,

With the I-11 Study recently completed, I've noticed that some maps involve I-19 from Nogales to Tucson as part of this Mexico-to-Canada corridor, and much of the language mentions improvements made to I-19 and around the border crossing at Nogales.

In seeing this and how I-11 may become a Canada-to-Mexico route in the future, are there plans or discussions for I-11 going all the way to Mexico either via a concurrency with I-19 or by renumbering I-19 as part of I-11? Or, is I-19 just planned to be part of the CANAMEX corridor?

Regards,

Landry

One of the agents responded with this:

Landry,

The I-11 corridor is intended to go from Mexico to Canada, but decisions on whether or not to change any overlapping interstate designations have not yet been discussed, and will depend on the final corridor routing for I-11, to be considered in subsequent studies.

Dan

[vdeane]

Does I-10 actually have enough traffic between Tucson and Phoenix that a parallel interstate is needed?

[kkt]

Does I-10 actually have enough traffic between Tucson and Phoenix that a parallel interstate is needed?

Well, no, but that doesn't seem to be stopping Arizona.

[blanketcomputer]

All I can say about I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson is that it is mostly two lanes in each direction, and semis and out of stater drivers make it a slower and more stressful drive than it needs to be.

[andy3175]

Does I-10 actually have enough traffic between Tucson and Phoenix that a parallel interstate is needed?

Based on my approx 10 times driving this corridor, in my opinion it ranks alongside I-15 San Bernardino to Las Vegas or I-5 Los Angeles to Sacramento in terms of apparent traffic volume, but I do not have the actual numbers to verify this. Every time I've been on I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson, it has been very busy, and the lone gas station/Dairy Queen at Picacho Peak interchange Exit 219 always seems to be full of travelers. However, I would think a third lane in each direction would suffice to cover existing traffic (and that expansion has been occurring in recent years) ... until you look at future plans for building Pinal County, which is located between Phoenix and Tucson. Pinal County's master plan (http://www.pinalcountyaz.gov/Departments/PlanningDevelopment/ComprehensivePlanUpdate/Pages/Home.aspx) calls for quite a bit of new development ... and freeways to go along with that development. I guess I-11 could be folded into this planning process at some point should I-11 indeed extend this far south.

Page 162 states, "Additional widening of I-10 will be required. I-10 is currently being planned for an ultimate width of five lanes in each direction between Maricopa and Pima counties. Funding for the widening of I-10 is not presently committed. The widening of I-10, high capacity regional transit on the corridor, and commuter rail and medium-capacity regional transit may be needed to meet travel demand before Pinal County reaches buildout. Currently, not enough transportation funding exists in the state to address all of the needs."

Page 163 continues by listing the proposed "high capacity roadways" (maps on pages 114 and 167 show some of this, although the maps refrain from using the word "freeway" and instead calls them "potential future high capacity corridors" with brown markings on page 167):

1. Proposed North-South Freeway connecting US 60 to I-10 (maybe new alignment for SR 79?)
2. US 60 Bypass around the Gold Canyon area which includes an option to connect to the future east-west SR 802 (now SR 24) alignment
3. Williams Gateway Freeway (SR 24, former SR 802) beginning at SR 202 in Mesa, connecting to the Phoenix-Mesa Gateway Airport, and continuing east to the east end of the US 60
4. The east-west potential high capacity corridor, entering Pinal County from far eastern Maricopa County and proceeding east in the vicinity of the Val Vista, Barnes, McCartney, and Bartlett Road alignments, connecting to the North-South Freeway
5. The north-south potential high capacity corridor connecting I-8 with the previously described corridor
6. A potential high capacity corridor beginning in the Casa Grande-Eloy area and proceeding south, then east to the I-10/Park Link Road interchange (could this be Pinal's segment of I-11???)

[J N Winkler]

Arizona DOT has also been considering an "I-10 alternate" that would bypass Tucson completely and run in an unpopulated valley one mountain range to the east of current I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson.  However, there is no obvious place for it to tie into the Phoenix freeway network, though the study I have seen suggests that it could cross existing I-10 somewhat to the north of the present I-8/I-10 split and merge back into I-10 somewhere around the SR 85 interchange.

[NE2]

Arizona DOT has also been considering an "I-10 alternate" that would bypass Tucson completely and run in an unpopulated valley one mountain range to the east of current I-10 between Phoenix and Tucson.

The valley that includes Mammoth?