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Regional Boards => Great Lakes and Ohio Valley => Topic started by: Revive 755 on June 18, 2011, 11:55:07 PM

Title: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Revive 755 on June 18, 2011, 11:55:07 PM
http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/projects/swregion/i3990/environ.htm (http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/projects/swregion/i3990/environ.htm)

* Looking over all of the alternatives, I have to wonder about WisDOT for replacing cloverleafs with diamonds instead of either SPUIs or partial cloverleafs.  Certainly looks like WisDOT is SPUIphobic.

* From the following map, WisDOT apparently considers mainline I-43 to merge with SB I-39 and then terminate:
ftp://ftp.dot.state.wi.us/transp/projects/i3990cs/ea/appendixe-interchangealts/exhibit-e-1.pdf (http://ftp://ftp.dot.state.wi.us/transp/projects/i3990cs/ea/appendixe-interchangealts/exhibit-e-1.pdf)
And how is the "Signal after long stretch of interstate" any worse than some of WisDOT's bypasses that start as a near freeway but then have stoplights?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on June 19, 2011, 07:22:12 PM
In the case of this study, there aren't really any space constraints that would warrant any SPUI's.

The I-43 interchange looks sweet.

I like the idea of the C/D setup through the US 14 & WI 26 interchanges in Janesville.

The Beltline interchange moves all the left hand ramps to the right, which I'm usually for.  In this case, most of the traffic EB on the Beltline gets on 39/90 as opposed to continuing on US 12/18.  So here's a spot where I'd be okay with some left side ramps.  But only for US 12/18.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on June 19, 2011, 10:39:55 PM
I'm a little surprised there's not a provision for a high-speed movement between SBD WI-26 and SBD I-39, or for NBD I-39 to NBD WI-26, considering all the work north of Janesville to convert the highway to expressway or freeway. Then again, it's not like they have high-speed movements at Johnson Creek either.

So far, I see little of a construction timetable here. The stretch up to Janesville will be pretty quick and easy to 6-lane, but north of there will require more work.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on June 19, 2011, 10:48:59 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on June 19, 2011, 07:22:12 PM
In the case of this study, there aren't really any space constraints that would warrant any SPUI's.

The I-43 interchange looks sweet.

I like the idea of the C/D setup through the US 14 & WI 26 interchanges in Janesville.

The Beltline interchange moves all the left hand ramps to the right, which I'm usually for.  In this case, most of the traffic EB on the Beltline gets on 39/90 as opposed to continuing on US 12/18.  So here's a spot where I'd be okay with some left side ramps.  But only for US 12/18.

A few quick thoughts:

I like the second I-43 interchange alternative the best - BUT - I would continue the street to the east as a street to feed into old WI 15 (County 'X') in order to restore that local connection, finding a different way to connect it with I-43.

The Beltline Interchange is much nicer in most of those alternatives, but I would also include provisions for potential future major upgrades to the SB I-39/90 to EB US 12/18 and WB US 12/18 to NB I-39/90 movements, this because of the very real potential for US 12 east of Madison to become a far, far more important route than it is now.  Those upgrades don't have to be built right away, but I would leave options open for that work to be done quickly when the need arises.

I like the diamond much more than a full cloverleaf at WI 11 east (Racine Rd), too, the connection does not rate any more than that.  I would do the ramp intersections as roundabouts, though.

As for the WI 26 interchange, I would include an option for a much more heavily upgraded connection to WI 26 to the north, with the way that that route is developing, it'll be needed.

(I should send these thoughts off to WisDOT)

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: on_wisconsin on April 12, 2012, 08:39:26 PM
QuoteDetails announced for I-39/90 expansion

BELOIT (WKOW) -- The Wisconsin Department of Transportation has announced plans to expand one of the state's busiest stretches of highway.

Officials plan to spend $715 million on reconstruction and expansion of a 45-mile stretch of I-39/90 from Madison to the Illinois state line.

Plans call for a third lane in each direction, new pavement, replacing two bridges over the Rock River and replacing nearly 100 other smaller bridges.

The project will be split into three segments. The North segment will be from I-39/90 & US 12/18 to the Dane/Rock County line. The Central segment will be from the Dane/Rock County line to I-39/90 & County O near Janesville. The South segment will be from County O to the Illinois state line.

The project will be 70 percent state funded and 30 percent federal.

The six-year project is scheduled to begin in 2015. But construction of the Highway 11 interchange in Janesville is scheduled for 2013.

You can share your thoughts on the plan. The north segment will hold its first public information meeting on April 24 from 5 to 7 p.m. at the Edgerton Public Library.
http://www.wkow.com/story/17400787/details-announced-for-i-3990-expansion

WisDOT Project site: http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/index.htm
(sorry for the  necro-post)
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SSOWorld on April 13, 2012, 07:16:49 AM
Now IDiOT will have 2 short stretches of road to expand. (94 and 90) (though the first is partially ISTHA)
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on April 14, 2012, 01:06:42 PM
Quote from: Master son on April 13, 2012, 07:16:49 AM
Now IDiOT will have 2 short stretches of road to expand. (94 and 90) (though the first is partially ISTHA)
Actually the only part of 90 that would need expansion is north of the IL 75 interchange to the state line so you're talking about maybe 3/4 mile at most.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Brandon on April 14, 2012, 03:30:47 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on April 14, 2012, 01:06:42 PM
Quote from: Master son on April 13, 2012, 07:16:49 AM
Now IDiOT will have 2 short stretches of road to expand. (94 and 90) (though the first is partially ISTHA)
Actually the only part of 90 that would need expansion is north of the IL 75 interchange to the state line so you're talking about maybe 3/4 mile at most.

Huh?  I thought it would need widening from Rockton Road to the state line.  The third lane ends at Rockton Road, IIRC.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on April 14, 2012, 09:31:18 PM
Quote from: Brandon on April 14, 2012, 03:30:47 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on April 14, 2012, 01:06:42 PM
Quote from: Master son on April 13, 2012, 07:16:49 AM
Now IDiOT will have 2 short stretches of road to expand. (94 and 90) (though the first is partially ISTHA)
Actually the only part of 90 that would need expansion is north of the IL 75 interchange to the state line so you're talking about maybe 3/4 mile at most.

Huh?  I thought it would need widening from Rockton Road to the state line.  The third lane ends at Rockton Road, IIRC.
You're right Brandon. I did forget that it drops at Rockton Rd and not ILL 75. ok so make it 2 1/2 miles or so.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: cwm1276 on April 15, 2012, 09:10:46 AM
Newbie, here.
Actually 39/90 is being completed to 6 lanes in Illinois, from Rockton Rd to the Stateline.

http://www.rrstar.com/blogs/brianleaf/x1581725206/Construction-on-new-I-90-lanes-from-Rockton-Road-to-stateline-starts-April-2 (http://www.rrstar.com/blogs/brianleaf/x1581725206/Construction-on-new-I-90-lanes-from-Rockton-Road-to-stateline-starts-April-2)
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Brandon on April 15, 2012, 02:17:41 PM
Finally IDiOT catches up.  Actually, District 2 isn't too bad at it.  Not like District 1 which can't get its head out of its ass..er..DuPage and Cook Counties (is there a difference?).

With ISTHA widening I-90 from O'Hare to Rockford, I-90 in Illinois will be a minimum of 6 lanes within a couple of years.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SSOWorld on April 16, 2012, 06:36:39 AM
so that will make I-90 6+ lanes from Mad-town to Chicago. It's about time.  I've seen that road jammed several time - especially around Janesville and Beloit.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Brandon on April 16, 2012, 07:23:15 AM
Quote from: Master son on April 16, 2012, 06:36:39 AM
so that will make I-90 6+ lanes from Mad-town to Chicago. It's about time.  I've seen that road jammed several time - especially around Janesville and Beloit.

With the Indiana Toll Road widening, it'll go all the way to I-65 at a minimum.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on April 16, 2012, 11:10:00 AM
Quote from: Master son on April 16, 2012, 06:36:39 AM
so that will make I-90 6+ lanes from Mad-town to Chicago. It's about time.  I've seen that road jammed several time - especially around Janesville and Beloit.

Madison?

The six lanes start at the Cascade Interchange (I-39/I-90/94 split) near Portage, WI

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SSOWorld on April 16, 2012, 01:51:25 PM
I wasn't considering that at the time - just looking at the new portion from the Cambridge Interchange southward. Technically, you're right.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on April 16, 2012, 06:17:43 PM
Quote from: Master son on April 16, 2012, 01:51:25 PM
I wasn't considering that at the time - just looking at the new portion from the Cambridge Interchange southward. Technically, you're right.
Actually, if InDOT expands to 6 lanes to the I-80/94 interchange near Portage, is it coincidence that it will be Portage to Portage??? :) Yeah just a bit.

What WisDOT should do is to extend the 6 lanes to the Tomah split.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Brandon on April 16, 2012, 07:42:56 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on April 16, 2012, 06:17:43 PM
Quote from: Master son on April 16, 2012, 01:51:25 PM
I wasn't considering that at the time - just looking at the new portion from the Cambridge Interchange southward. Technically, you're right.
Actually, if InDOT expands to 6 lanes to the I-80/94 interchange near Portage, is it coincidence that it will be Portage to Portage??? :) Yeah just a bit.

What WisDOT should do is to extend the 6 lanes to the Tomah split.

InDOT would have nothing to do with it.  IIRC, it's that Cinquas-Maquarie (sp?) (Spanish-Aussie company) that leases the Toll Road that would do the widening.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on April 16, 2012, 09:59:30 PM
Quote from: hobsini2 on April 16, 2012, 06:17:43 PM
What WisDOT should do is to extend the 6 lanes to the Tomah split.

Certainly warranted, but I'd rather they finish the 6-laning between Madison and Beloit first. ;-)

WisDOT is apparently trying to fast-track US-14 upgrades to help handle displaced I-39/90 traffic during the 6-lane upgrade process. The Janesville Gazette is certainly finding it easier to find detractors than supporters, despite those who do the Janesville to Madison commute daily who wholeheartedly support it. http://www.gazettextra.com/news/2012/apr/08/proposed-janesville-highway-project-draws-concerns/
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: on_wisconsin on April 17, 2012, 08:45:32 PM
This project is even important enough for WisDOT to make a logo for it:
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dot.state.wi.us%2Fprojects%2Fswregion%2Fi3990%2Fimages%2Flogo-200.gif&hash=db4019cf4d94442d238e9e89bdf55cd2877a8269)
(WisDOT usually only makes logos for its super-duper large projects.)
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: DaBigE on April 17, 2012, 10:12:42 PM
Quote from: on_wisconsin on April 17, 2012, 08:45:32 PM
(WisDOT usually only makes logos for its super-duper large projects.)

IDK, I think I'd remove the "duper" or maybe even the "super-duper".  Either their graphic artists are getting bored, or they're lowering their threshold, as they have a logo for the I-94 repaving project, for the I-43 bridge rehabs, and Bluemound Rd projects in the SE Region.  But I suppose it all depends on your point of reference--cost or project length.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 23, 2012, 06:21:51 PM
Interstate project could expand
http://gazettextra.com/news/2012/aug/22/interstate-project-could-expand/

Traffic count projections justify expanding Interstate 90/39 to four lanes in each direction through Janesville, state transportation officials said.

Original plans called for the widening of the Interstate from two lanes in each direction to three lanes from the Illinois state line to the Beltline in Madison.

Department of Transportation project manager Steve Marshall said 20-year traffic projections for the Interstate segment through Janesville warrant four lanes in each direction.

Federal highway officials, he said, suggested that the segment be expanded now rather than later.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 23, 2012, 07:42:01 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 23, 2012, 06:21:51 PM
Interstate project could expand
http://gazettextra.com/news/2012/aug/22/interstate-project-could-expand/

Traffic count projections justify expanding Interstate 90/39 to four lanes in each direction through Janesville, state transportation officials said.

Original plans called for the widening of the Interstate from two lanes in each direction to three lanes from the Illinois state line to the Beltline in Madison.

Department of Transportation project manager Steve Marshall said 20-year traffic projections for the Interstate segment through Janesville warrant four lanes in each direction.

Federal highway officials, he said, suggested that the segment be expanded now rather than later.


Hmmmmm, maybe I should send WisDOT a copy of my recent 'Fictional Highways' thoughts on the I-39/90/WI 26 interchange in Janesville.

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=3618.msg160354#msg160354

:nod:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on August 24, 2012, 08:37:01 AM
The four lane section wouldn't be very long...basically just through Janesville:

"Marshall said the segment with four lanes in each direction would run from the Avalon Road interchange to Highway 26 on Janesville's northwest side. All other segments of the expansion project are expected to remain at three lanes in each direction."

Avalon Road is where the WI-11 bypass approaches from the west.   This is basically an 8 mile section of highway.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Special K on August 24, 2012, 08:51:15 AM
Quote from: DaBigE on April 17, 2012, 10:12:42 PM
Quote from: on_wisconsin on April 17, 2012, 08:45:32 PM
(WisDOT usually only makes logos for its super-duper large projects.)

IDK, I think I'd remove the "duper" or maybe even the "super-duper".  Either their graphic artists are getting bored, or they're lowering their threshold, as they have a logo for the I-94 repaving project, for the I-43 bridge rehabs, and Bluemound Rd projects in the SE Region.  But I suppose it all depends on your point of reference--cost or project length.

or number of people affected/showing interest.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on August 24, 2012, 05:20:10 PM
Seems like the kind of thing where WisDOT could put in all the extra pavement and bridge widths, but only stripe it for 6 lanes at the end of the project.  Then the additional lane can be added in each direction when it's needed by just re-striping.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 25, 2012, 11:11:22 AM
They *could* do that, but the thinking is likely that once I-90 in Illinois is uncorked, traffic growth is going to take a spike upward, particularly on summer and holiday weekends. You'll get people who will travel more frequently since the drive is less stressful, and they'll also consider the traffic less when choosing when to travel. You'll see larger spikes in travel on Fridays and Sundays as everyone arrives and leaves at the same time.

The consideration isn't in just raw traffic numbers (which are certainly there), but in the high amount of commercial vehicle traffic. The Beltline in Madison gets away with 3 lanes each way (sort of) in part because truck traffic is a fairly low percentage of the traffic volume. But WisDOT can ill afford to have the backups on I-39/90 in Janesville that the Beltline in Madison gets, particularly with so many trucks on the highway. If they have to have the 4th lane to smooth traffic flow through Janesville, better to get it in place now than to come back 10 years later and tie up the highway again.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 25, 2012, 12:07:03 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 25, 2012, 11:11:22 AM
They *could* do that, but the thinking is likely that once I-90 in Illinois is uncorked, traffic growth is going to take a spike upward, particularly on summer and holiday weekends. You'll get people who will travel more frequently since the drive is less stressful, and they'll also consider the traffic less when choosing when to travel. You'll see larger spikes in travel on Fridays and Sundays as everyone arrives and leaves at the same time.

The consideration isn't in just raw traffic numbers (which are certainly there), but in the high amount of commercial vehicle traffic. The Beltline in Madison gets away with 3 lanes each way (sort of) in part because truck traffic is a fairly low percentage of the traffic volume. But WisDOT can ill afford to have the backups on I-39/90 in Janesville that the Beltline in Madison gets, particularly with so many trucks on the highway. If they have to have the 4th lane to smooth traffic flow through Janesville, better to get it in place now than to come back 10 years later and tie up the highway again.

One mitigating factor with regards to tourist traffic on summer weekends is that for traffic between Chicagoland and the Wisconsin northwoods, it is now shorter and faster to go by way of US 41(I-xx), US 45 and US 10 via Milwaukee and Oshkosh to Stevens Point than the all-interstate routing of I-90 and I-39 via Rockford and Madison.  That's why WisDOT built those high-powered ramps at US 41(I-xx)/US 45 in Oshkosh.  The final piece in that 'puzzle' is a direct free-flow feed between I-39 and US 10 to the east at Stevens Point/Plover, which is now waiting on funding.

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Revive 755 on August 25, 2012, 02:01:23 PM
^ Kind of depends upon the origin of the trip in Chicagoland whether I-90/I-39 is the better route over I-94/US 41.  Playing around with Google Maps, it seems the dividing line for which route is shorter distance wise is around the IL 83 corridor.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 28, 2012, 09:02:45 PM
I went to the PIM for the southern 3rd of the I-39/90 project tonight. There was heavy turnout tonight - the estimate I heard from WisDOT staff was about 175-200 attendees.

Some of the more interesting info:

- NO design consideration is being made for Hwy 11 and US 14 east of Janesville during the Hwy 11 interchange rebuild. The spokesman indicated that the study wasn't far enough along, and indicated the expressway was likely at least 10-20 years away.

- They are rebuilding the Hwy 11 West/Avalon Rd exit with either regular roundabouts, roundabouts for "oversize" semis, or stoplights. A ton of comments tonight were regarding accommodations for truck traffic and the (perceived) inappropriateness of roundabouts for truck traffic, particularly oversize trucks.

- The 8-lane I-39/90 section starts at Hwy 11 and continues northward to Hwy 26 (though the materials tonight only showed it to Hwy O). The materials presented tonight are presenting the 8-lane section as a done deal, whereas earlier news reports indicated it wasn't set in stone.

- The I-39/90 - I-43 - Hwy 81 interchange in Beloit will end up being a tri-level stack. All alternatives feature the high-speed ramps to and from I-43 in all scenarios, likely going over the remaining highways. I-39/90 is being shifted east a few hundred feet to accommodate the entrance and exit ramps to southbound I-39/90. Two of the scenarios show an extension of Milwaukee Rd east of the interchange to tie into County X, one does not. They featured examples with both roundabouts and signals at the Hwy 81/County X interchange.

- The ramps to and from the Welcome Center are being straightened to allow for future additional parking and allow vehicles to get back to highway speeds before the I-43/Hwy 81 exit.

- As previously discussed, they're widening first into the median with a center barrier, then expanding outward to accommodate the 4th lane north of Hwy 11.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 29, 2012, 03:06:31 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 28, 2012, 09:02:45 PM
I went to the PIM for the southern 3rd of the I-39/90 project tonight. There was heavy turnout tonight - the estimate I heard from WisDOT staff was about 175-200 attendees.

Some of the more interesting info:

- NO design consideration is being made for Hwy 11 and US 14 east of Janesville during the Hwy 11 interchange rebuild. The spokesman indicated that the study wasn't far enough along, and indicated the expressway was likely at least 10-20 years away.

- They are rebuilding the Hwy 11 West/Avalon Rd exit with either regular roundabouts, roundabouts for "oversize" semis, or stoplights. A ton of comments tonight were regarding accommodations for truck traffic and the (perceived) inappropriateness of roundabouts for truck traffic, particularly oversize trucks.

- The 8-lane I-39/90 section starts at Hwy 11 and continues northward to Hwy 26 (though the materials tonight only showed it to Hwy O). The materials presented tonight are presenting the 8-lane section as a done deal, whereas earlier news reports indicated it wasn't set in stone.

Was there anything there about upgrading that last little 'Breezewood' section of WI 26 between I-39/90 and the currently under-construction WI 26 freeway just to the northeast in Janesville?  I'll definitely have to send them a printout of my 'fictional highways'/'redesigned interchanges' posting on that from a few weeks ago!

:nod:

Quote from: JREwing78 on August 28, 2012, 09:02:45 PM
- The I-39/90 - I-43 - Hwy 81 interchange in Beloit will end up being a tri-level stack. All alternatives feature the high-speed ramps to and from I-43 in all scenarios, likely going over the remaining highways. I-39/90 is being shifted east a few hundred feet to accommodate the entrance and exit ramps to southbound I-39/90. Two of the scenarios show an extension of Milwaukee Rd east of the interchange to tie into County X, one does not. They featured examples with both roundabouts and signals at the Hwy 81/County X interchange.

This is one that I have had recent contact with WisDOT on - without fail, I would reconnect County 'X' (old WI 15) with Milwaukee Rd (WI 81) - it'll tie the whole road/street network in that area back together.  Ever since the WI 15 (now I-43) freeway was connected to I-39/90, that entire part of the City of Beloit east of I-39/90 has been effectively severed from the rest of the city to the west and that area is now primed and ready for some major economic development activity.  In fact, right now, I consider that area east of I-39/90 to be the most valuable undeveloped land in the entire State of Wisconsin.  A restored connection between Milwaukee Rd (WI 81) and County 'X', with direct access to I-39/90, is the final piece of that puzzle.

:thumbsup:

Did any of the WisDOT maps show a potential overcrossing of I-43 at Lathers Rd in Beloit?

Quote from: JREwing78 on August 28, 2012, 09:02:45 PM
- The ramps to and from the Welcome Center are being straightened to allow for future additional parking and allow vehicles to get back to highway speeds before the I-43/Hwy 81 exit.

- As previously discussed, they're widening first into the median with a center barrier, then expanding outward to accommodate the 4th lane north of Hwy 11.

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on August 29, 2012, 03:16:15 PM
The City of Janesville wants the stoplights on 26 at Kettering and at McCormick (new CTH Y).  Already fought the state in that regard and the DOT relented. 
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 29, 2012, 08:21:37 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on August 29, 2012, 03:06:31 PM
Was there anything there about upgrading that last little 'Breezewood' section of WI 26 between I-39/90 and the currently under-construction WI 26 freeway just to the northeast in Janesville?

No - the PIM yesterday only concerned the state line to County O (just south of Racine St in Janesville).

Quote from: mgk920 on August 29, 2012, 03:06:31 PMDid any of the WisDOT maps show a potential overcrossing of I-43 at Lathers Rd in Beloit?

No. The improvements were limited to the realigned I-39/90 interchange and the possible County X/Hwy 81 connection.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 29, 2012, 08:24:07 PM
Regarding the recent change in plans to 8-lane I-39/90 through Janesville: "Things have changed, and the numbers right now put the Janesville stretch very close to needing a fourth lane," said John Vesperman, the transportation department's project chief. "We have better sets of numbers, and they are consistently getting higher."

DOT: More traffic likely means four lanes of I-90/39 in Janesville
http://gazettextra.com/news/2012/aug/29/dot-more-traffic-likely-means-four-lanes-i-9039-ja/

Next PIMs:

Central segment
Project: From County O to Dane/Rock County line
When: 5 to 7 p.m. Wednesday, Sept. 19, with a brief formal presentation at 5:30 p.m.
Where: Marshall Middle School, 25 S. Pontiac Drive, Janesville.

North segment
Project: From the Dane/Rock County line to the Highway 12/18 interchange near Madison.
When: 5:30 to 7:30 p.m. Monday, Sept. 24, with a brief formal presentation at 6 p.m.
Where: McFarland High School, 5101 Farwell St., McFarland.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on September 01, 2012, 05:18:41 AM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 28, 2012, 09:02:45 PM

Some of the more interesting info:

- The ramps to and from the Welcome Center are being straightened to allow for future additional parking and allow vehicles to get back to highway speeds before the I-43/Hwy 81 exit.


This actually annoys me a bit because I do recall that prior to the rebuilding of this welcome center some 10 or so years ago (maybe longer), the exit/entrance ramp to/from the welcome center was STRAIGHT. That's why the old brown "Welcome to Wisconsin" sign is where it is. Obviously no foresight in this.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on September 06, 2012, 09:16:35 AM
The exhibits from the south section meeting are now available for online viewing.

http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/south/maps.htm#exhibits
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 06, 2012, 10:07:36 AM
I much prefer Alternative #3 to the WI-81/I-43 interchange.  Cutting off Gateway Blvd from WI-81 is long-term not a good idea.  Alternative #2 I think would be a disaster for the businesses currently operating along WI-81 just west of the current interchange.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on September 06, 2012, 11:22:45 AM
^^
Either Alt 2 or Alt 3 at I-43 in Beloit are acceptable to me - correcting the BIG mistake that was made there when the original WI 15 freeway was extended to Beloit by reconnecting Milwaukee Rd across I-39/90 just makes common sense and is most important to me.  I'm just not sure whether the added access to I-43 in Alt 3 is worth the additional cost as I don't think that it would be all that difficult to drive the short distance northeastward on (restored old WI 15) to get to the existing I-43/County 'X' interchange.

:thumbsup:

One additional thing - I would include a street overcrossing of I-43 at Lathers Rd - it will greatly improve access to that part of the City of Beloit in the NE quadrant of that interchange, which I also consider a prime area for development.

One point here, for those who are into 'dissing' roundabouts, is that with the option of using roundabouts Alt 3 is possible - they really do allow for much, much more flexibility in road layout by not having to restrict everything to near right-angle intersections with no more than four radial roadways.

:poke:

:cool:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
The central segment meeting is on Wednesday in Janesville.  And hopefully information from that meeting will be available by Friday on the DOT site.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on September 25, 2012, 11:42:07 AM
Central Region presentation and exhibits.
http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/central/public.htm

Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on September 25, 2012, 02:01:48 PM
No plans to eliminate that 'Breezewood' situation on WI 26 at Janesville?

:banghead:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on September 26, 2012, 12:56:34 AM
Nope. Janesville likes it that way - at least that's the story from the WisDOT rep I spoke to at the last PIM for the southern portion of the I-39/90 project. I agree, it sucks rocks, and I expect in 20-30 years some effort will be made to un-Breezewood it.

It's worse than Johnson Creek, since Hwy 26 through there has sufficient room to close side road access and convert the existing business access to RIRO without trouble, and none of the businesses have direct driveway access to the road. There's still businesses with driveway access to 26 north of I-39/90, with no practical way to put frontage roads in.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 26, 2012, 10:35:33 AM
It is not worth the extra money to eliminate the WI-26 situation.  Seriously, traffic from I-90 to WI-26 has to deal with two lights and I don't recall ever waiting through more than one cycle on either of them.  (And one of these lights might be going away with the WI-26 upgrades...although I am not sure.)  Johnson Creek may need to eventually deal with their situation now with the lights, but again, it isn't that inconvenient.

You simply can build everything free-flow without regards to cost.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on September 26, 2012, 09:49:53 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on September 26, 2012, 10:35:33 AM
It is not worth the extra money to eliminate the WI-26 situation.  Seriously, traffic from I-90 to WI-26 has to deal with two lights and I don't recall ever waiting through more than one cycle on either of them.  (And one of these lights might be going away with the WI-26 upgrades...although I am not sure.)  Johnson Creek may need to eventually deal with their situation now with the lights, but again, it isn't that inconvenient.

You simply can build everything free-flow without regards to cost.

If WisDOT has aspirations of truly making 26 a full fledged freeway, and they do, there should have been SB 26 to SB 39/90 and NB 39/90 to NB 26 free flow ramps that started north of Hwy Y in the plans.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Revive 755 on September 26, 2012, 10:03:47 PM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on September 25, 2012, 11:42:07 AM
Central Region presentation and exhibits.
http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/central/public.htm

Wait, they are adding C-D roads, yet still converting the parclos at WI 26 and US 14 to plain diamonds? :banghead:  If WisDOT really wants to use signals, they should pony up for some SPUIs; at least then they could sell some of the extra ROW near the interchanges.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 27, 2012, 11:01:31 AM
Quote from: hobsini2 on September 26, 2012, 09:49:53 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on September 26, 2012, 10:35:33 AM
It is not worth the extra money to eliminate the WI-26 situation.  Seriously, traffic from I-90 to WI-26 has to deal with two lights and I don't recall ever waiting through more than one cycle on either of them.  (And one of these lights might be going away with the WI-26 upgrades...although I am not sure.)  Johnson Creek may need to eventually deal with their situation now with the lights, but again, it isn't that inconvenient.

You simply can build everything free-flow without regards to cost.

If WisDOT has aspirations of truly making 26 a full fledged freeway, and they do, there should have been SB 26 to SB 39/90 and NB 39/90 to NB 26 free flow ramps that started north of Hwy Y in the plans.


Sorry I just disagree.  There is no need for it.  The need to eliminate all inconvenience with regards to connections simply isn't always worth the cost.  Yeah, I know Breezewood is a disaster.  But that doesn't mean that every similar situation needs to be eliminated.

US-10 in Stevens Point...WI-26 in Janesville and Johnson Creek...all of these are inconvenient, but they are small inconveniences.  That doesn't mean that millions need to be spent to completely eliminate them.  Adding a couple minutes of travel time is oftentimes not worth the cost.  Especially when IMO there are much greater needs facing the state.  Adding a third lane to I-94 between Madison and Milwaukee for example would go much further to meet the future travel needs of this state rather than adding free flow connections to highways with relatively less traffic.

For example, the free flow interchange between US-51 NB and WI-29 WB on the north side of Wausau.  I have driven through that interchange 100 times, and yes improvements to US-51 and the interchange were necessary, but I had never seen backups that lead to any serious issues.  So a beautiful flyover was added, that is fun to drive on, but probably saved about 2 minutes of travel time.  Is that really necessary?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Stephane Dumas on September 27, 2012, 04:20:24 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 26, 2012, 10:03:47 PM

Wait, they are adding C-D roads, yet still converting the parclos at WI 26 and US 14 to plain diamonds? :banghead:  If WisDOT really wants to use signals, they should pony up for some SPUIs; at least then they could sell some of the extra ROW near the interchanges.

What about the possibility to use some "diverging diamond interchanges"?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on September 28, 2012, 05:06:17 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 26, 2012, 10:03:47 PM

Wait, they are adding C-D roads, yet still converting the parclos at WI 26 and US 14 to plain diamonds? :banghead:  If WisDOT really wants to use signals, they should pony up for some SPUIs; at least then they could sell some of the extra ROW near the interchanges.

I agree, as they sit now, plain diamonds in these locations would be a horrible mistake. Anyone who commutes southbound on I-39/90 into Janesville knows how heavily the SBD I-39/90 to SBD WI-26 movement is used.

I suspect they don't know the final configuration they wish to use there, and those are just placeholders. I missed my opportunity to attend the PIM to comment on it, but may well submit written comments to express the need for more capable interchanges there.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on September 28, 2012, 09:06:01 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on September 27, 2012, 11:01:31 AM
For example, the free flow interchange between US-51 NB and WI-29 WB on the north side of Wausau.  I have driven through that interchange 100 times, and yes improvements to US-51 and the interchange were necessary, but I had never seen backups that lead to any serious issues.  So a beautiful flyover was added, that is fun to drive on, but probably saved about 2 minutes of travel time.  Is that really necessary?

In that situation I think WisDOT was very justified in separating local traffic from regional traffic with the new interchange.  It also allowed them to bump up the speed limit through Wausau on US 51.  By the time that project started, I would experience regular slowdowns on 51 SB at the old Stewart Ave entrance.  For WI 29 traffic, you also had vehicles going from 70 mph down to 0 and then back up to 70; a tremendous waste of fuel for that amount of traffic.

That being said, I guess I'm okay with WI 26 not having "system" interchanges at its interstate connections for now.  The traffic just isn't there yet.  And the regional significance of WI 26 is not equivalent to WI 29.  From a regional perspective, the 29 west interchange facilitates movement between two major population/commerce centers; the Fox Valley and the Twin Cities.  WI 26 and its Janesville interchange serve more as a short cut between the Fox Valley and disparate points south of Chicagoland and while it's now faster than US 151, it is still kind of redundant/complimentary.

What I'd like to see is the state to acquire most of the land they think they might need for a system interchange at Janesville and then continue to rent out the existing structures to commercial, etc tenants until such an upgrade is really needed.  We spend less on land and it's less of a problem to displace occupants in the future.

I tend to think Wisconsin was playing catchup when building rural expressways like WI 29 or US 10, but with WI 26 they've gotten out ahead of things.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on October 01, 2012, 07:49:46 AM
And here is the information from the north section meeting.

http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/north/public.htm
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Jordanah1 on October 11, 2012, 04:02:01 PM
Quote from: Stephane Dumas on September 27, 2012, 04:20:24 PM
Quote from: Revive 755 on September 26, 2012, 10:03:47 PM

Wait, they are adding C-D roads, yet still converting the parclos at WI 26 and US 14 to plain diamonds? :banghead:  If WisDOT really wants to use signals, they should pony up for some SPUIs; at least then they could sell some of the extra ROW near the interchanges.

What about the possibility to use some "diverging diamond interchanges"?
http://www.dot.wisconsin.gov/projects/swregion/i3990/north/docs/ss-pim2012sept24.pdf
a DDI is one of the alternatives for the county N interchange in the north segment of the project.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: sandwalk on October 13, 2012, 02:42:52 AM
A little off topic, but I thought it was interesting that the control cities for I-90 (while traveling west on I-43) are Chicago and Madison.  There's a secondary sign that mentions Bloomington/Normal (for the I-90 east exit).....but there's no mention of I-39 and Rockford (the obvious nearest metro area)..... I wonder why that is????
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: amroad17 on October 13, 2012, 03:42:56 AM
Quote from: sandwalk on October 13, 2012, 02:42:52 AM
A little off topic, but I thought it was interesting that the control cities for I-90 (while traveling west on I-43) are Chicago and Madison.  There's a secondary sign that mentions Bloomington/Normal (for the I-90 east exit).....but there's no mention of I-39 and Rockford (the obvious nearest metro area)..... I wonder why that is????
WSDOT simply has not updated the BGS's for that interchange even though I-39 has been designated through there for at least 10 years.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Revive 755 on October 13, 2012, 11:06:40 AM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on October 01, 2012, 07:49:46 AM
And here is the information from the north section meeting.

http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/north/public.htm

My comments/questions:

* At the US 51/WI 73 interchange, are the loops really that tight?  Otherwise I'd say it would be better to stick with the folded diamond since it appears to have better spacing between the ramps (which given the nearby residential development, will probably require traffic signals someday) and leaves open the option of going for a partial cloverleaf in the future.

* Maybe I'd just expect it because MoDOT would do it, but I'm somewhat surprised that WisDOT is keeping all of the ROW at the ghost interchange for the once proposed US 12 freeway into Chicagoland south of County B.  WisDOT is selling the land for the former rest area/welcome center on the US 12 freeway just north of the Illinois border after all.  Or am I wrong in assuming that should the US 12 freeway/expressway be completed to Madison it will now use the US 12/US 18 corridor?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on October 13, 2012, 11:48:51 AM
Quote from: Revive 755 on October 13, 2012, 11:06:40 AM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on October 01, 2012, 07:49:46 AM
And here is the information from the north section meeting.

http://www.dot.state.wi.us/projects/swregion/i3990/north/public.htm

My comments/questions:

* At the US 51/WI 73 interchange, are the loops really that tight?  Otherwise I'd say it would be better to stick with the folded diamond since it appears to have better spacing between the ramps (which given the nearby residential development, will probably require traffic signals someday) and leaves open the option of going for a partial cloverleaf in the future.

* Maybe I'd just expect it because MoDOT would do it, but I'm somewhat surprised that WisDOT is keeping all of the ROW at the ghost interchange for the once proposed US 12 freeway into Chicagoland south of County B.  WisDOT is selling the land for the former rest area/welcome center on the US 12 freeway just north of the Illinois border after all.  Or am I wrong in assuming that should the US 12 freeway/expressway be completed to Madison it will now use the US 12/US 18 corridor?

Distancewise, new construction would be about the same (via Cambridge v. via the ghost interchange).  As it stands now and with the way Central Dane County continues growing, I would upgrade the current US 12/18 with a north bypass of Cambridge, with the US 12 new-ROW to then continue southeastward towards Fort Atkinson to connect with WI 26 at its first curve south of existing US 12 interchange with a trumpet interchange favoring US 12.

To connect a US 12 freeway to I-39/90 at the ghost interchange today world dump a lot of additional commuter traffic onto the already traffic-clogged interstate from there to the Beltline Interchange while existing US 12/18 eastward from the Beltline interchange is an upgradable four lanes to County 'N' and a well-engineered, partially upgradable two lanes from there to just northwest of Cambridge (WI 134 area).

Also, upgrade/re-engineer the Beltline Interchange to reflect the ongoing changes in traffic patterns due to metro growth, especially adding a SB I-39/90 to EB US 12/18 flyover ramp.

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Jim920 on August 10, 2013, 11:42:04 PM
Quote from: amroad17 on October 13, 2012, 03:42:56 AM
Quote from: sandwalk on October 13, 2012, 02:42:52 AM
A little off topic, but I thought it was interesting that the control cities for I-90 (while traveling west on I-43) are Chicago and Madison.  There's a secondary sign that mentions Bloomington/Normal (for the I-90 east exit).....but there's no mention of I-39 and Rockford (the obvious nearest metro area)..... I wonder why that is????
WSDOT simply has not updated the BGS's for that interchange even though I-39 has been designated through there for at least 10 years.

A lot of the signs around this interchange just don't seem to mesh at all.. (I do realize all BGS pre-date I-39)

Here's how WisDOT added I-39 to the I-43/39/90 interchange from SB I-43.
http://goo.gl/maps/EbeLI
I think this is the only time I've seen Junction signs posted on an Interstate.

This is how I-39 South is signed through the interchange, there is no sign like this for NB I-39/WB I-90.
http://goo.gl/maps/zPYll
I-39 North from I-43 North is signed in similar fashion.

This is how they've signed SB I-39, also with Bloomington/Normal.
http://goo.gl/maps/FuJLy

I've always been amused with this one..
http://goo.gl/maps/NtRXo
The "Milwaukee Ahead" appears to have been added after the rest of the gantry, and the tacked on I-43 shield was indeed an afterthought many years after I-43 was already signed.

And one last oddity with this interchange.. all the ramps have overhead signage except the SB/EB I-39/90 to NB I-43
http://goo.gl/maps/se05i
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 11, 2013, 03:50:21 PM
I would safely assume that this will be addressed as the now-under way six-lane upgrade project progresses.

:nod:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mrose on August 12, 2013, 01:59:29 AM
Quote from: Jim920 on August 10, 2013, 11:42:04 PM
I've always been amused with this one..
http://goo.gl/maps/NtRXo
The "Milwaukee Ahead" appears to have been added after the rest of the gantry, and the tacked on I-43 shield was indeed an afterthought many years after I-43 was already signed.

Wow.... can you say "lazy"?

Yes, this had to have been added a lot later, because I went through there frequently maybe 15-20 years ago, and I don't ever remember seeing that.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on August 12, 2013, 09:31:23 AM
Quote from: mrose on August 12, 2013, 01:59:29 AM
Quote from: Jim920 on August 10, 2013, 11:42:04 PM
I've always been amused with this one..
http://goo.gl/maps/NtRXo
The "Milwaukee Ahead" appears to have been added after the rest of the gantry, and the tacked on I-43 shield was indeed an afterthought many years after I-43 was already signed.

Wow.... can you say "lazy"?

Yes, this had to have been added a lot later, because I went through there frequently maybe 15-20 years ago, and I don't ever remember seeing that.


I go through there a lot, and I think it's been there forever.  In fact I think it predates I-43.  I very well could be wrong however.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: GeekJedi on August 12, 2013, 11:54:27 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on August 12, 2013, 09:31:23 AM
Quote from: mrose on August 12, 2013, 01:59:29 AM
Quote from: Jim920 on August 10, 2013, 11:42:04 PM
I've always been amused with this one..
http://goo.gl/maps/NtRXo
The "Milwaukee Ahead" appears to have been added after the rest of the gantry, and the tacked on I-43 shield was indeed an afterthought many years after I-43 was already signed.

Wow.... can you say "lazy"?

Yes, this had to have been added a lot later, because I went through there frequently maybe 15-20 years ago, and I don't ever remember seeing that.


I go through there a lot, and I think it's been there forever.  In fact I think it predates I-43.  I very well could be wrong however.

I believe you're correct.  ISTR that is was there back in the WI-15 days in the early 80's.  The I-43 shield got tacked on after the switch.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on August 12, 2013, 02:11:51 PM
Quote from: GeekJedi on August 12, 2013, 11:54:27 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on August 12, 2013, 09:31:23 AM
Quote from: mrose on August 12, 2013, 01:59:29 AM
Quote from: Jim920 on August 10, 2013, 11:42:04 PM
I've always been amused with this one..
http://goo.gl/maps/NtRXo
The "Milwaukee Ahead" appears to have been added after the rest of the gantry, and the tacked on I-43 shield was indeed an afterthought many years after I-43 was already signed.

Wow.... can you say "lazy"?

Yes, this had to have been added a lot later, because I went through there frequently maybe 15-20 years ago, and I don't ever remember seeing that.


I go through there a lot, and I think it's been there forever.  In fact I think it predates I-43.  I very well could be wrong however.

I believe you're correct.  ISTR that is was there back in the WI-15 days in the early 80's.  The I-43 shield got tacked on after the switch.

The "mock-up" of plaques on the southbound 43 gantry for Wis 81 is a joke too.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on August 12, 2013, 02:20:40 PM
Quote from: GeekJedi on August 12, 2013, 11:54:27 AM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on August 12, 2013, 09:31:23 AM
Quote from: mrose on August 12, 2013, 01:59:29 AM
Quote from: Jim920 on August 10, 2013, 11:42:04 PM
I've always been amused with this one..
http://goo.gl/maps/NtRXo
The "Milwaukee Ahead" appears to have been added after the rest of the gantry, and the tacked on I-43 shield was indeed an afterthought many years after I-43 was already signed.

Wow.... can you say "lazy"?

Yes, this had to have been added a lot later, because I went through there frequently maybe 15-20 years ago, and I don't ever remember seeing that.


I go through there a lot, and I think it's been there forever.  In fact I think it predates I-43.  I very well could be wrong however.

I believe you're correct.  ISTR that is was there back in the WI-15 days in the early 80's.  The I-43 shield got tacked on after the switch.


And that would make the signing perfect sense when you think about it.  Back then WI-15 started in downtown Beloit, continued up the current WI-81 on the east side of town, and then up the current I-43.  There was never a need for a BGS with a WI-15 shield, because you were already on WI-15.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on August 14, 2013, 01:12:18 PM
Updates from the Central Segment meeting have now been updated online.

http://projects.511wi.gov/web/i-39-90-project

Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on October 19, 2013, 08:42:16 PM
I attended the PIM about the southern segment of the I-39/90 project on Thursday. They had information on most of the exits/overpasses they plan to use in the area, but did not discuss the I-39/90 - 43 - Hwy 81 interchange - they are reserving that one for a future PIM. Apparently this one is a tough nut to crack.

The one big piece of new information was a diverging-diamond interchange (DDI) proposed for the Hwy 11/Avalon Rd exit. WisDOT representatives indicated the DDI would handle turning truck traffic easier than the previously-proposed roundabouts. It certainly went over better with the audience than roundabouts; a considerable amount of complaining took place over how people just can't figure out those blasted roundabouts!
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on November 05, 2013, 10:42:05 AM
http://gazettextra.com/article/20131104/ARTICLES/131109915/1059

Officials again looking at possible interchange at I-39/90 and M.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on November 05, 2013, 01:28:45 PM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on November 05, 2013, 10:42:05 AM
http://gazettextra.com/article/20131104/ARTICLES/131109915/1059

Officials again looking at possible interchange at I-39/90 and M.


"Helgesen said his plan eventually could bring between 3,000 and 4,000 jobs, with development of approximately 4 million to 5 million square feet of industrial space. The development could bring in $200 million to $250 million in additional tax base."

Those are some hefty projections.  To give some scope, the GM plant in Janesville is just about 4.8 million square feet and employed 1,700 when it closed.  The businesses located in Gateway Business Park in Beloit employ less than 800 people combined.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on November 11, 2013, 01:51:33 PM
More on the proposed County M intercahnge: http://www.hngnews.com/milton_courier/news/government/article_54d7e674-4701-11e3-9543-001a4bcf6878.html
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Henry on November 11, 2013, 03:38:21 PM
Quote from: SEWIGuy on November 05, 2013, 01:28:45 PM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on November 05, 2013, 10:42:05 AM
http://gazettextra.com/article/20131104/ARTICLES/131109915/1059

Officials again looking at possible interchange at I-39/90 and M.


"Helgesen said his plan eventually could bring between 3,000 and 4,000 jobs, with development of approximately 4 million to 5 million square feet of industrial space. The development could bring in $200 million to $250 million in additional tax base."

Those are some hefty projections.  To give some scope, the GM plant in Janesville is just about 4.8 million square feet and employed 1,700 when it closed.  The businesses located in Gateway Business Park in Beloit employ less than 800 people combined.
Talk about blown chances! Those autobuilders sure could've used it back then.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on November 13, 2013, 12:45:01 AM
If Milton (town and/or village) wants a CTH M interchange that much, they should pay 100% of the cost.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on December 16, 2013, 02:38:04 PM
South Segment Meeting info now available --> Maps/exibits
http://projects.511wi.gov/web/i-39-90-project/#

This has to do with the I-39/90 and I-43 interchange.

Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 05, 2014, 10:55:35 PM
I went to the PIM this evening concerning the I-39/90 - I-43 - Hwy 81 interchange in Beloit.

Long story short - flyovers are planned for the interstate-to-interstate movements, Hwy 81/Milwaukee Rd gets extended to the County X/Hart Rd exit off I-43, direct access to Hwy 81/Milwaukee Rd is maintained for I-39/90 traffic, and I-43 traffic has to exit at Hart Rd to continue into Beloit.

That last portion was easily the most contentious with business owners who are on or near Milwaukee Rd. Their contention is that travelers will opt to stop in South Beloit or elsewhere instead of Beloit, and that people will have trouble navigating the new arrangement. I don't think it's going to be the issue they're making it out to be, but it's certainly a downgrade from what they had before.

They're still indecisive about what the street intersections will look like. They're leaning toward a diverging diamond for the I-39/90 @ Hwy 81/Milwaukee Rd interchange. As usual, the audience heavily panned the roundabouts, but were OK with the diverging diamond.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 06, 2014, 01:37:02 AM
That 'extension' of WI 81/Milwaukee Rd actually restores the connection that was there before the highway to the northeast of I-39/90 began evolving into today's I-43.  Restoring that will tie that part of the the City of Beloit back together, making, IMHO, for much more orderly and cohesive city growth and development than had it not been restored.

A DDI at I-39/90/WI 81 (Milwaukee Rd)?  Interesting.

:nod:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on August 06, 2014, 02:48:19 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 05, 2014, 10:55:35 PM
As usual, the audience heavily panned the roundabouts

:banghead: :banghead:
Idiots!

I have found it a little odd that WisDOT wants that WB->NB movement to be a flyover.  Doesn't seem like as it has the traffic for it.  However, it does make it easier to separate local and system movements at this location.  If one was building from scratch in this area, I-43 would likely terminate in a trumpet interchange at 39/90.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 06, 2014, 03:43:38 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 06, 2014, 02:48:19 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 05, 2014, 10:55:35 PM
As usual, the audience heavily panned the roundabouts

:banghead: :banghead:
Idiots!

I have found it a little odd that WisDOT wants that WB->NB movement to be a flyover.  Doesn't seem like as it has the traffic for it.  However, it does make it easier to separate local and system movements at this location.  If one was building from scratch in this area, I-43 would likely terminate in a trumpet interchange at 39/90.

The very original plans were for what is now I-43 to pass east-west between Beloit and Janesville, continuing on westward to feed into present-day WI 11/81 on the south edge of Brodhead.

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 06, 2014, 09:12:30 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on August 06, 2014, 02:48:19 PM
I have found it a little odd that WisDOT wants that WB->NB movement to be a flyover.

That's poor explanation on my part. This is the plan they presented last night: http://projects.511wi.gov/documents/33947/d60c0561-53f2-446c-aed8-6abf38516c74

The WB-> NB movement doesn't fly over anything (since there's nothing to fly over). NB->EB crosses over the extended Milwaukee Rd. The NB exit to Milwaukee Rd splits off from the NB->EB movement. SB->EB and WB->SB obviously are flyovers.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on August 07, 2014, 03:29:35 AM
Crap, I inverted the direction I was trying to talk about.  :-o

The point was, movement between the northern and eastern legs of the system interchange are fairly low volume.  Those ramps look to have a design speed of at least 55 mph and as such, they take up quite a bit of land.  They will be great to drive, but may be a tad overkill.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 08, 2014, 08:06:44 PM
The answer from WisDOT is that they are required to make the interstate-to-interstate connections high-speed. Yeah, that was brought up during the PIM too. ;-)
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SSOWorld on August 09, 2014, 08:46:40 AM
Required by whom? I find it ironic that if that is true, then why are many I-to-I connections - especially in less populated areas - still have cloverleaf or trumpets.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Revive 755 on August 09, 2014, 12:37:34 PM
^ I think it may be one of those supposedly FHWA requirements that is being made up by either the state DOT, or the state FHWA office.  Otherwise, I-74 at I-155 in Illinois should be becoming a semi-direct T instead of remaining a trumpet, and there wouldn't (I'd hope) be an alternative under consideration for leaving the SB I-55 to EB I-72 ramp as a loop around Springfield, IL.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on August 10, 2014, 12:55:41 PM
Quote from: JREwing78 on August 08, 2014, 08:06:44 PM
The answer from WisDOT is that they are required to make the interstate-to-interstate connections high-speed. Yeah, that was brought up during the PIM too. ;-)

High-speed?  I thought it just had to be free-flowing.  Like every loop ramp that handles interstate-interstate traffic.
See the Cascade Interchange and it's EB->NB loop ramp and the way it is barrier-separated from WI 78 as an example.

That 'requirement' is at least one form of bullcrap.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:31:36 AM
As somebody who uses the I-43 and I-39/90 interchange 8 times (or more) a week, here are my observations on the design-

-I personally think the fly-over and entrance ramps from SB 39/90 to NB 43 and SB43 to NB 39/90 are OVERKILL (though I see a lot of summer tourist traffic using the current ramps in place), but I think the DOT is building these as high speed ramps to try to entice drivers from using US14 between Janesville and I-43 and to use the interstates instead.  I could see the state putting up signage north of Janesville similar to the signs east of Lake Geneva that tell traffic to "use 12 and 43 to Delavan instead of WIS 50"- such as "Elkhorn & Lake Geneva traffic- use I-39/90 to I-43 North".  There have been too many deadly accidents on US14 (at least 2 this summer I think) and I don't think the state has any definite plans to widen this stretch or improve it to meet the traffic demand (especially on weekends). 

-I understand the business' complaints about losing customers- I may be one of them.  Now, I regularly use one of the gas stations in Beloit because of the ability to get on and off the freeway very easily and the station is usually a few cents cheaper than the others along my route.  At this time, I also am able to see the prices on the signs to determine if I want to utilize that station or not as I approach my exit onto I-39/90 SB. 

Now in order to use the same station in the future, I would have to exit a couple miles a way, and go through two roundabouts (possibly 4 if the engineers get their way) all while trusting gasbuddy.com will be correct for once.  Very unlikely that I will go through this inconvience regularly to save a couple cents a gallon. 

-On the exit to WI-81 and I-43 towards Milwaukee from NB I-39/90, why is the state wasting money on the bridge where traffic exiting off at Beloit goes under the through traffic lanes onto I-43.  When traffic exits off I-39/90, mark the left lane as an exit only for Beloit/WI-81 and the right lane(s) as I-43 NB to Milwaukee.  I imagine extending the three lane ramp configuration further south to accomodate for a dedicated left-hand exit to Beloit while maintaining two lanes for I-43 Milwaukee ramp would be a LOT cheaper than building a bridge on a floodplain.

-Thank goodness DOT came to their senses and decided to drop lanes for the traffic merging from I-43 W to I-39/90 SB instead of dropping the left lane as was drawn up in the original plans.  Having the left lane end for through traffic on 39/90 SB at Colley Rd. would have just been a road rage/pissing match nightmare (especially on Sundays) and traffic counts coming in from I-43 doesn't justify a lane for itself.  Just wish they would extend that auxilliary lane from I-43 until the bridge at Colley Rd (already built to only handle three lanes of traffic).  With the current set-up, it seems like a pretty tight area to have to make two merges if you are in the right lane coming off the fly-over ramp.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:52:22 AM
Quote from: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:31:36 AM
-On the exit to WI-81 and I-43 towards Milwaukee from NB I-39/90, why is the state wasting money on the bridge where traffic exiting off at Beloit goes under the through traffic lanes onto I-43.  When traffic exits off I-39/90, mark the left lane as an exit only for Beloit/WI-81 and the right lane(s) as I-43 NB to Milwaukee.  I imagine extending the three lane ramp configuration further south to accomodate for a dedicated left-hand exit to Beloit while maintaining two lanes for I-43 Milwaukee ramp would be a LOT cheaper than building a bridge on a floodplain.

Just thought of a better idea...  Just separate the exit for WI-81 Beloit to start after I-43 Milwaukee splits from 39/90....  The only issue I can see is having enough length to slow traffic down on the ramp before intersecting WI-81.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 12, 2014, 12:55:47 PM
Quote from: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:52:22 AM
Quote from: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:31:36 AM
-On the exit to WI-81 and I-43 towards Milwaukee from NB I-39/90, why is the state wasting money on the bridge where traffic exiting off at Beloit goes under the through traffic lanes onto I-43.  When traffic exits off I-39/90, mark the left lane as an exit only for Beloit/WI-81 and the right lane(s) as I-43 NB to Milwaukee.  I imagine extending the three lane ramp configuration further south to accomodate for a dedicated left-hand exit to Beloit while maintaining two lanes for I-43 Milwaukee ramp would be a LOT cheaper than building a bridge on a floodplain.

Just thought of a better idea...  Just separate the exit for WI-81 Beloit to start after I-43 Milwaukee splits from 39/90....  The only issue I can see is having enough length to slow traffic down on the ramp before intersecting WI-81.

Several of the options that were being considered included direct access between I-43 (to/from Milwaukee) and Milwaukee Rd (WI 81) at I-39/90.

Remember that before the highway upgrades that created current I-43, old WI 15 (what became I-43) was a two-lane surface road.  That 'old' road is now County 'X' to the northeast.  A big feature of the adopted plan is to restore that surface road connection (County 'X' <-> Milwaukee Rd), tying the local street system back together and eliminating a major disconnect, in a rapidly developing part of the City of Beloit.

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on August 12, 2014, 03:05:29 PM
Graphics from the Beloit meeting are available on the project website.

South Segment --> Maps/exhibits

http://projects.511wi.gov/web/i-39-90-project/
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on August 12, 2014, 03:10:38 PM
Looking at the signage link (http://projects.511wi.gov/documents/33947/b4eb167e-b48c-43ee-a947-f080845556aa), wondering why the DOT would want to sign WI-81 at the CTY X interchange on I-43 northbound.  Seems like overkill as all traffic heading north would have originated from the I-39/90 and already had their own exit for 81.  I would just sign it as 'X'.

Or am I just missing something?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on August 12, 2014, 08:31:10 PM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on August 12, 2014, 03:10:38 PM
Looking at the signage link (http://projects.511wi.gov/documents/33947/b4eb167e-b48c-43ee-a947-f080845556aa), wondering why the DOT would want to sign WI-81 at the CTY X interchange on I-43 northbound.  Seems like overkill as all traffic heading north would have originated from the I-39/90 and already had their own exit for 81.  I would just sign it as 'X'.

Or am I just missing something?

I suspect that it is because that restored section of Milwaukee Rd out to Hart Rd, plus that short piece of Hart Rd from there north to I-43, will become WI 81.

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on August 15, 2014, 07:16:16 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on August 12, 2014, 12:55:47 PM
Quote from: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:52:22 AM
Quote from: UNDSIOUX on August 12, 2014, 11:31:36 AM
-On the exit to WI-81 and I-43 towards Milwaukee from NB I-39/90, why is the state wasting money on the bridge where traffic exiting off at Beloit goes under the through traffic lanes onto I-43.  When traffic exits off I-39/90, mark the left lane as an exit only for Beloit/WI-81 and the right lane(s) as I-43 NB to Milwaukee.  I imagine extending the three lane ramp configuration further south to accomodate for a dedicated left-hand exit to Beloit while maintaining two lanes for I-43 Milwaukee ramp would be a LOT cheaper than building a bridge on a floodplain.

Just thought of a better idea...  Just separate the exit for WI-81 Beloit to start after I-43 Milwaukee splits from 39/90....  The only issue I can see is having enough length to slow traffic down on the ramp before intersecting WI-81.

Several of the options that were being considered included direct access between I-43 (to/from Milwaukee) and Milwaukee Rd (WI 81) at I-39/90.

Remember that before the highway upgrades that created current I-43, old WI 15 (what became I-43) was a two-lane surface road.  That 'old' road is now County 'X' to the northeast.  A big feature of the adopted plan is to restore that surface road connection (County 'X' <-> Milwaukee Rd), tying the local street system back together and eliminating a major disconnect, in a rapidly developing part of the City of Beloit.

Mike

At the PIM, they also cited cost as a concern when brainstorming other options for directly connecting Hwy 81/Milwaukee St to I-43. They would likely have to grade-separate the EBD off-ramp and WBD on-ramp to I-43 from traffic intending to exit to Hwy 81/Milwaukee St, as well as purchase additional right-of-way.

I'm also pretty sure a left-exit to Beloit would be verboten.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on September 04, 2014, 09:36:51 PM
Janesville Gazette: 2015 could be busy for Interstate alternative route

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:wToMg_WhrbkJ:www.gazettextra.com/20140813/2015_could_be_busy_for_interstate_alternative_route+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Jim920 on September 05, 2014, 01:54:31 AM
Wow, 12 lanes between US-14 and WI-26, that's going to be a tight fit!  I knew they were combining both interchanges with C/D roadways, however I didn't think the mainline would continue with 4 through lanes.  I just assumed the right most lane would become and exit only for 14/26 and have 3 through lanes.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on September 05, 2014, 03:02:07 PM
Quote from: Jim920 on September 05, 2014, 01:54:31 AM
Wow, 12 lanes between US-14 and WI-26, that's going to be a tight fit!  I knew they were combining both interchanges with C/D roadways, however I didn't think the mainline would continue with 4 through lanes.  I just assumed the right most lane would become and exit only for 14/26 and have 3 through lanes.

And then when the time comes to further upgrade the WI 26 interchange to eliminate the stop-and-go lights on WI 26, along with free-flow ramps in the major turn directions (NB I-39/90 -> NB WI 26 and SB WI 26 -> SB I-39/90) . . . .

:wow:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on October 08, 2014, 01:06:25 PM
WisDOT posted an animation of the upcoming DDI at I-39/90 and Hwy 26:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7L0gtmRzgd8#t=10
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on October 12, 2014, 07:06:39 PM
One of WisDOT's priorities this summer was complete reconstruction of Hwy 73 between I-39/90 in Edgerton and US-12/18 near Cambridge. I took a cruise down it this afternoon, and it's hardly recognizable from its previous narrow, rutted, frost-heaved iteration. The highway was completely regraded, realigned, widened, and rebuilt to modern standards. It (mostly) has it's initial layer of asphalt laid, with some turn lanes and intersections remaining.

According to the posted signs, they have a little under three weeks to complete the rebuild, which should be entirely possible.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on November 02, 2014, 08:37:48 AM
Discussion about the impacts of upcoming I-39/90 construction on Edgerton:

Alternate route through Edgerton: Five-year boon or bust?
http://www.gazettextra.com/20141102/alternate_route_through_edgerton_five_year_boon_or_bust
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on November 02, 2014, 01:45:35 PM
Is it really realistic to think that traffic is going to double on US-51 through Edgerton during the reconstruction?  Do people usually exit the mainline interstate and get on the local highways instead?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on November 02, 2014, 06:04:26 PM
I suspect they will when traffic backs up sufficiently on the interstate. They're not going to exit when traffic is flowing, but if traffic is at a standstill, and they see the opportunity to bail, they will. Ditto for Hwy 73 north to US-12/18.

One route that would be genuinely useful as a reliever route for I-39/90 would be US-14 between Madison and Janesville. Even without I-39/90 construction, I frequently took US-14 returning to Madison in the evening because the traffic was less maddening.

WisDOT has studies for the Oregon to Janesville segment, including the unofficial Evansville bypass of Territorial and Bullard Rds. They also appear to finally be pushing the widening of US-14 south to Hwy 92 outside Brooklyn, if the recent PIM and revived plans are any indication. Downside: that project won't be completed until AFTER the I-39/90 expansion.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: DaBigE on January 18, 2015, 12:39:13 AM
There is another study gaining traction along I-39, except it's the stretch between roughly the Beltline Interchange and the I-39 split near Portage (WisDOT already has a logo out for it). They've had one PIM for it--last week--caught me a bit off-guard. Just some rough ideas right now: potential problem areas that need addressing, future interchanges/overpasses, etc. All the materials that were at the PIM are on the study's website: http://www.wisconsindot.gov/projects/swregion/399094/index.htm (http://www.wisconsindot.gov/projects/swregion/399094/index.htm). Dirt would not begin to fly until 2025 at the earliest; no funding is currently appropriated other than for the study.

They also have an interactive survey that I highly recommend participating in: https://i399094.metroquest.com/ (https://i399094.metroquest.com/)
(I'm not directly working on this project, at least not in the near-term, but I do have a couple close friends/colleagues that are). The latter part of the survey (Tab 4) includes an interactive map that you can place coded pins on and describe the issue you would like to see addressed.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on February 17, 2015, 05:11:34 PM
Some more info about the I-39/90 and I-43 interchange at Beloit and how WI-81 gets tied into everything here:
http://projects.511wi.gov/web/i-39-90-project/resources?p_p_id=articles_WAR_Articlesportlet_INSTANCE_dLR8&p_p_lifecycle=0&p_p_state=normal&p_p_mode=view&p_p_col_id=column-1&p_p_col_count=1&articleReq=2063815

There are plans now for 3 DDIs in Rock County: WI-81 at I-39/90, WI-11 West (Avalon Rd) at I-39/90, and WI-26 at I-39/90.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: mgk920 on February 18, 2015, 11:08:28 AM
^^
Overall, I really like it.  It makes the correct interstate-to-interstate connections while correcting the serious Milwaukee Rd street disconnect that crept in over the years as the former WI 15 progressively morphed into I-43.

One change that I would make if I was the Poo-Bah in charge is that I would have also included a crossing of I-43 in the area of Gateway Bd/Lathers Rd, this to better tie the city's street network together.  I am aware of the land topography/elevation issue there for such a crossing, though (it would have to go under I-43 and then up through a fairly deep cut on the north side of I-43).

I also note from the handout material that WisDOT is showing the restored 'Milwaukee Rd' being marked as 'WI 81', I assume to extend out to and end at the I-43/Hart Rd interchange.

:nod:

Mike
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: NE2 on February 18, 2015, 11:56:36 AM
Poo-baaing is cool.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on February 18, 2015, 08:59:58 PM
Quote from: mgk920 on February 18, 2015, 11:08:28 AM
I also note from the handout material that WisDOT is showing the restored 'Milwaukee Rd' being marked as 'WI 81', I assume to extend out to and end at the I-43/Hart Rd interchange.

That is correct.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SSOWorld on February 18, 2015, 11:27:17 PM
More death-diamonds? why?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: NE2 on February 18, 2015, 11:34:57 PM
Quote from: SSOWorld on February 18, 2015, 11:27:17 PM
More death-diamonds? why?
Because they work?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on September 23, 2015, 10:53:56 AM
Work has been delayed on 39/90 between Madison and the Illinois border.
New dates: http://projects.511wi.gov/i-39-90/schedule/

Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: ET21 on September 23, 2015, 12:26:50 PM
6 years of yuck lol
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: I-39 on September 23, 2015, 12:46:27 PM
What the heck is going on here? Why is this getting delayed? This should be on the TOP of the list of projects. This should be moved up, not back.

So WisDOT feels it's cool to ignore main routes that need rebuilding, but build bypasses of every single major community that has a US highway running through it. Cool.



Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on September 23, 2015, 12:59:16 PM
My neighbor's theory is that the state legislators are sticking it to Dane and Rock Counties (Madison, Janesville, Beloit) since they almost always vote democratic.  My feeling is that may be a bit true, but they probably wanted to spread the money and projects out around the state instead of just the populated areas.  I'd rather the money go to wherever it does the most good instead of local pet projects, but I don't get a vote.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on September 23, 2015, 04:03:30 PM
They are delaying it until they get an injection of money from the feds.
That's my bet.

You watch; in a year or two, it will suddenly be full speed ahead.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: peterj920 on September 23, 2015, 05:26:44 PM
According to the new schedule, it looks like it's being delayed about 2-3 years.  The I-43 Interchange was supposed to be done by 2018, now it's 2020.  Right now, there are a lot of major projects that are being worked on that have significant progress.  The Zoo Interchange, the Wis 441 project, and the North-South Freeway project.  The Wis 23 project between Fond Du Lac and Plymouth was supposed to start this year, but Judge Adleman vacated the EIS and that project has been shelved indefinitely.  Another major project that hasn't started yet is Wis 15 between New London and Greenville.  That also may be delayed.  There's just so many projects that are being worked on, it's hard to delay other major projects that are far along.   
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on September 23, 2015, 07:29:14 PM
WI 23 and WI 15 can wait in my opinion.

The delay for I-43 north of Silver Spring sucks.  That stretch of freeway should have been modernized 30 years ago.

For I-39/90, it might have been better to go forward on the expansion from IL to Janesville (less the I-43 interchange) and bump the expansion between Janesville and Madison longer rather than stringing out the entire project like they seem to be doing.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Roadguy on September 23, 2015, 07:32:59 PM
The delay is not due to federal money.  These majors projects already have pretty low federal funding percentages with them (usually averaging around 30% with past majors).  We are witnessing the first string of delays due to the $500 million cut in the state transportation budget passed last June.  They won't blame it on that due to political reasons but that is the cause.  The project team was well on the original track to delivering the project in the original schedule.  Expect additional delays on Wis 441 (the eastern end of the project), North-South (already been delayed multiple times), and at this point I doubt 15 (Hortonville Bypass) will get built anytime soon (I think they would be lucky with the status of the state transportation budget it gets built).

If you think things are going to get better 2 years from now when the next state budget gets passed, take a hard look at the numbers.  The budget 2 years from now without any added funded (whether re-directed or new) to transportation will mean even more cuts than the $500 million if the want to maintain the existing bonding levels.  Wisconsin is at the 20% threshold where that percentage of the gas tax and registration fees coming in are needed to pay off existing bonding from past budgets.  If they keep bonding, it only means a higher percentage of those collected dollars (gas tax and registration fees) will go towards debt payment versus road construction.

39/90 will probably need to see a major re-scope for cost savings if the state wants to keep it on the delayed schedule that was just released.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: Rothman on September 24, 2015, 09:07:22 AM
Quote from: Roadguy on September 23, 2015, 07:32:59 PM
The delay is not due to federal money.  These majors projects already have pretty low federal funding percentages with them (usually averaging around 30% with past majors). 

That's bizarre if it's true.  Must be because of the share of federal funds distributed to Wisconsin, but this work would be National Highway Performance Program eligible and I'd wonder why Wisconsin would be using non-federal funds to complete major interstate work.

Then again, there's a proposed plan here in NY due to a shot of state bond money (to fill a hole to bring NYSDOT up to where it was per the state budget rather than true additional funds) to use a lot of that on huge projects as well and let the fed dollars go to all sorts of maintenance needs across NYSDOT's regions.  Perhaps Wisconsin somehow ended up in the same boat.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on September 24, 2015, 10:04:33 AM
Quote from: Roadguy on September 23, 2015, 07:32:59 PM
The delay is not due to federal money.  These majors projects already have pretty low federal funding percentages with them (usually averaging around 30% with past majors).  We are witnessing the first string of delays due to the $500 million cut in the state transportation budget passed last June.  They won't blame it on that due to political reasons but that is the cause.  The project team was well on the original track to delivering the project in the original schedule.  Expect additional delays on Wis 441 (the eastern end of the project), North-South (already been delayed multiple times), and at this point I doubt 15 (Hortonville Bypass) will get built anytime soon (I think they would be lucky with the status of the state transportation budget it gets built).

If you think things are going to get better 2 years from now when the next state budget gets passed, take a hard look at the numbers.  The budget 2 years from now without any added funded (whether re-directed or new) to transportation will mean even more cuts than the $500 million if the want to maintain the existing bonding levels.  Wisconsin is at the 20% threshold where that percentage of the gas tax and registration fees coming in are needed to pay off existing bonding from past budgets.  If they keep bonding, it only means a higher percentage of those collected dollars (gas tax and registration fees) will go towards debt payment versus road construction.

39/90 will probably need to see a major re-scope for cost savings if the state wants to keep it on the delayed schedule that was just released.



Exactly.  And the bonding issue isn't just related to roads.  The state has stopped or delayed numerous building projects across the state and the University system due to concerns over borrowing levels.  When you cut income tax, and refuse to raise gas tax, this is really an inevitable result. 
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: The Ghostbuster on September 24, 2015, 03:50:12 PM
That's a bummer 39/90 is being delayed, along with those other projects. But what are you going to do?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: I-39 on September 24, 2015, 05:39:49 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on September 24, 2015, 03:50:12 PM
That's a bummer 39/90 is being delayed, along with those other projects. But what are you going to do?

Time to raise the gas tax to get things moving again, but that will never happen.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on September 24, 2015, 06:31:57 PM
Tolls.
:poke: :ded: :-D
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: CtrlAltDel on September 24, 2015, 06:56:04 PM
Quote from: peterj920 on September 23, 2015, 05:26:44 PM
According to the new schedule, it looks like it's being delayed about 2-3 years.  The I-43 Interchange was supposed to be done by 2018, now it's 2020.

Did they pick an alternative for the I-43 interchange?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: I-39 on September 24, 2015, 08:29:46 PM
Quote from: triplemultiplex on September 24, 2015, 06:31:57 PM
Tolls.
:poke: :ded: :-D

No, Gas Tax increase. And perhaps a tax on electric charging stations for electric cars.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: peterj920 on September 25, 2015, 12:14:05 AM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on September 24, 2015, 06:56:04 PM
Quote from: peterj920 on September 23, 2015, 05:26:44 PM
According to the new schedule, it looks like it's being delayed about 2-3 years.  The I-43 Interchange was supposed to be done by 2018, now it's 2020.

Did they pick an alternative for the I-43 interchange?

They did.  It's a semi-directional T for I-43, then Wis 81 will have a diverging diamond interchange with I-39/90, and access to I-43 to Beloit will be at the County X/Hart Rd Interchange.  Here is the preferred alternative.  It's a large file so it may take a couple moments to load.

http://projects.511wi.gov/i-39-90/wp-content/uploads/sites/145/20150211-Interchange-Preferred-Alternative_South.pdf
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on July 07, 2016, 10:20:52 AM
http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/m-fed-grant-would-mean-earlier-expansion-of-i-/article_6c309d78-42eb-5353-be67-c7e511769032.html

$40M fed grant would mean earlier expansion of I-39/90 near Janesville

QuoteWith the grant, construction on the four-mile section between Avalon Road and Highway 14 will begin in 2018 instead of 2020 as initially planned.

The project will expand the number of lanes from four to eight.

The segment carries, on average, 57,000 cars each day and has the highest amount traffic of any portion of the 45 miles of interstate between the Illinois border and Madison, according to WisDOT.

Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: I-39 on July 07, 2016, 11:31:51 AM
Quote from: WarrenWallace on July 07, 2016, 10:20:52 AM
http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/m-fed-grant-would-mean-earlier-expansion-of-i-/article_6c309d78-42eb-5353-be67-c7e511769032.html

$40M fed grant would mean earlier expansion of I-39/90 near Janesville

QuoteWith the grant, construction on the four-mile section between Avalon Road and Highway 14 will begin in 2018 instead of 2020 as initially planned.

The project will expand the number of lanes from four to eight.

The segment carries, on average, 57,000 cars each day and has the highest amount traffic of any portion of the 45 miles of interstate between the Illinois border and Madison, according to WisDOT.

So is this just for the lanes or will they also be doing the interchanges in that segment at the same time?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: hobsini2 on July 07, 2016, 11:33:25 AM
I-39, I would guess that since they recently redid the Wis 11 interchange, it would be for just adding lanes.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: I-39 on July 07, 2016, 11:41:53 AM
Quote from: hobsini2 on July 07, 2016, 11:33:25 AM
I-39, I would guess that since they recently redid the Wis 11 interchange, it would be for just adding lanes.

The US 14 and WIS 26 interchanges will be reconstructed/reconfigured in the Janesville area as part of this project too, so I was wondering if those will be moved up as a result of this.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: The Ghostbuster on July 07, 2016, 05:14:55 PM
I still can't believe they are holding off on the reconstruction of the Interstate 39/90 interchange with US 12/18. I think it should have been reconstructed with the rest of the Madison-to-State Line project.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on July 11, 2016, 10:03:13 PM
Looks like I was at least partially right:

Quote from: triplemultiplex on September 23, 2015, 04:03:30 PM
They are delaying it until they get an injection of money from the feds.
That's my bet.
You watch; in a year or two, it will suddenly be full speed ahead.

:sombrero:
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: I-39 on July 11, 2016, 10:08:38 PM
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on July 07, 2016, 05:14:55 PM
I still can't believe they are holding off on the reconstruction of the Interstate 39/90 interchange with US 12/18. I think it should have been reconstructed with the rest of the Madison-to-State Line project.

I thought they were still supposed to? They had an information meeting in the Spring, but it's not in the schedule. Someone should contact WisDOT regarding the status of it.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: paulthemapguy on July 12, 2016, 08:57:33 PM
Hey, help a poor FIB out...When you talk about a reconstruction of the 39/90 and 12/18 interchange, does that include any realignment of the ramps?  Or just a replacement of the roadbeds (i.e. dig it out and put it back)?
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on July 12, 2016, 10:24:33 PM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on July 12, 2016, 08:57:33 PM
Hey, help a poor FIB out...When you talk about a reconstruction of the 39/90 and 12/18 interchange, does that include any realignment of the ramps?  Or just a replacement of the roadbeds (i.e. dig it out and put it back)?
WisDOT's latest preferred alternative is a massive rebuild into a turbine interchange with all exits and entrances on the right and some ramp braiding between the system interchange and Stoughton Road (US 51).
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on July 13, 2016, 10:53:39 AM
Quote from: paulthemapguy on July 12, 2016, 08:57:33 PM
Hey, help a poor FIB out...When you talk about a reconstruction of the 39/90 and 12/18 interchange, does that include any realignment of the ramps?  Or just a replacement of the roadbeds (i.e. dig it out and put it back)?


It would be a complete interchange redesign which would likely move the left exits to the right.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: WarrenWallace on July 13, 2016, 10:58:34 AM
http://projects.511wi.gov/i-39-90/segments/north/maps/

The latest alternative for the I-39/90 interchange with the Beltline.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: on_wisconsin on July 17, 2016, 12:40:55 PM
Unfortunately, the state will probably go with A-1 or (more likely) F, given the current budget crap going on within the DOT.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: JREwing78 on July 17, 2016, 11:48:11 PM
Strictly speaking, the only thing that WisDOT really has to do at the Beltline interchange is tie the leftmost lane of I-39/90 northbound into the left exit at the Beltline, and transition the onramp from the eastbound Beltline into the far right lane on southbound I-39/90.

There are compelling reasons to ditch the left exits. But this interchange isn't going to make or break the I-39/90 upgrades.

Say they wanted to punch a 3-lane mainline through this interchange. The major piece - the new NBD carriageway, can be done outside of the other changes to the interchange. Adding a third lane to southbound I-39/90 through here is likewise a simple undertaking. They can do it anytime.

If this is the piece that doesn't happen until 2022 or later, that's fine. Not doing this interchange right now is not a showstopper.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: SEWIGuy on July 18, 2016, 09:52:18 AM
Unless I am mistaken, every alternative gets rid of the sole remaining left hand exit (I-39/90 North to US-12/18 West).  The only problem with some of the alternatives is that the cloverleaf exits remain from I-39/90 South to US-12/18 West, and US-12/18 East to I-39/90 South.

Those cloverleafs are not ideal.  However they aren't horrendous.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: dfwmapper on July 23, 2016, 10:06:54 PM
E-1 and F maintain a left exit for the EB to NB movement. All alternatives eliminate weaving on the I-39/90 mainline, which is the important thing. D-1 seems like the best all-around option to me, keeping a loop for the movement almost no one is going to use, eliminating all left exits, eliminating all weaving, and still keeping a two-level design to keep the cost down.
Title: Re: I-39/I-90 study in southern Wisconsin
Post by: triplemultiplex on July 24, 2016, 12:27:35 PM
Big fan of alt E1; at least half the EB traffic on the beltline is heading north on 39/90 so that is a situation where a left diverging ramp is called for.

Alt F is not going to happen, I predict, because it needs a shit ton of new r/w for an interchange with an already enormous footprint.

All of the options eliminate the left exit NB on 39/90 which is great.
All of the options add a SB c/d lane for the loop ramps (except for the one that adds a turbine ramp SB->EB, naturally); also great.
The ramp braiding between the Beltline interchange and Stoughton Rd seems like a good idea, though I personally have not had much trouble with weaving traffic there.  But I'm never traveling that way during morning rush and I'm usually coming from the north and then exiting the Beltline right away at Stoughton Rd or Monona Dr, so I don't really have to change lanes.