Interstate 87 (NC-VA)

[adventurernumber1]

What difference does it make? Exactly zero people outside of this forum care whether 87 is the 'right' number for the road. The grid was only relevant when deciding the numbers for the initial routes.

I agree. It could be Interstate 90210 and I doubt there would be much protest.

You're both right. Unfortunately, I don't think theres much we can do about the numbering, which means to everyone outside this forum, my Interstate 46 suggestion is probably meaningless and would be to no avail. With that said, I have come up with a possible solution to fix up this I-87 stuff (which, I-87 isn't breaking any rules that I know of, I just personally don't think it is the best fit for this corridor) in the General Highway Talk - Duplicate Interstates thread:

With that said, it sounds like we will have to accept the Interstate 87 numbering, and with that said, I would be all for extending this new I-87 corridor north onto the Delmarva Peninsula, up to Wilmington, Delaware, then possibly have a brief concurrency with I-95 then I-295 into New Jersey, then have I-87 routed along the New Jersey Turnpike and later concurrent with I-95 along it until reaching New York City, and reaching the current, northern Interstate 87. Should that happen, the southernmost section of current I-87 from I-95 to I-278 could be an unused even I-x87 interstate designation, such like that of how I-75 in downtown Knoxville, Tennessee became Interstate 275. That might potentially sound wacky - possibly either like a really good idea or a really bad idea. But it would connect the two I-87s. While a lot of I-87 would be out of the grid, its southernmost part in North Carolina between Raleigh and I-95, and all of the current, northern I-87 in New York would not be. This could also work since it looks like they aren't going to change the numbering of I-97 and I-99 (which are both badly numbered, but that we have all long accepted, besides our fantasizing), and should a proposed Interstate 101 still come into play, it could connect I-87 in NC to I-95 in GA or SC, serving the east coast in that region. That is the best way (that I know of) we could modify the creation of this southern, duplicate Interstate 87.

[The Ghostbuster]

Put your second paragraph in Fictional Highways. I doubt the two Interstate 87s will ever be connected. Just like the two 74s, the two 76s, the two 84s, the two 86s, and the two 88s.

[Rothman]

Put your second paragraph in Fictional Highways. I doubt the two Interstate 87s will ever be connected. Just like the two 74s, the two 76s, the two 84s, the two 86s, and the two 88s.

...and the two 99s.

[english si]

and the four I-69s (MI-IN, KY, TN-MS, TX). OK, the northern two might get joined together...

[The Ghostbuster]

Oh right, can't forget those. However, those two routes have a higher likelihood of perhaps ultimately being connected, than the other ones mentioned.

[Bobby5280]

Mississippi's portion of I-69 and the Great River Bridge are both long shots of ever getting built any time soon. I-69 in Arkansas and Louisiana will only get short segments completed in a few spots over the next 10-20 years.

[Henry]

Put your second paragraph in Fictional Highways. I doubt the two Interstate 87s will ever be connected. Just like the two 74s, the two 76s, the two 84s, the two 86s, and the two 88s.

...and the two 99s.

and the four I-69s (MI-IN, KY, TN-MS, TX). OK, the northern two might get joined together...

...(ahem) and the two I-49s (AR), at least until that section in the middle gets built.

[bob7374]

Apparently, the FHWA has approved the decommissioning of I-495 between I-440 and I-540 and approved the establishment of I-87 from I-40 in Raleigh (running with with I-440 for its first 2.9 miles) 12.9 miles to the end of the Knightdale Bypass at US 64 Business. This is now listed in the updated FHWA Table 1 -Main Routes of the Interstate System, updated on Feb. 21:
https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/national_highway_system/interstate_highway_system/routefinder/table01.cfm

(I-495 is no longer listed for North Carolina on Table 2)

And, not related to I-87, but I-14 has been added for Texas totaling 25.1 miles.

[LM117]

I-495 is still listed in Tables 3 & 4 for NC.

[froggie]

Nothing new here, either.

[LM117]

Sooooo....which is it? FHWA says the Knightdale Bypass and a bit of I-440 is in the Interstate system as I-87 in Tables 1 & 4, I-495 isn't listed on Table 2 but is on Tables 3 & 4, and according to NCDOT I-87 doesn't exist yet and there's been no announcement by them concerning I-495 and I-87 recently. There's also been no applications submitted by NCDOT to AASHTO or FHWA asking for I-495's removal and/or permission to put up I-87 shields.

Is FHWA smoking crack?

[froggie]

We don't know if there have been applications submitted.  Presumably there have been, but if so, the public doesn't have access to them.

[bob7374]

Apparently, the FHWA has approved the decommissioning of I-495 between I-440 and I-540 and approved the establishment of I-87 from I-40 in Raleigh (running with with I-440 for its first 2.9 miles) 12.9 miles to the end of the Knightdale Bypass at US 64 Business. This is now listed in the updated FHWA Table 1 -Main Routes of the Interstate System, updated on Feb. 21:
https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/planning/national_highway_system/interstate_highway_system/routefinder/table01.cfm

(I-495 is no longer listed for North Carolina on Table 2)

Given at least FHWA's official recognition of I-87 in NC, I have created a new NC Future Interstates page based on my previous I-495 page (I've kept the I-495 page up, for now, to document the history of the short-lived route). The link:
http://www.malmeroads.net/ncfutints/fut87.html

[The Ghostbuster]

Maybe the 495 designation should not have been issued, if it was to replaced by a 2-digit Interstate designation only a few years after it was posted. And since 495 will now never reach 95, maybe it should have been an x-40 Interstate spur (although there aren't a lot of numbers to choose from anymore, if they went that route).

[sparker]

Maybe the 495 designation should not have been issued, if it was to replaced by a 2-digit Interstate designation only a few years after it was posted. And since 495 will now never reach 95, maybe it should have been an x-40 Interstate spur (although there aren't a lot of numbers to choose from anymore, if they went that route).

Well, there still aren't any I-340's anywhere!  But IIRC, the "495" designation was specifically selected by Raleigh metro as an indicator that the route was intended to serve as an "umbilical" between itself and the I-95 corridor -- that although removed from the actual 95 alignment by a few dozen miles, the city was still functionally served by it. 

[LM117]

When NCDOT requested I-495, they didn't anticipate the Raleigh-Norfolk corridor being signed into law as quick as it did. They sent an application to FHWA requesting Future I-44 for US-64/17 back in 2012, but it was presumably denied since the route wasn't Congressionally designated and that there was no way NCDOT could meet the 25-year deadline for upgrading the entire corridor to interstate standards unless a huge pile of cash fell in their lap.

I-495 was "Plan B" when I-44 didn't pan out since US-64 between Raleigh and Rocky Mount could easily be upgraded within a 25-year period.

NCDOT swung for the fences with I-44, struck out, used I-495 as a fallback & successfully sold it as a corridor connecting Raleigh to I-95, then got trolled by the FAST Act after I-495 shields went up. Hello I-87. Goodbye I-495.

[vdeane]

If an even number was acceptable before, why wasn't it acceptable now?

[LM117]

If an even number was acceptable before, why wasn't it acceptable now?

My guess is it's for the same reason I-495 is signed N/S rather than E/W: To give Raleigh a "N/S" connection to I-95 and the Northeast while also having an interstate connection to Hampton Roads.

It's also possible that VDOT wanted an odd number, though I doubt that's the case. VA isn't keen on new interstates, especially if I-73 is any indication. There has been no mention of I-87 AT ALL by VDOT. Now, if it benefited Richmond or NoVA, it would probably be different. That being said, I see no hurry for VA to upgrade US-17. There are more important projects in Hampton Roads at the moment.

[Interstate 69 Fan]

Just started updating Wikipedia. Updated the I-495 page. God, this will be a long process. I'm done for now. Glad that I-87 is designated. Get I-42 designated along the beginning of its route.

[The Ghostbuster]

Now that 42 and 87 are designated, are there any near-term plans for upgrading the two roads to Interstate Standards (and converting all of US 70 into a continuous freeway)?

[wdcrft63]

Now that 42 and 87 are designated, are there any near-term plans for upgrading the two roads to Interstate Standards (and converting all of US 70 into a continuous freeway)?

For US 70/I-42 there are web sites with full information:

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/US70corridor/

http://www.super70corridor.com/

I don't think NCDOT has a page yet for I-87 upgrades.

[Mapmikey]

Now that 42 and 87 are designated, are there any near-term plans for upgrading the two roads to Interstate Standards (and converting all of US 70 into a continuous freeway)?

The draft 2017-27 STIP (https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/STIPDocuments1/Draft%202017-2027%20STIP.pdf) says interstate from Williamston to Virginia is undergoing a feasibility study.  It also says the same about upgrading US 64 from Wake County to Williamston.

There are however projects that might contribute to the conversion:  Interchanges with US 17 and Perquimans SR 1300 and Perquimans SR 1336/1338.  Construction slated to start in FY 2025 and 2026 respectively.  US 64 bridge widening at Nash SR 1603 (FY 2025 start)

[WashuOtaku]

Just started updating Wikipedia. Updated the I-495 page. God, this will be a long process. I'm done for now. Glad that I-87 is designated. Get I-42 designated along the beginning of its route.

I reversed them too, because you are jumping the gun.  There are no I-87 guide signs posted, only the "Future" signs; I-495 is still active designation in the state.  Until NCDOT makes the changes, the I-495 article should remain.

[sparker]

Now that 42 and 87 are designated, are there any near-term plans for upgrading the two roads to Interstate Standards (and converting all of US 70 into a continuous freeway)?

US 64 east of the US 258 interchange in Tarboro and all the way to US 17 is already at Interstate standards (shoulders, etc.); it was completed after the 1991 ISTEA act designated it a high-priority corridor (#13).  Whether or not that in itself prompted the upgrade of physical standards on that section is a matter of speculation at this point -- but it's "ready to go".  Nevertheless, there's no indication that it will receive advanced signage; most likely it'll have to wait until the remainder of the route from Knightdale to Tarboro is brought up to spec. 

[Finrod]

I wonder if there's any chance that I-87 will be extended in the future south of Raleigh; the most logical place would be along the US 1 corridor.  I've heard that there is serious local opposition to making US 1 an expressway all the way to Rockingham, who knows if that will change if the possibility of it becoming an interstate gets thrown into the mix.

The most logical place for it to go south of there would be down to I-20 at Camden, but since South Carolina can't seem to get I-73 built to Myrtle Beach, the chances of something like that happening would be remote at best.