Side Mounted 8-inch Signals are not Sufficiently Visable

[Brian556]

I feel that 8-inch side mounted signals are not sufficiently visible and should not be allowed.

The first example is Travis and Cherry Streets in Sherman, Texas.

The good thing about these is that they are yellow and bright. Still, they could easily not be seen because they are so small, not overhead, and outside the drivers cone of vision.



In Denison, Texas it gets even worse. on Main Street, one intersection has modern overhead 12 inch signals, then you have two with black 8-inch side mounted signals, then two intersections with overhead single unit black 8-inch signals.

The 8-inch side mounted signals are very hard to see, even on a cloudy day. The fact that they are painted black and aren't that bright doesn't help. The fact that they are side mounted, while other signals on this street are overhead created an inconsistency problem.





Also, all the old signals on Main St in Denison are in permanent flash mode, and no stop signs have been installed, which is an MUTCD violation.

The fact that the side mounted signals are flashing and are still hard to see is further testament to their deficiency.

[jakeroot]

I agree that, on their own, corner-posted 8-inch signals don't have the best visibility (though they can if posted properly, like at this intersection in Seattle: https://goo.gl/vzesrI). But as a compliment to one or two overhead signals, I think they're just fine. An example of that can be seen here (and at all other intersections) in Vancouver: https://goo.gl/UFiCgU

Like I've mentioned elsewhere a billion times, British Columbia (and agencies within) continue to install 20 cm (8 inch) secondary/auxiliary signal heads at intersections (30 cm/12 inch required for overhead signals). I've never had a hard time noticing the signals before (rainy/cloudy weather very common around here). And you do spend a lot of time looking at the secondary signal heads, because invariably, you end up behind a large truck that's had to divert to a side street, because there's no other good route for them to use.

[Brian556]

Quote from Jakeroot:

I agree that, on their own, corner-posted 8-inch signals don't have the best visibility (though they can if posted properly, like at this intersection in Seattle: https://goo.gl/vzesrI). But as a compliment to one or two overhead signals, I think they're just fine. An example of that can be seen here (and at all other intersections) in Vancouver: https://goo.gl/UFiCgU

Like I've mentioned elsewhere a billion times, British Columbia (and agencies within) continue to install 20 cm (8 inch) secondary/auxiliary signal heads at intersections (30 cm/12 inch required for overhead signals). I've never had a hard time noticing the signals before (rainy/cloudy weather very common around here). And you do spend a lot of time looking at the secondary signal heads, because invariably, you end up behind a large truck that's had to divert to a side street, because there's no other good route for them to use.

I would have no problem with 8-inch signals on the side supplementing an overhead signal. Heck, a single 8-inch signal overhead is sufficiently visible to me (like in one of the pics above).

Concerning the Denison signals, my though was that an 8-inch overhead flasher should be installed at the intersections with side-mounted signals to make the adequately visible and consistent with the two other intersections on the same street that have 8-inch 4-way signals overhead

It's amazing now non-visible the Denison signals are considering how close they are to the traffic lane. The signal head color makes a huge difference in this situation

[plain]

This was a big concern in Richmond when the city had numerous intersections with only side mounted 8 inch signals back in the day. Thankfully they're all gone now... most of those intersections now have overhead 12 inch. The very few intersections left with side mounted signals are also all 12 inch.

[mrsman]

I think that the issue of visibility has a lot to do with the width of the street.  And yes, to some extent to the other signals further along the street.

The first picture that Brian556 posted was bad because you can see the overhead signals up ahead on upcoming intersections.  It makes the current intersection less pronounced and easy to overlook.  Also, it seems that the street was too wide for a side mounted only signal.

Here's the intersection of Buckingham and 29th in Los Angeles (west Adams neighborhood) - perfectly visible because the streets are narrow and the signal is placed in the proper position.  All signals are 8 inch. 

https://www.google.com/maps/@34.0294657,-118.3405882,3a,75y,147.21h,87.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sZTNls7GNuB6MxSXBjIwxAg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

[cpzilliacus]

The District of Columbia used to have nothing but 8" signal heads posted on the sides at intersections.  Now all have been replaced by 12" units, and at least one head is usually mounted on a mast arm.