Has the flashing yellow left turn signal made it to your state?

[slorydn1]

We have them all over the place here now, and I like them. I hated missing the opportunity to turn at the green arrow then sitting forever at a red one while no one was going in the opposite direction making me sit there burning gas for nothing.

[Revive 755]

I haven't seen any of those in KY or OH yet. That will be interesting to see that. Is it possible it could help congestion or safety at some diamond interchanges? I could see it being installed at the I-75/I-71 and KY 1072 interchange which should actually be an SPUI.

There's a bunch around Lexington, KY, and I recall seeing an article a while back indicating that FYA's were going to be installed in Paducah.

[doorknob60]

It appears Bend recently install 3 section FYA signals. This video was posted today on ODOT's Youtube Channel

Interesting that they use the middle head (the yellow one) for the FYA. Most of the time I see these the FYA is in the same spot as the green arrow. I'd prefer that over this. I don't really like them, just use the 4 section signals. Though, this intersection in particular (27th St. and Neff Rd.) should benefit form the FYA. Most of the other signals on 27th have FYAs ever since they upgraded 27th to 4 lanes, but Neff never got them. Not sure why this is on ODOT's page though, both 27th and Neff are not on the state highway system. Maybe just showing an example of the 3 section FYAs (are these the first ones in Oregon?).

[Ace10]

^ There are a lot of 3-section FYAs in Washington County, Oregon where the green and flashing yellow arrows are in the same (bottom) signal head. I did notice a 3-section where the FYA was in the middle just two days ago in Pendleton, I think. I'd rather the green and flashing yellows be in the same signal head so that it's more apparent when the signal changes from flashing yellow to solid yellow. When they're in different heads, there is a clear visual indicator that the signal is changing, but when they occupy the same head, it's not immediately apparent until you notice the flashing has stopped and the arrow is staying steady.

[doogie1303]

Rhode Island finally has a FYA on Rte. 3 in Coventry at the Stop and Shop. I've seen them whenever I travel to Washington state and thought they would never show up here (our state seems to have a love for protected left turns at a majority of intersections), but I guess times are changing.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6805187,-71.5699476,3a,75y,270h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3O0cS0b0qVVVPlZPhgvvMg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

[mrsman]

As far as the 3 section FYAs are concerned, it seems to me that they are done simply to save money.

If the intersection already had a a red arrow, yellow arrow, green arrow signal, then why add new signal hardware to implement FYA.  Simply adjust the timing hardware to provide for flashing yellow.

Has anyone implemented FYA with a doghouse signal?  I could imagine that it could be done.

[jakeroot]

Has anyone implemented FYA with a doghouse signal?  I could imagine that it could be done.

I believe the first was in Minnesota, which was then copied by Wisconsin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onyZQcgkMOw

[doogie1303]

Rhode Island finally has a FYA on Rte. 3 in Coventry at the Stop and Shop. I've seen them whenever I travel to Washington state and thought they would never show up here (our state seems to have a love for protected left turns at a majority of intersections), but I guess times are changing.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.6805187,-71.5699476,3a,75y,270h,90t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3O0cS0b0qVVVPlZPhgvvMg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

So, I again went by this new FYA intersection the other day and caught the sequence and noticed it was different from what I've seen in Washington State. This new FYA signal sequence appears to be

RA->GA->YA->RA->FYA

where as what I've seen in Washington:

RA->GA->FYA  or RA->FYA

Does this seem strange, or is this just because RI is new to this?

[Ace10]

^ You've seen a light go from green arrow directly to flashing yellow arrow? I always thought the protected movement had to be terminated with a solid yellow, then solid red, then the permissive phase could begin (exactly like you describe with the RI signal). Where in Washington did you see this happen? I've never personally seen it done this way - I always see GA go directly to YA (not FYA) afterwards every time.

I've seen a bunch of signals in Washington County, Oregon that begin with the permissive phase (RA > FYA), then change to protected by going FYA > GA. However, when the GA ends (going from protected to permissive), it always goes GA > YA> RA (then to FYA if the permissive phase follows).

[Revive 755]

where as what I've seen in Washington:

RA->GA->FYA  or RA->FYA

That sequence would violate Section 4D.20, Paragraph 03, Item C of the current National MUTCD.

A steady left-turn YELLOW ARROW signal indication shall be displayed following the left-turn GREEN ARROW signal indication.

[jakeroot]

I've seen some funny things before, but typically the phase I've seen here in Washington is GA-YA-FYA. No RA.

[cl94]

I've seen some funny things before, but typically the phase I've seen here in Washington is GA-YA-FYA. No RA.

Per Section 4D.20, paragraph 3, there is no prohibition of that phasing. Red arrow only required at the end of a permissive phase or if the protected phase is lagging (obviously). Granted, every example I've seen in these parts has a red arrow between the leading protected and permissive phases.

[Ace10]

I found something else in the same chapter but in a different section that also allows that sequence:

Section 4D.05 Application of Steady Signal Indications
Standard
03 Steady signal indications shall be applied as follows:
E. A steady YELLOW ARROW signal indication:
6.Shall be terminated by a RED ARROW signal indication for the same direction or a CIRCULAR RED signal indication except:
• When entering preemption operation, the display of a GREEN ARROW signal indication or a flashing arrow signal indication shall be permitted following a steady YELLOW ARROW signal indication.
• When the movement controlled by the arrow is to continue on a permissive mode basis during an immediately following CIRCULAR GREEN or flashing YELLOW ARROW signal indication.

Looks like that second bulletpoint appears to allow the FYA to be displayed directly after the YA without an intermediate RA.

Edit: The above I've found only permits jakeroot's description of YA > FYA. Haven't found anything that allows doogie1303's description of GA > FYA.

[Tarkus]

As far as the 3 section FYAs are concerned, it seems to me that they are done simply to save money.

The 3-section FYAs (or as I've taken to calling them, "flellows") are a large part of the reason why Washington County was able to install hundreds of them in a matter of months.  They're just about everywhere.  The county also went on a spree of replacing the vast majority of right turn signals with long 5-section signals sometime in the past year, though there's actually an experimental right-turn 3-section FYA on NW Cornell Road (westbound) at Evergreen Pkwy/179th.

Additionally, ODOT changed the state signal guidelines quite some time ago to favoring FYAs over doghouses in virtually all cases, though their installations had all been using the 4-section signal heads--I suspect the Bend video doorknob60 posted suggests they might be jumping on the 3-section bandwagon.  Oddly enough, though, the one place with the most doghouses left is Salem.

[doogie1303]

^ You've seen a light go from green arrow directly to flashing yellow arrow? I always thought the protected movement had to be terminated with a solid yellow, then solid red, then the permissive phase could begin (exactly like you describe with the RI signal). Where in Washington did you see this happen? I've never personally seen it done this way - I always see GA go directly to YA (not FYA) afterwards every time.

I've seen a bunch of signals in Washington County, Oregon that begin with the permissive phase (RA > FYA), then change to protected by going FYA > GA. However, when the GA ends (going from protected to permissive), it always goes GA > YA> RA (then to FYA if the permissive phase follows).

I've been in Kitsap County of Washington state mainly Bremerton, Poulsbo, and Silverdale. I know I've definitely seen the RA->FYA sequence, I'm trying to remember which intersection I might have seen a GA->FYA sequence, either that or I'm loosing my mind.

Another thought, does the solid YA now have two meanings? In a protected sequence GA->YA->RA the solid YA indicates the protected movement is about to end (but you are still protected from oncoming traffic until the RA). In a permissive sequence FYA->YA->RA, the solid YA takes on a different meaning (the permissive movement is about to end) but now you are not protected from oncoming traffic. It's not a "Yellow Trap" per say, but I could see a situation where a driver is not paying attention to the sequence and mistakes the solid YA as protected instead of permissive. 

I found this video of a light in Pasadena showing both cases:

http://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=A2KLqITK1NdVajAAUMT8w8QF;_ylu=X3oDMTJkN2RscmhyBHNlYwNjZC1hdHRyBHNsawNzb3VyY2UEdnRpZAMEcnVybANodHRwczovL3d3dy55b3V0dWJlLmNvbS93YXRjaD92PTViWVpXdE1Ga05F/RV=2/RE=1440236874/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fwww.youtube.com%2fwatch%3fv%3d5bYZWtMFkNE/RK=0/RS=mZuaaBr5WP9fuscPuJwN1cJvdoI-

[Ace10]

^ Before the FYA, I don't think an arrow was ever used to denote a permissive movement - only a protected one. However, now with the advent of the FYA, the solid yellow arrow has taken on a dual meaning (depending on what was displayed immediately preceding it). In the simplest sense, it means the signal is about to change to a more restrictive instruction than whatever came before - e.g., after a protected GA, protected phase is ending, and after a FYA, permissive phase is ending, and that in all cases traffic should stop before entering the intersection unless it is unsafe to do so, in which case traffic should complete the turn.

In the GA > YA situation (protected phase ending), oncoming traffic is about to get the green (if they had red before - leading protected phase) or cross traffic is about to get a green (if oncoming traffic had a green but now has a red - lagging protected phase). In the FYA > YA situation (permissive phase ending), oncoming traffic should be getting a yellow, then red, and then cross traffic (or pedestrians) is about to get a green. In both cases, it is necessary to make sure the intersection is clear of left-turning traffic, whether they are turning during a protected movement or a permissive movement, to allow left-turning traffic to clear so other traffic can proceed.

(Writing and then reading the above has my head spinning, so if there is anything wrong someone please call it out!)

[roadfro]

The meaning of the steady yellow arrow had not changed. It means that the associated turn phase that proceeded it (whether protected green arrow or permissive FYA) is terminating and changing to the restrictive instruction. Now, the reaction of a driver may need to be different depending on the previous signal indication.

[jakeroot]

I'm not sure if this has been posted yet, but here's a signal in South Seattle which demonstrates how some of the FYAs work around here. I've seen some which throw in a red arrow between solid and flashing arrows, but quite a few are like this:

https://youtu.be/2QDiFJvYYas

[doogie1303]

I'm not sure if this has been posted yet, but here's a signal in South Seattle which demonstrates how some of the FYAs work around here. I've seen some which throw in a red arrow between solid and flashing arrows, but quite a few are like this:

https://youtu.be/2QDiFJvYYas

Ok, so that's what I must have seen when I was out there, GA->YA->FYA, not GA->FYA ... my bad.

[roadman65]

In Orange County we use the four lens heads that are designed for FYL on fully protected left turns.

Orange Blossom Trail at Taft-Vineland Road and Central Florida Parkway at Orangewood Blvd. have the FYA assembly, but do not use it.

Pretty strange.

[UCFKnights]

In Orange County we use the four lens heads that are designed for FYL on fully protected left turns.

Orange Blossom Trail at Taft-Vineland Road and Central Florida Parkway at Orangewood Blvd. have the FYA assembly, but do not use it.

Pretty strange.

There's a few on Alafaya Trail that have gotten it as well that do not use it. I really wish they'd enable it, it'd help traffic out a lot. One of them even has an instructional sign, but still never seen it flash yellow. https://www.google.com/maps/@28.5611615,-81.2070363,3a,15y,331.44h,96.24t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sdyu3OMMyU_oVolq42UEkdw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

[cl94]

Cross-posting from the New York thread...

NYSDOT Region 10 is adopting flashing yellow arrows (plans). Intersection of Northern Boulevard (NY 25A) and Cedar Swamp Rd (NY 107) in Nassau County is getting FYAs for left turn movements from NY 25A. Other than NYCDOT using them at intersections with no through movement, I think this is the first application downstate and the first "standard" installation in the region.

[jakeroot]

I'm not sure if this has been posted yet, but here's a signal in South Seattle which demonstrates how some of the FYAs work around here. I've seen some which throw in a red arrow between solid and flashing arrows, but quite a few are like this:

Ok, so that's what I must have seen when I was out there, GA->YA->FYA, not GA->FYA ... my bad.

No no don't worry, the possibility still exists. Seattle has had a lot of strange signals in the past (all gone now, though):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOEy3BARK1c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0aWmC4pBQfY

[doorknob60]

I suspect the Bend video doorknob60 posted suggests they might be jumping on the 3-section bandwagon.

Not sure how much ODOT had to do with that signal. Yes, it was posted on ODOT's Youtube channel which makes me question it, but the intersection is at Neff Rd and 27th St which are not on the state highway system, but I'm pretty sure handled by the City of Bend. I'm guessing ODOT gave the city permission to use this signal, and ODOT will be examining it to see how it does. I'm just speculating though.

[Buffaboy]

Sorry for potentially stating the obvious, but is the point of this FYA to allow left turning traffic the same benefits as turning left at a green light when oncoming traffic has cleared?