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Why Sacramento does not have an freeway bypass around the city?

Started by ACSCmapcollector, July 10, 2016, 11:57:56 AM

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ACSCmapcollector

Why Sacramento does not have an freeway bypass around the city?

I wonder why Sacramento does not have an freeway bypass around the city, and no other Interstate to serve Sacramento and it neighboring suburbs, just curious as of now why they don't have a plan as of now to bring the city up to Interstate standards on the east side of Sacramento?

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA


TheStranger

The Route 143 corridor (pretty much approximately Watt Avenue/Elk Grove-Florin Road from Elk Grove north to the edge of the Sacramento city limits near Foothill Farms at the 80/Business 80 split) has been proposed in years past but a 1970s regional vote that went against that and other proposals in the area (Route 102 along Elkhorn Boulevard, Route 244 connecting the 80/Business 80 split with US 50 in Rancho Cordova on a routing paralleling Winding Way) halted momentum for most new-build freeway construction, with the right of way being developed on in the years since.

A part of the planned Route 148 along the Sacramento/Elk Grove border has since been constructed as a non-state-maintained surface street, Cosumnes River Boulevard.  (The newest portion of this opened in 2015, from Freeport east across I-5 to Franklin Boulevard)
Chris Sampang

jrouse

Scott,
A lot of the questions you ask all pretty much have the same answer.

In 1959 the California Legislature authorized the development of a State Freeway & Expressway System, which would have resulted in an extensive network of controlled access highways around the state.  This included a number of freeways in the urban areas.  This system was supposed to have been completed by 1980, if I remember correctly, but it was not, and it probably never will be.  The reasons why include lack of funding, environmental concerns, and public opposition.  As a result, there are a number of routes in the State Highway System that will never be built or improved to higher standards.  This includes the routes mentioned in this thread, Route 380, and improvements to Route 133.   

I hope this explanation helps.


iPhone

sparker

Re 133 and 380 -- part of their proposed corridor was within the jurisdiction of the California Coastal Commission, which has historically opposed large-scale highway upgrades in their zone (just getting them to vet the Devils' Slide CA 1 bypass was like pulling teeth!).  Pretty much any freeway project extending into their area, which includes all of the coastal watershed draining directly into the ocean, is DOA -- which is why you'll probably never see a CA 1 freeway facility (or even a Super-2, for that matter!) between Santa Cruz and Half Moon Bay.   The only freeways existing within their jurisdiction were pre-existing, "grandfathered" in at the time of the Commission's establishment.

ACSCmapcollector

I don't think that Interstate 70 will ever be extended from Interstate 15 in Utah to be on U.S. 50 to Sacramento, CA ever through Nevada, maybe it is not needed either, if it did we would have an Interstate x70 bypass around Sacramento, CA.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA


Max Rockatansky

Quote from: ACSCmapcollector on July 10, 2016, 06:14:09 PM
I don't think that Interstate 70 will ever be extended from Interstate 15 in Utah to be on U.S. 50 to Sacramento, CA ever through Nevada, maybe it is not needed either, if it did we would have an Interstate x70 bypass around Sacramento, CA.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

Don't tell that FritzOwl...  :rolleyes:

ACSCmapcollector

I wont...he would get some really dumb ideas.  I think.  Maybe Interstate 70 should be going to Fresno underneath the Sierra Nevada and from Fresno, to Monterey, CA. From the I-15/I-70 jct in Utah across to the desert to Nevada and into California.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: ACSCmapcollector on July 10, 2016, 09:52:40 PM
I wont...he would get some really dumb ideas.  I think.  Maybe Interstate 70 should be going to Fresno underneath the Sierra Nevada and from Fresno, to Monterey, CA. From the I-15/I-70 jct in Utah across to the desert to Nevada and into California.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

Wouldn't worry about it regardless, US 50 is going to be plenty adequate for the foreseeable future...or life times...but that's the crown jewel of Fritzy's "plans" is to get I-70 to Sacramento.  Basically once you get east of Fallon, NV that traffic count basically drops to nothing and doesn't pick up all that much until you hit I-15 in Utah...they don't call it the most lonely road in America for nothing.  At best I could see maybe some expansion of the expressway from from Carson to Fallon with some grade separation, with the Lake Tahoe area you're basically land locked which would mitigate almost any future improvement.  Hell even I-11 along US 95 to Reno is highly questionable given the current traffic counts.

sparker

What do you mean -- he'd really get some dumb ideas?  Scott, that ship sailed long ago -- Fritz' capacity for overblown ideas is pretty much at maximum; outside influences no longer required!

US 41

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kkt

The Elvas Freeway was going to be a bypass around Sacramento on the east side.  It was cancelled due to the usual suspects - expense, takings, local opposition, not reserving a reasonable right of way until it was too late.

TheStranger

Quote from: kkt on July 10, 2016, 11:35:45 PM
The Elvas Freeway was going to be a bypass around Sacramento on the east side.  It was cancelled due to the usual suspects - expense, takings, local opposition, not reserving a reasonable right of way until it was too late.


The Elvas freeway is Business 80 between 160 and E Street.  Were you thinking of Route 244 (the Winding Way corridor)?

The Interstate-standards replacement for what is now Business 80 that was nixed by the City of Sacramento in 1979...that would have used still-extant right of way along the railroad tracks in North Sacramento, some of which was built up to the Roseville Road light rail station.  Funding for that freeway realignment project went to the light rail system instead.
Chris Sampang

ACSCmapcollector

I think FritzOwls's ideas are just outrageous, nothing to draw on paper and mechanical pencil with sharpened pencil, like I can do with my own drawn maps that are based on my imagination only, not for real, even not for fantasy.  I would like to have an Interstate 70 come through Fresno on California state route 180 anyhow, but I don't think that Fresno need an Interstate upgrade as of now. It is home to my ex-gf Vicki O'Connor.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: ACSCmapcollector on July 11, 2016, 07:00:47 PM
I think FritzOwls's ideas are just outrageous, nothing to draw on paper and mechanical pencil with sharpened pencil, like I can do with my own drawn maps that are based on my imagination only, not for real, even not for fantasy.  I would like to have an Interstate 70 come through Fresno on California state route 180 anyhow, but I don't think that Fresno need an Interstate upgrade as of now. It is home to my ex-gf Vicki O'Connor.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay

It wouldn't be realistic with the terrain around Kings Canyon and the Sierra Ridge.  Probably the best avenue for a southern cut of the Sierras that has potential for a state highway would Sherman Pass.  If I recall correctly he mapped out 180 as an Interstate on his flight simulator if memory serves correct.

ACSCmapcollector

Where is Sherman Pass, Max?  Maybe I would Google it tomorrow.  Anyway Sherman Pass Road is a dangerous road.

http://www.dangerousroads.org/north-america/usa/3943-sherman-pass.html

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: ACSCmapcollector on July 11, 2016, 10:44:18 PM
Where is Sherman Pass, Max?  Maybe I would Google it tomorrow.  Anyway Sherman Pass Road is a dangerous road.

http://www.dangerousroads.org/north-america/usa/3943-sherman-pass.html

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

They have some pretty silly roads on that site that are more interesting than dangerous....at least so long as they aren't those unmaintained mine roads they got listed like crazy out of Colorado.  Basically Sherman Pass Road terminates at US 395 and if I recall correctly to Johnsondale?  Basically you can follow a couple paved mountain roadways out of Johnsondale north to the western CA 190.

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Sherman+Pass/@35.9905005,-118.3834268,14z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m5!3m4!1s0x80c0390db1d7e185:0x26a85907522b24d2!8m2!3d35.9905023!4d-118.3659172?hl=en

Incidentally the Google car hasn't been over Sherman before, there are plenty of user photos though.  The pass isn't that bad in the summer time but I would expect typical County Route levels of bumpiness.

coatimundi

Kaiser Pass Road is paved yet Google SV hasn't made it up there yet. I haven't driven either, so I can't say if it's more or less dangerous than Sherman Pass Road.
Incidentally, CA 168 ends at its junction with Kaiser Pass Road. I would guess then there was another line over to the other 168, but there's not a really good way to do that. Italy Pass is mostly directly east of the end of Kaiser Pass Road and west of the end of eastern 168, but that's well above the treeline and it's a pretty absurd idea to put a road up there. Piute Pass would be another possibility for a routing, but that's also a stretch.

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: coatimundi on July 11, 2016, 11:56:23 PM
Kaiser Pass Road is paved yet Google SV hasn't made it up there yet. I haven't driven either, so I can't say if it's more or less dangerous than Sherman Pass Road.
Incidentally, CA 168 ends at its junction with Kaiser Pass Road. I would guess then there was another line over to the other 168, but there's not a really good way to do that. Italy Pass is mostly directly east of the end of Kaiser Pass Road and west of the end of eastern 168, but that's well above the treeline and it's a pretty absurd idea to put a road up there. Piute Pass would be another possibility for a routing, but that's also a stretch.


Found a brochure on Sequoia National Forest that has some decent map and road info for Sherman Pass on page 13/14:

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprd3801985.pdf

Given that Kaiser Pass Road is part of the whole Big Creek project I would suspect that it somewhat minimal in terms of road quality which would certainly increase the danger factor.  For what it's worth Sherman Pass Road is meant for all vehicles as a scenic byway...not bad for something out of the way for a 9,200 foot pass.  It looked like the Google car ran into a closed gate when it was up around Johnsondale.

ACSCmapcollector

Anyways, economically and enviromentally I would think there would NEVER be an Interstate 70 extension across central California, including the Sierra Nevada, Fresno and Monterey, CA.  No plans, no routing as of yet.  I don't see a movement to push that forward as of now.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

ACSCmapcollector

Anyway when I do my own road and street maps with a mechanical pencil, sharpened pencil, colored pencils...it is just for the imagination and a gift from God.  The ruled paper is the canvas, the pencils are the brushes, and the color I add is the paint.  Anyhow I have been doing that for 39 years since I was a young pre-teenager of 11 years old.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

Avalanchez71

Who is going to pay for this road?  Remember that Sacramento is the capital of California and that it is a destination for those in power in the state.  They need to route roads to Sacramento.  Business needs customers.  No customers not business. 

myosh_tino

Any talk of extending I-70 over the Sierra Nevadas really should be confined to the Fictional Highways board.
Quote from: golden eagle
If I owned a dam and decided to donate it to charity, would I be giving a dam? I'm sure that might be a first because no one really gives a dam.

Avalanchez71

The dirt people and the controllers of the purse would not allow that to happen.  Have you taken a look at a map and the protected areas along with the cost/benefit of such a route?

ACSCmapcollector

Maybe it should be DELETED as a route.  I don't think there is much of a need for Interstate 70 in California.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: ACSCmapcollector on July 12, 2016, 03:46:10 PM
Maybe it should be DELETED as a route.  I don't think there is much of a need for Interstate 70 in California.

Scott C. Presnal
Morro Bay, CA

I don't think anyone in legislative session has even brought up the topic of I-70 in California.  It almost didn't happen at all west of Denver



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