Rental car: Trunk taped shut?

[US81]

The reported experience of drivers in some areas is that police can use this law (license plate frames) both as justification for a stop for an otherwise law-abiding driver...

The following would work as well:

The reported experience of drivers in some areas is that police can use this law (broken headlight) both as justification for a stop for an otherwise law-abiding driver...

Or....

The reported experience of drivers in some areas is that police can use this law (speeding) both as justification for a stop for an otherwise law-abiding driver...

It doesn't matter the violation, and if the driver is otherwise doing everything right:  If the driver is operating a car that's not operating legally in some fashion, he/she can be stopped and ticketed.

While some people discount the importance of being able to see the state name on the tag number, it would be important if a cop was trying to determine what state that tag was from.  Or, if AAA-123 went thru a red light camera intersection, or a toll lane without paying and it was caught on camera, someone reviewing that may mistake one state's plate for another, and send the bill to the wrong person.  And we've read horror stories on here of people trying to get it dismissed because it wasn't their car!

I am not disagreeing that the all the numbers, letters, stickers, all identifying information should be completely visible. I do have a problem with widely inconsistent enforcement.  I do have a problem with ticketing when the frame does not obscure the license plate in any way, when all the numbers and letters, the state name and logo and all images are completely visible.

[NJRoadfan]

One guy on the next block over from us simply has no "month" or "year" stickers on his plate at all. I'm not sure how he escapes getting ticketed.

NJ tried plate stickers for 5 years since they were moving to 2 year inspections and could no longer use the inspection sticker as a rudimentary proof of registration (the theory was you couldn't get a car inspection without proof of registration). Nobody could figure out how to put them on the plate right, so they got rid of them figuring they serve no real purpose since a police officer is going to run the plate to check registration status anyway (the state was progressive for once!). So, NJ saves money and is one of the few states that have no visible way of telling if a plate is valid or not. Plate stickers on motorcycles, trailers and commercial vehicles were around since the 60s, they were only eliminated 2 years ago.

Plate stickers sometimes landed up in odd places too: http://njplates.moini.net/njfunny.html

[The Nature Boy]

In my opinion, if you're in a state with a front/back plate then a plate frame on at least one side should be okay. Plate frames actually have a point on front plates since they're often the only protection that plates have. Despite most of the country requiring front plates, most car manufacturers still don't make cars with a front indentation for the plate.

[Duke87]

The front plate on my car has nothing behind it on the bottom. When I had CT plates on it this was never really an issue but after putting NY plates on it it has gotten a bit bent up fairly quickly. It would seem that NY plates are thinner and flimsier than CT plates, much like how NY licenses are thinner and flimsier than CT licenses.


Connecticut did away with plate stickers in 2007 and occasionally you may still see a CT plated car driving around with a sticker on it with a 2007 expiration date. Perfectly legal since the sticker no longer has any meaning. Connecticut then did away with window stickers in 2011 such that now vehicles with CT registrations have no sticker of any sort. Instead, cops have automated license plate readers with live access to the DMV system, and so if your registration is expired, or you're past due for inspection, or anything of the sort, the computer will tell them.

New York has not advanced so far technologically yet and still has window stickers for registrations (every 2 years), and a separate window sticker for inspections (yearly). The upshot to this is that the registration sticker says the year, make, and model of the car on it, so if you encounter a car parked on the street that catches your interest you can quickly verify exactly what it is.

[SteveG1988]

One guy on the next block over from us simply has no "month" or "year" stickers on his plate at all. I'm not sure how he escapes getting ticketed.

NJ tried plate stickers for 5 years since they were moving to 2 year inspections and could no longer use the inspection sticker as a rudimentary proof of registration (the theory was you couldn't get a car inspection without proof of registration). Nobody could figure out how to put them on the plate right, so they got rid of them figuring they serve no real purpose since a police officer is going to run the plate to check registration status anyway (the state was progressive for once!). So, NJ saves money and is one of the few states that have no visible way of telling if a plate is valid or not. Plate stickers on motorcycles, trailers and commercial vehicles were around since the 60s, they were only eliminated 2 years ago.

Plate stickers sometimes landed up in odd places too: http://njplates.moini.net/njfunny.html

I remember that the 1993-2008 era of plates, even my 2010 issued Agriculture plate (i have a regular flat base one now) had the boxes for stickers.

[jeffandnicole]

Plate stickers sometimes landed up in odd places too: http://njplates.moini.net/njfunny.html

Thanks for that!

[jakeroot]

Despite most of the country requiring front plates, most car manufacturers still don't make cars with a front indentation for the plate.

A lot of cars are "world cars", meaning they remain mostly unchanged throughout world-wide sales. As such, front plate indentations just for the American market don't seem to make a lot of sense financially. For example, Europe uses stick on front plates (not sure as to the type of adhesive). No indentation required. Further, if you look on the back of some cars, the indent for the plate is often wider than the plate by a significant amount. This is to save money because the wider indent fits all of the world's licence plates.

[J N Winkler]

A lot of cars are "world cars", meaning they remain mostly unchanged throughout world-wide sales. As such, front plate indentations just for the American market don't seem to make a lot of sense financially. For example, Europe uses stick on front plates (not sure as to the type of adhesive). No indentation required. Further, if you look on the back of some cars, the indent for the plate is often wider than the plate by a significant amount. This is to save money because the wider indent fits all of the world's licence plates.

A few observations:

*  Automakers don't have to provide an indentation on front as long as they provide a bracket and attachment points for it.

*  I don't think it is generally true that European countries use adhesive-fixed license plates.  In Britain, for example, screw mounting is the norm, as in the US, even though license plates stay with the car by default.

*  Even world cars have a significant amount of country-specific hardware without taking different formats of license plates into consideration.  The front bumper, which is the usual mounting point for front license plates, is one of the easiest things to naturalize to a particular country.

[jakeroot]

*  Automakers don't have to provide an indentation on front as long as they provide a bracket and attachment points for it.

Do any [new] cars have indentations for the front plate? I was eating at Arby's while thinking about this post, and, watching through the large front windows onto the street, not one car had an indent for the plate. About 1/3 had a bracket and the other 2/3 had the plate screwed straight into the bumper.

*  Even world cars have a significant amount of country-specific hardware without taking different formats of license plates into consideration.  The front bumper, which is the usual mounting point for front license plates, is one of the easiest things to naturalize to a particular country.

True, but unless it's required by law, car manufacturers generally won't change things country to country. Since licence-plate-indents are not required by regulation, most won't bother. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but there'd be little reason beyond some sales concern (like a car name unlikely to sell well, et al).

*  I don't think it is generally true that European countries use adhesive-fixed license plates.  In Britain, for example, screw mounting is the norm, as in the US, even though license plates stay with the car by default.

Meh. The British don't consider themselves European anyways.

[andrewkbrown]

Now that we're on the license plate discussion, I have this question.

How many modern vehicles, if any, have offset front plate mounting, rather than center of the bumper? I seem to remember it common to find many cars, trucks and vans on the roads featuring left or right mounted plates when I was younger. In fact, my first car was a 1984 Oldsmobile Omega, who's front license plate was on the driver's side of the bumper.

Any ideas as to the reason plates in older vehicles were mounted this way?

[briantroutman]

Now that we're on the license plate discussion, I have this question.

How many modern vehicles, if any, have offset front plate mounting, rather than center of the bumper? I seem to remember it common to find many cars, trucks and vans on the roads featuring left or right mounted plates when I was younger. In fact, my first car was a 1984 Oldsmobile Omega, who's front license plate was on the driver's side of the bumper.

Any ideas as to the reason plates in older vehicles were mounted this way?

I don't think it's necessarily a question of old vs. new. My family had a Plymouth Voyager in the '90s with the front plate mounting off-center on the driver's side, but we had multiple full-size Oldsmobiles in the '80s–including an '84 Delta 88–with the license plate centered. By my observation, the vast majority of front license plates through all eras have been centered.

Where the front place is off-center, I suspect it's simply an aesthetic consideration. There was an era, roughly from the late '70s through the early '90s when car designs tended to be extremely subdued–grilles were often a flat rectangular grate across the front of the car, hoods were nearly level from left to right, etc.–that some automakers might have opted for an off-center mounting just to add some visual interest. Today, most car designs have gotten more extreme with all kinds of character lines, bulges and creases, radically swept back headlights, and so on, that the design is too busy for anything to be placed off-center.

[Scott5114]

I should probably have one for the front plate on my RX-7 because the car was not designed with a front plate in mind and the bracket they added is of a design that means if someone parallel-parks New York—style, the plate gets nicked and beat-up. The bracket is essentially just two small vertical pieces of metal to which the plate gets bolted.

I don't think I have ever had a car with wholly satisfactory provision for mounting a front license plate.  The 1986 Maxima is the only car we have had in this family that we bought new with a front bracket, probably because it was purchased at a border-town dealership and Oklahoma requires front plates (Kansas itself does not).

Oklahoma does not require front plates. Missouri does, however. Must have just been some policy particular to that model or dealership.

[SteveG1988]

One of the changes ford made to the focus in 2005 was to make the rear plate area more US sized.

[SP Cook]

Couple of things.

- The last few new cars I have been involved with have been several Toyotas, a Hyundai and a Lincoln.  In all case there are tiny pilot holes where the front plate holder would go.  In all cases except for the FoMoCo product, the holder itself was in the well where the spare tire was.  The Lincoln you had to buy it from the parts department for like $20.  I suppose if you live in a state with front plates the dealer just has to eat the cost of that.

- The DC metro area seems to me to be the capital (no pun intended) of dealer ad plate frames.  Seems to be a higher %age of cars there than anywhere.  Not just DC, with its political slogan that some people might want to quietly cover up, but MD and VA plates too.  Even seen dealer plates around Diplomatic plates.

- If you watch NCIS LA the undercover Dodge is illegally missing its front California plate.  Since FIAT is paying to have the car in the show, that means even they understand that a front plate ruins the look of a sporty car.  In fact, if you look at car ads or the brochures they give out, the cars almost never have front plates.

- As to international there tends to be 3 types.  The US standard, the Euro standard (long and narrow), and Australian ones which are kind of in-between those two.  Really I think the whole "world car" of making a plate area where all 3 will fit is more a marketing affectation than anything.  German cars (particularly Audi) especially.  Its more "look at my cool Euro car" than trying to save having 3 part numbers.  There are 1000s of more important differences across countries in car design regs than that.

- In Cincinnati, the taxis all have Ohio tags in their proper places and a separate add on plate holder on the rear, with a light, for a Kentucky tag.  I assume the Commonwealth won't let taxis come in with out paying for tags (the airport is in Kentucky), but how is this legal?  Why would not every state do that to every commercial vehicle.

[1995hoo]

I've seen cabs in the DC area with license plates from two jurisdictions. I've always assumed the cabbie either uses the vehicle as a personal vehicle, thus requiring it to be registered in his home jurisdiction as well as in the jurisdiction where it's licensed as a taxi, or else it's simply necessary to register in two places due to laws about registering vehicles parked overnight for more than a certain number of days in a year. (In other words, it's no surprise a jurisdiction would require a taxi to be registered as a taxi, and bear taxi plates, in that jurisdiction. But if the vehicle is routinely parked in another jurisdiction, that jurisdiction will want to tax it.)

So maybe Ohio and Kentucky are similar?

[The Nature Boy]

I've seen cabs in the DC area with license plates from two jurisdictions. I've always assumed the cabbie either uses the vehicle as a personal vehicle, thus requiring it to be registered in his home jurisdiction as well as in the jurisdiction where it's licensed as a taxi, or else it's simply necessary to register in two places due to laws about registering vehicles parked overnight for more than a certain number of days in a year. (In other words, it's no surprise a jurisdiction would require a taxi to be registered as a taxi, and bear taxi plates, in that jurisdiction. But if the vehicle is routinely parked in another jurisdiction, that jurisdiction will want to tax it.)

So maybe Ohio and Kentucky are similar?

I always wonder how college students get around that. If you go to any college student parking area, you'll see a rainbow of license plates.

[SP Cook]

So maybe Ohio and Kentucky are similar?

I suppose.  IIRC, at the airports for DC there are multiple cab lines for MD, DC, or VA.  I do know that if you fly into Newark, the NJ cab can take you into NYC but has to "deadhead" back to NJ, and the NYC cabs can take you back to EWR but likewise cannot pick anybody up. 

[corco]

I've seen cabs in the DC area with license plates from two jurisdictions. I've always assumed the cabbie either uses the vehicle as a personal vehicle, thus requiring it to be registered in his home jurisdiction as well as in the jurisdiction where it's licensed as a taxi, or else it's simply necessary to register in two places due to laws about registering vehicles parked overnight for more than a certain number of days in a year. (In other words, it's no surprise a jurisdiction would require a taxi to be registered as a taxi, and bear taxi plates, in that jurisdiction. But if the vehicle is routinely parked in another jurisdiction, that jurisdiction will want to tax it.)

So maybe Ohio and Kentucky are similar?

I always wonder how college students get around that. If you go to any college student parking area, you'll see a rainbow of license plates.

A lot of states have a codified exemption for college students and military. I came within 24 hours of moving to Nebraska for grad school several years ago (went to Arizona at the last minute instead), and that state, interestingly, didn't require college kids to get license plates but did require them to go the the DMV and pay the state road tax. I have no idea if or how this was enforced.

[Pete from Boston]

I've seen cabs in the DC area with license plates from two jurisdictions. I've always assumed the cabbie either uses the vehicle as a personal vehicle, thus requiring it to be registered in his home jurisdiction as well as in the jurisdiction where it's licensed as a taxi, or else it's simply necessary to register in two places due to laws about registering vehicles parked overnight for more than a certain number of days in a year. (In other words, it's no surprise a jurisdiction would require a taxi to be registered as a taxi, and bear taxi plates, in that jurisdiction. But if the vehicle is routinely parked in another jurisdiction, that jurisdiction will want to tax it.)

So maybe Ohio and Kentucky are similar?

I always wonder how college students get around that. If you go to any college student parking area, you'll see a rainbow of license plates.

Depends.  Colleges here generally don't care.  The state has a requirement to register here after 30 days, but I am sure this is unenforced for most cars here for part of the year for college.  Where it's an issue is for the rising number of jurisdictions with permit street parking.  The car in these cases has to be locally registered if parked on the street (don't get me started in how much of a money-making ploy this is even with regard to people from other towns).  This also has the added benefit to the municipality of collecting motor vehicle excise tax on more of the cars garaged in their jurisdiction.

[SP Cook]

I always wonder how college students get around that. If you go to any college student parking area, you'll see a rainbow of license plates.

College students (and military and their dependents) are an exception to the standard rule that you have to legally move your car plates and DL.  Technically you should carry your college issued ID to avoid a problem with the cops in such a circumstance.

Buddy of mine's daughter is a doc.  She attended college and med school in two different states, neither of which she lived in legally, without an issue, but then she did her residency in Alabama.  Since she was now an employee and not a student, she awoke one day to find her car towed away, because she had lived and worked in Alabama for 60 days without moving.  Got a pretty stiff fine on top of all the taxes, not only for her plates but also for her DL.    Apparently the Birmingham cops do such a sweep every year, getting the info from UAB.

[The Nature Boy]

I always wonder how college students get around that. If you go to any college student parking area, you'll see a rainbow of license plates.

College students (and military and their dependents) are an exception to the standard rule that you have to legally move your car plates and DL.  Technically you should carry your college issued ID to avoid a problem with the cops in such a circumstance.

Buddy of mine's daughter is a doc.  She attended college and med school in two different states, neither of which she lived in legally, without an issue, but then she did her residency in Alabama.  Since she was now an employee and not a student, she awoke one day to find her car towed away, because she had lived and worked in Alabama for 60 days without moving.  Got a pretty stiff fine on top of all the taxes, not only for her plates but also for her DL.    Apparently the Birmingham cops do such a sweep every year, getting the info from UAB.

This is the issue I faced. I went to undergrad and graduate school in states that are not my state of residence. I still have a driver's license from where I grew up, even if I haven't lived there in 7 years. I'll be moving back there next month anyway.

For street parking though, I agree that it's different. I know for Boston, they require you to have a Massachusetts plate to take advantage of street parking. I know that Washington DC allows you to street park without a DC plate if you pay a fee to the city.

[Duke87]

I always wonder how college students get around that. If you go to any college student parking area, you'll see a rainbow of license plates.

College students (and military and their dependents) are an exception to the standard rule that you have to legally move your car plates and DL.  Technically you should carry your college issued ID to avoid a problem with the cops in such a circumstance.

Buddy of mine's daughter is a doc.  She attended college and med school in two different states, neither of which she lived in legally, without an issue, but then she did her residency in Alabama.  Since she was now an employee and not a student, she awoke one day to find her car towed away, because she had lived and worked in Alabama for 60 days without moving.  Got a pretty stiff fine on top of all the taxes, not only for her plates but also for her DL.    Apparently the Birmingham cops do such a sweep every year, getting the info from UAB.

Typically if you live in a dormitory it is not your permanent residence so you don't officially "live" there. I didn't own a car when I was in college but I still had my ID at my parents' address, and I was registered to vote at my parents' address.


Interesting to know, though, that there are places where it is actually enforced that if you live somewhere you need to register your car there. New York City is not one of them. There are a lot of PA and CT plates on the streets here. And an indeterminate number of NY plates registered upstate.

[vdeane]

Yeah, dorms are NOT legally permanent addresses (or even physical addresses - mail comes to PO boxes that have deals with UPS and FedEx to deliver there).  Plus people who live in dorms typically park on college lots that have their own parking requirements (vehicles must be registered, which usually isn't free, and often freshmen aren't allowed cars at all).  As such, college students who live on campus legally still live at their parents' house.  Many states have no incentive to change this because of the political effects that college students voting in local elections would have.

[corco]

Yeah, dorms are NOT legally permanent addresses (or even physical addresses - mail comes to PO boxes that have deals with UPS and FedEx to deliver there).  Plus people who live in dorms typically park on college lots that have their own parking requirements (vehicles must be registered, which usually isn't free, and often freshmen aren't allowed cars at all).  As such, college students who live on campus legally still live at their parents' house.  Many states have no incentive to change this because of the political effects that college students voting in local elections would have.

Though when I lived in the dorms in Tacoma, I was able to register to vote in the state of Washington (even fully disclosing that I was a college student with a campus address). Same with Wyoming and UW- there was even a polling place set up on campus. I didn't see anything that would indicate that this was illegal, as long as I renounced my Idaho voter's registration.

Here's a voter guide for New York State that seems to indicate the same (PDF: http://www.lwvny.org/advocacy/vote/RTVCollegeStudents.pdf)

[SteveG1988]

my 1996 ford has a front plate frame, since it was registered in Maryland before i bought it, i could not fathom trying to find one that fits the pointy nose in 2015.