What states have nonduplication rule for route numbers?

Started by kkt, July 12, 2016, 04:55:47 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

kkt

California is well-known for not duplication route numbers, even if they are different types of highway (state routes, US routes, Interstates).  For example, there is a California state route 180, therefore there can't be an I-180 within California.

What other states follow that rule?


noelbotevera

Do you mean internally or externally? If you mean internally, then PA counts. I-283 and PA 283 have the same number, but I-283 is inventoried as PA 300. The only exception was for the brief time there was two PA 17's, prior to I-86 extended into PA. Both were inventoried as PA 17.

TheHighwayMan3561

Wisconsin I believe had a rule on the books until I-39 was commissioned. WIS 39 is a fairly minor road away from any major population centers, so it was allowed to keep its number.
self-certified as the dumbest person on this board for 5 years running

thenetwork

Ohio does not duplicate.  There once was a SR-76 as one example.  That route is now known as SR-83.  it changed when I-80S was renamed I-76.

hotdogPi

Connecticut, Rhode Island, and Vermont.

Massachusetts has I-295 and MA 295, New Hampshire has US 4 and NH 4, and Maine has I-195 and ME 195.
Clinched, minus I-93 (I'm missing a few miles and my file is incorrect)

Traveled, plus US 13, 44, and 50, and several state routes

I will be in Burlington VT for the eclipse.

cahwyguy

Quote from: kkt on July 12, 2016, 04:55:47 PM
California is well-known for not duplication route numbers, even if they are different types of highway (state routes, US routes, Interstates).  For example, there is a California state route 180, therefore there can't be an I-180 within California.

Just to be precise, California doesn't have a non-duplication rule; rather, it just doesn't make a distinction between the type of sign on a route (those states that permit "duplication" likely don't really duplicate, but include the sign type as part of the number). California also legislatively defines its route, so that all the segments of a route must connect (although they may be connected via an unsigned multiplex or an unconstructed portion of a route).
Daniel - California Highway Guy ● Highway Site: http://www.cahighways.org/ ●  Blog: http://blog.cahighways.org/ ● Podcast (CA Route by Route): http://caroutebyroute.org/ ● Follow California Highways on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cahighways

kkt

I was thinking of routes as signed, disregarding hidden numbers.

briantroutman

Quote from: noelbotevera on July 12, 2016, 05:07:06 PM
Do you mean internally or externally? If you mean internally, then PA counts. I-283 and PA 283 have the same number, but I-283 is inventoried as PA 300. The only exception was for the brief time there was two PA 17's, prior to I-86 extended into PA. Both were inventoried as PA 17.

Not to be pedantic, but you're confusing some terms. "PA 300"  would refer to a Pennsylvania numbered traffic route (i.e. with a keystone marker) designated as 300. There is no PA 300. What you mean to say is PA 283 is inventoried as SR 300. (SR 0300, actually.) And about the section of NY 17/I-86 near Sayre, does it even show up in PennDOT route logs at all? I was under the impression that it was a NYSDOT designed, built, and maintained road that incidentally crossed the PA border for a very short distance.

There are other duplications in Pennsylvania–PA 380, PA 99, and PA 86 come to mind. All of those were numbered long before I-81E was changed to I-380, the Budway was designated as I-99, or I-86 was signed on NY/PA 17, hence the reason to keep the PA routes signed under their old numbers.

But in general, PA has historically avoided number duplication, and early PA numbered routes including 1, 6, 11, 15, and 22 were decommissioned between 1926 and 1930 to free those numbers for US numbered routes. In 1961, a raft of PA routes (including 70, 78, 79, 80, 83, 84, 90, 95, 180, 480, and 680) were all decommissioned at once to free those numbers for new Interstates. The flurry of Interstate renumberings in 1964 (I-80S to I-76, etc.) resulted in PA 76, 176, 276, and 376 losing their designations. But apparently, some time between 1964 and 1973 when I-81E was redesignated as I-380, PennDOT relaxed the no duplication rule.

lordsutch

Mississippi until very recently avoided duplicate numbers, but I-22 and I-69 are exceptions as preexisting MS 22 and MS 69 remain signed as such rather than being renumbered. Both are relatively short and could be renumbered fairly easily (neither is terribly important and both could be given 3-digit designations), but neither are likely to be confused with the interstates since they're not even in the same transportation districts, so I doubt MDOT will bother.

It does create the rather odd coincidence that both of the car manufacturing plants in Mississippi are near a route numbered 22, however (I-22 near Toyota at Blue Springs and MS 22 near Nissan in Canton).

Quillz

Does Oregon have a rule? Other than OR-82 and OR-84, which are relatively short routes and not near either I-82 or I-84, seems the state does not do duplication. There used to be a OR-26, but it was later replaced by US-20 and likely due to the US-26 also having been created.

corco

Washington and Utah both assign route numbers by statute with all highways being State Routes regardless of system (e.g. I-5 in WA is officially State Route 5), which prevents duplication from ever occurring (similar to CA), whether or not there is a formal rule on the books.

Idaho has no duplicates, though I don't know if there is a formal reason for that.

Oregon is like Montana and Wyoming, which have duplicates - in that the signed route numbers are just signed route numbers and there is an internal highway designation that the mileposts are based on that does not duplicate that may or may not be the same as the signed route number.

Quillz

I do wonder about states that do have duplication, such as Texas... There is both a TX-10 and an Interstate 10. I suppose in those states, you simply always prefix the highway type when speaking.

TheStranger

Quote from: Quillz on July 12, 2016, 06:52:05 PM
I do wonder about states that do have duplication, such as Texas... There is both a TX-10 and an Interstate 10. I suppose in those states, you simply always prefix the highway type when speaking.

In Texas's case, two-letter prefixes are pretty much common in regular usage (US, FM, SH, IH).
Chris Sampang

noelbotevera

Quote from: briantroutman on July 12, 2016, 06:14:28 PM
Quote from: noelbotevera on July 12, 2016, 05:07:06 PM
Do you mean internally or externally? If you mean internally, then PA counts. I-283 and PA 283 have the same number, but I-283 is inventoried as PA 300. The only exception was for the brief time there was two PA 17's, prior to I-86 extended into PA. Both were inventoried as PA 17.

Not to be pedantic, but you're confusing some terms. "PA 300"  would refer to a Pennsylvania numbered traffic route (i.e. with a keystone marker) designated as 300. There is no PA 300. What you mean to say is PA 283 is inventoried as SR 300. (SR 0300, actually.) And about the section of NY 17/I-86 near Sayre, does it even show up in PennDOT route logs at all? I was under the impression that it was a NYSDOT designed, built, and maintained road that incidentally crossed the PA border for a very short distance.
I meant the 3 mile section near Erie, not the section near Sayre. This was prior to the early 2000's.

djsekani

Michigan has both US-24 and M-24 (state route) near Pontiac.

freebrickproductions

Alabama does not duplicate US routes, but they do have a duplicate state route for every 2 digit interstate in the state (I-10 & AL 10, I-20 & AL 20, I-22 & AL 22, I-59 & AL 59, I-65 & AL 65, I-85 & AL 85).
It's all fun & games until someone summons Cthulhu and brings about the end of the world.

I also collect traffic lights, road signs, fans, and railroad crossing equipment.

(They/Them)

renegade

Quote from: djsekani on July 12, 2016, 08:11:29 PM
Michigan has both US-24 and M-24 (state route) near Pontiac.
Not to mention I-75 and M-75 in the northern Lower Peninsula.

I said not to mention it.
Don’t ask me how I know.  Just understand that I do.

pianocello

I know Iowa, Illinois, Indiana, and Maryland have no such rule.

When the Interstates came around, though, Illinois had the decency to renumber some state routes to prevent an intersection between two routes of the same number. Indiana, not so much.
Davenport, IA -> Valparaiso, IN -> Ames, IA -> Orlando, FL -> Gainesville, FL -> Evansville, IN

kurumi

For a little over a year (1968 to 1970), I-87 and CT 87 co-existed; for 6 years (1958 to 1964), CT 95 existed as an extension of I-95 in the southeast.

(Very close but no overlap: CT 291 transition to I-291 in the early '90s. No other interstates than 95 and 291 have existed on the same alignment as state routes.)
My first SF/horror short story collection is available: "Young Man, Open Your Winter Eye"

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: renegade on July 12, 2016, 08:49:43 PM
Quote from: djsekani on July 12, 2016, 08:11:29 PM
Michigan has both US-24 and M-24 (state route) near Pontiac.
Not to mention I-75 and M-75 in the northern Lower Peninsula.

I said not to mention it.

M-10 and US 10....which were both part of US 10 at one point....

Duke87

One interesting case of the creation of an interstate resulting in a road being renumbered in a state it does not enter: when I-84 was built in New York, nearby NY 84 was renumbered NY 284 to avoid confusion. New Jersey then renumbered NJ 84 to NJ 284 to match.

This was only done due to proximity, though, New York has no policy against duplication: NY 87 and I-87 coexisted for a good 20 years or so before the former was renumbered to NY 812. NY 287 and I-287 coexisted for a similar period of time. To this day, 81, 86, 88, 90, 278, 290, 295, and 695 all exist both as interstates and unrelated NY state routes. NY 90 and I-90 even cross, although there is no interchange.

New York handles this by inventorying interstates with an "I" suffix (e.g. I-81 is "81I" on reference markers whereas NY 81 is simply "81").
If you always take the same road, you will never see anything new.

Takumi

Quote from: Rothman on July 15, 2021, 07:52:59 AM
Olive Garden must be stopped.  I must stop them.

Don't @ me. Seriously.

SidS1045

"A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves." - Edward R. Murrow

jemacedo9

Quote from: noelbotevera on July 12, 2016, 08:04:58 PM
Quote from: briantroutman on July 12, 2016, 06:14:28 PM
Quote from: noelbotevera on July 12, 2016, 05:07:06 PM
Do you mean internally or externally? If you mean internally, then PA counts. I-283 and PA 283 have the same number, but I-283 is inventoried as PA 300. The only exception was for the brief time there was two PA 17's, prior to I-86 extended into PA. Both were inventoried as PA 17.

Not to be pedantic, but you’re confusing some terms. “PA 300” would refer to a Pennsylvania numbered traffic route (i.e. with a keystone marker) designated as 300. There is no PA 300. What you mean to say is PA 283 is inventoried as SR 300. (SR 0300, actually.) And about the section of NY 17/I-86 near Sayre, does it even show up in PennDOT route logs at all? I was under the impression that it was a NYSDOT designed, built, and maintained road that incidentally crossed the PA border for a very short distance.
I meant the 3 mile section near Erie, not the section near Sayre. This was prior to the early 2000's.
There are duplicate numbers with secret differences
There is I-283 and PA 283...PA 283 is SR 0300
There is I-380 and PA 380...PA 380 is SR 0400
There is I-86 and PA 86...PA 86 is SR 0886
There is I-99 and PA 99...PA 99 is SR 0399

BUT...there are duplicate numbers with the same inventory number.
There is US 222 and PA 222...both are SR 0222, where PA 222 is an extension of US 222 into Allentown

There are two PA 29s (SE PA and NE PA) and two PA 97s (Erie County and Adams County), and both I believe are SR 0029 and SR 0097.  The two PA 29s were once connected along and before US 309 (I think).  The Adams County PA 97 used to be US 140 and I think was match MD 97.


roadman

Quote from: 1 on July 12, 2016, 05:26:14 PM
Connecticut, Rhode Island, and Vermont.

Massachusetts has I-295 and MA 295, New Hampshire has US 4 and NH 4, and Maine has I-195 and ME 195.
MassDOT (and MassHighway and MassDPW in the past) does not allow duplication of route numbers.  MA 295 and MA 3 are the sole exceptions.  MA 295 was grandfathered in because MA 295 is nowhere near I-295, and because it is such a short state route.  Likewise, US 3/MA 3 - which is mile posted as a continuous route, was also grandfathered in because, due to AASHO requirements, it was not practical to re-designate MA 3 as an extension of US 3 due to low clearances in Cambridge (Memorial Drive) and Boston (Storrow Drive), nor were there alternate roadways that met AASHO standards.
"And ninety-five is the route you were on.  It was not the speed limit sign."  - Jim Croce (from Speedball Tucker)

"My life has been a tapestry
Of years of roads and highway signs" (with apologies to Carole King and Tom Rush)



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.