I-485

[74/171FAN]

For those that don't know NCDOT wants to use Independence Blvd widening money to complete I-485  http://www.wcnc.com/news/topstories/stories/wcnc-071609-dd-n.c_dot_postpone_independence_wid.463aa116.html

[rickmastfan67]

I think I-485 is more important than Independence Blvd at this time.  I mean the cost per mile is a lot better with the I-485 project.

[CanesFan27]

This is very much a game of political football.  During her 2008 campaign, Governor Bev Perdue promised that 485 construction would begin this year - and completion by 2012. (Though with 485's history that would have been 2014.)

NCDOT is trying to lobby and now politicians will try to twist the arms of MUMPO members to move I-485 to the top of the priority list - which is third behind the upgrade of Independence from Albemarle Road (NC 27) to Idlewild., and the construction of the Monroe Bypass.

I have a few opinions on it:
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/07/pressures-oninterstate-485-timeline-in.html

http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/07/what-project-is-more-important.html

[froggie]

I think I-485 is more important than Independence Blvd at this time.  I mean the cost per mile is a lot better with the I-485 project.

"Cost-per-mile" has zero correlation with importance or traffic demand.

Independence is a major traffic corridor that needs a lot of improvement.  Traffic isn't so bad, nor is there a lot of demand, for that northeast leg of I-485.

I agree with CanesFan...keep the current priority list as-is.

[CanesFan27]

I think I-485 is more important than Independence Blvd at this time.  I mean the cost per mile is a lot better with the I-485 project.

"Cost-per-mile" has zero correlation with importance or traffic demand.

Independence is a major traffic corridor that needs a lot of improvement.  Traffic isn't so bad, nor is there a lot of demand, for that northeast leg of I-485.

I agree with CanesFan...keep the current priority list as-is.

Exactly, the folks that want 485 finished have made the most noise.  But you can be sure that Aunt Bev will be trying to twist some arms down in Charlotte the next few weeks.

[CanesFan27]

Has the much-needed, often complained about, widening of I-485 in Southern Mecklenburg County been forgotten in this mess?

http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/07/has-widening-interstate-485-in-southern.html

[Marc]

Has the much-needed, often complained about, widening of I-485 in Southern Mecklenburg County been forgotten in this mess?

I've traveled through Pineville quite a bit on I-485 and it seems to me that for a belt, one would think to make it at least six-lane divided in the first place. Especially in a city the size of Charlotte. It's been five years since I've been to Charlotte, so I can only imagine how much worse traffic has gotten there.

[CanesFan27]

Has the much-needed, often complained about, widening of I-485 in Southern Mecklenburg County been forgotten in this mess?

I've traveled through Pineville quite a bit on I-485 and it seems to me that for a belt, one would think to make it at least six-lane divided in the first place. Especially in a city the size of Charlotte. It's been five years since I've been to Charlotte, so I can only imagine how much worse traffic has gotten there.

Well kinda, that part of the loop was planned and then built in the late 80s - early 90s when most of Charlotte's growth hadn't reached South Meck.

As a result, many loop freeways in NC now are being designed with a minimum of six lanes.

[CanesFan27]

More fun in the I-485 Hot Potato game:

http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/08/i-485-hot-potato-who-wants-it.html

[mightyace]

More fun in the I-485 Hot Potato game:

http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/08/i-485-hot-potato-who-wants-it.html

I was on the southwest part of I-485 this weekend and in looking it up I wondered why I-485 was not a complete loop.

Now, I know.  Sheesh. 

[CanesFan27]

Time for the post-freeway opening - "Hey how did that freeway get in my backyard?" story.

http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/08/hey-whats-that-interstate-doing-in-my.html

[CanesFan27]

Earlier this month, the Mecklenburg Union Metropolitan Planning Organization formally chose the next leg of the widening/upgrading of Independence Blvd. as the region's top transportation priority. 

Governor Beverly Perdue, who promised during her 2008 campaign that work on the last leg of I-485 would begin this year, was surprised - and then vowed to continue to aggressively work on getting 485 done.

Construction on Independence (US 74) will begin in the fall of 2010.  The work for I-485 2014 or 2015.

Head to the blog for a summation of all the links.
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/09/while-i-was-away.html

[CanesFan27]

An Elon University poll of 422 Mecklenburg County adults on various Charlotte area issues show that close to 75% of Mecklenburg residents prefer the completion of Interstate 485 as the region's top transportation priority. 21% of those surveyed preferred the upgrading of Independence Blvd. 73% of respondents said the I-485 loop should be finished first.

The survey was taken between September 16-20; and the margin of error is +/- 4.9 percent.

http://www.elon.edu/e-net/Note.aspx?id=940184&board_ids=5&max=5
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/local/story/963656.html

[CanesFan27]

The Charlotte Observer reports that Governor Beverly Perdue will announce a funding solution that will allow I-485 to be completed sooner.  The funding plan, which has never been used before in NC, will be revealed tomorrow at 11.  The only details made available is that it won't take money away from the Independence Blvd. widening project nor any other loop project in the state.

The story is here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/topstories/story/1045187.html

Anyone want to take a stab at what this rare funding plan would be?

[rickmastfan67]

The Charlotte Observer reports that Governor Beverly Perdue will announce a funding solution that will allow I-485 to be completed sooner.  The funding plan, which has never been used before in NC, will be revealed tomorrow at 11.  The only details made available is that it won't take money away from the Independence Blvd. widening project nor any other loop project in the state.

The story is here: http://www.charlotteobserver.com/topstories/story/1045187.html

Anyone want to take a stab at what this rare funding plan would be?

I think they are going to by 2,000 tickets to try to win the Powerball jackpot.

[froggie]

Public-private partnership, perhaps?

[CanesFan27]

The plan is something call design-build-finance. Something I hadn't heard before - the contractors will help pay for the construction - and will later be reimbursed by the state.

"The plan -- called design-build-finance -- offers a streamlined schedule for construction of the unfinished section of the loop, between N.C. 115 and Interstate 85 in northeast Charlotte. The price tag is estimated at $220 million."

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/topstories/story/1045187.html

I'll have more on it later this evening when I get home from work.

Has any major project in the country ever use this financing before??

[rawmustard]

Has any major project in the country ever use [design-build-finance] before??

Yes, and they've been discussed in these fora. Here's an example of an MDOT project which used this method.

[froggie]

Has any major project in the country ever use this financing before??

MnDOT attempted to use the financing bit last year for the Crosstown Commons reconstruction.  Got zero response.

[CanesFan27]

I already have my doubts on this plan.  The new adjusted cost of the project is $340 million.  The contractor will only need to pay for $50 million.  The $50 million will be paid back over a 10 year period.

When the project cost only $220 million (prior to changes made to the 85/485 interchange), the state said they didn't have the cash.  Now the state has to come up with $70 million above that - and now it "won't be an issue", yet it won't delay/move/cut other projects?

Well, NCDOT is already going back on the governor's promise saying they are 'prioritizing' (read: shifting money around) projects including I-485.

Lots of good articles:
My Commentary - http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/11/perdue-offers-i-485-financing-plan-but.html

News stories some w/ video:
http://news14.com/charlotte-news-104-content/top_stories/617299/perdue-unveils-plan-to-complete-interstate-485
http://www.charlotteobserver.com/topstories/story/1047199.html
http://www.wcnc.com/news/topstories/stories/wcnc-110809-sjf-485announcement.2991eb800.html
http://www.wbtv.com/global/story.asp?s=11466790

[jdb1234]

The plan is something call design-build-finance. Something I hadn't heard before - the contractors will help pay for the construction - and will later be reimbursed by the state.

"The plan -- called design-build-finance -- offers a streamlined schedule for construction of the unfinished section of the loop, between N.C. 115 and Interstate 85 in northeast Charlotte. The price tag is estimated at $220 million."

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/topstories/story/1045187.html

I'll have more on it later this evening when I get home from work.

Has any major project in the country ever use this financing before??

That what I thought the plan would be.  The widening of I-75 from Fort Myers to Naples, FL is a major project that was financed this way.   

[CanesFan27]

From questions out of the state treasurer's office to other cities within the state unhappiness with the plan, the design-build-finance plan to complete Interstate 485 in Charlotte is nowhere near out of the woods just yet.

Summary of all the stories in the blog:
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/11/i-485-financing-plan-already-mess.html

[CanesFan27]

And more drama w/I-485.  NCDOT and Skanska USA (the contractor who built the most recently opened stretch of the highway) are still at odds over late fees.  The project is technically not complete.

http://www.wsoctv.com/news/21544477/detail.html

[CanesFan27]

It appears that the NC Treasurer's office has been skeptical of the design-build-finance plan for I-485 in Charlotte since the idea began gaining legs in October.

NCDOT has publicly stated that they had thought the treasurer's office was in support of the plan.

Summary and a ton of links at the blog:
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2009/12/it-seems-like-nc-treasurers-office-has.html

[CanesFan27]

Both the Triad and Triangle Business Journal's published last week stories on the amount of funding for highway loops throughout the state of North Carolina. And when you look at the details, Charlotte doesn't have much to complain about.

Story Links:
http://triangle.bizjournals.com/triangle/stories/2010/01/04/story1.html?b=1262581200^2656691

http://triad.bizjournals.com/triad/stories/2010/01/04/story11.html

Commentary:
http://surewhynotnow.blogspot.com/2010/01/will-charlotte-stop-complaining-about-i.html