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[roadman]

This past Tuesday (4/3), MassDOT opened bids on a project to replace guide signs and structures, as well as all other warning, regulatory, and route signs, on Interstate 91 between the Connecticut line and the 'bowtie' interchange (Exit 13) in West Sipringfield.  As with the recently awarded I-95 Wellesley to Lexington project, this work will include advance signing for I-91 on approach roads - with the exception of the signs on I-391 and I-291(the I-391 approach to I-91 was last updated in 2002, and the I-291 approach to I-91 was last updated in 2007).

The signing on this section of I-91 was last replaced in 1995.  With the exception of button copy numerals on the OH Interstate shields, all exisitng signs are high-intensity sheeting with the old MassHighway standard 18 inch high 'integral' exit tabs (where the number ovelaps onto the main sign panel).  Per current MassDOT specifications, the new signs will be high intensity prismatic (HIP) sheeting, with separate full height (30 inch per current MUTCD requirements) exit number tabs.  Also, the button copy numerals on the Interstate shields will be replaced with demountable HIP numerals on the new signs.

[agentsteel53]

Also, the button copy numerals on the Interstate shields will be replaced with demountable HIP numerals on the new signs.

why are the numbers being made demountable?  is this standard practice?  I would imagine this to add cost compared to just digitally printing the numbers on, or even using stickers.

[shadyjay]

This past Tuesday (4/3), MassDOT opened bids on a project to replace guide signs and structures, as well as all other warning, regulatory, and route signs, on Interstate 91 between the Connecticut line and the 'bowtie' interchange (Exit 13) in West Sipringfield.  As with the recently awarded I-95 Wellesley to Lexington project, this work will include advance signing for I-91 on approach roads - with the exception of the signs on I-391 and I-291(the I-391 approach to I-91 was last updated in 2002, and the I-291 approach to I-91 was last updated in 2007).

The signing on this section of I-91 was last replaced in 1995.  With the exception of button copy numerals on the OH Interstate shields, all exisitng signs are high-intensity sheeting with the old MassHighway standard 18 inch high 'integral' exit tabs (where the number ovelaps onto the main sign panel).  Per current MassDOT specifications, the new signs will be high intensity prismatic (HIP) sheeting, with separate full height (30 inch per current MUTCD requirements) exit number tabs.  Also, the button copy numerals on the Interstate shields will be replaced with demountable HIP numerals on the new signs.

Interesting.  Those signs are in pretty good shape - some were replaced much later than 1995 when the Springfield exits were rearranged (2000s).  I won't miss the button copy Interstate numerals, but then again, there were only a handful, and there are only a handful of I-91 pull-throughs within those project limits.

And as a side, I was hoping when I saw the topic of this thread that it was referring to I-91 VT or CT signage.  The ones in VT up to Exit 10 are most likely 1970s-early 80s vintage (some have been replaced as part of individual projects) and those in CT especially from Hartford north are from the late 1980s-90s era. 

[roadman]

Also, the button copy numerals on the Interstate shields will be replaced with demountable HIP numerals on the new signs.

why are the numbers being made demountable?  is this standard practice?  I would imagine this to add cost compared to just digitally printing the numbers on, or even using stickers.

As I noted in the thread about the I-95 Wellesley to Lexington sign project, in the late 1970s and early 1980s, MassDPW had problems with silk screened Interstate shields prematurely fading, thus causing the numbers to be illegible at night.  They originally went to button copy numbers, but since button copy was discontinued in the early 1990s, the specification has since been changed to demountable high intesnity prismatic numbers.

And, despite advances in technology, silk screen Interstate shields are still prone to premature fading.  The 93 shield on the pull-thru sign at Exit 27 northbound (northbound Zakim Bridge), which was NOT fabricated to MassHighway specifications, is a good example of a recently-installed sign that has problems.

[roadman]

Interesting.  Those signs are in pretty good shape - some were replaced much later than 1995 when the Springfield exits were rearranged (2000s). 

There are one or two signs on the mainline, and a handful of signs on local streets in Downtown Springfield that will be reset or retained.  By the time the other signs are replaced, they will have been in service for almost exactly twenty years since they were installed.  High intensity retro-reflective sheeting slowly degrades over time, then loses its final "punch" very quickly - in western Massachusetts, this normally occurs at the 20 to 22 year mark.  MassDOT's philosophy is simple - replace the signs before they wear out.

Also note that, during the 1995 update project, nearly all the sign supports (some of which date from the late 1960s) were retained.  Apart from their age, none of these structures meet current MassDOT or AASHTO standards for design or wind loading.

[agentsteel53]

As I noted in the thread about the I-95 Wellesley to Lexington sign project, in the late 1970s and early 1980s, MassDPW had problems with silk screened Interstate shields prematurely fading, thus causing the numbers to be illegible at night.  They originally went to button copy numbers, but since button copy was discontinued in the early 1990s, the specification has since been changed to demountable high intesnity prismatic numbers.

And, despite advances in technology, silk screen Interstate shields are still prone to premature fading.  The 93 shield on the pull-thru sign at Exit 27 northbound (northbound Zakim Bridge), which was NOT fabricated to MassHighway specifications, is a good example of a recently-installed sign that has problems.

what about silk screening (or digital printing) over prismatic high intensity?  or, alternately, using prismatic numbers that are simply stuck on, as opposed to being demountable?  the "demountable" requirement seems to be an extra expense.

[roadman]

what about silk screening (or digital printing) over prismatic high intensity?  or, alternately, using prismatic numbers that are simply stuck on, as opposed to being demountable?  the "demountable" requirement seems to be an extra expense.

Which is why the requirement is only for overhead signs - the extra expense of applying demountable numerals is negligible compared to the total cost of the sign panel.  But silk screening over HIP sheeting is an interesting idea.

[agentsteel53]

But silk screening over HIP sheeting is an interesting idea.

the sign shop which makes my route markers has an option to digitally print over prismatic high intensity.  I thought this was standard practice for recent signs used in the field.  I do not know for sure, as I always request old-school engineer grade and therefore haven't paid much attention to new materials, but I can inquire about the HIP usage patterns.

[hbelkins]

I was on I-91 from the state line to the MassPike interchange about 18 months ago, and the signage appeared to be in great shape then. This seems IMHO to be a huge waste of money.

[roadman]

I was on I-91 from the state line to the MassPike interchange about 18 months ago, and the signage appeared to be in great shape then. This seems IMHO to be a huge waste of money.

I respectfully refer you to my earlier follow-up post in this thread about the useful lifespan of retro-reflective sheeting

[hbelkins]

I was on I-91 from the state line to the MassPike interchange about 18 months ago, and the signage appeared to be in great shape then. This seems IMHO to be a huge waste of money.

I respectfully refer you to my earlier follow-up post in this thread about the useful lifespan of retro-reflective sheeting

Kentucky gets a heck of a lot longer than 17 years out of its guide signage. Much of the signage on the Mountain Parkway is more than 30 years old. Some of the signage on I-75 and I-65 is of similar vintage.

[roadman]

Kentucky gets a heck of a lot longer than 17 years out of its guide signage. Much of the signage on the Mountain Parkway is more than 30 years old. Some of the signage on I-75 and I-65 is of similar vintage.

I'll take your word for it.  I refuse to drive through or even patronize a state that not only bans the use of mobile scanners (even if you're a licensed Ham), but also gives their state patrol officers the authority to confiscate your radio equipment on sight.

As for your comment about the lifespan of signs in Massachusetts, it's my understanding that MassDOT will be looking at the performance of the high intensity prismatic (HIP) sheeting now specified very closely to see if they can extend the interval between sign replacement projects.

[froggie]

Kentucky gets a heck of a lot longer than 17 years out of its guide signage.

Kentucky is also a different climate.  Less snow and Nor'easters don't exist.

[SidS1045]

The 93 shield on the pull-thru sign at Exit 27 northbound (northbound Zakim Bridge), which was NOT fabricated to MassHighway specifications, is a good example of a recently-installed sign that has problems.

The I-93 and US-1 shields on the two gantries located just as you come out of the tunnel were replaced a few months ago.  The I-93 shield was illegible on both, the US-1 on the first one.

[roadman]

The 93 shield on the pull-thru sign at Exit 27 northbound (northbound Zakim Bridge), which was NOT fabricated to MassHighway specifications, is a good example of a recently-installed sign that has problems.

The I-93 and US-1 shields on the two gantries located just as you come out of the tunnel were replaced a few months ago.  The I-93 shield was illegible on both, the US-1 on the first one.

Thanks for the update.  I also noticed those shields were (finally) replaced when I came across the Zakim Bridge this past Sunday night.

[wytout]

I will admit one thing, while i don't understand the overkill of some of the things MA does (have you ever seen  so many recessed raised payment deliniators in a northeast state?) I will agree that compared to CT signage, You can read the signs in MA at night.  For whatever reason, CT just isn't funding the signing projects.  The big one going on on 84 from the NY Line to Newtown was way over due, that signage en-masse was getting close to celebrating it's 30th birthday.  

Another planned project that is yet unfunded is replacing signage from exit 32 to exit 52 vic on I 84.  It was put up in 1985, by the time the project gets underway those signs will be 30 years old.  The signs on I 84 East of manchester are CA 1995.  In CT that's "new" signage.  By our standards those will likely be there until about 2025.

[agentsteel53]

I will agree that compared to CT signage, You can read the signs in MA at night.  

that's mainly because Conn jumped way too heavily on the 'button copy over retroreflective background' trend.  Mass has that too, but not nearly as much.  Button copy is intended to be used with non-reflective background.

[shadyjay]

Another planned project that is yet unfunded is replacing signage from exit 32 to exit 52 vic on I 84.  It was put up in 1985, by the time the project gets underway those signs will be 30 years old.  The signs on I 84 East of manchester are CA 1995.  In CT that's "new" signage.  By our standards those will likely be there until about 2025.

I'm guessing signage on CT 25 is the oldest in the state... early 80s?  

I-84, Exit 32 to 52 ... wouldn't say 1985.  The I-84/I-91 interchange project wrapped up in the early 90s and the signs are pretty much from that era.  Those around the 72 junction were replaced in the past few years.  That takes us up to Exit 35.  Those from there up to Hartford appear to be relatively the same vintage as those right at 91.  Of course the ones at Exit 39A were put up in 1992.

I'd give second place would have to go to I-84 from Exit 57 to Exit 64.  You can tell by the size of the route markers (though not the interstate ones anymore as most of them have been replaced).  But look at Exit 64-65 EB / Exit 64-WB.  This probably dates to the mid 1980s, when I-384 was connected to I-84, and the whole "frontage roads"-esque system went in.

Third place.... I-395 - mid 1980s, possibly tied with I-95 - Stratford.  We'll most likely lose the I-95 section when the Moses Wheeler Bridge project wraps up.  I did see I-395 signage mentioned in a long-range CDOT plan.

Fourth place.... to keep this post ON TOPIC, I'm saying I-91 from East Windsor, north to Enfield / MA state line.  I'm giving them an installation date of late 1980s, as this was the first part of I-91 to be reconstructed, and I remember traveling north to VT in 1990 and seeing Phase III.  Back in those days, Mass. still had an earlier generation of signage, where I recall much more pull-through signage, LEFT 2 LANES used instead of LEFT LANES, and a Northampton/Greenfield pullthrough on the Exit 13 gantry.  

[roadman]

I will agree that compared to CT signage, You can read the signs in MA at night. 

that's mainly because Conn jumped way too heavily on the 'button copy over retroreflective background' trend.  Mass has that too, but not nearly as much.  Button copy is intended to be used with non-reflective background.

Except for numbers on scattered OH sign Interstate shields, button copy will soon be a thing of the past in Maasachusetts.  The button copy signs on I-95/Southeast Expressway between Braintree and Boston will be replaced with new HIP signs by Fall of 2012, the remaining button copy signs at the MassPike Newton Corner and Newton Corner signs will be replaced with new HIP signs by late summer of 2012, and the remaining button copy signs on the MassPike extension between Weston and Boston are tenatively scheduled to be replaced by late 2015-early 2016.

The remaining Interstate shields with button copy will be replaced over the next eight years as signs are updated "segment by segment" under MassDOT's ongoing freeway sign replacement program.

So, get those photos while you can.

[agentsteel53]

Except for numbers on scattered OH sign Interstate shields, button copy will soon be a thing of the past in Maasachusetts.  The button copy signs on I-95/Southeast Expressway between Braintree and Boston will be replaced with new HIP signs by Fall of 2012, the remaining button copy signs at the MassPike Newton Corner and Newton Corner signs will be replaced with new HIP signs by late summer of 2012, and the remaining button copy signs on the MassPike extension between Weston and Boston are tenatively scheduled to be replaced by late 2015-early 2016.

what about random button copy on non-freeway state highways?  

As of April, 2008, there was a gantry on MA-138 southbound in maybe Canton or so.  There's also some MDC button copy on Memorial Drive, though it might be down to one sign near the 2-3-16 junction.  As far as I know, the button copy on the MA-2 freeway is gone, but what about side streets to it?

all of these signs I refer to are all caps Series DM button copy.

also, the MA-16 entrance to the turnpike has some very old button copy with rectangular shields on the side streets.  Is that slated for replacement too?

[PHLBOS]

the MA-16 entrance to the turnpike has some very old button copy with rectangular shields on the side streets.  Is that slated for replacement too?

Those signs date back to when the Turnpike Extension first opened in the early 1960s; though the shields were replaced once back in the early 80s IIRC.

The button copy signs on I-95/Southeast Expressway between Braintree and Boston will be replaced with new HIP signs by Fall of 2012

I believe that you meant to say I-93/Southeast Expressway.

I'm guessing signage on CT 25 is the oldest in the state... early 80s?

Some of the signs along I-84 between Exits 22-25 likely date back to the early-to-mid 1980s as well.

[agentsteel53]

the MA-16 entrance to the turnpike has some very old button copy with rectangular shields on the side streets.  Is that slated for replacement too?

Those signs date back to when the Turnpike Extension first opened in the early 1960s; though the shields were replaced once back in the early 80s IIRC.

what did the shields look like before that? rectangles with custom font?  reflective or non-reflective?

[Beeper1]

Except for numbers on scattered OH sign Interstate shields, button copy will soon be a thing of the past in Maasachusetts.  The button copy signs on I-95/Southeast Expressway between Braintree and Boston will be replaced with new HIP signs by Fall of 2012, the remaining button copy signs at the MassPike Newton Corner and Newton Corner signs will be replaced with new HIP signs by late summer of 2012, and the remaining button copy signs on the MassPike extension between Weston and Boston are tenatively scheduled to be replaced by late 2015-early 2016.

what about random button copy on non-freeway state highways? 

As of April, 2008, there was a gantry on MA-138 southbound in maybe Canton or so.  There's also some MDC button copy on Memorial Drive, though it might be down to one sign near the 2-3-16 junction.  As far as I know, the button copy on the MA-2 freeway is gone, but what about side streets to it?

all of these signs I refer to are all caps Series DM button copy.

also, the MA-16 entrance to the turnpike has some very old button copy with rectangular shields on the side streets.  Is that slated for replacement too?

There is an overhead gantry with two button copy BGSs in Worcester on the ramp from I-190 SB to I-290 EB, where the ramp to MA-70 splits off.  It is original to when I-190 was built in the early 80s, and has been missed by all subsequent 190 and 290 sign replacement projects.   

[KEVIN_224]

http://www.panoramio.com/photo_explorer#view=photo&position=745&with_photo_id=29658150&order=date_desc&user=520571  

I assume you mean this sign gantry?

(NOTE: This is NOT my photo.)

[PHLBOS]

what did the shields look like before that? rectangles with custom font?  reflective or non-reflective?

If memory serves, the original shields were rectangular, biege/off-white (that turned tan/brown w/age & dirt) w/a black outline slightly offset from the edge.  The font for the 16 numerals was actually FHWA standard.  I can't remember whether the font was the standard width (Series D) or wider (Series F).  Non-reflectorized.