South Carolina

[lordsutch]

The only logical reason I can come up with is that the VDOT-NCDOT underposting virus is spreading south. 4 miles is just enough for some quality, Boss Hogg style revenue enhancement.

(Although GDOT's 2-mile speed limit drop in Valdosta between exits 16 and 18 may be the record-holder for shortest gratuitous Interstate speed limit drop.)

[froggie]

To be fair, it's not the whole 6 lane stretch that they dropped to 60 MPH...just the first couple exits north of I-20.  It was definitely back to 70 MPH before TV Road, 55 MPH construction zone at the SC 327 interchange reconstruction notwithstanding.  And on that note, they really need to finish that project...the lane weaving/merging northbound is horrid.  They close the right lane for the ramp construction, then open it back up just before the permanent left lane drop...with no restriping to keep things consistent.  Result is a LOT of unnecessary lane merging.

[PColumbus73]

What kind of road projects would you like to see in SC? I-73/74 has been mentioned several places.

Personally, I'd like to see I-26 widened to 6 lanes between Columbia and about I-385 (or all the way to Spartanburg), that stretch is fairly busy with truck/tourist traffic to and from the mountains and the ocean. Maybe even widen I-26 all the way to Charleston.

Also, fix the I-20/26 interchange in Columbia! From now until SCDOT does something about it, I plan on taking I-26 to I-77 whenever I travel from Greenville to Myrtle Beach.

[1995hoo]

What kind of road projects would you like to see in SC? ....

Widen I-95 to six lanes (three per side) for its full length throughout the state. Same also applies to North Carolina, although obviously the Lumberton area would pose some problems there.

I recognize the high cost of a full widening, so in the interest of focusing the improvement in a way that could help move traffic, I'd focus first on the northbound carriageway starting at the Georgia state line. Traffic always backs up in Georgia around weekends with heavy beach traffic because the road narrows. I'd set a priority of widening South Carolina's I-95 at least to the exit for Hilton Head (to start) and then up to the US-17 exit south of Yemassee where Charleston-bound traffic peels off. I view northbound as the higher priority than southbound because of the bottleneck created by the road narrowing at the state line (in other words, while I often hit inexplicable slowdowns around Hardeeville going south, the number of lanes is not the reason).

On our last trip north there the traffic was at a complete standstill, so we exited at one of the last two exits in Georgia, crossed over into South Carolina on the road named "Alligator Alley," then took US-17 back to I-95. Worked pretty well, but I have no idea whether we saved any time. The backup that day didn't extend as far as I-16, which is why we didn't go around that way instead.



BTW, unrelated to this question, froggie's post made me recall that South Carolina was the first place I ever saw a 60-mph speed limit, back in August 1991 on a school trip to Atlanta. We were on a charter bus coming back up I-85 on the way home and they had posted 60-mph speed limits in some work zones. I remember wondering at the time why nobody else ever posted 60 mph anywhere.

[DeaconG]

What kind of road projects would you like to see in SC? ....

Widen I-95 to six lanes (three per side) for its full length throughout the state. Same also applies to North Carolina, although obviously the Lumberton area would pose some problems there.

I recognize the high cost of a full widening, so in the interest of focusing the improvement in a way that could help move traffic, I'd focus first on the northbound carriageway starting at the Georgia state line. Traffic always backs up in Georgia around weekends with heavy beach traffic because the road narrows. I'd set a priority of widening South Carolina's I-95 at least to the exit for Hilton Head (to start) and then up to the US-17 exit south of Yemassee where Charleston-bound traffic peels off. I view northbound as the higher priority than southbound because of the bottleneck created by the road narrowing at the state line (in other words, while I often hit inexplicable slowdowns around Hardeeville going south, the number of lanes is not the reason).

On our last trip north there the traffic was at a complete standstill, so we exited at one of the last two exits in Georgia, crossed over into South Carolina on the road named "Alligator Alley," then took US-17 back to I-95. Worked pretty well, but I have no idea whether we saved any time. The backup that day didn't extend as far as I-16, which is why we didn't go around that way instead.



BTW, unrelated to this question, froggie's post made me recall that South Carolina was the first place I ever saw a 60-mph speed limit, back in August 1991 on a school trip to Atlanta. We were on a charter bus coming back up I-85 on the way home and they had posted 60-mph speed limits in some work zones. I remember wondering at the time why nobody else ever posted 60 mph anywhere.

Agreed, though if it were a cost-saving that needed to be brought into play I would go from the I-20 junction north to the North Carolina state line. That road in both states is turning into the world's fastest parking lot...

[froggie]

Based on traffic data (yes, I looked it up), top priority for 6 lanes in South Carolina should actually be I-26 between Columbia and I-95.

Secondary priority would go to the I-95 section from Georgia to where US 17 splits towards Charleston as Hoo noted, as well as I-85 between Spartanburg and Gaffney.

Tertiary priority would go to the remainder of I-85, all of I-77 that isn't already 6 lanes (per traffic data, stronger arguments can be made for widening all of I-77 *AND* I-85 in SC before I-95), I-95 south of I-26, and I-20 from Columbia to Camden.

Low priority would be I-26 from Charleston to I-95 and from Columbia to I-385 (an argument could be made for a higher priority up to around Newberry but not all the way to I-385), I-95 north of Florence, and I-385 north of Fountain Inn (if it isn't already).

I-95 from I-26 to Florence, I-26 from I-385 to the south edge of Spartanburg, and most of I-20 don't even hit a planning level threshold (usually lower than actual Level-of-Service calculations) of when 6-lane widening should be considered.

[1995hoo]

When you refer to traffic data, what sort of data are you looking at? Numbers of vehicles, average speed, type of vehicle, etc.? The reason I ask is that certainly we've all encountered the situation where you have a road that carries a large number of vehicles but often moves along at fairly high speed without much difficulty, and we've all also encountered roads that may carry a lower "raw" number of vehicles but that are more frustrating to drive due to the type of vehicles (roads with particularly high volumes of truck traffic would be a prime example because the trucks cause more of the slower drivers into the left lane).

I'm not disputing any of your statistical analysis, mind you; I'm just curious about the details. One reason why is that I've found that I-26 between Columbia and I-95 generally seems to move along at a pretty good clip and passing slower drivers is not usually a problem, whereas on I-95 passing can be a good deal more difficult. I would theorize (based solely on my own observations behind the wheel) that I-95 probably carries more long-distance trucking, whereas I-26 connects the state's two main population centers and carries a lower volume of long-distance trucks compared to in-state traffic.

[froggie]

In this case, I was looking at average daily traffic, as that's all I have ready access to.  Few states put out a product such as VDOT's traffic logs, which actually have enough data from which one could go as far as making rough LOS calculations (if you have ready access to the Highway Capacity Manual).  But planning-level analysis typically starts with just AADT and perhaps truck volume data to identify rough areas for further detailed analysis.

Freight volume/traffic is particularly difficult to get a hold of for the layman.  What little I can find for South Carolina suggests that yes, I-95 sees more trucks than I-26, but I-85 sees more trucks than I-95.

[cpzilliacus]

What kind of road projects would you like to see in SC? ....

Widen I-95 to six lanes (three per side) for its full length throughout the state. Same also applies to North Carolina, although obviously the Lumberton area would pose some problems there.

I recognize the high cost of a full widening, so in the interest of focusing the improvement in a way that could help move traffic, I'd focus first on the northbound carriageway starting at the Georgia state line. Traffic always backs up in Georgia around weekends with heavy beach traffic because the road narrows. I'd set a priority of widening South Carolina's I-95 at least to the exit for Hilton Head (to start) and then up to the US-17 exit south of Yemassee where Charleston-bound traffic peels off. I view northbound as the higher priority than southbound because of the bottleneck created by the road narrowing at the state line (in other words, while I often hit inexplicable slowdowns around Hardeeville going south, the number of lanes is not the reason).

If I had to choose and between widening I-95 in North Carolina and South Carolina, the Tar Heel State beats the Palmetto State hands-down. 

Having said that, I could see widening South Carolina's I-95 along two segments.  First, as you suggest above, from the Georgia border to the point where U.S. 17 heads away in the direction of the Low Country, Exit 33).  If you want to extend the six lanes north to S.C. 68 (Yemassee, Exit 38), that sounds fine. 

The second (and IMO higher-priority) widening would be from the end of the six lane section of I-95 at Florence (Exit 170) to the North Carolina border at U.S. 301/U.S. 501 at Dillon and South of the Border.

I should add this disclaimer - I don't live in South Carolina, and I make the statements above as a (somewhat) frequent driver of I-95 in the state.  Residents probably have other priorities, like completing I-526. 

As in North Carolina, I-95 in South Carolina makes a whole lot of political sense as a tolled highway, which could probably fund widening (including the widening of the long bridge over Lake Marion) and some interchange reconstruction projects.  A lot of out-of-state auto and truck traffic, and the lack of any large metropolitan areas along its path (except Florence), mean relatively little objection would be raised.

[1995hoo]

If I had to choose and between widening I-95 in North Carolina and South Carolina, the Tar Heel State beats the Palmetto State hands-down. 

....

Agreed, but this is, after all, a thread about South Carolina.

[cpzilliacus]

In this case, I was looking at average daily traffic, as that's all I have ready access to.  Few states put out a product such as VDOT's traffic logs, which actually have enough data from which one could go as far as making rough LOS calculations (if you have ready access to the Highway Capacity Manual).  But planning-level analysis typically starts with just AADT and perhaps truck volume data to identify rough areas for further detailed analysis.

Trucks (3 or more axles single-unit and all combinations) as a percentage of AADT or AAWDT are important.

It's probably naive of me, but I wish we could have a merger of VDOT's traffic count book and the Maryland Highway Location Reference. VDOT, to its immense credit, publishes at least an estimate of the volumes of various kinds of trucks on most of its primary network.

Freight volume/traffic is particularly difficult to get a hold of for the layman.  What little I can find for South Carolina suggests that yes, I-95 sees more trucks than I-26, but I-85 sees more trucks than I-95.

I have driven on I-26 between Columbia and its eastern terminus in Charleston, and especially between I-95 and Charleston.  There are a fair number of truck-related businesses along the freeway, and Charleston is also a major seaport, which means a steady flow of trucks coming and going. But in total, I think the percentage of trucks on I-95 is higher than on I-26.

[Grzrd]

What kind of road projects would you like to see in SC?

Interesting October 23 article about intra-state wrangling over this very question.

[PColumbus73]

I think the I-20/26 interchange should be a top priority, the weaving on I-26 East is really bad, as well as trying to merge on/off the cloverleafs.

[Grzrd]

fix the I-20/26 interchange in Columbia!

I think the I-20/26 interchange should be a top priority

What kind of road projects would you like to see in SC?

Interesting October 23 article about intra-state wrangling over this very question.

This article reports that the I-20/I-26 interchange is becoming embroiled in the controversy:

... The state Department of Transportation sent four projects to the board for approval — including a $38 million project to widen I-77 from I-20 to S.C. 277 — based on a prioritized list of state projects.
Redesigning Malfunction Junction, the bottleneck of Interstates 20 and 26 in Columbia, is No. 1 on the Transportation Department's priority list. But that project was passed over because it would cost at least $700 million, which is more the Infrastructure Bank has to spend.
However, Don Leonard, the chairman of the Infrastructure Bank and an appointee of Gov. Nikki Haley, a Lexington Republican, wants to take the I-77 money and use $12 million of it to pay engineers to completely redesign Malfunction Junction. That would put the project one step closer to being "shovel-ready,"  meaning it would be a better candidate for federal or state highway money ...

[Thing 342]

I would like to see I-73 completed between MB and I-95 completed, followed by the replacement of the I-20/26 junction.

As for widening I-95, I would recommend working from the state borders inward, starting with Georgia to US-17 south of Yemassee, followed by NC to SC-38. Next, I would widen from SC-38 to Florence, and then from US-17 to I-26. The portion from I-26 to I-20 is in the least need of widening, IMHO.

[PColumbus73]

I'm hoping that SCDOT gets SC 31 extended to US 17 soon. As far as I know, the next phase will be to extended it to SC 707. There was something on WMBF News here about possibly a spur being added to US 701 across the Waccamaw River. If the SELL project doesn't go through, I think a bridge from SC 31 to US 701 would be beneficial because there is no way to cross the Waccamaw between Conway and Georgetown.

Also, if the SELL is built, then I'd like SCDOT to reroute US 701 on the newly formed loop to get around Conway. Then US 701 could be advertised as an alternative through the Myrtle Beach area.

[Henry]

I'm hoping that SCDOT gets SC 31 extended to US 17 soon. As far as I know, the next phase will be to extended it to SC 707. There was something on WMBF News here about possibly a spur being added to US 701 across the Waccamaw River. If the SELL project doesn't go through, I think a bridge from SC 31 to US 701 would be beneficial because there is no way to cross the Waccamaw between Conway and Georgetown.

Also, if the SELL is built, then I'd like SCDOT to reroute US 701 on the newly formed loop to get around Conway. Then US 701 could be advertised as an alternative through the Myrtle Beach area.

It probably will be built soon, if it's known what the I-74 plans are to the north.

[WashuOtaku]

It probably will be built soon, if it's known what the I-74 plans are to the north.

What do you mean by that?  If you mean if I-74 is to be built into South Carolina, then that's already a given... it will... just a matter of when.  North and South Carolina made a compact; North Carolina will extend I-74 into South Carolina and South Carolina will build the piece from the state line to Future I-74/US 74 near Hamlet.  Just because they are inactive on it doesn't mean they have changed their minds on it, it's just not a high priority for either state at the moment, in regards of I-74.

[NE2]

If you mean if I-74 is to be built into South Carolina, then that's already a given... it will... just a matter of when.

Gitmo will be closed first.

Oh, that agreement? Doesn't say anything about NC building the Bolton-Supply Porkway, only that SC will build an SC 31 extension to the state line in cooperation with NC (whose Segment 19, which would provide obvious independent utility, is only the 4 miles from the state line to the curve in US 17).
http://www.i73.com/pdf/CarolinasReach021205.pdf

[PColumbus73]

All we need is for SC 31 to tie into US 17 so that Myrtle Beach can have a legitamate bypass. The US 17 'Bypass' is a joke. It's easier for me to take 17 Business through Myrtle Beach, although between US 501 and Harrelson Blvd is a pain.

[WashuOtaku]

All we need is for SC 31 to tie into US 17 so that Myrtle Beach can have a legitamate bypass. The US 17 'Bypass' is a joke. It's easier for me to take 17 Business through Myrtle Beach, although between US 501 and Harrelson Blvd is a pain.

When it was completed in 1981, it had nothing on it.  All throughout the '80s it only had Myrtle Waves and a few business south of the Air Force Base.  Of course, nowadays is a different story; but that typically what happens when they build bypasses without making them controlled access.   

[PColumbus73]

True, ironically, I can go north from 501 quicker on 17 Business than I can if I tried using US 17 mainline.

[Grzrd]

Oh, that agreement? ... that SC will build an SC 31 extension to the state line in cooperation with NC (whose Segment 19, which would provide obvious independent utility, is only the 4 miles from the state line to the curve in US 17).
http://www.i73.com/pdf/CarolinasReach021205.pdf

This article reports that contracts will soon be let for "the final phase of S.C. 31", which is an extension of the southern (non-N.C. state line) end of S.C. 31 :

Now that permits have been obtained, contracts will soon be let to complete the final phase of S.C. 31.
Also included in that phase will be the widening of S.C. 707 to five lanes.
Local and state officials gathered Wednesday at the southern end of S.C. 31 to announce the beginning of the two projects ....
S.C. 31 will be extended from its current stopping point at S.C. 544 to S.C. 707 just north of Moss Creek Road, covering almost four miles.
This project will also include a bridge over the Intracoastal Waterway.
The cost for this segment will be close to $230 million with most of the money coming from the State Infrastructure Bank.
Horry County spokeswoman Lisa Bourcier said construction would probably begin near the first of the year with completion slated for spring of 2017.
The S.C. 707 widening project will begin near Enterprise Road and run 9.2 miles to U.S. 17 in Georgetown County.
The project will also include an interim intersection at Big Block Road.
The cost for the project is estimated between $100 million and $105 million to be paid for by the Riding on a Penny one-cent capital projects sales tax.
It, too, is scheduled to be completed in 2017.

[WashuOtaku]

This article reports that contracts will soon be let for "the final phase of S.C. 31", which is an extension of the southern (non-N.C. state line) end of S.C. 31 :

Thank you for sharing that, that sheds a lot of light of whats going on there.

[Grzrd]

This Nov. 12 article reports that the Transportation Infrastructure Bank has approved four major interstate improvement projects:

Two projects to widen and improve segments of Interstate 85 in the Upstate are one step closer to construction after approval by the state Transportation Infrastructure Bank.
The bank's board unanimously approved four major interstate improvement projects on Tuesday and funding to pay for preliminary engineering on others, a $550 million funding package of cash and bonds. All that remains is approval by the Joint Bond Review Committee, which is expected.
The money will pay $80 million for improving the I-85/I-385 interchange in Greenville; $262 million to widen a 16-mile stretch of I-85 in Spartanburg and Cherokee counties; $154 million to widen a 10-mile stretch of I-20 in Lexington County; and $38 million to widen a 2.6-mile segment of I-77 near Columbia.

This article reports that the I-20/I-26 interchange is becoming embroiled in the controversy:

... Don Leonard, the chairman of the Infrastructure Bank and an appointee of Gov. Nikki Haley, a Lexington Republican, wants to take the I-77 money and use $12 million of it to pay engineers to completely redesign Malfunction Junction. That would put the project one step closer to being "shovel-ready,"  meaning it would be a better candidate for federal or state highway money ...

Approval of $10 million for preliminary engineering for the I-20/I-26 Malfunction Junction redesign was also granted, with the money coming from the I-85/I-385 interchange rebuild instead of the I-77 project:

Also approved was up to $10 million for preliminary engineering for the area where I-20 joins I-26 near Columbia and known by motorists as "Malfunction Junction;" $4 million for preliminary engineering for the last segment of widening I-85 to the North Carolina border; and up to $6 million for engineering of other interstate projects to be submitted by Department of Transportation officials and approved by the bank board ....
The plan approved by the board used $20 million from the I-385/85 interchange project to pay for the preliminary engineering.
Leonard also said the $20 million of bank funding that would be taken from the I-385/I-85 project would have no impact on that project. The interchange project is closest to construction among the four projects considered Tuesday, officials said.