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Phone Numbers

Started by zachary_amaryllis, October 29, 2021, 12:30:29 PM

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SP Cook

Spammers spoofing numbers.

At least around here, this is a dead give away.  Any call from some small WV hill town is a fraud, because I know no one in the state outside my local area, which also is the only place a business would be located with which I would be engaged.   


andrepoiy

Quote from: SkyPesos on November 01, 2021, 01:20:16 AM
Quote from: andrepoiy on October 31, 2021, 11:32:03 PM
Also with area codes, due to the proliferation of mobile phones, you don't necessarily get a number assigned to where you actually live.

For example, Toronto proper's area codes are 416, 647, and 437.

However, the suburbs of Toronto (such as York, Durham, Peel, Halton, and beyond) are assigned 905 and 289. And even though I live in a 905 area, my mobile phone is a 647, and so was pretty much all my high school classmates.
Is 416 considered more "prestigious" than the other Toronto area area codes, as the OG one, similar to 212 in NYC, 213 in LA and 312 in Chicago? If so, imaging hitting the jackpot when you get assigned a 416 number without living in its zone.

Yes, 416 is considered more prestigious than 647. 437 and 289 are used by spammers for now.

zachary_amaryllis

also somewhat interesting ... gang memebers frequently tout their area codes 'reppin 970, fool!'

970 covers a huge area of colorado, most of it rural save the northern front range..
so it makes me wonder, just how well the gang business is going in say ... holyoke?

when they mention 303, it makes more sense since that's denver, but with the 720 (and the coming of 983 next year) seems like their greetings might become a little convoluted 'repping 303/720/983, fool!'
clinched:
I-64, I-80, I-76 (west), *64s in hampton roads, 225,270,180 (co, wy)

GaryV

My sister kept her 616 area code (Grand Rapids) through moves to CO, SD, and now southeast MI.

CNGL-Leudimin

I wonder why cell phones in the NANPA are tied to a geographic area. This means you could be calling someone near you and the call be de iure a cross country one (e.g. calling from a 213 area code to a 212 area code cell phone located in Los Angeles, that would mean one would be calling to New York City when in reality it's not). This doesn't happen in most of Europe, as cell phones usually have a different number range to landlines, e.g. here in Spain landlines start with 9 or more recently 8, with the next two numbers indicating the province; while cell phones start with 6 or more recently 7, with the next two numbers indicating the original provider of the number (e.g. my cell phone starts with 608 which means the number was originally issued to Movistar even though I'm now with Vodafone; no relation to 974 which is the prefix, "area code", assigned to landlines in my province).
Supporter of the construction of several running gags, including I-366 with a speed limit of 85 mph (137 km/h) and the Hypotenuse.

Please note that I may mention "invalid" FM channels, i.e. ending in an even number or down to 87.5. These are valid in Europe.

kalvado

Quote from: CNGL-Leudimin on November 02, 2021, 04:01:21 PM
I wonder why cell phones in the NANPA are tied to a geographic area. This means you could be calling someone near you and the call be de iure a cross country one (e.g. calling from a 213 area code to a 212 area code cell phone located in Los Angeles, that would mean one would be calling to New York City when in reality it's not). This doesn't happen in most of Europe, as cell phones usually have a different number range to landlines, e.g. here in Spain landlines start with 9 or more recently 8, with the next two numbers indicating the province; while cell phones start with 6 or more recently 7, with the next two numbers indicating the original provider of the number (e.g. my cell phone starts with 608 which means the number was originally issued to Movistar even though I'm now with Vodafone; no relation to 974 which is the prefix, "area code", assigned to landlines in my province).
I would suspect no particular reason other than tradition. Originally, it should be tied to old switch capabilities. As things got upgraded, it was just kept that way. Could also have something to do with still existing landlines operating in local-vs-long distance mode (I just tried to dial a long distance from my office phone, call didn't go through) and 800 toll-free phones revenue.
Also, with area codes occupying most of available range with no  big gaps leaves little room for dedicated cell phone range. 
I wonder if there would be some carrier willing to jump in for their own area code. May cut their costs a bit.

1995hoo

Don't forget that cellular calling areas used to be much more circumscribed than they are now. You used to pay for long distance and you originally couldn't keep your number when you changed carriers or moved; you also had to pay roaming fees when you went outside your calling area and either made or received a call. I know some of the younger forum members won't remember those days.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

kalvado

Quote from: 1995hoo on November 02, 2021, 04:29:25 PM
Don't forget that cellular calling areas used to be much more circumscribed than they are now. You used to pay for long distance and you originally couldn't keep your number when you changed carriers or moved; you also had to pay roaming fees when you went outside your calling area and either made or received a call. I know some of the younger forum members won't remember those days.
I got my number in 2001, and Sprint had nationwide roaming and calls included (I believe they were the first to do so). Number portability occurred much later.

JayhawkCO

Quote from: kalvado on November 02, 2021, 04:52:06 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on November 02, 2021, 04:29:25 PM
Don't forget that cellular calling areas used to be much more circumscribed than they are now. You used to pay for long distance and you originally couldn't keep your number when you changed carriers or moved; you also had to pay roaming fees when you went outside your calling area and either made or received a call. I know some of the younger forum members won't remember those days.
I got my number in 2001, and Sprint had nationwide roaming and calls included (I believe they were the first to do so). Number portability occurred much later.

Similar story.  2000 with Sprint because it was free to call my parents in Florida from Kansas.

Chris

zachary_amaryllis

Quote from: 1995hoo on November 02, 2021, 04:29:25 PM
Don't forget that cellular calling areas used to be much more circumscribed than they are now. You used to pay for long distance and you originally couldn't keep your number when you changed carriers or moved; you also had to pay roaming fees when you went outside your calling area and either made or received a call. I know some of the younger forum members won't remember those days.

i got into a little trouble with roaming back in those days.. i had travelled to laramie with my cingular phone, and it gave no indication that i was roaming, but apparently cingular had no coverage there. boy was i surprised when i got the bill.

my current phone just uses whoever's closest, which, where i live, is nobody.
clinched:
I-64, I-80, I-76 (west), *64s in hampton roads, 225,270,180 (co, wy)

Pink Jazz

Looks like a boundary elimination overlay is being proposed for the Phoenix area:
Arizona Corporation Commission November Open Meeting Highlights (azcc.gov)

This will eliminate the 480/602/623 boundaries for the Phoenix area. While 480 (East Valley) and 602 (most of Phoenix proper) are near exhaustion, 623 (West Valley) has plenty of spare capacity.

KeithE4Phx

Quote from: Pink Jazz on November 09, 2021, 09:18:12 PM
Looks like a boundary elimination overlay is being proposed for the Phoenix area:
Arizona Corporation Commission November Open Meeting Highlights (azcc.gov)

This will eliminate the 480/602/623 boundaries for the Phoenix area. While 480 (East Valley) and 602 (most of Phoenix proper) are near exhaustion, 623 (West Valley) has plenty of spare capacity.

For now.  The west side is where most of the future growth will be, so 623 will get used up fast, even without this proposed overlay.  I won't be shocked if a 4th area code is added within a decade. 

And with Pinal County growing so fast, I won't be surprised if there's a 520 split or overlay as well, sooner rather than later.
"Oh, so you hate your job? Well, why didn't you say so? There's a support group for that. It's called "EVERYBODY!" They meet at the bar." -- Drew Carey

Pink Jazz

Quote from: KeithE4Phx on November 09, 2021, 09:46:49 PM
Quote from: Pink Jazz on November 09, 2021, 09:18:12 PM
Looks like a boundary elimination overlay is being proposed for the Phoenix area:
Arizona Corporation Commission November Open Meeting Highlights (azcc.gov)

This will eliminate the 480/602/623 boundaries for the Phoenix area. While 480 (East Valley) and 602 (most of Phoenix proper) are near exhaustion, 623 (West Valley) has plenty of spare capacity.

For now.  The west side is where most of the future growth will be, so 623 will get used up fast, even without this proposed overlay.  I won't be shocked if a 4th area code is added within a decade. 

And with Pinal County growing so fast, I won't be surprised if there's a 520 split or overlay as well, sooner rather than later.

Current NANPA projections don't show 623 being exhausted anytime in the near future. My guess is that mobile users are choosing 480 and 602 numbers because they are considered more desirable than 623.

hbelkins

Is spoofing of numbers even legal? I got a phone call from a 606-area code prefix that I didn't know, but the phone identified it as being from Jackson. Since that's my office location, I answered it. The call was from a legitimate entity, but they do not have a physical presence in Jackson, Ky. I suspect that the call was spoofed in order to trick me into answering it. (I typically don't answer calls unless I know who's calling; caller ID is one of the greatest modern inventions ever.)

It's particularly problematic because our work phones are Verizon, and Verizon doesn't have native service in our area, so they roam off a local provider, and all our phones have a Morehead prefix. So I never know if I get a call from a 606-207 number if it's a co-worker on their cell or someone spoofing a number to try to sell an extended car warranty.


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

SP Cook

Quote from: hbelkins on November 10, 2021, 03:03:06 PM
Is spoofing of numbers even legal?

According to the FCC, it is unless the intent is to defraud.  While an extended car warranty is certainly an idiotic purchase, it is a product that some people (AKA idiots) buy, so its not fraudulent.  Same with the "unclaimed travel points"  (I get that one a lot, basically trying to sell package travel to Latin America) and all the fake political polls.  However things like the "grandparent scam"  and the non-native English speakers claiming to be with the IRS or Social Security are illegal. 

As I understand it, one method used in this dates back to the 1970s and has a relationship to long distance.  Back in the day where you could call was often asynchronous.  Take a typical city, with suburbs.  People in the northern suburbs could call the core city and v-v, people in the south suburbs could call the core city and v-v, but it was long distance to call from the south suburbs to the north suburbs.   Services arose that would allow a call and redial, so you could bypass the tolls. 

zachary_amaryllis

Quote from: hbelkins on November 10, 2021, 03:03:06 PM
It's particularly problematic because our work phones are Verizon, and Verizon doesn't have native service in our area, so they roam off a local provider, and all our phones have a Morehead prefix. So I never know if I get a call from a 606-207 number if it's a co-worker on their cell or someone spoofing a number to try to sell an extended car warranty.

the car warranty ones are the best. they usually show the number of some random small town near here.. apparently the metropolis of julesburg, co has a big call center lol. they usually start with 'our records indicate your warranty expired yadda-yadda'

i laugh because:
my current car has 230k on it.
i've never owned a car with less than 200k
mom's car has 260k on it.

yeah my warranty expired alright, like 20 years ago.
clinched:
I-64, I-80, I-76 (west), *64s in hampton roads, 225,270,180 (co, wy)

steviep24

I noticed that the new commercials for Cellino Law Firm have their phone number as 1-800-555-5555.

With that said, movies and TV shows typically used 555-xxxx phone numbers.

1995hoo

Quote from: steviep24 on December 09, 2021, 07:50:33 AM
I noticed that the new commercials for Cellino Law Firm have their phone number as 1-800-555-5555.

With that said, movies and TV shows typically used 555-xxxx phone numbers.

That's because the 555 exchange was traditionally reserved for phone company operations, so the use of those numbers (or numbers beginning with KLamath) for entertainment purposes wouldn't cause people with real phone numbers to suffer a lot of prank calls and the like. The number of prank calls resulting from the song "867-5309" underscores why the use of "555" became customary.

More recently, the administrators of the North American Numbering Plan determined there are enough other ways to get directory assistance nowadays that there was no reason to continue to hold back the 555 exchange, so individual phone companies can decide whether to allow such numbers.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

7/8

Quote from: steviep24 on December 09, 2021, 07:50:33 AM
I noticed that the new commercials for Cellino Law Firm have their phone number as 1-800-555-5555.

The "Cellino & Barnes, injury attorneys, call 854-2020" jingle is still drilled in my head after all these years. :D

kalvado

Quote from: 1995hoo on December 09, 2021, 08:19:29 AM
Quote from: steviep24 on December 09, 2021, 07:50:33 AM
I noticed that the new commercials for Cellino Law Firm have their phone number as 1-800-555-5555.

With that said, movies and TV shows typically used 555-xxxx phone numbers.

That's because the 555 exchange was traditionally reserved for phone company operations, so the use of those numbers (or numbers beginning with KLamath) for entertainment purposes wouldn't cause people with real phone numbers to suffer a lot of prank calls and the like. The number of prank calls resulting from the song "867-5309" underscores why the use of "555" became customary.

More recently, the administrators of the North American Numbering Plan determined there are enough other ways to get directory assistance nowadays that there was no reason to continue to hold back the 555 exchange, so individual phone companies can decide whether to allow such numbers.
Also, a good lawyer should be able to make a case out of a nuisance call, one way or the other...

Scott5114

What are the odds that the number doesn't belong someone like a retired school bus driver or something like that, who can't afford to hire a good lawyer to sue...who exactly...when his phone number turns up in some work of fiction?
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

SectorZ

Quote from: Scott5114 on December 09, 2021, 02:54:05 PM
What are the odds that the number doesn't belong someone like a retired school bus driver or something like that, who can't afford to hire a good lawyer to sue...who exactly...when his phone number turns up in some work of fiction?

I imagine most lawyers would salivate at that possible windfall and would take it on contingency.

Scott5114

Quote from: SectorZ on December 09, 2021, 03:25:46 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on December 09, 2021, 02:54:05 PM
What are the odds that the number doesn't belong someone like a retired school bus driver or something like that, who can't afford to hire a good lawyer to sue...who exactly...when his phone number turns up in some work of fiction?

I imagine most lawyers would salivate at that possible windfall and would take it on contingency.

There are two actual lawyers on the forum (that I know of), so one of them can correct me if I'm wrong here, but a windfall is only possible if one can actually justify in court that the person was actually harmed in the amount of the proposed damages. A crank phone call only takes a minute to dispense with at the most. Even if you make $100/hour and you're taking time off of work to handle the calls, that's only $1.67 worth of time you're out for each call. It would take a lot of calls to reach "windfall" territory. And then you would have to satisfactorily answer the defense's question of "If dealing with the calls was so burdensome, why did you not simply change your phone number?"
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

kalvado

Quote from: Scott5114 on December 09, 2021, 05:01:59 PM
Quote from: SectorZ on December 09, 2021, 03:25:46 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on December 09, 2021, 02:54:05 PM
What are the odds that the number doesn't belong someone like a retired school bus driver or something like that, who can't afford to hire a good lawyer to sue...who exactly...when his phone number turns up in some work of fiction?

I imagine most lawyers would salivate at that possible windfall and would take it on contingency.

There are two actual lawyers on the forum (that I know of), so one of them can correct me if I'm wrong here, but a windfall is only possible if one can actually justify in court that the person was actually harmed in the amount of the proposed damages. A crank phone call only takes a minute to dispense with at the most. Even if you make $100/hour and you're taking time off of work to handle the calls, that's only $1.67 worth of time you're out for each call. It would take a lot of calls to reach "windfall" territory. And then you would have to satisfactorily answer the defense's question of "If dealing with the calls was so burdensome, why did you not simply change your phone number?"
I was more thinking finding a client that way. 

GenExpwy

Quote from: SectorZ on December 09, 2021, 03:25:46 PM
Quote from: Scott5114 on December 09, 2021, 02:54:05 PM
What are the odds that the number doesn't belong someone like a retired school bus driver or something like that, who can't afford to hire a good lawyer to sue...who exactly...when his phone number turns up in some work of fiction?

I imagine most lawyers would salivate at that possible windfall and would take it on contingency.

Maybe Rich Barnes, brother of the late Steve Barnes. His phone number is 1-800-800-0000; as the jingle says, "♪ The Barnes Firm, injury attorneys, call one eight hundred eight million ♫" .



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