PA Turnpike News

[qguy]

With the higher limit in rural areas, on the Turnpike you had the irony of the highest measured speeds in areas with the lowest posted limits and vice versa.

[cpzilliacus]

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

I'll take it!  The improvement on the one section that's complete between I-276 and Lansdale is pretty dramatic.

On a side note, why is Exit 31 (Pa. 63) signed Lansdale when it is in Kulpsville?

[cl94]

The highest actual speeds between Harrisburg and the Delaware River Bridge are between the Valley Forge and Bensalem interchanges. With the law restricting the higher limit to so-called rural areas only being no longer in effect, the PTC and PennDOT have both said they will consider 70 mph for non-rural stretches, specifically this stretch.

When did PennDOT do that? I hope it was recently, because there are some Interstate segments in Pennsylvania that have heinously underposted speed limits. They include, but might not be limited to:


I-70 between Breezewood and the Maryland state line
I-79 between Washington and Cranberry Township
I-90
I-99 between State College and I-80


Quite frankly, the only Interstates that should have 55 MPH limits are the substandard ones in urban areas. Pennsylvania reminds me a lot of the Carolinas, with widely variable speed limits. At least the Interstates in Pennsylvania aren't as heavily patrolled as they are in the Carolinas.

I-90 won't go up that much. The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them. I-79 could use a 70 MPH limit from I-279 to a little south of US 20. All of I-80 excluding Stroudsburg could be 70, as could US 15/future I-99 north of Williamsport.

[cpzilliacus]

I-90 won't go up that much. The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them. I-79 could use a 70 MPH limit from I-279 to a little south of US 20. All of I-80 excluding Stroudsburg could be 70, as could US 15/future I-99 north of Williamsport.

At least for now, one section of Pennsylvania's Interstate highway network that should not have a higher posted speed limit is I-70 between Washington (I-79) and New Stanton (I-76, Pennsylvania Turnpike).

I did see that PennDOT was starting a project to do some work along this stretch the last time I was by there (September 2014), but even by PennDOT standards, that is a terrible section of freeway.

[roadman65]

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

I'll take it!  The improvement on the one section that's complete between I-276 and Lansdale is pretty dramatic.

On a side note, why is Exit 31 (Pa. 63) signed Lansdale when it is in Kulpsville?

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

I'll take it!  The improvement on the one section that's complete between I-276 and Lansdale is pretty dramatic.

On a side note, why is Exit 31 (Pa. 63) signed Lansdale when it is in Kulpsville?

Better question how come there is only one control city for PA 63?  Remember there is a space included in the sign for two cities or places, yet it uses the redundant "Landsdale" for both the name and destination.  If there is no other being used or planned to be used, then make a smaller sign.

[qguy]

The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them.

If by "them," you mean PennDOT, actually the funds from speeding and other fines collected from citations issued by the PA State Police (which is the only force which patrols PA's interstates) goes into the state coffers, not to PennDOT or the PTC. PennDOT and the PTC don't set the speed limit based on how much they think they can collect from speeders. (Local municipalities may do this despite its illegality.) PennDOT sets the limits on the advice of its traffic engineers, within the restrictions of state law (like that which previously restricted the limit to 55 in built-up areas).

I suspect the 55 mph stretch through the Erie area fell into this category. Perhaps it will eventually now be raised.

Let me summarize (stop me if you've heard this): Previous PA law allowed the PTC and PennDOT to set the speed limit as high as 65 in rural areas at the agencies' discretion (based on safety of course) and limited them to 55 in built-up areas. Recent legislation allows both agencies to set the limit up to 70 at their discretion anywhere they see fit, including built-up areas.

[roadman65]

I-78 from Hamburg to Fogelsville is rural, but the last time I drove it was 55 mph.  So I can understand why I-90 is totally 55 as that section, I imagine, must be more built up than west of Allentown is.

[Flyer78]

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

I'll take it!  The improvement on the one section that's complete between I-276 and Lansdale is pretty dramatic.

On a side note, why is Exit 31 (Pa. 63) signed Lansdale when it is in Kulpsville?

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

I'll take it!  The improvement on the one section that's complete between I-276 and Lansdale is pretty dramatic.

On a side note, why is Exit 31 (Pa. 63) signed Lansdale when it is in Kulpsville?

Better question how come there is only one control city for PA 63?  Remember there is a space included in the sign for two cities or places, yet it uses the redundant "Landsdale" for both the name and destination.  If there is no other being used or planned to be used, then make a smaller sign.

This was actually brought up by the residents of Kulpsville in 2012... see http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2012/07/11/residents-of-kulpsville-pa-say-turnpikes-lansdale-exit-is-really-theirs/

[briantroutman]

Not clear to me how far north the PTC is going to take the widening of the Northeast Extension...

According to the Morning Call, there are reasonably firm plans to go up as far as Quakertown, intentions to go to Lehigh Valley, and perhaps the possibility of going further, depending on the availability of funds.

The improvement on the one section that's complete between I-276 and Lansdale is pretty dramatic.

The Turnpike's other recent reconstructions have been rather dramatic, too. I drove the length of the mainline from Harrisburg to the Ohio line last year for the first time in several years, and the many rebuilt sections were startlingly unfamiliar–it felt like a completely different highway.

I have mixed feelings about it, too, because there was a fertile period in my roadgeeking life when I lived in Harrisburg and drove long distances on the Turnpike regularly. And being engrossed in the Turnpike's history, looking at old photos, etc., driving it in those days (early-mid 2000s) still evoked a sense of connection to the highway's earliest days–with all of the original stylized concrete arch overpasses, wayside tables, colonial house service plazas, etc. With most of those things now gone, the highway is progressively getting more much modern, but unfortunately, it feels much less unique, too.

On a side note, why is Exit 31 (Pa. 63) signed Lansdale when it is in Kulpsville?

Probably the same reason why Exit 226 is Carlisle and not Middlesex–more populous municipality nearby with a more recognizable name. "Kulpsville"  isn't a municipality of any kind, just a Census Designated Place with a post office, so any claim it might have on the interchange name is tenuous at best.

Better question how come there is only one control city for PA 63?  Remember there is a space included in the sign for two cities or places, yet it uses the redundant "Landsdale" for both the name and destination.  If there is no other being used or planned to be used, then make a smaller sign.

The redundancy isn't really unique–just look at Irwin, Somerset, or Lebanon-Lancaster for examples of that. I have always wondered about the blank space, though. I seem to recall that it was there on old button copy signs decades ago, then the blank space was retained on new retroreflective signs in FHWA type, then retained yet again on newer signs in Clearview.

The obvious choice for a second destination would be "Harleysville" .

There had been a similar situation for years on I-180 at the interchange with PA 87 near Montoursville. All of the original button copy signs listed "Montoursville"  with a space beneath for a second destination. I could never figure out why–none of the towns north of there were worth mentioning. But when the signs were replaced recently, the destination was changed to the street name (Loyalsock Ave).

[thenetwork]

The highest actual speeds between Harrisburg and the Delaware River Bridge are between the Valley Forge and Bensalem interchanges. With the law restricting the higher limit to so-called rural areas only being no longer in effect, the PTC and PennDOT have both said they will consider 70 mph for non-rural stretches, specifically this stretch.

When did PennDOT do that? I hope it was recently, because there are some Interstate segments in Pennsylvania that have heinously underposted speed limits. They include, but might not be limited to:


I-70 between Breezewood and the Maryland state line
I-79 between Washington and Cranberry Township
I-90
I-99 between State College and I-80


Quite frankly, the only Interstates that should have 55 MPH limits are the substandard ones in urban areas. Pennsylvania reminds me a lot of the Carolinas, with widely variable speed limits. At least the Interstates in Pennsylvania aren't as heavily patrolled as they are in the Carolinas.

I-90 won't go up that much. The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them.

Agreed.  For a town the size of Erie to have such looong stretches of "urban" speed limit zones on it's two major interstates is ridiculous!  The traffic on I-79 -- especially between I-90 and US-20 -- is so sparse, giving it a 55 MPH limit is a joke.

And I-90's zone is a joke as most everything south of the freeway's 55 MPH zone is rural.  With the exception of US-19/Peach Street, or as I like to call it:  The "Peach Pit" due to all the poorly timed traffic lights along it, you have to go north a couple of miles or so before you get to actual bona-fide bedroom communities with sizable street grids or subdivisions.  Hell, I-90 never comes close to Erie's city limits -- another reason to kill off the 55 zone.

One of the jokes I heard about the I-90 stretch thru PA is that 50% of it is a 55 MPH zone and the other 50% is always under construction with the speed limit even less.  I guess they really want you to spend as much time in their little corner of the Commonwealth as possible.

[cl94]

The highest actual speeds between Harrisburg and the Delaware River Bridge are between the Valley Forge and Bensalem interchanges. With the law restricting the higher limit to so-called rural areas only being no longer in effect, the PTC and PennDOT have both said they will consider 70 mph for non-rural stretches, specifically this stretch.

When did PennDOT do that? I hope it was recently, because there are some Interstate segments in Pennsylvania that have heinously underposted speed limits. They include, but might not be limited to:


I-70 between Breezewood and the Maryland state line
I-79 between Washington and Cranberry Township
I-90
I-99 between State College and I-80


Quite frankly, the only Interstates that should have 55 MPH limits are the substandard ones in urban areas. Pennsylvania reminds me a lot of the Carolinas, with widely variable speed limits. At least the Interstates in Pennsylvania aren't as heavily patrolled as they are in the Carolinas.

I-90 won't go up that much. The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them.

Agreed.  For a town the size of Erie to have such looong stretches of "urban" speed limit zones on it's two major interstates is ridiculous!  The traffic on I-79 -- especially between I-90 and US-20 -- is so sparse, giving it a 55 MPH limit is a joke.

And I-90's zone is a joke as most everything south of the freeway's 55 MPH zone is rural.  With the exception of US-19/Peach Street, or as I like to call it:  The "Peach Pit" due to all the poorly timed traffic lights along it, you have to go north a couple of miles or so before you get to actual bona-fide bedroom communities with sizable street grids or subdivisions.  Hell, I-90 never comes close to Erie's city limits -- another reason to kill off the 55 zone.

One of the jokes I heard about the I-90 stretch thru PA is that 50% of it is a 55 MPH zone and the other 50% is always under construction with the speed limit even less.  I guess they really want you to spend as much time in their little corner of the Commonwealth as possible.

I was on there a couple months ago and, for the first time in many years, there's no construction in Pennsylvania. Heck, there's little of anything between Cleveland and the New York line for the first time in nearly 2 decades.

[thenetwork]

It's still early in the construction season...Give PennDOT some time!   

[signalman]

It's still early in the construction season...Give PennDOT some time!   

Exactly!  Memorial Day weekend is right around the corner.  PennDOT seems to love closing a lane for several miles right before a holiday weekend.

[jeffandnicole]

I-90 won't go up that much. The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them.

When statements like this are made, is there any truth to it?  This seems to be a universal excuse, often times without any substance to back it up.  Do the police really congregate on I-90, or does traffic seem to flow fairly fast without much enforcement?  And the million dollar question: What is the speed at which the cops will start stopping people? 

"I saw someone pulled over" isn't really answering the question, because you don't know if that person was going 63 in a 55, 82 in a 55, had mechanical problems and the cop pulled up to help, or any other numerous possibilities as to why a civilian car and cop car were on the side of the road.

[PHLBOS]

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

That is indeed a new development (to me anyways).  The current widening contract, now under construction, only goes as far north as the Lansdale interchange.

Better question how come there is only one control city for PA 63?  Remember there is a space included in the sign for two cities or places, yet it uses the redundant "Lansdale" (intentional spelling correction) for both the name and destination.  If there is no other being used or planned to be used, then make a smaller sign.

I seem to recall that it was there on old button copy signs decades ago, then the blank space was retained on new retroreflective signs in FHWA type, then retained yet again on newer signs in Clearview.

The obvious choice for a second destination would be Harleysville

One has to wonder if the space (at least for the old, long-gone button-copy BGS') was originally reserved for Green Lane (where PA 63 ends at PA 29).

It should be noted that there are plans to split/reconfigure the Lansdale interchange into 2 separate exit ramps: one for EZ-Pass only (proposed Exit 31A), the other for the conventional cash/ticket booths (existing Exit 31/proposed Exit 31B).  The signage plans I saw (from a couple of years ago) do indeed include Kulpsville as well as Lansdale (interchange name/listed destination redundancy will be retained) and Harleysville on the main BGS boards.  Harleysville will be listed above Kulpsville.  The Lansdale interchange name banner will remain but it will be the same height (16", 5-W Clearview font) as the destination listings and will also be in mixed-case lettering.

[cl94]

I-90 won't go up that much. The asinine, unnecessary 55 section in Erie is a cash cow for them.

When statements like this are made, is there any truth to it?  This seems to be a universal excuse, often times without any substance to back it up.  Do the police really congregate on I-90, or does traffic seem to flow fairly fast without much enforcement?  And the million dollar question: What is the speed at which the cops will start stopping people? 

"I saw someone pulled over" isn't really answering the question, because you don't know if that person was going 63 in a 55, 82 in a 55, had mechanical problems and the cop pulled up to help, or any other numerous possibilities as to why a civilian car and cop car were on the side of the road.

Typically moves 55-60 and there's almost always a cop sitting there with the radar gun out. Get much above 60 and you might get stopped. I've been going 60, been passed by someone going slightly faster than I was driving, and seen that person get pulled over not far ahead.

[jemacedo9]

I noticed new advisory signs on curves between Downingtown and Malvern.  Some 60, some 65.  A 65 advisory in a 65 zone doesn't make a lot of sense.  Could this imply a forthcoming increase in the limit from 65 to 70 on this stretch?  It would certainly be appropriate.  When it is not rush hour, one can comfortably handle this stretch at 75-80.

I drove the stretch from Downingtown west to Morgantown yesterday, and there were curve signs with a 60 advisory speed on that stretch as well.

[Gnutella]

At least for now, one section of Pennsylvania's Interstate highway network that should not have a higher posted speed limit is I-70 between Washington (I-79) and New Stanton (I-76, Pennsylvania Turnpike).

I did see that PennDOT was starting a project to do some work along this stretch the last time I was by there (September 2014), but even by PennDOT standards, that is a terrible section of freeway.

The Speers-Belle Vernon Bridge is fucking terrible. They need to replace it yesterday.

It appears that PennDOT is reconstructing the highway and reconfiguring the interchanges closest to I-79 and the Pennsylvania Turnpike first, which is understandable, because any work done between the Mon-Fayette Expressway and PA 51 will require the replacement of the Speers-Belle Vernon Bridge, and probably the Smithton Hi-Level Bridge as well.

The completed work on I-70 so far has been excellent, with long acceleration and deceleration lanes at the interchanges, and 4' interior shoulders on each side.

According to the Morning Call, there are reasonably firm plans to go up as far as Quakertown, intentions to go to Lehigh Valley, and perhaps the possibility of going further, depending on the availability of funds.

...

The Turnpike's other recent reconstructions have been rather dramatic, too. I drove the length of the mainline from Harrisburg to the Ohio line last year for the first time in several years, and the many rebuilt sections were startlingly unfamiliar–it felt like a completely different highway.

I have mixed feelings about it, too, because there was a fertile period in my roadgeeking life when I lived in Harrisburg and drove long distances on the Turnpike regularly. And being engrossed in the Turnpike's history, looking at old photos, etc., driving it in those days (early-mid 2000s) still evoked a sense of connection to the highway's earliest days–with all of the original stylized concrete arch overpasses, wayside tables, colonial house service plazas, etc. With most of those things now gone, the highway is progressively getting more much modern, but unfortunately, it feels much less unique, too.

The Pennsylvania Turnpike is becoming a superhighway once again, segment by segment. If that means it loses its uniqueness, then so be it. Nobody can bitch about how narrow and outdated the Turnpike is anymore. Shutting people the fuck up is worth sacrificing uniqueness for.

Typically moves 55-60 and there's almost always a cop sitting there with the radar gun out. Get much above 60 and you might get stopped. I've been going 60, been passed by someone going slightly faster than I was driving, and seen that person get pulled over not far ahead.

What's funny is, speed enforcement in Pennsylvania has always struck me as lax compared to some of its neighboring states (Ohio and Maryland being the biggest culprits). I guess there had to be a "got'cha" segment somewhere.

On a related note, I think it's fucking awesome how the state police are the only law enforcement agency allowed by law to run radar in Pennsylvania.

[storm2k]

The redundancy isn't really unique–just look at Irwin, Somerset, or Lebanon-Lancaster for examples of that. I have always wondered about the blank space, though. I seem to recall that it was there on old button copy signs decades ago, then the blank space was retained on new retroreflective signs in FHWA type, then retained yet again on newer signs in Clearview.

Or how about Norristown? Literally, the sign repeats itself. Norristown/Norristown.

[PHLBOS]

The redundancy isn't really unique–just look at Irwin, Somerset, or Lebanon-Lancaster for examples of that. I have always wondered about the blank space, though. I seem to recall that it was there on old button copy signs decades ago, then the blank space was retained on new retroreflective signs in FHWA type, then retained yet again on newer signs in Clearview.

Or how about Norristown? Literally, the sign repeats itself. Norristown/Norristown.

With the recent signage replacements along I-276; that redundancy now only exists for the westbound exit signs.  PTC changed (long overdue IMHO) the legends for the eastbound exit BGS' Scroll down to Reply #955.

[qguy]

According to the PTC website, the only publicaly announced widening on the NE extension is up to Quakertown

That is indeed a new development (to me anyways).  The current widening contract, now under construction, only goes as far north as the Lansdale interchange.

The PTC website has two sites dedicated to the widening from Lansdale to Quakertown.
    Southern portion: https://www.patpconstruction.com/mpA31toA38/
    Northern portion: https://www.patpconstruction.com/mpA38toA44/index.html[/list][/list]

[storm2k]

The redundancy isn't really unique–just look at Irwin, Somerset, or Lebanon-Lancaster for examples of that. I have always wondered about the blank space, though. I seem to recall that it was there on old button copy signs decades ago, then the blank space was retained on new retroreflective signs in FHWA type, then retained yet again on newer signs in Clearview.

Or how about Norristown? Literally, the sign repeats itself. Norristown/Norristown.

With the recent signage replacements along I-276; that redundancy now only exists for the westbound exit signs.  PTC changed (long overdue IMHO) the legends for the eastbound exit BGS' Scroll down to Reply #955.

I did not know they changed it EB. I drove through there WB in March and the signs were still just Norristown/Norristown.

[Flyer78]

It should be noted that there are plans to split/reconfigure the Lansdale interchange into 2 separate exit ramps: one for EZ-Pass only (proposed Exit 31A), the other for the conventional cash/ticket booths (existing Exit 31/proposed Exit 31B).  The signage plans I saw (from a couple of years ago) do indeed include Kulpsville as well as Lansdale (interchange name/listed destination redundancy will be retained) on the main BGS boards.

They provided this image as what the new ramps will look like, no indication of exit numbers though...

auxiliary ramps
Three auxiliary ramps are being constructed:
one ramp from Towamencin
and two E-ZPass-only ramps
(one entering southbound I-476 from
Old Forty Foot Road and one exiting
I-476 northbound to Sumneytown Pike).

Project newsletter: https://www.patpconstruction.com/mpA20toA31/lib/pdf/Winter_2015_Newsletter.pdf

If they do opt for suffixes, it will be the first ones since Mid-County (Exit 20) was Exit 25A, numbered as a main-line exit when it opened.

[roadman65]

The redundancy isn't really unique–just look at Irwin, Somerset, or Lebanon-Lancaster for examples of that. I have always wondered about the blank space, though. I seem to recall that it was there on old button copy signs decades ago, then the blank space was retained on new retroreflective signs in FHWA type, then retained yet again on newer signs in Clearview.

Or how about Norristown? Literally, the sign repeats itself. Norristown/Norristown.

Oh I know that one very well, but at least there is no blank space for a second control city there like at Landsdale. 

[PHLBOS]

I did not know they changed it EB. I drove through there WB in March and the signs were still just Norristown/Norristown.

The reason why the westbound signs didn't change was because there's a separate, direct exit ramp to I-476 South just prior to that exit.  Eastbounders (that did not already exit off at Valley Forge to continue along I-76 East to I-476) wanting to get on I-476 South have to use the Norristown exit.  As I stated earlier; this change (for the eastbound signs) should've been done when the I-476/Blue Route connection was first completed in the early 90s.

Oh I know that one very well, but at least there is no blank space for a second control city there like at Landsdale.

It should be noted that when Germantown Pike was still part of US 422; Philadelphia was included with Norristown for the destination listings.  One old BGS along I-276 eastbound survived (w/the US 422 shield removed/greened out) into the late 90s/early 2000s.