Interstate 15 From Barstow to Primm.

[Interstate Trav]

I was wondering is there actually a plan to widen the 15 from the I-40 jct to Primm?  I have read that there was, and back when the economy was going good, I could see why traffic counts could justify it, mainly on fridays. 

[Bigmikelakers]

I driven that route plenty of times before. Once you get past Barstow its pretty smooth sailing going northbound all the way to Las Vegas. Southbound may be a little different especially sunday evenings or at the end of a holiday weekend like memorial day. I could see Caltrans adding a lane southbound on 15 from Primm to Barstow. Well come to think, they do have a lot of truck lanes on that stretch of road so there goes the third lane right there. 

[agentsteel53]

there is hardly any speed limit enforcement in California, so do 110-115 the whole way.  I know I've done San Diego to Vegas (320 miles) in 3 1/2 hours, averaging 97mph with a gasoline break.

but slow down as you cross the state line!  I once raced someone down the hill doing 126... I slowed up before Primm and he kept going.  Double fine construction zone, instant flashing lights across the state line; yeah I think they took his license on the spot.

[Interstate Trav]

I driven that route plenty of times before. Once you get past Barstow its pretty smooth sailing going northbound all the way to Las Vegas. Southbound may be a little different especially sunday evenings or at the end of a holiday weekend like memorial day. I could see Caltrans adding a lane southbound on 15 from Primm to Barstow. Well come to think, they do have a lot of truck lanes on that stretch of road so there goes the third lane right there. 

Well I did drive it on a Friday and I got on the 15 in Barstow and it was bumper to bumper from Ft Irwin Road to Primm.  Only loosened up through Baker but got packed again up the Baker grade.    So southbound gets even worse then northbound?
I wonder if part of the Southboudn has to do with the Inspection Station in Yermo. 

[agentsteel53]

I wonder if part of the Southboudn has to do with the Inspection Station in Yermo. 

forget that inspection station.  It has an easily available bypass because it is far enough away from the Mexican border and the US border patrol just has not wormed its way north enough to make the Yermo station a real part of the perimeter...

get off at the Harvard Road exit on I-15 about 3 mi north of the inspection station; get back on the road just past where you see the station to your right.  Far too easy to bypass... renders it meaningless, doesn't it?

[Bigmikelakers]

Well I did drive it on a Friday and I got on the 15 in Barstow and it was bumper to bumper from Ft Irwin Road to Primm.  Only loosened up through Baker but got packed again up the Baker grade.    So southbound gets even worse then northbound?
I wonder if part of the Southboudn has to do with the Inspection Station in Yermo. 

Oh you did the drive on a friday. That was probably all the Socal people driving up there for the weekend. I never drove up there those days.

[roadfro]

I was wondering is there actually a plan to widen the 15 from the I-40 jct to Primm?  I have read that there was, and back when the economy was going good, I could see why traffic counts could justify it, mainly on fridays. 

I know Caltrans was doing work to widen and/or add truck lanes between Primm and roughly I-40 or Victorville within the last few years.

I seem to recall hearing at some point that Caltrans had plans to widen I-15 to three lanes in each direction along this stretch. Part of that was reconstruction of several bridges which would not accommodate a widened roadbed due to multiple sets of columns. If they haven't already started reconstructing bridges, then perhaps it was some long-range planning that I had heard about... In any event, I can't find any info on the Caltrans website.

Well I did drive it on a Friday and I got on the 15 in Barstow and it was bumper to bumper from Ft Irwin Road to Primm.  Only loosened up through Baker but got packed again up the Baker grade.    So southbound gets even worse then northbound?
I wonder if part of the Southboudn has to do with the Inspection Station in Yermo.  

Oh you did the drive on a friday. That was probably all the Socal people driving up there for the weekend. I never drove up there those days.

Typical delays are light backups northbound on Friday and more intense backups southbound on Sunday late afternoon/early evening (or whatever day ends a 3-day weekend).

[agentsteel53]

don't do that drive during the commute hours - Friday evening, Saturday morning/afternoon/evening going northbound, and then Sunday afternoon and evening going southbound.  When it goes, it goes: I remember the Saturday of Memorial Day in 2005 I was doing 114 down I-15 in the middle lane of downtown Vegas - and getting passed on both sides by drivers with California plates... but when it stops, oh lord does it ever stop.  You're lucky to do 35 down that four-lane road.

I've done the drive from San Diego to Vegas quite efficiently - 326 miles in three and a half hours, averaging about 97.  (93 with a gasoline break in Barstow.  damn standing still reducing my average velocity!)  how?  start at 1am, arrive at 430am, blaze through and see the deserts and mountains of east Nevada and southern Utah instead!  Screw the lights, screw the colors, screw the flash - stop for the surviving 91/466 green sign and otherwise don't stop at all!

when caught in the worst of traffic, an option is to duck out at Baker - take Kelbaker Road to Amboy Road to 29 Palms which brings you back to the 10 and then the 215/15 if you need to head south... it adds about 63 miles but when you're doing 115-120 down the middle of the double yellow stripe avoiding rabbits, it's well worth it.  Just get gas in Baker; there ain't any more for a while.  There's other options (Cima Road, Nipton Road, etc) that are visible on the map but I do not offhand know the speed/time calculations to be able to unequivocally recommend the alternate route as being faster.  

especially avoid the Cajon pass coming back to the LA area during peak traffic hours.  Drivers run scared and therefore malevolently idiotic: a 6% incline appears to be the perfect motivation to slow down to 35, make illogical lane changes, just do the general hog and clog because you're too stupid to know better...  everyone could stick to their own lane and do 70 without any problem, but people seem to court problems of their own free will.  (Down the hill, don't do much over 75.  Up the hill; they'll never stop you - get a powerful enough car, know how to switch lanes quickly and sensibly on short notice when you find the inevitable overloaded truck doing 12 (12!) up the hill... and do 102-103 climbing the pass; just slow down at the summit because there's cops at the drop!  Remember, in California they never patrol the uphill, but beware the downhill!  This applies to the Grapevine on I-5 too.)

[Interstate Trav]

I wonder if part of the Southboudn has to do with the Inspection Station in Yermo. 

forget that inspection station.  It has an easily available bypass because it is far enough away from the Mexican border and the US border patrol just has not wormed its way north enough to make the Yermo station a real part of the perimeter...

get off at the Harvard Road exit on I-15 about 3 mi north of the inspection station; get back on the road just past where you see the station to your right.  Far too easy to bypass... renders it meaningless, doesn't it?

Yeah pretty much.  I live near Palm Springs, and if you take the "Amboy Route" you never even go near the inspection station.  I heard they were moving it to the Nevada Stateline.

[Interstate Trav]

Oh you did the drive on a friday. That was probably all the Socal people driving up there for the weekend. I never drove up there those days.

Basically, on Friday the 15 north is a parking lot in a lot of places.

{Fixed quote. --roadfro}

[Interstate Trav]

I know Caltrans was doing work to widen and/or add truck lanes between Primm and roughly I-40 or Victorville within the last few years.

I seem to recall hearing at some point that Caltrans had plans to widen I-15 to three lanes in each direction along this stretch. Part of that was reconstruction of several bridges which would not accommodate a widened roadbed due to multiple sets of columns. If they haven't already started reconstructing bridges, then perhaps it was some long-range planning that I had heard about... In any event, I can't find any info on the Caltrans website.

They actually finished it, it's now 3 lanes eachway minumum all the way to the 40.  On southbound there is even a 4th lane or truck lane to climb out of Barstow towards Victorville.  15 north at the 58 is 4 lanes wide, plus an exit lane for the 58.  It then just keeps loosing lanes until you pass the 40.  Then it's back to 2 lanes

{Modified quote. Please remove parts of the quote that aren't relevant to your reply, and watch to make sure you don't remove the quote headers. Thanks. --roadfro.}

[agentsteel53]

Yeah pretty much.  I live near Palm Springs, and if you take the "Amboy Route" you never even go near the inspection station.  I heard they were moving it to the Nevada Stateline.

that's random.  this way they can catch people coming out of Death Valley as well as Vegas.  If they moved it to the state line, then people would just take 127 in from Nevada with their illicit cargo of mutant chickens.

[Interstate Trav]

Yeah pretty much.  I live near Palm Springs, and if you take the "Amboy Route" you never even go near the inspection station.  I heard they were moving it to the Nevada Stateline.

that's random.  this way they can catch people coming out of Death Valley as well as Vegas.  If they moved it to the state line, then people would just take 127 in from Nevada with their illicit cargo of mutant chickens.

Shouldn't they have one on the 127 then too?  But then again that would mean more inspection stations on various highways. So I can see the reasoning for having the inspection station on the 15 near Yermo. I just know I read in a caltrans webisght article I think that they want to move the inspection station to Primm, and I'm sure Primm is for it, to stop traffic near the casinos.

[citrus]

there is hardly any speed limit enforcement in California, so do 110-115 the whole way.  I know I've done San Diego to Vegas (320 miles) in 3 1/2 hours, averaging 97mph with a gasoline break.

Is this still true? I got a ticket for 81 in a 70 on I-5 way up in Glenn County a couple years back. Seems like I see a few CHPs on I-5 in the Central Valley whenever I'm driving up that way. Was enough to scare me into sticking to under 80mph on I-15 across the desert more recently....

[agentsteel53]

Is this still true? I got a ticket for 81 in a 70 on I-5 way up in Glenn County a couple years back. Seems like I see a few CHPs on I-5 in the Central Valley whenever I'm driving up that way. Was enough to scare me into sticking to under 80mph on I-15 across the desert more recently....

I cannot officially recommend it, but let's just say that enforcement is generally minimal.  I-5 up north in the central valley is known for cops.  So is the new Mojave bypass on 58 and there's a few other sections where they're always around (Grapevine coming down, etc)

[roadfro]

I know Caltrans was doing work to widen and/or add truck lanes between Primm and roughly I-40 or Victorville within the last few years.

I seem to recall hearing at some point that Caltrans had plans to widen I-15 to three lanes in each direction along this stretch. Part of that was reconstruction of several bridges which would not accommodate a widened roadbed due to multiple sets of columns. If they haven't already started reconstructing bridges, then perhaps it was some long-range planning that I had heard about... In any event, I can't find any info on the Caltrans website.

They actually finished it, it's now 3 lanes eachway minumum all the way to the 40.  On southbound there is even a 4th lane or truck lane to climb out of Barstow towards Victorville.  15 north at the 58 is 4 lanes wide, plus an exit lane for the 58.  It then just keeps loosing lanes until you pass the 40.  Then it's back to 2 lanes

I was referring to widening between Barstow and Primm and Caltrans desiring to make that stretch 3 lanes. That's what I recalled hearing.

Nevada I-15 is three lanes in both directions from Primm into the Las Vegas Valley. One of the backups that is sometimes experienced is southbound where that third lane drops at the Primm exit, since the California section has only two lanes each way through to Barstow.

[Interstate Trav]

I know Caltrans was doing work to widen and/or add truck lanes between Primm and roughly I-40 or Victorville within the last few years.

I seem to recall hearing at some point that Caltrans had plans to widen I-15 to three lanes in each direction along this stretch. Part of that was reconstruction of several bridges which would not accommodate a widened roadbed due to multiple sets of columns. If they haven't already started reconstructing bridges, then perhaps it was some long-range planning that I had heard about... In any event, I can't find any info on the Caltrans website.

They actually finished it, it's now 3 lanes eachway minumum all the way to the 40.  On southbound there is even a 4th lane or truck lane to climb out of Barstow towards Victorville.  15 north at the 58 is 4 lanes wide, plus an exit lane for the 58.  It then just keeps loosing lanes until you pass the 40.  Then it's back to 2 lanes

I was referring to widening between Barstow and Primm and Caltrans desiring to make that stretch 3 lanes. That's what I recalled hearing.

Nevada I-15 is three lanes in both directions from Primm into the Las Vegas Valley. One of the backups that is sometimes experienced is southbound where that third lane drops at the Primm exit, since the California section has only two lanes each way through to Barstow.

Okay, my bad, I got confused, and ironically the origianl purpose of this thread was about the 15 from Barstow to Primm.  Last time I drove itthe only section that was 3 lanes going northbound past Barstow was the Baker Grade and climbing to mountain Pass and then the drop to Primm up until right before Yeates Well Road.

[nexus73]

Let's see, the largest megapolis on the Pacific Ocean side of the Western Hemisphere being within a few hour's drive of the most desired gambling mecca on the planet...how many lanes do we need?  Oh heck, bring back 2-lane US 91...LOL!

Seriously, I'd have it as 4 lanes in each direction built heavy duty like a German autobahn and drop the speed limit entirely for the desert stretches.  How many folks can a freeway like that carry compared to high speed rail?  Don't forget the freight either!  Prove the concept on I-15 from Barstow (my best friend calls that town Barstool) to Jean, then redo I-10 to Phoenix ("other Desert Cities") and I-5 through the Central Valley the same way.  Heck, toss in I-8 so the San Diego traffic gets a chance to motate!

Rick

[Alps]

Seriously, I'd have it as 4 lanes in each direction built heavy duty like a German autobahn and drop the speed limit entirely for the desert stretches.  How many folks can a freeway like that carry compared to high speed rail?  Don't forget the freight either!  Prove the concept on I-15 from Barstow (my best friend calls that town Barstool) to Jean, then redo I-10 to Phoenix ("other Desert Cities") and I-5 through the Central Valley the same way.  Heck, toss in I-8 so the San Diego traffic gets a chance to motate!

Rick

Well traffic theory says 70 mph and 75 mph max out at the same capacity (2400 cars per hour per lane), which assumes cars going by at 1 every 1.5 second (40 a minute). That's really pushing what you can do on a freeway, so higher speeds are unlikely to net you any benefit in that regard. I know, you're thinking "but if those 2400 vehicles can get there faster, that makes more room on the freeway," but they need so much more headway at speeds of 100+ mph that it cancels out.

[agentsteel53]

the question is: are there 2400 cars going by?  if the capacity is less, then the speed limit can be increased

[Ubeans2001]

there is hardly any speed limit enforcement in California, so do 110-115 the whole way.  I know I've done San Diego to Vegas (320 miles) in 3 1/2 hours, averaging 97mph with a gasoline break.

but slow down as you cross the state line!  I once raced someone down the hill doing 126... I slowed up before Primm and he kept going.  Double fine construction zone, instant flashing lights across the state line; yeah I think they took his license on the spot.

Wow, you must have had good luck going through the 15 that fast in California! They aren't as strict as in Nevada but they are out there waiting to pull someone over (I always take the ol' radar detector as a precaution). Fortunately on a good Sunday afternoon everyone returning to Vegas from LA tends to keep the flow into Nevada at around 90ish. As for heading southbound, I drove bumper to bumper from about Harvard Road to the Ag inspection at Minneola Road and that took about 30 minutes to do (painfully SLOW, but I got to finally read all of the very fine print on that sign showing the terms for the agriculture whatnot  ).

Regardless, I think to avoid anymore problems CalTrans should really consider making it at least a 6 lane highway from Barstow to Primm, but preferably an 8 lane to completely rid the corridor of all the traffic problems that've been happening for as long as I can remember.

[agentsteel53]

Wow, you must have had good luck going through the 15 that fast in California! They aren't as strict as in Nevada but they are out there waiting to pull someone over (I always take the ol' radar detector as a precaution).

in the last 3-4 months or so, enforcement has gone up by at least a factor of 50.  they're even patrolling the Grapevine uphill now!  I saw six cop cars lined up at the Templin Highway construction project, ready to go.

I drove bumper to bumper from about Harvard Road to the Ag inspection at Minneola Road and that took about 30 minutes to do (painfully SLOW, but I got to finally read all of the very fine print on that sign showing the terms for the agriculture whatnot  ).

get off at Harvard Road.  head southeast.  turn onto the road parallel to I-15, which is old US-91/466.  Drive past people queued at the aggie checkpoint.  Get back onto 15 at Minneola.