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CA 247 Lucerne Valley Postmile job on Old Woman Springs Road

Started by Max Rockatansky, April 29, 2023, 11:25:01 AM

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Max Rockatansky

Brain teaser for the route clinching crowd out there:

California State Route 247 in Lucerne Valley contains an oddity in that it has a spur which technically is part of the mainline of the highway.  California State Route 247 northbound enters Lucerne Valley via Old Woman Springs Road at approximately Postmile SBD 44.62.  Signage indicates California State Route 247 continues north directly onto Barstow Road but in reality, it doesn't.  California State Route 247 instead follows Old Woman Springs Road to approximately Postmile SBD 44.85 to California State Route 18.  From California State Route 18 the Postmiles on California State Route 247 begin to ascend again via Barstow Road.  I've never found a similar phenomenon to this anywhere else in the California State Highway System as it requires backtracking on California State Route 247 to technically clinch the highway. 

Pictured in the first three photos is the junction signage for California State Route 247 and California State Route 18 in Lucerne Valley.  Photo 1 is from California State Route 18 descending from Big Bear to California State Route 247 at Old Woman Springs Road. 

247CAe by Max Rockatansky, on Flickr

Photo 2 is northbound California State Route 247 entering Lucerne Valley via Old Woman Springs Road approaching Barstow Road. 

https://flic.kr/p/SXYqpa

Photo 3 is southbound California State Route 247 along Barstow Road approaching Old Woman Springs Road. 

247CAg by Max Rockatansky, on Flickr

The jogged Postmiles of California State Route 247 on Old Woman Springs Road from Barstow Road west to California State Route 18 can be observed directly on the Caltrans Postmile Tool.  The Postmiles are likely this way due to Barstow Road being added as an extension of California State Route 247 during 1970.  All the same, odd that the Division of Highways didn't opt for a 247S Route given it wouldn't have taken much effort to do. 

https://postmile.dot.ca.gov/PMQT/PostmileQueryTool.html


pderocco

The signage in photo 3 makes no sense. It shows that the last little bit of Barstow Rd south of Old Woman Springs Rd is part of CA-247, which it's not. It looks like the 247 sign should be turned 90 degrees and face west, for the benefit of eastbound traffic, which would be correct. But the other signs on that signpost are oriented correctly, so it's not that the signpost got rotated. Or maybe the arrow below the 247 got rotated 90 degrees when the idiot installed it.

It's also odd that they'd list 29 Palms as the control city, since it only goes to Yucca Valley.

skluth

Nice catch on the sign problems. I never noticed the sign says Twentynine Palms and I've been through that intersection several times. If not Yucca Valley, Joshua Tree or Palm Springs would make more sense than Twentynine Palms.

Occidental Tourist

Photo 2 is CA-62 at the east end of CA-247 in Yucca Valley.

Max Rockatansky

Quote from: Occidental Tourist on April 30, 2023, 11:28:26 AM
Photo 2 is CA-62 at the east end of CA-247 in Yucca Valley.

You're right, I linked the wrong image.  I corrected in the original post to the image I wanted to display.

cahwyguy

I think what you are talking about is even clearer on the SHL database (state highway lines):

https://gisdata-caltrans.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/77f2d7ba94e040a78bfbe36feb6279da_0/explore?location=34.422762%2C-116.960574%2C13.00

There you can see that the Route 18 endpoint of one segment, and the Route 18 start of another segment, are clearly different points on Route 18, but they create a point at which Route 247 crosses itself (if you're not familiar with this database, click on a line to see the data).

(Also: Follow this to Barstow. There's a Route 40 Spur.)
Daniel - California Highway Guy ● Highway Site: http://www.cahighways.org/ ●  Blog: http://blog.cahighways.org/ ● Podcast (CA Route by Route): http://caroutebyroute.org/ ● Follow California Highways on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/cahighways

pderocco

Quote from: cahwyguy on April 30, 2023, 04:14:10 PM
I think what you are talking about is even clearer on the SHL database (state highway lines):

https://gisdata-caltrans.opendata.arcgis.com/datasets/77f2d7ba94e040a78bfbe36feb6279da_0/explore?location=34.422762%2C-116.960574%2C13.00

There you can see that the Route 18 endpoint of one segment, and the Route 18 start of another segment, are clearly different points on Route 18, but they create a point at which Route 247 crosses itself (if you're not familiar with this database, click on a line to see the data).

Okay, I was wrong: technically they regard both those short on-grid streets as part of 247. But to sign that "correctly" would involve a three-headed arrow, showing that you're coming into the intersection on 247, and to continue on 247 you may go left, right, or straight. Obviously that would be ridiculous.

They should pretend, for signage purposes, that those two short streets aren't numbered at all, that 247 simply makes a right-angle turn, and that 247 and 18 don't touch. Those streets are best signed as they are now, as "TO" 18 either way. The only sense in which they are part of 247 is that the state maintains them, and no one but Caltrans gives a crap about that.



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