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Author Topic: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction  (Read 7817 times)

silverback1065

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The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« on: July 26, 2020, 09:56:17 AM »

The north split in downtown Indy is going to finally be reconstructed. Project starts this fall and will last 2 years. Currently scheduled to be done by Turkey Day 2022. In order to build this, through traffic for both interstates will be closed for the whole 2 years. Access to the local streets will be maintained the whole time though. More details on the MOT: https://northsplit.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Construction-Information.pdf

The preferred alternative is pretty great, the new interchange is much smaller, as the ghost ramps to I-165 will be gone. Other things include flipping 65 and 70 on the NB approach. 65 will leave from the right and 70 will leave from the left to eliminate the weave from the south split. Final design will remove access to certain movements though. 2 that come to mind are 70 wb can't get to penn anymore and delware st cant get to 65 sb anymore. interesting fact is that daily backup on 65 sb from 21st st to the north split is caused by the weaving from this movement! Bridges will be longer over the local streets, with wider sidewalks and a forest will be planted around the interchange. Monon trail will be widened from 10 to 14 feet, and a new trail will be built on the north side of the interchange. A look at the preferred alternative: https://northsplit.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Preferred-Alternative.pdf
This is a design build interchange. This interchange is the second busiest, and most dangerous interchange in the state. I wonder what the busiest is?
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ilpt4u

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #1 on: July 26, 2020, 11:44:08 AM »

I-65 and I-80/94 would be my guess for busiest in the Hoosier state
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jhuntin1

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #2 on: July 26, 2020, 11:49:47 AM »

^ My guess as well.

It will be interesting to see what this does to traffic on I-465. If anything, it's really going to show that INDOT needs to add lanes to the south side sooner rather than later.
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Revive 755

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #3 on: July 26, 2020, 12:31:16 PM »

Is I-465 going to be free of construction for the next two years while this project is going on?
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tdindy88

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #4 on: July 26, 2020, 02:11:01 PM »

Nope. I-465 will be undergoing construction on the south side over the next few years in relation to the I-69 extension coming up from the south. 465 from 65 west to 70 will be adding a lane and several overpasses are going to be rebuilt. The only good thing might be to keep the interstate at six lanes even with construction in process, a possibility.
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ilpt4u

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #5 on: July 26, 2020, 02:20:27 PM »

Will West St/Missouri St be signed as an official Downtown Detour? Obviously, outside 465, INDOT will direct Thru Traffic to use the Beltway
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #6 on: July 26, 2020, 02:52:34 PM »

Will West St/Missouri St be signed as an official Downtown Detour? Obviously, outside 465, INDOT will direct Thru Traffic to use the Beltway

Maybe, that exit will be widened this fall to accommodate more traffic. 465 On the south side is going to be widened to 8 lanes, i think this will happen after north split, in 2024. The next big project after the north split will be 465/69 clear path on the NE side, they can't do that until after the north split.  Within the next ten years all the bottlenecks will be gone in the metro area. 465 on the south side, north split, 69/465 NE side, 465 from 86th to us 31 (this will be last) and SR 37 in fishers and noblesville and 65 in whitestown. I have also heard rumors about widening 65 from the south split to 465. Eventually the south split will be reconstructed completely as well but this won't be any time soon. I also wouldn't be surprised if 65 from 38th to the north split gets reconstructed in the coming years too.
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Revive 755

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2020, 09:50:02 PM »

465 from 65 west to 70 will be adding a lane and several overpasses are going to be rebuilt.

I-65 at Exit 20 or I-65 at Exit 53?  I see a website for a project from I-65 Exit 53 to I-70 west, but not one that would redo the west side stretch again.
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2020, 10:04:40 PM »

465 from 65 west to 70 will be adding a lane and several overpasses are going to be rebuilt.

I-65 at Exit 20 or I-65 at Exit 53?  I see a website for a project from I-65 Exit 53 to I-70 west, but not one that would redo the west side stretch again.

53, the portion from exit 9 to 53. that part of 465 is the oldest.
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2020, 09:05:12 AM »

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ibthebigd

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2020, 07:47:32 PM »

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skluth

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2020, 07:38:43 PM »


Could something like this work on the 65/70 thru Downtown?

https://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta-news/midtown-interstate-deck-supporters-seek-public-input/JUDOGF5ZKREMDJPVI7ZJDAM25U/?outputType=amp

SM-G950U

Interesting idea, but I see some obstacles.

First is cost. Prices for land in and around downtown Indy aren't nearly as high as Atlanta or Boston (mentioned in the linked article). Other places where highways have been built underground include Dallas (Klyde Warren Park), DC (I-395 under the Capitol grounds), and Minneapolis (between Loring Park and the Walker). All would have been impossible to build above ground or were moved underground for political reasons. A more recent example in St Louis (connecting Luther Ely Smith Park to the Arch grounds) was to facilitate pedestrian access between downtown and the Arch, much needed due to the many events on the Arch grounds (especially the Fair St Louis/ VP Fair every July 4th) and which was mostly paid for by fundraising efforts rather than tax dollars/ highway funds for a park over a freeway that was already in a trench through downtown.

The second is practicality. There looks to be a railroad which may or may not follow Pogue's Run at Ohio Street. A cut-and-cover tunnel would have to account for both Pogue's Run and the railroad. The creek means the water table is probably close to the surface the tunnels need to be well-sealed and monitored. It would be below ground with no easy way to drain, so you'd need pumps for those Midwestern summer cloudbursts as any heavy rains could temporarily close the tunnel. The other railroads near Maryland are elevated so are not an issue. All this would drive up the cost even more, though hopefully not close to Big Dig costs on a per mile basis.

There may be other reasons to not bury the highway, but this is just off the top of my head. The solution here wouldn't be a simple tunnel through a hill like Minneapolis or an already trenched highway like St Louis. The flat land in downtown Indy (I've visited and walked around the area. It's glacial lakebed flat.) is probably why the freeways around its downtown are elevated in the first place. My quick perusal of the area showed not a single trenched freeway anywhere around Indianapolis. I have seen highway tunnels in really flat areas (often around airports like South Howell in Milwaukee or Sepulveda at LAX) but those were driven by other factors.  Putting green space over a highway is great when it can be done (and should be done to complete the US 71 gap in Kansas City), but I don't see it as a realistic solution.
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tdindy88

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2020, 09:05:21 PM »

The stretch of I-65/I-70 from Virginia Avenue to just north of Fletcher Avenue theoretically could be capped since it is already below street level and I'm sure there's a few in Fletcher Place/Fountain Square that might like that. But north of there you run into the Pogue's Run/railroad issue and practicality goes out the window.
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #13 on: November 17, 2020, 08:08:34 PM »

the project starts 11/30/20

https://content.govdelivery.com/accounts/INDOT/bulletins/2ab40ee

michigan st ramp to close for a year! ohio st will stay open until michigan is finished, then ohio will close for a year. fletcher ramp will be closed for 2 yrs. pine st will stay open the whole time.

65/70 will close for 2 years starting may 2021
« Last Edit: November 17, 2020, 08:15:52 PM by silverback1065 »
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2021, 03:41:38 PM »

Major construction has begun with the Michigan St. ramp closed. the bridge has been demoed and it looks like new piles are being driven for a new bridge. Meanwhile traffic is shifted on 65 around Central Ave. for what appears to be for the same thing. Whole interchange is set to close this spring!
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2021, 08:50:13 PM »

traffic has been shifted on 70 west coming into the split.
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silverback1065

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #16 on: April 29, 2021, 03:58:39 PM »

North Split will close in about 2 weeks for 1.5 yrs. As a result several exits on 465 will close for the same length to help traffic flow better. Ramp meters will also be added on some other exits too.
Exits to close include:

US 36/SR 67 ramp to SB 465

East St. to EB 465

Ramp Meters on:

Sam Jones Parkway, southbound
Kentucky Avenue, eastbound
Mann Road, eastbound
East Street, northbound/westbound
Shadeland Avenue, southbound

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/local/transportation/2021/04/29/indianapolis-traffic-465-ramps-close-receive-traffic-signals/4876188001/
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FixThe74Sign

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #17 on: April 29, 2021, 08:20:55 PM »

It will be an interesting 1.5 years here in Indy with this project. We've had a few short closures over the past few summers but nothing this intense.

They've been putting up the detour signs around the area (covered up until its go time). I've never thought INDOT did a very good job with posting detours with the past closures so we shall see what happens this go around. The official 65 detour is not going to be the same detour that Google maps would take you on so I don't know how well that will work out.

I read INDOT's Mobility Plan and they are supposed to improve the 65/70 Washington St exit to help traffic since they will force all highway traffic to exit here but they have not touched it at all yet.

https://northsplit.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/North-Split-Mobility-Management-Plan.pdf  (Page 24 and 25).
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CtrlAltDel

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #18 on: April 29, 2021, 08:35:06 PM »

The official 65 detour is not going to be the same detour that Google maps would take you on so I don't know how well that will work out.

An interesting choice:



The reason given is to avoid overloading I-465 on the south side of the city. Still, it's interesting that I-70 eastbound traffic will be instructed to get off I-70, so that I-65 southbound traffic can get on.
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Interstates clinched: 4, 57, 275 (IN-KY-OH), 465 (IN), 640 (TN), 985
State Interstates clinched: I-26 (TN), I-75 (GA), I-75 (KY), I-75 (TN), I-81 (WV), I-95 (NH)

tdindy88

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #19 on: April 29, 2021, 09:15:16 PM »

Yeah, that's not happening. There's no way most people aren't just going to stick to I-465 around the south side to get back to I-65. I have to drive from Rockville Road to I-65 every day and that interstate is already crowded but this convoluted detour isn't going to fix anything. Alternatively if traffic on 465 becomes so bad I might end up taking that I-70 to I-65 route to get home. Of course I either get to use the loop ramp from I-465 south to I-70 east or that lovely triple left turn at the stoplight onto Sam Jones Expressway (to bring up a recent discussion on another thread.)
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FixThe74Sign

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #20 on: April 29, 2021, 09:38:41 PM »

I have to drive from Rockville Road to I-65 every day and that interstate is already crowded but this convoluted detour isn't going to fix anything.

You are about to have a fun 4 years. There really isn't any good way to cross the White River south of Indy except 465.
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Revive 755

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #21 on: April 29, 2021, 10:43:57 PM »

So the official detour for I-70 goes through the work zone for the future I-69 interchange near IN 37?  Great planning.
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FixThe74Sign

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2021, 11:13:45 PM »

So the official detour for I-70 goes through the work zone for the future I-69 interchange near IN 37?  Great planning.

The major work on 465 for the 69 project won't start until the North Split project is done.
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I-55

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #23 on: April 30, 2021, 12:25:24 AM »

Yeah, that's not happening. There's no way most people aren't just going to stick to I-465 around the south side to get back to I-65. I have to drive from Rockville Road to I-65 every day and that interstate is already crowded but this convoluted detour isn't going to fix anything. Alternatively if traffic on 465 becomes so bad I might end up taking that I-70 to I-65 route to get home. Of course I either get to use the loop ramp from I-465 south to I-70 east or that lovely triple left turn at the stoplight onto Sam Jones Expressway (to bring up a recent discussion on another thread.)

Or if they close the I-65N to I-465/74 W movement the detour might actually be followed (at least more than it would if that exit remains open).
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nwi_navigator_1181

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Re: The I-65/70 North Split Reconstruction
« Reply #24 on: April 30, 2021, 12:35:10 AM »

I’m curious to see how far the advisories for this project will reach. I wouldn’t be surprised if we had warning signage for this either via the overhead VMS signage scattered throughout Northwest Indiana, or if they put up temporary orange signs similar to what they did during the massive Borman reconstruction of 2004-12.

Given the size and scope of this project, and the impact it will have on the main drags of Indianapolis (as well as the surrounding surface streets), this is going to be a very big deal. It’s sorely needed, but still…
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