Football (North America: NFL, CFL, Arena Football, minor leagues)

[Alps]

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fox-backing-2022-reboot-of-u-s-football-league-1234962480/
There are talks to reboot the USFL in 2022. That's right the last time the USFL was talked about was because that league was run over by the NFL in 1985.

Despite mentioning Trump, this is a non-political post.  Donald Trump owned the NJ Generals.  They had a decent team and there were others like the Philadelphia Bell and Houston Gamblers.  Trump pushed for the USFL to play in the fall.  That seemed to be the breaking point for the USFL.  The quality of play was good enough as evidenced by the amount of former USFL players who played in the NFL.  One has to wonder if there was room for another fall league back in the Eighties?

Rick

And let's make sure we keep it non-political... A lot of what-ifs. The USFL seemed to be similar to the WHL - several teams with good talent but money issues because they had to go from 0-competitive at the get-go. I doubt the reboot is going to fare any better.

[sturmde]

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fox-backing-2022-reboot-of-u-s-football-league-1234962480/
There are talks to reboot the USFL in 2022. That's right the last time the USFL was talked about was because that league was run over by the NFL in 1985.

Despite mentioning Trump, this is a non-political post.  Donald Trump owned the NJ Generals.  They had a decent team and there were others like the Philadelphia Bell and Houston Gamblers.  Trump pushed for the USFL to play in the fall.  That seemed to be the breaking point for the USFL.  The quality of play was good enough as evidenced by the amount of former USFL players who played in the NFL.  One has to wonder if there was room for another fall league back in the Eighties?

Rick

There was no NFL expansion between 1976 (Tampa and Seattle) and 1995 (Carolina and Jacksonville).  Tampa and Seattle somewhere were a response to the WFL.   So, if you consider that when the USFL began, there were only 26 NFL teams, and 2 of them fairly new (and one horribly bad)... there was a market for maybe 6 or 7 teams.
.
At the time, the Colts had just left Baltimore, so cities like Baltimore, Memphis, Charlotte, Nashville, Birmingham, Jacksonville, San Antonio, Phoenix, Portland, Oakland, Columbus all were open for setting up shop.  Throw in a New York metro and an LA metro team, and had they stuck to that, they might have survived.  Trump's and others' intent was to push for something like 6 teams to get absorbed into the NFL.  They would have reduced to an 8-team fall league, and pushed to be absorbed like the ABA into the NBA or the WHA into the NHL.
.
With the NFL at 32 teams today rather than 26, it would be a tough sell today for a fall league.  A spring league could succeed if it planned to stay there though.  A fall league... what cities are you going to go to?  At best, maybe you could pull off an 8 or 10 or 12 team fall minor league like this:
East:  New Jersey, Hartford, Birmingham, Memphis, Raleigh, Columbus
West:  Carson (California), San Diego, Oakland, San Antonio, Portland, Omaha
.
Problem is, you're also competing against college football... even back in the 1980's.

[Roadgeekteen]

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fox-backing-2022-reboot-of-u-s-football-league-1234962480/
There are talks to reboot the USFL in 2022. That's right the last time the USFL was talked about was because that league was run over by the NFL in 1985.

Despite mentioning Trump, this is a non-political post.  Donald Trump owned the NJ Generals.  They had a decent team and there were others like the Philadelphia Bell and Houston Gamblers.  Trump pushed for the USFL to play in the fall.  That seemed to be the breaking point for the USFL.  The quality of play was good enough as evidenced by the amount of former USFL players who played in the NFL.  One has to wonder if there was room for another fall league back in the Eighties?

Rick

There was no NFL expansion between 1976 (Tampa and Seattle) and 1995 (Carolina and Jacksonville).  Tampa and Seattle somewhere were a response to the WFL.   So, if you consider that when the USFL began, there were only 26 NFL teams, and 2 of them fairly new (and one horribly bad)... there was a market for maybe 6 or 7 teams.
.
At the time, the Colts had just left Baltimore, so cities like Baltimore, Memphis, Charlotte, Nashville, Birmingham, Jacksonville, San Antonio, Phoenix, Portland, Oakland, Columbus all were open for setting up shop.  Throw in a New York metro and an LA metro team, and had they stuck to that, they might have survived.  Trump's and others' intent was to push for something like 6 teams to get absorbed into the NFL.  They would have reduced to an 8-team fall league, and pushed to be absorbed like the ABA into the NBA or the WHA into the NHL.
.
With the NFL at 32 teams today rather than 26, it would be a tough sell today for a fall league.  A spring league could succeed if it planned to stay there though.  A fall league... what cities are you going to go to?  At best, maybe you could pull off an 8 or 10 or 12 team fall minor league like this:
East:  New Jersey, Hartford, Birmingham, Memphis, Raleigh, Columbus
West:  Carson (California), San Diego, Oakland, San Antonio, Portland, Omaha
.
Problem is, you're also competing against college football... even back in the 1980's.

Try some big Mexican cities. Could be a huge untapped market.

[TheHighwayMan3561]

As someone put it on another board a couple days ago, NFL fans and football fans are not the same thing. Most "football" fans in reality just do not give a shit about non-NFL action, and to a lesser degree major college football.

[tidecat]

The Chicago Bears may be sharing their new den with an expansion team:

https://www.nj.com/giants/2021/07/nfl-rumors-chicago-expansion-team-how-new-bears-stadium-could-make-it-happen.html
This would also add a lot of value to the AFC TV contract - there is no AFC team between Indianapolis and Kansas City.

[Roadgeekteen]

https://sports.yahoo.com/chiefs-de-frank-clark-facing-3-years-prison-felony-weapon-possession-charge-220557743.html

oof

[KeithE4Phx]

The Chicago Bears may be sharing their new den with an expansion team:

https://www.nj.com/giants/2021/07/nfl-rumors-chicago-expansion-team-how-new-bears-stadium-could-make-it-happen.html
This would also add a lot of value to the AFC TV contract - there is no AFC team between Indianapolis and Kansas City.

There won't be one in Chicago, either.  Chicago has not been a two-team NFL city since 1959, the last year before the Chicago Cardinals moved to St. Louis.  In those days, the Bears/Cards rivalry was north side/south side, like the Cubs/White Sox today.

If another team moved into the new Bears stadium, or even if both played at Soldier Field, the AFC team would be a moot point.  Chicago is a Bears and NFC town, and the AFC is all but irrelevant there.

[Roadgeekteen]

I would expand to many cities before adding a second team in Chicago.

[Stephane Dumas]

The CFL will have another reality check.
https://www.tsn.ca/questions-surrounding-big-markets-loom-after-cfl-xfl-fallout-1.1665876

We interrupt this joyous return to the field in Canadian Football for a reality check about the future of the league beyond this season.

As most are aware, the CFL announced this week that it's no longer in talks about collaboration with the XFL, meaning the league will plot its way into the future as we've always known in it — nine teams in Canada, playing three-down football, guaranteeing 21 Canadians on every team.

And a business model that's as traditional as it gets.

All of which is reason for celebration for many, especially those who believe that the CFL's traditional qualities give it a unique flavour in the vast and ever-expanding world of professional sports.

Heck, it was even cause for one CFL team (Edmonton) to issue a celebratory news release that might as well have read "Ding, dong, The Witch is dead."

So into the future the CFL goes, pretty much as we've always known it.

The only problem with that is that the CFL business model — which is fundamental to its existence -- hasn't worked very well of late in Vancouver, Montreal and especially Toronto.

And unless the league comes up with a way to solve that, or ensure ownership in those cities is willing to subsidize teams in perpetuity, then there's going to a crisis. And quite possibly, a big one.

Objectively, the ownership situation in all three of those markets is such that it begs questions about the future.

The B.C. Lions were owned by David Braley for more than 23 years when the Ontario businessman passed away in October of 2020, leaving the team in the hands of his estate.

Braley supported the Lions through some lean years, with his own money and that from the many Grey Cups he hosted, as owner in B.C. and, for a time, in Toronto.

But he leaves the franchise on a low in terms of popularity and profitability. The Lions didn't draw 20,000 fans to a single game last season.

And the brand is struggling to engage younger fans, as it does elsewhere in the country.

There is said to be multiple groups interested in purchasing the team, but the devil here is in the details. Under what terms?

The next owner of the B.C. Lions has to be prepared to spend, at least for a while.

[Roadgeekteen]

If the CFL folds the NFL should take advantage and expand to Toronto and maybe Vancouver or Montreal.

[Big John]

There is a rumor of the Toronto Argonauts joining he XFL by 2023: https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/could-cfls-toronto-argonauts-join-xfl-for-2023/ar-AALYyGO?ocid=uxbndlbing

[TheHighwayMan3561]

There is a rumor of the Toronto Argonauts joining he XFL by 2023: https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/could-cfls-toronto-argonauts-join-xfl-for-2023/ar-AALYyGO?ocid=uxbndlbing

It was discussed on another board I'm on. Their ownership structure and Canadian pride won't allow that to happen.

[thspfc]

If the CFL folds the NFL should take advantage and expand to Toronto and maybe Vancouver or Montreal.

Can we just get over it with this? Every. Single. Month. We have a silly suggestion about the NFL expanding across international borders, over oceans, into tiny little cities that could never support a team. Look at the mess the NHL, NBA, and MLB are/were in during Covid, when the Raptors and Blue Jays semi-permanently relocated and the Canadian hockey teams may as well have formed their own league.

[Roadgeekteen]

If the CFL folds the NFL should take advantage and expand to Toronto and maybe Vancouver or Montreal.

Can we just get over it with this? Every. Single. Month. We have a silly suggestion about the NFL expanding across international borders, over oceans, into tiny little cities that could never support a team. Look at the mess the NHL, NBA, and MLB are/were in during Covid, when the Raptors and Blue Jays semi-permanently relocated and the Canadian hockey teams may as well have formed their own league.

Toronto is not a tiny city, and in non-covid times the Raptors and Blue Jays are doing just fine.

[SP Cook]

Chicago.  Agree there will never be another team there.  All I can add is that there really is hardly an "AFC contract" anymore.  The new TV deal, which kicks in in 22, will allow for yet more "flexing" between Fox and CBS.

CFL.  Agree 100% with all of this international expansion is so much ho-ha.  But the point of the TSN article is that the CFL is working, in the Prairies, where it fill a cultural and social role similar to college football in America's more rural states.  But not in Canada's big cities, where it is seen as a minor league.  This is true.  If, as I believe it will, NIL destroys college football as we know it, I would not be surprised to see those teams in the minor league that replaces the NCAA.

Canada generally.  To me the true deadline is September.  The Blue Jays really don't matter, they can play all year in Buffalo, but if Canada cannot get its health situation together in order to allow the NHL a normal season, the future of cross border sports, heck, cross border entertainment generally, will change forever.

[Roadgeekteen]

Chicago.  Agree there will never be another team there.  All I can add is that there really is hardly an "AFC contract" anymore.  The new TV deal, which kicks in in 22, will allow for yet more "flexing" between Fox and CBS.

CFL.  Agree 100% with all of this international expansion is so much ho-ha.  But the point of the TSN article is that the CFL is working, in the Prairies, where it fill a cultural and social role similar to college football in America's more rural states.  But not in Canada's big cities, where it is seen as a minor league.  This is true.  If, as I believe it will, NIL destroys college football as we know it, I would not be surprised to see those teams in the minor league that replaces the NCAA.

Canada generally.  To me the true deadline is September.  The Blue Jays really don't matter, they can play all year in Buffalo, but if Canada cannot get its health situation together in order to allow the NHL a normal season, the future of cross border sports, heck, cross border entertainment generally, will change forever.

Canada needs to get its head out of its ass with this covid sports thing

[NWI_Irish96]

The Chicago Bears may be sharing their new den with an expansion team:

https://www.nj.com/giants/2021/07/nfl-rumors-chicago-expansion-team-how-new-bears-stadium-could-make-it-happen.html
This would also add a lot of value to the AFC TV contract - there is no AFC team between Indianapolis and Kansas City.

Indianapolis isn't far from Chicago. I can't imagine they would be happy about having to compete with another AFC team for fans in northern and northwestern Indiana.

[Stephane Dumas]

Could we said "Adios Buffalo Bills! Hello Austin Bills!" soon? https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2021/08/01/texas-gov-abbott-acknowledges-buffalo-bills-austin-relocation/

AUSTIN, Texas (CBSDFW.COM) — Could there be a third NFL team in the Lone Star State? It appears Texas Gov. Greg Abbott at least acknowledges the idea.

According to a report from ESPN writer Seth Wickersham, the Buffalo Bills are looking into potential relocation spots, including Austin, amid negotiations for a new stadium.

The idea of Austin or another city as a possible destination could be seen as a "threat,"  according to Wickersham.

In a tweet, the Texas governor reacted to news of the report with a simple emoji of eyes glancing to the left. Abbott has not said what he thinks of the possibility.

[Roadgeekteen]

Could we said "Adios Buffalo Bills! Hello Austin Bills!" soon? https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2021/08/01/texas-gov-abbott-acknowledges-buffalo-bills-austin-relocation/

AUSTIN, Texas (CBSDFW.COM) — Could there be a third NFL team in the Lone Star State? It appears Texas Gov. Greg Abbott at least acknowledges the idea.

According to a report from ESPN writer Seth Wickersham, the Buffalo Bills are looking into potential relocation spots, including Austin, amid negotiations for a new stadium.

The idea of Austin or another city as a possible destination could be seen as a "threat,"  according to Wickersham.

In a tweet, the Texas governor reacted to news of the report with a simple emoji of eyes glancing to the left. Abbott has not said what he thinks of the possibility.

Austin is a cool NFL market but I don't want the loyal fans in Buffalo to lose their team.

[Alps]

Could we said "Adios Buffalo Bills! Hello Austin Bills!" soon? https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2021/08/01/texas-gov-abbott-acknowledges-buffalo-bills-austin-relocation/

AUSTIN, Texas (CBSDFW.COM) — Could there be a third NFL team in the Lone Star State? It appears Texas Gov. Greg Abbott at least acknowledges the idea.

According to a report from ESPN writer Seth Wickersham, the Buffalo Bills are looking into potential relocation spots, including Austin, amid negotiations for a new stadium.

The idea of Austin or another city as a possible destination could be seen as a "threat,"  according to Wickersham.

In a tweet, the Texas governor reacted to news of the report with a simple emoji of eyes glancing to the left. Abbott has not said what he thinks of the possibility.

Austin is a cool NFL market but I don't want the loyal fans in Buffalo to lose their team.

They still have the Argonauts. Austin/San Antonio has grown enough to deserve teams in all major sports.

[Roadgeekteen]

Could we said "Adios Buffalo Bills! Hello Austin Bills!" soon? https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2021/08/01/texas-gov-abbott-acknowledges-buffalo-bills-austin-relocation/

AUSTIN, Texas (CBSDFW.COM) — Could there be a third NFL team in the Lone Star State? It appears Texas Gov. Greg Abbott at least acknowledges the idea.

According to a report from ESPN writer Seth Wickersham, the Buffalo Bills are looking into potential relocation spots, including Austin, amid negotiations for a new stadium.

The idea of Austin or another city as a possible destination could be seen as a "threat,"  according to Wickersham.

In a tweet, the Texas governor reacted to news of the report with a simple emoji of eyes glancing to the left. Abbott has not said what he thinks of the possibility.

Austin is a cool NFL market but I don't want the loyal fans in Buffalo to lose their team.

They still have the Argonauts. Austin/San Antonio has grown enough to deserve teams in all major sports.

The Argonauts play in Toronto. That's not the same market. Move the Chargers to Austin.

[CoreySamson]

Could we said "Adios Buffalo Bills! Hello Austin Bills!" soon? https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2021/08/01/texas-gov-abbott-acknowledges-buffalo-bills-austin-relocation/

AUSTIN, Texas (CBSDFW.COM) — Could there be a third NFL team in the Lone Star State? It appears Texas Gov. Greg Abbott at least acknowledges the idea.

According to a report from ESPN writer Seth Wickersham, the Buffalo Bills are looking into potential relocation spots, including Austin, amid negotiations for a new stadium.

The idea of Austin or another city as a possible destination could be seen as a "threat,"  according to Wickersham.

In a tweet, the Texas governor reacted to news of the report with a simple emoji of eyes glancing to the left. Abbott has not said what he thinks of the possibility.

Austin is a cool NFL market but I don't want the loyal fans in Buffalo to lose their team.

They still have the Argonauts. Austin/San Antonio has grown enough to deserve teams in all major sports.

The Argonauts play in Toronto. That's not the same market. Move the Chargers to Austin.

I think it's basically a done deal that if Austin gets an NFL team, it'll be the Jacksonville Jaguars.

[Roadgeekteen]

Could we said "Adios Buffalo Bills! Hello Austin Bills!" soon? https://dfw.cbslocal.com/2021/08/01/texas-gov-abbott-acknowledges-buffalo-bills-austin-relocation/

AUSTIN, Texas (CBSDFW.COM) — Could there be a third NFL team in the Lone Star State? It appears Texas Gov. Greg Abbott at least acknowledges the idea.

According to a report from ESPN writer Seth Wickersham, the Buffalo Bills are looking into potential relocation spots, including Austin, amid negotiations for a new stadium.

The idea of Austin or another city as a possible destination could be seen as a "threat,"  according to Wickersham.

In a tweet, the Texas governor reacted to news of the report with a simple emoji of eyes glancing to the left. Abbott has not said what he thinks of the possibility.

Austin is a cool NFL market but I don't want the loyal fans in Buffalo to lose their team.

They still have the Argonauts. Austin/San Antonio has grown enough to deserve teams in all major sports.

The Argonauts play in Toronto. That's not the same market. Move the Chargers to Austin.

I think it's basically a done deal that if Austin gets an NFL team, it'll be the Jacksonville Jaguars.

I chose the Chargers as they have no fans in LA.

[JayhawkCO]

I think it's basically a done deal that if Austin gets an NFL team, it'll be the Jacksonville Jaguars.

I doubt it.  The owner, Shad Khan, has invested heavily in the city of Jacksonville.  I doubt he'd do that if he were planning to move.

Chris

[SP Cook]

Having squeezed all the value out of "if you taxpayers don't build me a stadium, I will move to LA"  for 25 years, the NFL has apparently settled on Austin, TX as the new boogie man. 

With the Bills (23), Bengals (26), Titans (27), and Saints (25) all being small markets with leases running out soon, we will see this theme for a while. 

There are three reasons no team will ever be in Austin or San Antonio.  These are spelled C O W B O Y S, T E X A N S, and L O N G H O R N S.

While the largest market w/o an NFL team is actually Orlando, which isn't getting one either for similar reasons, if I were in charge of stadium extortion for the NFL, I would use Salt Lake City, which is fast growing, rich, and hundreds of miles from the other teams.