I don't foresee myself ever needing a new car with driver assist features

Started by RobbieL2415, February 17, 2021, 01:40:53 PM

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kkt

The biggest danger I see in the hill holding feature is if people get used to a car with hill holding and then are driving a borrowed or rented car that does not.


Dirt Roads

Quote from: kkt on February 28, 2021, 11:17:13 PM
The biggest danger I see in the hill holding feature is if people get used to a car with hill holding and then are driving a borrowed or rented car that does not.

Or worse, trying to drive off in an old fashioned stick shift.

formulanone

Quote from: interstatefan990 on February 28, 2021, 04:47:41 PM
Quote from: Duke87 on February 28, 2021, 04:33:54 PM
I have rented Toyotas, for example, that will play a warning chime and pop up a message suggesting you take a break simply if you have been operating the vehicle for more than 2 hours continuously. This... no, this is not helpful.

Another common offending item is the thermometer. Outdoor temp drops below 35 or so, the car plays a loud warning chime and pops up a message saying "Caution: icy conditions possible". While the icy conditions popup is arguably helpful (and I have no problem with such a message popping up quietly), the warning chime accompanying it is uncalled for.

Subarus do this too, but the warning chime for that is more of a friendly, singular chirp. When it actually needs to warn you of something urgent, it'll loudly beep at you rapidly. Maybe Toyota should follow suit.

In some vehicles, you can mute most offending chimes or disable the warnings, such as icy conditions or for so-called fatigue.

I don't think I've ever seen one that fully ignores TPMS (as it would probably not ignore mandated items), but not every vehicle makes an audible signal.

I've never played around with hill-holding features, to be honest. I think I've had a rental or two which seemed to not roll forward at idle speeds, but I still keep my foot on the brake in an automatic, unless it's a really long stop for an active rail crossing, when I'll put it in Park.

kphoger

Quote from: US 89 on February 28, 2021, 04:58:40 PM
The loudest sound I've ever heard come from a car was from my mom's Volkswagen Jetta. I was driving it down the interstate and out of nowhere came a very loud BEEEEEEEEP. After a few seconds of wearing off from the initial shock, I was able to find the culprit: the semi-annual TPMS light that always comes on after it gets cold in fall.

I took the next exit and pulled into a gas station to check my tire pressures. All were roughly 1-2 psi too low. I'm glad the warning light came on, but the reality is that you don't need a loud, loud noise to distract you from the interstate for a tire that's just slightly flat. For as much warning as I got, I'd expect my engine to be overheating or something.

Meanwhile... if you've run out of coolant, you car has overheated, and you're about to crack the engine block, all you get is a little needle that points more upward than usual.

I've owned two Pathfinders, and the TPMS hasn't worked in either one of them.  So the light flashes whenever I start the car, and then it remains on constantly thereafter.  Mention it to a used car dealer, and he'll probably tell you that's the case for half the cars on the lot.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

interstatefan990

Quote from: formulanone on March 01, 2021, 05:37:17 AM
I've never played around with hill-holding features, to be honest. I think I've had a rental or two which seemed to not roll forward at idle speeds, but I still keep my foot on the brake in an automatic, unless it's a really long stop for an active rail crossing, when I'll put it in Park.

Some new vehicles on the market today have a feature called Auto Brake Hold or something along the lines of that. It basically keeps your brake engaged from when you come to a full stop and take your foot off the brake pedal until you press on the gas again, so you don't have to hold it down the entire time you're waiting for a red light or stopped at a railroad crossing, etc. My car has it, and it can be helpful, but it gets extremely annoying when you're trying to inch into a parking spot by letting the car roll and stopping it with the brake, in which case I turn it off.
Multi-lane roundabouts are an abomination to mankind.

Duke87

Quote from: kkt on February 28, 2021, 11:17:13 PM
The biggest danger I see in the hill holding feature is if people get used to a car with hill holding and then are driving a borrowed or rented car that does not.

I mean, this is potentially true of any feature once you are conditioned to its existence.

I once backed into another vehicle in a parking lot because, rather than looking behind me, I had been staring at the center console where the screen displaying the feed from the backup camera should be. Except... the rental vehicle I was driving did not have a backup camera, and I manged to not notice its absence until I heard a crunch. Oops.

Fortunately, this collision occurred at a low enough speed that there was absolutely no visible damage to either vehicle.
If you always take the same road, you will never see anything new.

Scott5114

Quote from: formulanone on March 01, 2021, 05:37:17 AM
I don't think I've ever seen one that fully ignores TPMS (as it would probably not ignore mandated items), but not every vehicle makes an audible signal.

Yeah, mine just has a yellow light on the dash, no chime or anything. Fortunately, my car allows you to view the PSI the tire sensors are reporting, and most of the time it's just a couple pounds low. I kind of habitually ignore it enough that I'm afraid the bulb is going to burn out.
uncontrollable freak sardine salad chef

jakeroot

Quote from: Dirt Roads on February 28, 2021, 11:55:42 PM
Quote from: kkt on February 28, 2021, 11:17:13 PM
The biggest danger I see in the hill holding feature is if people get used to a car with hill holding and then are driving a borrowed or rented car that does not.

Or worse, trying to drive off in an old fashioned stick shift.

I suffered from this a few times at the hotel where I worked. While waiting at this traffic light to turn left, I assumed the 2005 Subaru Impreza 5-speed I was driving had hill-hold, as an older Subaru we owned from the 80s had the feature; alas, it did not, and I nearly went into the car behind me when I swapped my right foot from the brake to the throttle. I quickly caught it and performed the old slowly-release-the-handbrake trick, but it did briefly alarm me.

JayhawkCO

Quote from: Scott5114 on March 01, 2021, 08:13:15 PM
Quote from: formulanone on March 01, 2021, 05:37:17 AM
I don't think I've ever seen one that fully ignores TPMS (as it would probably not ignore mandated items), but not every vehicle makes an audible signal.

Yeah, mine just has a yellow light on the dash, no chime or anything. Fortunately, my car allows you to view the PSI the tire sensors are reporting, and most of the time it's just a couple pounds low. I kind of habitually ignore it enough that I'm afraid the bulb is going to burn out.

My Jeep has nitrogen filled tires, which is supposedly less expansive/contractive with weather changes.  So I'm hoping that it will eliminate the TPMS issues that my previous ride (Xterra) had.

Chris

kphoger

Quote from: 1995hoo on February 18, 2021, 12:31:58 PM
I used to think a backup camera was no big deal, but I have to say I really love the one in my wife's TLX. That car also has the "proximity sensors" (my father called it "sonar"). The combination of those makes it really easy when you're pulling into a tight parallel parking spot. I don't turn my head when I park that car–I use the camera instead, and I miss it when I parallel park our other cars (well, except the convertible if the top is down, but that's just because having the top down makes it so easy to see behind you).

On June 15, Scot Burner of Nashville (TN) set a Guinness world record by driving a mile in a 2017 Corvette Stingray in 1 minute 15.18 seconds–for an average speed of 48 mph.  In reverse.

And this is how Scot Burner drives in reverse:  "I turn around with my right hand on the passenger seat, put my left hand on the steering wheel and look out the rear window."
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

1995hoo

Quote from: kphoger on December 28, 2022, 04:43:04 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on February 18, 2021, 12:31:58 PM
I used to think a backup camera was no big deal, but I have to say I really love the one in my wife's TLX. That car also has the "proximity sensors" (my father called it "sonar"). The combination of those makes it really easy when you're pulling into a tight parallel parking spot. I don't turn my head when I park that car–I use the camera instead, and I miss it when I parallel park our other cars (well, except the convertible if the top is down, but that's just because having the top down makes it so easy to see behind you).

On June 15, Scot Burner of Nashville (TN) set a Guinness world record by driving a mile in a 2017 Corvette Stingray in 1 minute 15.18 seconds–for an average speed of 48 mph.  In reverse.

And this is how Scot Burner drives in reverse:  "I turn around with my right hand on the passenger seat, put my left hand on the steering wheel and look out the rear window."

Which is nice but doesn't invalidate anything I said about the reasons why I like my wife's rearview camera. I note that our other cars do not have them, so I certainly turn my head often enough (except backing out of our garage–I use the sideview mirrors for that). But the camera is the thing I miss the most when I drive one of the other cars.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

thspfc

Quote from: kphoger on December 28, 2022, 04:43:04 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on February 18, 2021, 12:31:58 PM
I used to think a backup camera was no big deal, but I have to say I really love the one in my wife's TLX. That car also has the "proximity sensors" (my father called it "sonar"). The combination of those makes it really easy when you're pulling into a tight parallel parking spot. I don't turn my head when I park that car–I use the camera instead, and I miss it when I parallel park our other cars (well, except the convertible if the top is down, but that's just because having the top down makes it so easy to see behind you).

On June 15, Scot Burner of Nashville (TN) set a Guinness world record by driving a mile in a 2017 Corvette Stingray in 1 minute 15.18 seconds–for an average speed of 48 mph.  In reverse.

And this is how Scot Burner drives in reverse:  "I turn around with my right hand on the passenger seat, put my left hand on the steering wheel and look out the rear window."
And why should I care?

If the backup camera helps me then I'm going to use it.

kalvado

Quote from: thspfc on December 29, 2022, 09:03:28 AM
Quote from: kphoger on December 28, 2022, 04:43:04 PM
Quote from: 1995hoo on February 18, 2021, 12:31:58 PM
I used to think a backup camera was no big deal, but I have to say I really love the one in my wife's TLX. That car also has the "proximity sensors" (my father called it "sonar"). The combination of those makes it really easy when you're pulling into a tight parallel parking spot. I don't turn my head when I park that car–I use the camera instead, and I miss it when I parallel park our other cars (well, except the convertible if the top is down, but that's just because having the top down makes it so easy to see behind you).

On June 15, Scot Burner of Nashville (TN) set a Guinness world record by driving a mile in a 2017 Corvette Stingray in 1 minute 15.18 seconds–for an average speed of 48 mph.  In reverse.

And this is how Scot Burner drives in reverse:  "I turn around with my right hand on the passenger seat, put my left hand on the steering wheel and look out the rear window."
And why should I care?

If the backup camera helps me then I'm going to use it.
A huge point of the backup camera is being able to see a dead spot right behind the car. There are cases with smaller people (also known as "children") walking or standing behind the car unnoticed when the car start moving. No driver skill can help with that. Taking notice of that spot while getting into the car helps but may not be enough.

1995hoo

One thing I've found that I like with the backup camera in my wife's TLX is that when I pull through a parking space to face out, or (much more rarely) when I back into a space, the ability to change the camera view to a straight-down view once I'm in the space is very nice because it means I can back the car right up to the line that's below the rear bumper, while not protruding in any way to the space behind the car, all so as to ensure the car is as far back in the space (and thus as far out of the drive aisle) as possible.

For the most part, not counting parallel parking, the only place where I normally back into a space is the City Center DC garage downtown, which is where we park for Capitals games–I always go to the drive aisle that leads directly to my preferred exit, and while I normally enter via the next aisle over and then pull straight through, if it's crowded I'll back in. In that particular circumstance of a popular event with a lot of people leaving at the same time, the ability to drive straight out of the spot makes a difference. In most other situations, I've never perceived much advantage to it, and as I've mentioned elsewhere I consider it disadvantageous at the grocery store because I want easy access to the trunk there.

I would be somewhat interested in knowing to what extent drivers of various ages and experience feel comfortable using a backup camera. When Ms1995hoo first got her TLX, it took me a while to overcome the muscle memory of turning my head. My mother, who is in her late 70s, never uses the backup camera in my late father's Volvo, and it has an exceptionally sharp and crisp image–she says, "I don't trust it," and I suspect part of it is the ingrained habit from 50+ years of turning her head. That's understandable. (She's a terrible parallel parker, too. I haven't looked into the feature on that car that allows it to park itself, so I don't know whether it's meant for parking spaces or parallel parking, but I'm pretty confident she's never used it either.) My mom is by no means a Luddite and uses technology for various things, which is why I suspect that muscle memory and years of habit are the determinative issues as to the backup camera.
"You know, you never have a guaranteed spot until you have a spot guaranteed."
—Olaf Kolzig, as quoted in the Washington Times on March 28, 2003,
commenting on the Capitals clinching a playoff spot.

"That sounded stupid, didn't it?"
—Kolzig, to the same reporter a few seconds later.

skluth

I find it far easier to back into a parking lot space using a combination of backup camera and side mirrors than pulling in normally. This also allows me so see better when I pull out of the space since so many people have SUVs and other vehicles taller than my sedan. Backup cameras are great. I will still pull in normally if I can drive through the open space to another open space that allows me to pull out quickly like 1995hoo because it's easier and quicker.

kphoger

I've never been able to confidently back up on a curve while using a backup camera–but it's easy when I'm actually looking out the rear window.  For example, backing into my driveway and having to get it between the goalposts of the curb cutout from a perpendicular starting position.  I actually have an easier time using my side mirrors for that purpose than a backup camera.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

thspfc

When backing out of the driveway I probably look forwards more than I look backwards. The driveway is straight, so as long as I'm going straight back and between the two edges, I'm fine. I only look back to make sure there's no cars coming and nothing in the way.

jakeroot

The only time I ever used a backup camera as a valet was to ensure I didn't hit anything behind me, like a post, another car, or concrete wall. Cameras can help you get crazy close, which is really all that matters as a valet. For everything else, like maneuvering into the stall, I just used the mirrors.

Dirt Roads

I hardly ever used the backup camera until a few weeks ago.  I still use left eye over the right arm manuever, but often glance at the passenger side mirror in the process.  One day in a large parking lot, I put the minivan in reverse and saw something dart into the backup camera image out of the corner of my eye when I peeked at the side mirror.  A tiny little girl was running across only about 4 inches from the car, such that there was no way I could see her through the rear windshield.  I've wisened up and am now using the backup camera, but it is certainly a strain to rotate back-and-forth between the two positions.



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