DC: some changes to the design of the 11th St Bridge project

Started by froggie, May 30, 2009, 08:09:41 AM

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cpzilliacus

Quote from: Steve on August 25, 2012, 11:56:34 PM
Baltimore could renumber its 695 easily enough since it has two other 2dis - 70 and 83. DC has only 95.

D.C. also has I-66.

Quote from: Steve on August 25, 2012, 11:56:34 PM
Also, Baltimore uses five 3dis (195, 395, 695, 795, 895), while DC uses five (295, 395, 495, 595, 695), so there has to be SOME duplication unless 695 is renumbered. Baltimore's 395 could easily become 995, since it's so short.

IMO, I-97 should be I-995.
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vdeane

Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 26, 2012, 11:40:53 AM
Quote from: Steve on August 25, 2012, 11:56:34 PM
Baltimore could renumber its 695 easily enough since it has two other 2dis - 70 and 83. DC has only 95.

D.C. also has I-66.

Quote from: Steve on August 25, 2012, 11:56:34 PM
Also, Baltimore uses five 3dis (195, 395, 695, 795, 895), while DC uses five (295, 395, 495, 595, 695), so there has to be SOME duplication unless 695 is renumbered. Baltimore's 395 could easily become 995, since it's so short.

IMO, I-97 should be I-995.
I-66 only meets I-495, or do you suggest that it have a similar situation to the I-x78 routes in NY?
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: deanej on August 26, 2012, 11:57:34 AM
I-66 only meets I-495, or do you suggest that it have a similar situation to the I-x78 routes in NY?

That is correct.  I was just pointing out that I-66 does enter the District of Columbia, that's all.
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Beltway

Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 26, 2012, 11:40:53 AM
IMO, I-97 should be I-995.

IMO, I-97 should be extended along the US-301 and VA-207 corridor, to I-95 at Carmel Church, VA.  It would be inter-state in scope and I-97 would be an appropriate designation.
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cpzilliacus

Quote from: Beltway on August 26, 2012, 03:50:43 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 26, 2012, 11:40:53 AM
IMO, I-97 should be I-995.

IMO, I-97 should be extended along the US-301 and VA-207 corridor, to I-95 at Carmel Church, VA.  It would be inter-state in scope and I-97 would be an appropriate designation.


My solution to that is to extend I-85 north from Petersburg as a multiplex with I-95 (and I-64 through Richmond - a multiplex with three 2DIs), then have I-85 branch off to the northeast, following Va. 207 and then U.S. 301 to Bowie, then a twisted path along U.S. 50 and (what is now) I-97 to I-695.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

NE2

I-97 should go down the Delmarva to Raleigh.
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Beltway

Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 26, 2012, 10:57:04 PM
Quote from: Beltway on August 26, 2012, 03:50:43 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 26, 2012, 11:40:53 AM
IMO, I-97 should be I-995.

IMO, I-97 should be extended along the US-301 and VA-207 corridor, to I-95 at Carmel Church, VA.  It would be inter-state in scope and I-97 would be an appropriate designation.


My solution to that is to extend I-85 north from Petersburg as a multiplex with I-95 (and I-64 through Richmond - a multiplex with three 2DIs), then have I-85 branch off to the northeast, following Va. 207 and then U.S. 301 to Bowie, then a twisted path along U.S. 50 and (what is now) I-97 to I-695.

No, that is way too long of an overlap.  I think that I-97 would be the best proposal.
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cpzilliacus

Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 06:24:27 AM
No, that is way too long of an overlap.  I think that I-97 would be the best proposal.

Ever noticed the overlap of I-80 and I-90 across much of Ohio (Turnpike) and Indiana (Toll Road)?

I've driven it.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

Beltway

Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 27, 2012, 07:53:53 AM
Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 06:24:27 AM
No, that is way too long of an overlap.  I think that I-97 would be the best proposal.

Ever noticed the overlap of I-80 and I-90 across much of Ohio (Turnpike) and Indiana (Toll Road)?

Yes.  That was established when those turnpikes were incorporated into the Interstate system 50 years ago, given that the Great Lakes pushed I-90 traffic down to I-80.  That doesn't justify what you are proposing.

The VA-207/US-301/MD-3 Interstate corridor deserves a number of its own, and extending I-97 is ideal.
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Henry

Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 10:14:58 AM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 27, 2012, 07:53:53 AM
Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 06:24:27 AM
No, that is way too long of an overlap.  I think that I-97 would be the best proposal.

Ever noticed the overlap of I-80 and I-90 across much of Ohio (Turnpike) and Indiana (Toll Road)?

Yes.  That was established when those turnpikes were incorporated into the Interstate system 50 years ago, given that the Great Lakes pushed I-90 traffic down to I-80.  That doesn't justify what you are proposing.

The VA-207/US-301/MD-3 Interstate corridor deserves a number of its own, and extending I-97 is ideal.
I know this is more of a Fictional Highways thing, but what would you do with the leftover part that goes to Annapolis? MD 32 could continue along the "old" I-97, unless it is incorporated into an Interstate corridor that extends all the way to I-70.
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cpzilliacus

Quote from: Henry on August 27, 2012, 02:25:43 PM
Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 10:14:58 AM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 27, 2012, 07:53:53 AM
Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 06:24:27 AM
No, that is way too long of an overlap.  I think that I-97 would be the best proposal.

Ever noticed the overlap of I-80 and I-90 across much of Ohio (Turnpike) and Indiana (Toll Road)?

Yes.  That was established when those turnpikes were incorporated into the Interstate system 50 years ago, given that the Great Lakes pushed I-90 traffic down to I-80.  That doesn't justify what you are proposing.

The VA-207/US-301/MD-3 Interstate corridor deserves a number of its own, and extending I-97 is ideal.
I know this is more of a Fictional Highways thing, but what would you do with the leftover part that goes to Annapolis? MD 32 could continue along the "old" I-97, unless it is incorporated into an Interstate corridor that extends all the way to I-70.

Md. 32 has two segments that are clearly not up to Interstate standards. 

First, the segment between I-70 is far from Interstate-standard.  Some parts are almost Super-2 design (and I believe this section of 32 has the highest AADT of any two-lane highway in the state at almost 28,000), other parts are just rural arterial.  And the diamond interchange at I-70 won't do if Md. 32 is upgraded to a freeway.

Second, there westbound side of the highway has some very sharp curves as it passes by the main National Security Agency complex at Fort George G. Meade.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

agentsteel53

Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 27, 2012, 02:53:21 PM
Some parts are almost Super-2 design (and I believe this section of 32 has the highest AADT of any two-lane highway in the state at almost 28,000), other parts are just rural arteria

define "almost".  what differentiates it from the traditional super-2 design (two lane undivided, with no at-grade crossings)
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cpzilliacus

Quote from: agentsteel53 on August 27, 2012, 03:06:20 PM
Quote from: cpzilliacus on August 27, 2012, 02:53:21 PM
Some parts are almost Super-2 design (and I believe this section of 32 has the highest AADT of any two-lane highway in the state at almost 28,000), other parts are just rural arteria

define "almost".  what differentiates it from the traditional super-2 design (two lane undivided, with no at-grade crossings)

Several at-grade crossings, including a set of driveways into a highway maintenance complex for both the State Highway Administration and Howard County.

There are several driveways leading to Md. 32 from properties along it near I-70 West Friendship, and there may be a few curves that are too sharp for a Super-2 between West Friendship and Dayton.

The worst at-grade crossing has been converted to a grade-separated interchange (at Burntwoods Road and Pfefferkorn Road (GSV here)), and even though Md. 32 was made a divided highway at this point, it's still only one lane each way.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

Beltway

Quote from: Henry on August 27, 2012, 02:25:43 PM
Quote from: Beltway on August 27, 2012, 10:14:58 AM
The VA-207/US-301/MD-3 Interstate corridor deserves a number of its own, and extending I-97 is ideal.
I know this is more of a Fictional Highways thing, but what would you do with the leftover part that goes to Annapolis? MD 32 could continue along the "old" I-97, unless it is incorporated into an Interstate corridor that extends all the way to I-70.

I-97 could follow the corridors of MD-408 and MD-2 between US-301 at Upper Marlboro and where I-97 currently terminates at US-50.

That would be a direct extension of the current route.
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