I'm not sure if a topic has been posted about this or not.
Apparently toll express lanes (which Tennessee is calling "Choice lanes") similar to those in California, Florida, Georgia, and other states (not sure where all) are coming to the Nashville metropolitan area along I-24.
I support this. Hopefully this will be used to fund six-laning I-24 between Murfreesboro and Chattanooga, which should have been done in the 1980's or 1990's. This route gets heavily congested due to Nashville's rapid population growth (it has roughly quadrupled during my lifetime, from approximately 500,000 in the early 1980's to a little over 2.2 million now) which has been most explosive in Rutherford county and traffic between Florida and Atlanta in the south and Chicago in the north.
I have some choice words to say about the term "choice lanes".
Just Googled "Tennessee choice lanes", and found this article:
https://www.wsmv.com/2023/12/18/where-are-choice-lanes-proposed-tennessee/
TDOT is also planning choice lanes for I-65 from Nashville to Spring Hill, I-24 in Chattanooga and I-40/I-75 in Knoxville. None are planned for Memphis at this point.
Ugh. "Choice lanes" is so Orwellian.
Quote from: Henry on December 23, 2023, 12:03:04 AM
TDOT is also planning choice lanes for I-65 from Nashville to Spring Hill
I'm guessing that would involve widening it between I-840 and TN 396.
More info here: https://www.tn.gov/tdot/news/2023/12/18/tennessee-unveils-state-s-first-ever-10-year-fiscally-constrained-transportation-project-plan.html
TDOT will be recommending to the General Assembly and the Transportation Modernization Board that the first Choice Lanes project in Tennessee be on I-24 between Nashville and Murfreesboro. Other potential future locations include I-65 between Nashville and Spring Hill, Moccasin Bend in Chattanooga, and I-40 from the I-40/I-75 junction to State Route 158 west of downtown Knoxville.
Moccasin Bend is I-24 along the Tennessee River?
Quote from: Chris on December 23, 2023, 05:26:20 AM
Moccasin Bend is I-24 along the Tennessee River?
Moccasin Bend is where the Tennessee River makes a U-turn west of downtown Chattanooga.
C.f. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moccasin_Bend_Mental_Health_Institute
I could see the I-24 corridor between Murfreesboro and Nashville as a prime candidate for this. I am a bit disappointed that the I-24 corridor in Chattanooga west of US 27 is being considered for this instead of traditional widening.
Their claim that toll lanes will reduce congestion in general purpose lanes is one of the most disingenuous policy statements I've ever seen.
Also, why 10 years? State and federal funding sources are not predictable that far out and they'll just be updating it again as MPOs go through their TIP update processes anyway. In NY, that occurs every three years, but even at four or five, you're looking at updating more than half of your program that frequently if you stick to a 10-year program ("fiscally-constrained" does not necessarily mean by year, so later years can be loaded up with projects that will get smoothed out later as inflation and other overruns set in).
Well, at least they got a good press release out of it.
Quote from: Chris on December 23, 2023, 05:26:20 AM
More info here: https://www.tn.gov/tdot/news/2023/12/18/tennessee-unveils-state-s-first-ever-10-year-fiscally-constrained-transportation-project-plan.html
TDOT will be recommending to the General Assembly and the Transportation Modernization Board that the first Choice Lanes project in Tennessee be on I-24 between Nashville and Murfreesboro. Other potential future locations include I-65 between Nashville and Spring Hill, Moccasin Bend in Chattanooga, and I-40 from the I-40/I-75 junction to State Route 158 west of downtown Knoxville.
Moccasin Bend is I-24 along the Tennessee River?
In my opinion, I-24 in SE Nashville is the perfect place for initiating the program, especially with the new SMART corridor that went online (if it decides to work properly). :crazy: The biggest concern I have is how they plan on addressing the bottlenecks and merge points at I-40/440.
Quote from: Rothman on December 23, 2023, 09:29:09 AM
Their claim that toll lanes will reduce congestion in general purpose lanes is one of the most disingenuous policy statements I've ever seen.
Also, why 10 years? State and federal funding sources are not predictable that far out and they'll just be updating it again as MPOs go through their TIP update processes anyway. In NY, that occurs every three years, but even at four or five, you're looking at updating more than half of your program that frequently if you stick to a 10-year program ("fiscally-constrained" does not necessarily mean by year, so later years can be loaded up with projects that will get smoothed out later as inflation and other overruns set in).
Well, at least they got a good press release out of it.
If done correctly, they seem to actually provide a benefit. Unfortunately, to your point, 99% of the time they're NOT done correctly, with too many entrance/exit points, minimal separation, unreasonably low speed limits (causing illegal right-side passing or long lines behind a single car), dynamic pricing done wrong, lanes ending pre-maturely causing a bottleneck at the merge point, etc.... IMO, many of these issues seem to be caused by "long-term plans" that are a bit too ambitious, running into the cost barriers, especially as local goals by MPOs & funding sources change over time. I'm just going to hope TN doesn't make these same mistakes seen elsewhere...
I hope TDOT will make their choice lanes at least two lanes in each direction instead of just slapping tolls on existing HOV lanes.
Quote from: codyg1985 on December 25, 2023, 02:42:38 PM
I hope TDOT will make their choice lanes at least two lanes in each direction instead of just slapping tolls on existing HOV lanes.
This is another issue with HO/T or express lanes too... the single lane methodology. I imagine, just like other DOTs have, Tennessee will simply convert the existing lane without physical expansion.
VDOT is doing a similar thing in the Hampton Roads region, in fact also building
new HO/T lane projects with only one lane in each direction. The speed limit will be 65 mph, but traffic will want to move 70-75 mph, and someone going either right at 65 mph or even under will cause tailgating and braking... as the general purpose lanes posted at only 60 mph fly by at 70+ mph.
I hate it when DOT's use existing HOV lanes and convert them to toll lanes! GDOT did that on IH 85 in Atlanta where the rates exceed 20+ dollars during peak hours instead of building 2 lane/elevated sections like what has been done in Florida/California and Texas. They do it the right way, IMO instead of just doing temporary BS fixes which are like a band aid on a Bullet wound
Quote from: sprjus4 on December 25, 2023, 03:05:49 PM
Quote from: codyg1985 on December 25, 2023, 02:42:38 PM
I hope TDOT will make their choice lanes at least two lanes in each direction instead of just slapping tolls on existing HOV lanes.
This is another issue with HO/T or express lanes too... the single lane methodology. I imagine, just like other DOTs have, Tennessee will simply convert the existing lane without physical expansion.
VDOT is doing a similar thing in the Hampton Roads region, in fact also building new HO/T lane projects with only one lane in each direction. The speed limit will be 65 mph, but traffic will want to move 70-75 mph, and someone going either right at 65 mph or even under will cause tailgating and braking... as the general purpose lanes posted at only 60 mph fly by at 70+ mph.
Meanwhile in Florida:
Puts single-lane ETLs at 55 MPH because reasonsDrivers aren't having any of it, even caught on GSV https://www.google.com/maps/@25.97472,-80.1660217,3a,17.7y,177.56h,87.61t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1srKmiF6Dzxu4mrZy-0w_2Ig!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu
Then there's the Atlanta Toller-coaster with 65 in GP and 55 in Express :crazy: At least it has two lanes instead of just one...
Maybe the limit was set based on peak-hour speeds? If so, one could argue this makes the case for variable and/or lane-specific speed limits, something I-24 actually has (when it works...) :biggrin:
Quote from: Tomahawkin on December 25, 2023, 04:59:08 PM
I hate it when DOT's use existing HOV lanes and convert them to toll lanes! GDOT did that on IH 85 in Atlanta where the rates exceed 20+ dollars during peak hours instead of building 2 lane/elevated sections like what has been done in Florida/California and Texas. They do it the right way, IMO instead of just doing temporary BS fixes which are like a band aid on a Bullet wound
Temporary fixes can be useful, especially if something larger is on the books. However, as is mentioned in its name, they MUST be temporary. Simple conversions from HOV to HOT/ETL probably work best to give the DOT experience operating lanes on one or two corridors when they're first constructed, like I-85 (GA's first HOT/ETL system). However, once that time has passed, they must be improved. IMHO I-85's lanes should have been converted to at least 2-2 elevated / barrier separated instead of having the corridor extended... this likely would have been a lot more efficient on a traffic standpoint.
Also, to your point, maybe the high tolls now fund future projects that could result in lower tolls? Still, it looks like the time has passed for their effectiveness as a simple conversion on I-85. :-(
Quote from: Rothman on December 23, 2023, 09:29:09 AM
Their claim that toll lanes will reduce congestion in general purpose lanes is one of the most disingenuous policy statements I've ever seen.
Also, why 10 years? State and federal funding sources are not predictable that far out and they'll just be updating it again as MPOs go through their TIP update processes anyway. In NY, that occurs every three years, but even at four or five, you're looking at updating more than half of your program that frequently if you stick to a 10-year program ("fiscally-constrained" does not necessarily mean by year, so later years can be loaded up with projects that will get smoothed out later as inflation and other overruns set in).
Well, at least they got a good press release out of it.
I can't tell you how many times I've been stopped in traffic on I-70 in the mountains.. Stopped, or putting at 10 mph, while the wide-open "Express Lane" collects dust.
Here, they try to sucker you into the lanes. They'll happily gate you in, and charge a toll, when the lane ends a mile down the road.
Now, my company pays my tolls, so I use them when I need/want to. But no way I'm paying. that.
As with all road signage, a common term is necessary for motorist safety and information. If it is a HOT lane or simply a toll express lane, label it as such. No ordinary person can remember that a "Tennessee Choice Lane" is the same as an "Alabama Happiness Lane" as a "Wisconsin Freedom Lane" as a "Colorado Truth Justice and the American Way Lane", etc.
Quote from: SP Cook on December 26, 2023, 02:15:19 PM
As with all road signage, a common term is necessary for motorist safety and information. If it is a HOT lane or simply a toll express lane, label it as such. No ordinary person can remember that a "Tennessee Choice Lane" is the same as an "Alabama Happiness Lane" as a "Wisconsin Freedom Lane" as a "Colorado Truth Justice and the American Way Lane", etc.
Counterpoint: All the various names EZ-Pass/I-Pass/RiverLink/etc have, as well as other interoperable tolling systems like TxTag/K-Tag/PikePass and the various Florida SunPass variants. Same/similar technologies, even in the interoperable territories, but individual branding, either by state or even various toll agencies within a state
For the record, I agree that uniformity in traffic control and devices is useful and should be required
It's like how in Michigan, bridge tolls are called "fares". :pan
I guess I'm down with HOT lanes for Nashville if it means there will actually be enforcement of the "high occupancy" part of that acronym. Seen lots of non-compliance in Nashville area HOV lanes during my time there over the years.
Quote from: ilpt4u on December 27, 2023, 12:21:02 PM
Quote from: SP Cook on December 26, 2023, 02:15:19 PM
As with all road signage, a common term is necessary for motorist safety and information. If it is a HOT lane or simply a toll express lane, label it as such. No ordinary person can remember that a "Tennessee Choice Lane" is the same as an "Alabama Happiness Lane" as a "Wisconsin Freedom Lane" as a "Colorado Truth Justice and the American Way Lane", etc.
Counterpoint: All the various names EZ-Pass/I-Pass/RiverLink/etc have, as well as other interoperable tolling systems like TxTag/K-Tag/PikePass and the various Florida SunPass variants. Same/similar technologies, even in the interoperable territories, but individual branding, either by state or even various toll agencies within a state
For the record, I agree that uniformity in traffic control and devices is useful and should be required
Well, two things.
IMHO, we missed the boat on transponder tolls. They should have easily established a single international (include Canada, Mexico would be more difficult) transponder system, given it one name and one symbol, and the trucking industry would have covered the administration costs.
Having a toll transponder is somewhat more than a standard motorist. You made an effort to get one. It is easy to look up if a River Pass is accepted at EZ Pass in North Carolina.
But, there should be one toll transponder system, and one symbol.
My choice is made. Same as my choice in North Texas.
i just wished they use the choice lanes along I-40 from exit 20 to exit 201. that would free up a lot in the rural counties for other funding. yea it'll be more expensive, and more difficult to get the capital raised, but the amount of truck traffic on that road would at least give motorists a area where they can feel safe. just complete dogcrap that they are starting with the middle Tennessee corridors first, while i can understand, i don't like it one bit. at the very least if they are gonna do ANY section of I-40, it should be the portion in tennessee between memphis and nashville, not all the way out into knoxville on the other side of the state. :rolleyes:
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
Quote from: SP Cook on December 26, 2023, 02:15:19 PM
As with all road signage, a common term is necessary for motorist safety and information. If it is a HOT lane or simply a toll express lane, label it as such. No ordinary person can remember that a "Tennessee Choice Lane" is the same as an "Alabama Happiness Lane" as a "Wisconsin Freedom Lane" as a "Colorado Truth Justice and the American Way Lane", etc.
There's an MUTCD standard for the signage, which is "express lane(s)". All the newly built HOT lanes I've seen comply with the usage of "express lane(s)" on signage even if they are marketed/publicized under a different name.
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 25, 2024, 12:35:32 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
They haven't... the urban toll lanes will only be single lane and make use of the existing HOV, I believe.
I could imagine two toll lanes could theoretically be needed in Nashville and possibly Memphis, but other cities such as Chattanooga and Knoxville likely wouldn't need two toll lanes.
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 25, 2024, 12:35:32 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
The bigger issue is that HOV/HOT lanes aren't a great fit for rural areas in general. Those areas are busiest on weekends and during summer travel season, when relatively few people on the road are traveling by themselves, and aren't reliably congested enough to be worth paying a toll to use.
This is a horrible idea, and I was not for this at all. The climate changed slightly at the capitol once certain folks were ousted for raising the gasoline taxes. This was a compromise to not raise the taxes, and a horrible one at that. It will be pretty neat when someone uses the lanes, travels the speed limit and someone behind them gets raged out.
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 25, 2024, 08:24:49 AM
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 25, 2024, 12:35:32 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
They haven't... the urban toll lanes will only be single lane and make use of the existing HOV, I believe.
i refuse to understand tennessees government.
for one, this should've been done once other states did it with the concrete barriers. theres a critical need for widening I-40 from memphis to nashville to at least 3x3 configuration, but the only way anyone is gonna see the light of day on that is if theres suddenly a bad enough wreck on the interstate that shuts the interstate down in both directions.
and the amount of truck traffic that goes on that interstate it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if that ends up happening and TDOT suddenly decides its best to widen the entire roadway to 3x3 or even have HOT lanes for a 2x2x2x2 configuration, assuming TDOT officials are given a "blank check" for getting the corridor safer.
Quote from: webny99 on January 26, 2024, 10:39:34 AM
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 25, 2024, 12:35:32 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
The bigger issue is that HOV/HOT lanes aren't a great fit for rural areas in general. Those areas are busiest on weekends and during summer travel season, when relatively few people on the road are traveling by themselves, and aren't reliably congested enough to be worth paying a toll to use.
i disagree, for 1: there is more than enough truck traffic to offset the lack of passenger traffic on the roadway. and 2: the passenger traffic that does go on the roadway, its mainly travel traffic from either out of state or moving within the state.
there should be at least a 4x4 configuration, with the 2 right lanes being truck lanes, and the 2 left lanes for general purpose.
Quote from: Avalanchez71 on January 27, 2024, 06:54:45 PM
This is a horrible idea, and I was not for this at all. The climate changed slightly at the capitol once certain folks were ousted for raising the gasoline taxes. This was a compromise to not raise the taxes, and a horrible one at that. It will be pretty neat when someone uses the lanes, travels the speed limit and someone behind them gets raged out.
to be fair, i was one of the people on board with raising the gas taxes. we need to get caught up and west tennessee was getting neglected bad thanks to nashvegas and its substantial growth over the prior 10 years.
if it meant that west tennessee projects got the green light for expansion or completion, which btw it did, i was completely on board with it.
the problem is, is the majority of the population didn't think so. for some reason they thought it was completely possible to build a interstate road or expand a freeway or highway for far under what it was gonna be priced at and the tennessee legislature was being greedy.
even tho, the state was honest with the gas tax raises, made a entirely new website for it, including a literal project page tracker, and even made compromises for truckers, and urbanists, it still wasn't enough to sway the population.
choice lanes were the compromise, which btw, will most likely never get off the ground because the same people who proposed and passed the laws are gonna be ousted again. :rolleyes: :banghead:
its like the people expect the state to force construction companies to pay well below market rate for projects.
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 28, 2024, 02:14:48 PM
Quote from: webny99 on January 26, 2024, 10:39:34 AM
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 25, 2024, 12:35:32 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
The bigger issue is that HOV/HOT lanes aren't a great fit for rural areas in general. Those areas are busiest on weekends and during summer travel season, when relatively few people on the road are traveling by themselves, and aren't reliably congested enough to be worth paying a toll to use.
i disagree, for 1: there is more than enough truck traffic to offset the lack of passenger traffic on the roadway. and 2: the passenger traffic that does go on the roadway, its mainly travel traffic from either out of state or moving within the state.
there should be at least a 4x4 configuration, with the 2 right lanes being truck lanes, and the 2 left lanes for general purpose.
Yeah, my point is that most of those traveling from out of state or long distance within the state, are not traveling alone so they couldn't use the HOT lane. I would support a widening, but 2 general purpose + 1 HOV/HOT is barely an upgrade as it does not allow two cars to pass at once in sync. Just a regular widening to 6-lanes would be sufficient, as it is almost anywhere else in the country (aside from the NJTP which is in its own class).
Quote from: webny99 on January 29, 2024, 12:46:34 PM
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 28, 2024, 02:14:48 PM
Quote from: webny99 on January 26, 2024, 10:39:34 AM
Quote from: civilengineeringnerd on January 25, 2024, 12:35:32 AM
Quote from: sprjus4 on January 01, 2024, 12:24:51 AM
One guy going 65 mph in a rural 70 mph zone, a single toll lane, with no room to pass for 15-20 miles. Many cars stacking up behind. Great idea!
to be fair, i can only hope tennessee watched other states learn harsh lessons and have the choice lanes be mandated to have 2 lanes minimum each way, or at least have people pulled over for going less than the speed limit.
The bigger issue is that HOV/HOT lanes aren't a great fit for rural areas in general. Those areas are busiest on weekends and during summer travel season, when relatively few people on the road are traveling by themselves, and aren't reliably congested enough to be worth paying a toll to use.
i disagree, for 1: there is more than enough truck traffic to offset the lack of passenger traffic on the roadway. and 2: the passenger traffic that does go on the roadway, its mainly travel traffic from either out of state or moving within the state.
there should be at least a 4x4 configuration, with the 2 right lanes being truck lanes, and the 2 left lanes for general purpose.
Yeah, my point is that most of those traveling from out of state or long distance within the state, are not traveling alone so they couldn't use the HOT lane. I would support a widening, but 2 general purpose + 1 HOV/HOT is barely an upgrade as it does not allow two cars to pass at once in sync. Just a regular widening to 6-lanes would be sufficient, as it is almost anywhere else in the country (aside from the NJTP which is in its own class).
if not that, then do like what oklahoma does, and toll the entire length of I-40 from memphis to the Tennessee/NC state line.
people would get ousted, but the roads would get done.
Given that Tennessee that hasn't had any toll roads, these "choice" lanes are likely to be a hard sell, just like in other historically non-toll states. I still think they should be built, and in time, the public may come to accept them. That has happened when toll lanes have been introduced elsewhere.
Quote from: The Ghostbuster on March 01, 2024, 12:42:40 PM
Given that Tennessee that hasn't had any toll roads, these "choice" lanes are likely to be a hard sell, just like in other historically non-toll states. I still think they should be built, and in time, the public may come to accept them. That has happened when toll lanes have been introduced elsewhere.
in the past, it wasn't near as polarized politically as it is today. calling toll roads/toll lanes a "hard sell" is downplaying the situation a bit. yea in florida you have toll lanes and in texas you have toll roads and toll lanes, both are right leaning, but with the current political structure of the GOP today, and given that tennessee is pretty hard to the more traditional GOP as apposed to the current GOP, it is more likely you won't find toll lanes here anytime soon, let alone a toll road. people around here will just clog up U.S. 70 and U.S. 412 to get to places or through the state. however there is some hope for toll lanes/toll roads in the state. people in my state are changing minds, its a slow progress, but they are waking up to the harsh reality that we need actual solutions, and they come from toll roads and toll lanes.
CONFIRMED: I-24 Nashville Choice Lanes to be 2-lanes in each direction. :D :biggrin: :clap: :love:
More from today's meeting. Skip to 28:41 or https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=C0mnVm-4vHY&t=1721s
^ So the existing lanes will remain free for all. I wonder if that means the existing part time HOV lanes will become permanent general purpose lanes, with HOV-3 permitted to use the Choice Lanes for free. That's sort of what happened in Charlotte where the I-77 HOV lanes were eliminated, but were converted to HOT along with an additional lane added. I-24 has a far left HOV lane through most of this corridor from about mm 57 to about mm 80.
Quote from: wriddle082 on March 21, 2024, 09:19:10 PM
^ So the existing lanes will remain free for all. I wonder if that means the existing part time HOV lanes will become permanent general purpose lanes, with HOV-3 permitted to use the Choice Lanes for free. That's sort of what happened in Charlotte where the I-77 HOV lanes were eliminated, but were converted to HOT along with an additional lane added. I-24 has a far left HOV lane through most of this corridor from about mm 57 to about mm 80.
IMHO, if they do end up being HOT lanes, I really do hope that E-ZPass will be accepted as the primary transponder. Having the Flex option would really make travel more convenient for not only these lanes, but also for the other HOT lanes using E-ZPass Flex.
On a similar note, the meeting mentioned priority-use of the SMART corridor during construction, so I have a feeling they could be using that as a test case for future installments. Overhead and dynamic signage could be key to ensuring proper lane use during construction and during operations, not to mention the flexibility. Not working as an express lane or major incident? *Click* It's now open to all. Too crowded as an express lane & can't raise tolls any more? *Click* It's now HOV 2+ Only. Most express lanes I've seen are also equipped to do something similar, but not to this scale.
I like the look of this... keep the existing 8 general purpose lanes and add 2 HO/T or toll lanes each way, creating a total of 6 lanes in each direction.
Far better than the tacky, cheap single express lane solution some areas have done where you take a gamble to get stuck behind a slow driver to several miles with no passing ability.
Also like that they're not taking away an existing HOV lane either - one that could be converted to general purpose and actually promote better traffic flow.
Back here in Hampton Roads / Chesapeake / Va Beach, they recently converted a segment that was 8 lanes (4 each way, the left lane being HOV restricted either during 7-9am or 4-6pm depending on direction) to essentially 6 general purpose lanes and a full time HO/T lane. Rush hour traffic in the general purpose lanes has seemingly gotten heavier, especially in the direction that the HOV lane was open to all traffic previously - now the HO/T gets minimal usage in what my opinion is a failed / flawed project in a desperate attempt to create this unnecessary HO/T / express lane network by cheaply adding a single, no passing allowed (where people seem to be unable to ever maintain the 65 mph speed limit) toll lane. The conversion has actually worsened traffic, on a segment of interstate that virtually had none before. So props to Tennessee for wanting to construct new lanes for the toll lanes and not convert existing free HOV lanes that are most of the time not occupancy restricted.
^ At least along the Smyrna to Murfreesboro portion of the corridor, from just past TN 266 to just past I-840, they have lots of median room to build four more lanes. It will be trickier the closer you get to Nashville, the trickier it gets, but it's not going to be impossible. The trickiest area will probably be ending the lanes at I-440 or Briley Pkwy.
Quote from: wriddle082 on March 22, 2024, 03:30:24 AM
^ At least along the Smyrna to Murfreesboro portion of the corridor, from just past TN 266 to just past I-840, they have lots of median room to build four more lanes. It will be trickier the closer you get to Nashville, the trickier it gets, but it's not going to be impossible. The trickiest area will probably be ending the lanes at I-440 or Briley Pkwy.
I'm curious if portions of the corridor could be elevated, like the 110 express in LA. Below grade like I-635 Dallas? I'm slightly biased against going in
that direction, given what happened in 2010 in Nashville... :-o :crazy:
Great news the lanes will be two each way.
Quote from: ElishaGOtis on March 22, 2024, 10:13:30 AM
Quote from: wriddle082 on March 22, 2024, 03:30:24 AM
^ At least along the Smyrna to Murfreesboro portion of the corridor, from just past TN 266 to just past I-840, they have lots of median room to build four more lanes. It will be trickier the closer you get to Nashville, the trickier it gets, but it's not going to be impossible. The trickiest area will probably be ending the lanes at I-440 or Briley Pkwy.
I'm curious if portions of the corridor could be elevated, like the 110 express in LA. Below grade like I-635 Dallas? I'm slightly biased against going in that direction, given what happened in 2010 in Nashville... :-o :crazy:
On the other hand, below-grade choice lanes may potentially give somewhere for the floodwater to go rather than ponding on the I-24's mainline, so...
My guess would be, if they aren't at-grade with the rest of I-24, they'll be put above-grade like the express lanes on I-75 around Atlanta.
Quote from: freebrickproductions on March 23, 2024, 03:12:12 AMQuote from: ElishaGOtis on March 22, 2024, 10:13:30 AMQuote from: wriddle082 on March 22, 2024, 03:30:24 AM^ At least along the Smyrna to Murfreesboro portion of the corridor, from just past TN 266 to just past I-840, they have lots of median room to build four more lanes. It will be trickier the closer you get to Nashville, the trickier it gets, but it's not going to be impossible. The trickiest area will probably be ending the lanes at I-440 or Briley Pkwy.
I'm curious if portions of the corridor could be elevated, like the 110 express in LA. Below grade like I-635 Dallas? I'm slightly biased against going in that direction, given what happened in 2010 in Nashville... :-o :crazy:
On the other hand, below-grade choice lanes may potentially give somewhere for the floodwater to go rather than ponding on the I-24's mainline, so...
My guess would be, if they aren't at-grade with the rest of I-24, they'll be put above-grade like the express lanes on I-75 around Atlanta.
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