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I-10 East of Houston, Why So Crowded?

Started by bluecountry, October 08, 2020, 12:04:32 PM

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bluecountry

And I'm not talking just immediate metro Houston, I'm talking well into eastern Texas.  I expected this would be like I-95 south of Richmond; easy cruise control, but its pretty steady, why?


sprjus4

#1
Port Arthur / Beaumont / Lake Charles traffic, in addition to long distance through traffic.

Going to your Virginia comparison, I-64 east of Richmond is a very busy corridor.

ski-man

If it was this way today or yesterday, could be folks evacuating from the incoming hurricane.

TXtoNJ

It's the only major east-west route for 200 miles in the heart of a significant petroleum producing region. Not only do you have traffic from South, Central, and Southeast Texas going to-and-from Louisiana and points east, you've also got all the oilfield services traffic going between the coast, the refineries, and pipeline terminals. It's very much a strategic chokepoint.

Bobby5280

I-10 is crowded East of Houston to the Louisiana border because it just isn't wide enough. The Houston metro area has over 6 million people. I-10 is one of the nation's most important cross-country highways.

East of downtown out to Beltway 8 the configuration of I-10 is mostly 4 lanes in both directions. It only widens to 5 or 6 lanes for lane drops onto other major routes, such as I-610. Just to the East of Beltway 8 and Sheldon Rd I-10 drops to 3 lanes in both directions. If you look at the Google Earth imagery (dated 12/1/2019) it's easy to see how that lane drop from a 4-4 to 3-3 configuration causes a traffic bottle-neck.

I-10 drops to 2 lanes in each direction just East of Winnie. There are spotty pieces of construction between there and Beaumont. I-10 goes back up to 3-3 in Beaumont. Some of that was widened from 2-2 to 3-3 around 10 years ago. There is on-going construction on I-10 at Orange, TX right up to the LA border.

I think I-10 needs to be at least a 5-5 or 6-6 configuration inside the Houston beltways. I-10 probably needs to go from a 3-3 to 4-4 configuration to Winnie. Louisiana has even bigger problems with I-10. Those really long bridges over the Atchafalaya River/Swamp and the Maurepas Swamp are really old and the 2-2 configuration is really not adequate.

sprjus4

^

I-10 only carries around 50,000 - 55,000 AADT east of SH-99 to Winnie. Perhaps in the future, 8 lane widening will be necessarily, but it's generally adequate with 6 lanes.

Between SH-99 and Beltway 8, 8 lane widening is needed, carrying 70,000 AADT near SH-99 and up to nearly 130,000 AADT near Beltway 8.

Between Beaumont and the Louisiana border, I-10 carries over 60,000 AADT, peaking to nearly 80,000 AADT at the border. That section has mostly been widened to 6 lanes. Louisiana needs to finish the 10 mile gap between the Texas state line and the 6 lane segment near Vinton.

STLmapboy

The same reason 35 between San Antonio and DFW is crowded; a continuous string of towns. Same story with 95 in the northeast, 95 in Florida, US-101 from LA to SF.
Teenage STL area roadgeek.
Missouri>>>>>Illinois

sprjus4

Quote from: STLmapboy on October 10, 2020, 12:57:27 PM
The same reason 35 between San Antonio and DFW is crowded; a continuous string of towns. Same story with 95 in the northeast, 95 in Florida, US-101 from LA to SF.
While some of the medium-sized cities on I-35 (not small towns) do contribute to a percentage of the traffic, a good majority of that traffic is either long-distance truck traffic or traffic traveling between San Antonio, Austin, and Dallas-Fort Worth. Same goes for I-45 between Dallas and Houston, and I-10 between San Antonio and Houston to a lesser extent.

Tomahawkin

IMO, IH 10 should have been made to be 8 lanes minimum from Jacksonville to the westside of Houston after Katrina hit in 2005 because it's such a crucial economic route/Vacation/Spring Break and evacuation route, why that wasn't acted on as a big infrastructure project after 2005 is beyond me! I say the same for IH 75 and 85 in Florida. The southern part of Florida could be next in upcoming years with catastrophic hurricanes. 

sprjus4

^

I-10 doesn't need any more than 6 lanes in most areas and all of I-10 east of Mobile is adequate with 4 lanes. Carries around 30,000 AADT between east of Mobile and Pensacola, with only about 22,000 AADT between Pensacola and outside of Jacksonville.

bluecountry

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 08, 2020, 01:47:55 PM
Port Arthur / Beaumont / Lake Charles traffic, in addition to long distance through traffic.

Going to your Virginia comparison, I-64 east of Richmond is a very busy corridor.
Yea but that's because of beach and tourist traffic, I-64 W of Richmond is dead.

Quote from: STLmapboy on October 10, 2020, 12:57:27 PM
The same reason 35 between San Antonio and DFW is crowded; a continuous string of towns. Same story with 95 in the northeast, 95 in Florida, US-101 from LA to SF.
But those are major cities, east of Houston it's rural.  I expected it to be like I-95 south of Richmond.

bwana39

Quote from: bluecountry on October 11, 2020, 07:02:53 PM
Quote from: sprjus4 on October 08, 2020, 01:47:55 PM
Port Arthur / Beaumont / Lake Charles traffic, in addition to long distance through traffic.

Going to your Virginia comparison, I-64 east of Richmond is a very busy corridor.
Yea but that's because of beach and tourist traffic, I-64 W of Richmond is dead.

Quote from: STLmapboy on October 10, 2020, 12:57:27 PM
The same reason 35 between San Antonio and DFW is crowded; a continuous string of towns. Same story with 95 in the northeast, 95 in Florida, US-101 from LA to SF.
But those are major cities, east of Houston it's rural.  I expected it to be like I-95 south of Richmond.

I-10, I-20, and I-30 are pretty congested everywhere east of I-45 (maybe even I-35)

I-35 is congested everywhere.

Why? All three of them have to do with imports from Mexico and to a lesser degree the west coast.

The difference between the Richmond location on I-95 and I-35 are several. First the exports fan out predominately from west to east in the US. The west coast traffic would either be on I-40 or I-81 (among others). There is a greater interstate highway density east of the Mississippi river. Interstate 95 is a regional route whereas I-35 and the east west routes are heavy with national traffic.

The CITIES may make it worse, but even the materials that are processed in them is traffic making a short stop in a fairly linear path from Mexico or the west coast to wherever.
Let's build what we need as economically as possible.

sprjus4

Quote from: bluecountry on October 11, 2020, 07:02:53 PM
I-64 W of Richmond is dead.
Hardly "dead". It can get quite full, though usually moves 75 - 80 mph. It carries over 40,000 AADT between I-81 and Richmond, the same volume as I-81. The difference between I-64 and I-81 though is truck percentages. If I-64 carried the sheer amount of truck traffic that I-81 did in that section, 6 lane widening would be as necessary as it is along I-81.

I-64 west of I-81 is dead, carrying under 10,000 AADT for the most part. Most long distance traffic from Hampton Roads, Richmond, and Charlottesville default onto I-81 South heading west towards I-40 West in Tennessee.

The Ghostbuster

Would it be possible to upgrade US 90 to freeway standards from Houston to Beaumont as a way of relieving congestion on Interstate 10, as well as providing an alternative route? Or wouldn't it make much difference?

sprjus4

^

Perhaps start with 4 lane widening with a median sufficient for a future mainline, plus town bypasses.

I think all priority though is still on widening I-10.

bwana39

Quote from: The Ghostbuster on October 12, 2020, 07:12:25 PM
Would it be possible to upgrade US 90 to freeway standards from Houston to Beaumont as a way of relieving congestion on Interstate 10, as well as providing an alternative route? Or wouldn't it make much difference?

About 1/4 of it is already done. From I-10 just east of I-610 to near Crosby.  It is doable, but it still leaves the aggregate traffic volume in Beaumont. It will likely be built slowly but surely, but widening I-10 is a more immediate project.
Let's build what we need as economically as possible.

Plutonic Panda

Quote from: Tomahawkin on October 10, 2020, 10:10:02 PM
IMO, IH 10 should have been made to be 8 lanes minimum from Jacksonville to the westside of Houston after Katrina hit in 2005 because it's such a crucial economic route/Vacation/Spring Break and evacuation route, why that wasn't acted on as a big infrastructure project after 2005 is beyond me! I say the same for IH 75 and 85 in Florida. The southern part of Florida could be next in upcoming years with catastrophic hurricanes.
Agreed. And even with the traffic counts, it seems like traffic is always pretty packed and the would road would be more pleasant to drive at 8 lanes. Not all roads in DFW warrant six lanes but many are which vastly improves quality of life and their roads are beautiful.

Tomahawkin

Perfectly put and 8 lanes total makes a last minute evacuation due to a hurricane a hell of a lot more bearable. IMO

bluecountry

SO what's the I-10 traffic, freight/NAFTA imports/exports as opposed to Megalopolis/tourists on I-95/I-64 N and E or Richmond.

bwana39

Quote from: bluecountry on October 14, 2020, 03:36:10 PM
SO what's the I-10 traffic, freight/NAFTA imports/exports as opposed to Megalopolis/tourists on I-95/I-64 N and E or Richmond.

Well the Northeast from DC to Boston is pretty congested. The east has a larger concentration of freeways than west of the Mississippi.  Traffic can fan out.
Houston and San Antonio are both on I-10. Austin and even DFW feed from them. Tourists? Louisiana is a tourist Mecca.  I might add. Texans average 35K miles on their personal cars. We drive. 

As to comparing I-10 east of Houston to Richmond, you might choose I-40 west of Memphis to compare.  Houston is the 4th or 5th largest metro area in the US. Memphs and Richmond fall in the forties.
Let's build what we need as economically as possible.

Bobby5280

Not only does the DC to Boston corridor have numerous freeway and toll road options (parallel freeways and toll roads linking the same cities in some cases), but there is also far more in the way of regional commuter rail. That also spreads out the burden. I remember all the talk in the 1990's about a "Texas TGV" high speed rail system linking the Texas Triangle cities. As best as I can tell that effort has gone nowhere.

For the time being there is not much in the way of relief routes or relatively low cost forms of alternative transportation to link Houston, DFW, Austin-San Antonio.

Quote from: The GhostbusterWould it be possible to upgrade US 90 to freeway standards from Houston to Beaumont as a way of relieving congestion on Interstate 10, as well as providing an alternative route? Or wouldn't it make much difference?

I think there is a good case to be made for upgrading US-90 to Interstate standards from Houston to Beaumont as a means of giving the Northern reaches of Houston a faster outlet to Beaumont and points farther East. There is probably already a good amount of traffic using US-90 for that purpose. When you incorporate the Northern leg of the Grand Parkway the route can function as an effective gateway to Austin. The "Texas I-12" route I've mentioned in the past would incorporate US-90, The Grand Parkway and US-290.

KCRoadFan

Quote from: sprjus4 on October 10, 2020, 01:08:02 PM
Quote from: STLmapboy on October 10, 2020, 12:57:27 PM
The same reason 35 between San Antonio and DFW is crowded; a continuous string of towns. Same story with 95 in the northeast, 95 in Florida, US-101 from LA to SF.
While some of the medium-sized cities on I-35 (not small towns) do contribute to a percentage of the traffic, a good majority of that traffic is either long-distance truck traffic or traffic traveling between San Antonio, Austin, and Dallas-Fort Worth. Same goes for I-45 between Dallas and Houston, and I-10 between San Antonio and Houston to a lesser extent.

Not to mention people heading to New Braunfels to cool off at Schlitterbahn every summer.

sprjus4

Quote from: Bobby5280 on October 15, 2020, 11:47:29 PM
Not only does the DC to Boston corridor have numerous freeway and toll road options (parallel freeways and toll roads linking the same cities in some cases), but there is also far more in the way of regional commuter rail. That also spreads out the burden. I remember all the talk in the 1990's about a "Texas TGV" high speed rail system linking the Texas Triangle cities. As best as I can tell that effort has gone nowhere.

For the time being there is not much in the way of relief routes or relatively low cost forms of alternative transportation to link Houston, DFW, Austin-San Antonio.
Construction on a 90-minute high speed rail line between Houston and Dallas is scheduled to begin next year.

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/09/21/dallas-houston-high-speed-train/
https://www.texascentral.com/

Bobby5280

After the pathetic debacle to link Los Angeles and the SF Bay Area with high speed rail I'm going to go with the attitude of "I'll believe it when I see it" in regards to a DFW-Houston high speed rail line. IIRC the LA-SF high speed rail line is now just going to be a Bakersfield to Fresno thing. And even that segment is still going to cost tens of billions of dollars.

sprjus4

^

Major difference between the two. The Houston - Dallas one is being completed by a private company, the LA - SF one is public and being complete by the state.

Not to mention, the Houston - Dallas line doesn't have the geographic issues that LA - SF does, and costs significantly less.



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