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Pennsylvania

Started by Alex, March 07, 2009, 07:01:05 PM

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ARMOURERERIC

I thought some parts of 78 east of 81 to 476 were upgraded


02 Park Ave

I say, in which direction from the Pittsburgh airport to the Turnpike are you concerned about the I-376?
C-o-H

Roadsguy

Is there also a project in the works to six-lane 80 all the way to the bridge for when it's replaced? Maybe even west to 380?
Mileage-based exit numbering implies the existence of mileage-cringe exit numbering.

froggie

QuoteAs for the I-80 project, here's the PennDOT District 5 home page. I'm sure you can find an e-mail link there.

I looked...no luck without going through a whole bunch of strings.

Gnutella

#154
Quote from: ARMOURERERIC on December 18, 2014, 10:20:59 AM
I thought some parts of 78 east of 81 to 476 were upgraded

I just examined I-78 via satellite images, and it appears that the first 10 miles east of I-81 have already been upgraded, as well as MM 30 to MM 35. This leaves MM 10 to MM 30 and MM 35 to MM 50 to be upgraded, so that's 35 miles of I-78 in need of upgrading, instead of 51 miles.

Quote from: 02 Park Ave on December 18, 2014, 10:55:18 AM
I say, in which direction from the Pittsburgh airport to the Turnpike are you concerned about the I-376?

Through the city of Pittsburgh. It's one of the worst examples of substandard Interstate in the United States. Honestly, I bet PennDOT is getting all the "easy" substandard Interstate upgrades (I-70, I-78, I-80, I-83) out of the way first before it tackles the two notorious segments in Pittsburgh and Philadelphia.

Quote from: Roadsguy on December 18, 2014, 12:24:52 PM
Is there also a project in the works to six-lane 80 all the way to the bridge for when it's replaced? Maybe even west to 380?

There was a study done in 2005 that recommended upgrading I-80 all the way from the New Jersey state line to I-380, and widening it to six lanes in the process. The segment in Stroudsburg that I linked to above is the first (and most difficult) step in the process. After it's done, the two remaining segments that will need upgrading are a 10-mile segment west to I-380, and a four-mile segment east to the New Jersey state line.

Also worth noting is that a segment of I-80 in western Pennsylvania (MM 90 to MM 97) is being reconstructed, though it already meets modern Interstate standards. Also, though they're not Interstates, PennDOT has hinted at reconstruction of U.S. 222 between Lancaster and Reading, and there's already upgrades for U.S. 422 in Reading on the drawing board. I also expect I-79 between the Pennsylvania Turnpike and I-80 to be reconstructed, though that probably won't happen until next decade.

hbelkins

Quote from: J N Winkler on October 10, 2014, 01:26:17 PM
Thought I'd mention that I-78 is getting new signs:  the construction plans are under ECMS 91957 and include almost 80 pattern-accurate sign panel detail and sign elevation sheets.

Clearview?


Government would be tolerable if not for politicians and bureaucrats.

rickmastfan67

Quote from: Gnutella on December 18, 2014, 03:43:17 PM
Quote from: 02 Park Ave on December 18, 2014, 10:55:18 AM
I say, in which direction from the Pittsburgh airport to the Turnpike are you concerned about the I-376?

Through the city of Pittsburgh. It's one of the worst examples of substandard Interstate in the United States. Honestly, I bet PennDOT is getting all the "easy" substandard Interstate upgrades (I-70, I-78, I-80, I-83) out of the way first before it tackles the two notorious segments in Pittsburgh and Philadelphia.

I'm pretty sure that the segment between US-22 Business (Exit 80) and the Turnpike is up to Interstate standards (or really close) since it was built using Interstate money unlike the rest of the Parkway East.

As for the segment between I-279 and Exit 71A (the bathtub segment), I don't see any way of upgrading it any farther than it has been without doing a true 'Big Dig' and routing it under the Monongahela River and bypassing the Fort Pitt Bridge & Tunnel.

Now, I could see them in the future maybe trying to add a third lane to the Fort Pitt Tunnel, but that would cost a lot of money, but at least the Fort Pitt Bridge would be ready for it already as long as they either eliminate Exit 69C (West Carson Street), or shrink the ramps for it down to one lane only and giving the other lane to the tunnel traffic (which would be an easy traffic reliever for the traffic from I-279).

Gnutella

Quote from: rickmastfan67 on December 18, 2014, 08:26:01 PM
Quote from: Gnutella on December 18, 2014, 03:43:17 PM
Quote from: 02 Park Ave on December 18, 2014, 10:55:18 AM
I say, in which direction from the Pittsburgh airport to the Turnpike are you concerned about the I-376?

Through the city of Pittsburgh. It's one of the worst examples of substandard Interstate in the United States. Honestly, I bet PennDOT is getting all the "easy" substandard Interstate upgrades (I-70, I-78, I-80, I-83) out of the way first before it tackles the two notorious segments in Pittsburgh and Philadelphia.

I'm pretty sure that the segment between US-22 Business (Exit 80) and the Turnpike is up to Interstate standards (or really close) since it was built using Interstate money unlike the rest of the Parkway East.

As for the segment between I-279 and Exit 71A (the bathtub segment), I don't see any way of upgrading it any farther than it has been without doing a true 'Big Dig' and routing it under the Monongahela River and bypassing the Fort Pitt Bridge & Tunnel.

Now, I could see them in the future maybe trying to add a third lane to the Fort Pitt Tunnel, but that would cost a lot of money, but at least the Fort Pitt Bridge would be ready for it already as long as they either eliminate Exit 69C (West Carson Street), or shrink the ramps for it down to one lane only and giving the other lane to the tunnel traffic (which would be an easy traffic reliever for the traffic from I-279).

The segment of I-376 past downtown Pittsburgh would stay as is because there's no realistic way to upgrade it, but I do think the segment between Grant Street and the Boulevard of the Allies should at least be given full-width exterior shoulders, even if the number of lanes remains at four.

Basically, what I'd do is make the Parkway West six lanes with full-width interior and exterior shoulders between Pittsburgh International Airport and I-79, and eight lanes with full-width interior and exterior shoulders between I-79 and Saw Mill Run Boulevard. I'd also expand the Fort Pitt Tunnel to three lanes in each tube, and drop one lane from each of the Carson Street ramps at the (south)west end of the Fort Pitt Bridge. The Saw Mill Run Boulevard interchange would be reconfigured to a modified "directional T" with an eastbound 'EXIT ONLY' lane and a new westbound lane.

Eventually, the Parkway East would be widened to six lanes with full-width interior and exterior shoulders from the Boulevard of the Allies to the Pennsylvania Turnpike, though the Squirrel Hill Tunnel might remain "shoulderless" even with an expansion. Most interchanges along the Parkway East would be reconfigured.

ARMOURERERIC

I had thoughts of a Parkway west as a 3-2-3 configuration with the reversible center "2" branching off before Banksville into a whole separate alignment and tunnel.  Have it stay on the south shore with ramps to either a new Wabash Bridge, the Smilthfield Bridge and/or into a big Station Square parking garage with direct "T" access.  This reversible "2" would recross the Mon and rejoin the parkway near the J&L bend with ramps to/from 2nd Ave SB and Bates into Oakland.  I also envision a 2-3 lane HOT alignment from the Bus 22 exit goint to and along/ adjacent to the east Busway with a large parking structure around 28th and Liberty, a "T" connection to downtown via the Penn Station line.

roadman65

Are there still any old signs left anywhere in PA?  I always remembered even in the early 2000's seeing old signs from the 70's and before on many PA freeways.  Some were so faded that PennDOT left them there regardless of how useless they became, then there was the US 22 freeway that still had old signs or carbon copy of old signs, and even when PA 145 was extended south of US 22 to meet I-78 in the late 80's, instead of replacing the 7th Street signs to include the route number, PennDOT just added a shield to the top of the signs that were there.

Even US 1 in Chester County along the freeway, had faded old signs that they finally replaced in 02 with newer signs featuring shields instead of text, but for many years the PA 896 sign NB was so faded it was blank and I could never understand why some engineer did not replace it sooner as it gave out no vital information for a driver to read.

Are all the old text and signs gone or does PA still have some old relics that have not yet been replaced?  I am asking because I do not get to go on my yearly visit to NJ anymore where I used to also cross the Delaware River to check out PA, so I am curious if there are any historical signing left in this disposable age.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

PHLBOS

Quote from: roadman65 on February 19, 2015, 09:53:59 AMAre all the old text and signs gone or does PA still have some old relics that have not yet been replaced?  I am asking because I do not get to go on my yearly visit to NJ anymore where I used to also cross the Delaware River to check out PA, so I am curious if there are any historical signing left in this disposable age.
Short answer, there are still some out there (see above comments from others) but not as many as there once were. 

If you're expecting to see a stretch of older signs (pre-80s) in one location; you're probably too late for that.  The ones that might be still standing today are mostly entrance ramp signage vs. ones on the actual mainline (with an occasional exception).
GPS does NOT equal GOD

rickmastfan67

Quote from: roadman65 on February 19, 2015, 09:53:59 AM
Are all the old text and signs gone or does PA still have some old relics that have not yet been replaced?  I am asking because I do not get to go on my yearly visit to NJ anymore where I used to also cross the Delaware River to check out PA, so I am curious if there are any historical signing left in this disposable age.

We still have a 'text' sign over here in Pittsburgh on PA-28.

ARMOURERERIC

I was stumbling through news items about some of my favorite PA projects to be and found this:

http://www.dailyitem.com/news/m-thruway-bridge-to-be-bid-this-year/article_7047e1cc-9d1b-11e4-a96b-375f1fef4ef8.html

The new PA 147 bridge potion of the US 11/15/PA 147 freeway will go out to bid in August

ARMOURERERIC

#163
Here is a cool you tube video by the builder of the last part of the superstructure for the new Hulton Bridge being set into place.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPdst9iZgbM

Mr_Northside

I crossed the [existing] bridge 2 or so weeks ago.  It's impressive how much higher the new bridge is in the middle compared to the current Hulton Bridge.
I don't have opinions anymore. All I know is that no one is better than anyone else, and everyone is the best at everything

Gnutella

Business groups in Franklin County are urging PennDOT to widen I-81 to six lanes. I support this, especially since the Harrisburg area is becoming a major warehouse distribution hub.

CentralPAGal

That badly needs widening. It's not in Franklin County, and is only about 2 miles, but there is apparently a project in the pipeline to widen I-81 from PA 581 to PA 114.
Clinched:
I: 83, 97, 176, 180 (PA), 270 (MD), 283, 395 (MD), 470 (OH-WV), 471, 795 (MD)
Traveled:
I: 70, 71, 75, 76 (E), 78, 79, 80, 81, 86 (E), 95, 99, 270 (OH), 275 (KY-IN-OH), 376, 495 (MD-VA), 579, 595 (MD), 695 (MD)
US: 1, 9, 11, 13, 15, 22, 25, 30, 40, 42, 50, 113, 119, 127, 209, 220, 222, 301

roadman65

Were the old incomplete unnumbered freeways of PA state maintained?  I often wondered before the current US 222 bypass of Reading was given the US 222 number, and referred to by locals as the "Road to nowhere" as literally it did go no place at the time and of course it had no number either.

Also the US 1 Bucks County Freeway was unnumbered from the current south business end to Oxford Valley for decades until PennDOT completed it from Oxford Valley to Morrisville in 1987.

Even PA 12 did not gets its number until US 222 was realigned to the Road to Nowhere, and the freeway was simply signed Pricetown going east and west I was not sure as I never got to see the ramps leading to it WB in those days.

I know that reference numbers are used just like NY State has for its parkways and expressways, but they are part of the state road's network.  I would imagine that future state route freeways partially completed in PA until completed fully, were also given reference numbers, however did PennDOT maintain them when they were not shielded with even temporary numbers?
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

NE2

Quote from: roadman65 on March 06, 2015, 01:46:02 AM
Were the old incomplete unnumbered freeways of PA state maintained?
Yes. Some freeways still have no signed number.
pre-1945 Florida route log

I accept and respect your identity as long as it's not dumb shit like "identifying as a vaccinated attack helicopter".

ixnay

#169
Quote from: roadman65 on February 19, 2015, 09:53:59 AM
Are there still any old signs left anywhere in PA?  I always remembered even in the early 2000's seeing old signs from the 70's and before on many PA freeways.  Some were so faded that PennDOT left them there regardless of how useless they became, then there was the US 22 freeway that still had old signs or carbon copy of old signs, and even when PA 145 was extended south of US 22 to meet I-78 in the late 80's, instead of replacing the 7th Street signs to include the route number, PennDOT just added a shield to the top of the signs that were there.

Even US 1 in Chester County along the freeway, had faded old signs that they finally replaced in 02 with newer signs featuring shields instead of text, but for many years the PA 896 sign NB was so faded it was blank and I could never understand why some engineer did not replace it sooner as it gave out no vital information for a driver to read.

Are all the old text and signs gone or does PA still have some old relics that have not yet been replaced?  I am asking because I do not get to go on my yearly visit to NJ anymore where I used to also cross the Delaware River to check out PA, so I am curious if there are any historical signing left in this disposable age.

Elsewhere in Chester County (on WB U.S. 30 west of Coatesville), this old sign was still up in Sept. 2012...

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.992347,-75.859477,3a,24.4y,260.61h,90.36t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sCJWHNqmKrp89v_x2bNI9fA!2e0

I-95 between Philadelphia International Airport and the Delaware state line in the '70s and '80s had almost nothing but all-text, all-caps (except for numerals), non-button copy signs (interstate was the only shield used), but they all have been replaced.  The replacement actually started with the reconstruction of the Flower Street interchange in Chester into the connection with the Commodore Barry Bridge, a project that started about 8 months after the opening of the CBB in 1974.  New overhead signs with shields (some with button copy, a couple without) were erected as part of that project.  Alas, it's all reflective signs now on that part of 95.

ixnay
The Washington/Baltimore/Arlington CSA has two Key Bridges, a Minnesota Avenue, and a Mannasota Avenue.

Mergingtraffic

#170
I only take pics of good looking signs. Long live non-reflective button copy!
MergingTraffic https://www.flickr.com/photos/98731835@N05/

NJRoadfan

Are there any plans to extend the US-202 freeway east of Doylestown? I was in the area today and there looked to be some road way at the eastern stub end of the bypass. That 2-lane section of US-202 is barely adequate for the traffic in the area. Tons of rim busting potholes too, typical PA.

jemacedo9

Quote from: NJRoadfan on March 08, 2015, 05:14:05 PM
Are there any plans to extend the US-202 freeway east of Doylestown? I was in the area today and there looked to be some road way at the eastern stub end of the bypass. That 2-lane section of US-202 is barely adequate for the traffic in the area. Tons of rim busting potholes too, typical PA.

No, and in fact, there is a project just starting to basically get rid of the stub ending there, make US 202 a straight-thru movement, have E State St end at US 202 as a T-intersection, and add left turn lanes at the PA 313/US 202 intersection.

Gnutella

Quote from: doofy103 on March 07, 2015, 08:59:03 PM
Are these beauties still up? 

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.312267,-74.803063,3a,75y,59.13h,86.4t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1scYJh41mXNEEkRZP3p2eWvA!2e0

and according to GSV looks like they're reconstructing I-84 but looks like no concrete is being used.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.3592,-74.699645,3a,75y,74.06h,72.71t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1saACSF30VAYcpSqR3ti9YwQ!2e0

Apparently the concrete base of the existing I-84 roadbed is having a chemical reaction with the bedrock under it, which might be why the new base is asphalt. It also looks like I-84 will be completely reconstructed through Pike County over the next several years.

ixnay

Quote from: Gnutella on March 08, 2015, 07:01:19 PM
Quote from: doofy103 on March 07, 2015, 08:59:03 PM
Are these beauties still up? 

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.312267,-74.803063,3a,75y,59.13h,86.4t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1scYJh41mXNEEkRZP3p2eWvA!2e0

and according to GSV looks like they're reconstructing I-84 but looks like no concrete is being used.

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.3592,-74.699645,3a,75y,74.06h,72.71t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1saACSF30VAYcpSqR3ti9YwQ!2e0

Apparently the concrete base of the existing I-84 roadbed is having a chemical reaction with the bedrock under it, which might be why the new base is asphalt. It also looks like I-84 will be completely reconstructed through Pike County over the next several years.

One breakdown or accident in that westbound cattle chute and...

ixnay
The Washington/Baltimore/Arlington CSA has two Key Bridges, a Minnesota Avenue, and a Mannasota Avenue.



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