Pennsylvania

[Alps]

is there any plans to connect the lancaster and downington area sections of the US 30 freeway?

no

[briantroutman]

is there any plans to connect the lancaster and downington area sections of the US 30 freeway?

no

To my knowledge, it's never even been brought up as some state representative's pipe dream. At the moment, the only items on PennDOT's twelve-year plan relevant to this section are various resurfacing projects and intersection improvements. In fact, PennDOT just spent about $10 million on a slight realignment of the westbound lanes at the PA 41 intersection in Gap.

[74/171FAN]

is there any plans to connect the lancaster and downington area sections of the US 30 freeway?

no

I had actually thought about this last night.  I would have to look into this more, but I feel that if the Goat Path Expressway was ever truly brought back, it should function as mainly a US 30 bypass of that area and then at most maybe a spur to connect PA 23 to PA 10 and I-176.  Note that I am unsure how east the ROW continues for it east of PA 772.

[Beltway]

is there any plans to connect the lancaster and downington area sections of the US 30 freeway?

no

To my knowledge, it's never even been brought up as some state representative's pipe dream. At the moment, the only items on PennDOT's twelve-year plan relevant to this section are various resurfacing projects and intersection improvements. In fact, PennDOT just spent about $10 million on a slight realignment of the westbound lanes at the PA 41 intersection in Gap.

Sure would be a massive improvement to the region if PennDOT and the local officials could engineer a route for a US-30 freeway that has the maximum sensitivity to the natural and human environments.

[ixnay]

People should appreciate the novelty that is Breezewood.  Yes, there is stop-and-go traffic at times but where else on our Interstate system is something quite like this?  I never did mind driving through Breezewood--in fact, I would purposely stop there just to eat or fuel up.  Building a new interchange bypassing Breezewood would financially put a big dent in the area.  If Breezewood is such a pain to people then they should find a way not to drive through Breezewood.  There are ways to avoid it--if it is such a hassle.  I, myself, find Breezewood to be unique and a throwback to our early days of the Interstate system--and if I need to drive through there to go to a certain destination, then I will.

WTF?  Yeah, it's unique -- but a throwback?  First time I've heard anyone nostalgic for the times when the Interstate network was still in bits & pieces.  Sort of reminds me of that old Dana Carvey SNL sketch where the elderly gentleman waxes on about unpleasant or even cruel practices of his youth, concluding with the phrase "And we LIKED it!"   Oh well, to each their own, I suppose.

I also like Breezewood.  And I am nostalgic for those days as well.  You don't have to want something back to be nostalgic about it.  I appreciate the fascinating transition into the era of Interstates and the collision of old and new worlds.  What historically-interested person wouldn't find such a period of change remarkable?

I also appreciate it for what it is, and one thing I've noticed about this forum as compared to m.t.r. is that I'm even more in the minority with that opinion here than I was there!

What's m.t.r. stand for?

ixnay

[dgolub]

People should appreciate the novelty that is Breezewood.  Yes, there is stop-and-go traffic at times but where else on our Interstate system is something quite like this?  I never did mind driving through Breezewood--in fact, I would purposely stop there just to eat or fuel up.  Building a new interchange bypassing Breezewood would financially put a big dent in the area.  If Breezewood is such a pain to people then they should find a way not to drive through Breezewood.  There are ways to avoid it--if it is such a hassle.  I, myself, find Breezewood to be unique and a throwback to our early days of the Interstate system--and if I need to drive through there to go to a certain destination, then I will.

WTF?  Yeah, it's unique -- but a throwback?  First time I've heard anyone nostalgic for the times when the Interstate network was still in bits & pieces.  Sort of reminds me of that old Dana Carvey SNL sketch where the elderly gentleman waxes on about unpleasant or even cruel practices of his youth, concluding with the phrase "And we LIKED it!"   Oh well, to each their own, I suppose.

I also like Breezewood.  And I am nostalgic for those days as well.  You don't have to want something back to be nostalgic about it.  I appreciate the fascinating transition into the era of Interstates and the collision of old and new worlds.  What historically-interested person wouldn't find such a period of change remarkable?

I also appreciate it for what it is, and one thing I've noticed about this forum as compared to m.t.r. is that I'm even more in the minority with that opinion here than I was there!

What's m.t.r. stand for?

ixnay

misc.transport.road

It was a newsgroup for roadgeeks back in the days when people actually used newsgroups.

[qguy]

is there any plans to connect the lancaster and downington area sections of the US 30 freeway?

no

To my knowledge, it's never even been brought up as some state representative's pipe dream. At the moment, the only items on PennDOT's twelve-year plan relevant to this section are various resurfacing projects and intersection improvements. In fact, PennDOT just spent about $10 million on a slight realignment of the westbound lanes at the PA 41 intersection in Gap.

I'll see your "in fact" and raise you and "indeed!" 

Approximately 20 years ago, that PA 41 intersection project started out as a proposed short US 30 expressway segment stretching from just west of the US 30 intersection with PA 10 to just west of the US 30 intersection with PA 772. There were various alternative alignments along the north and south sides of existing US 30 as well as various alternative treatments of the intersection with PA 41, including grade-separated alternatives.

Over the years PennDOT progressively downsized it until you have the feeble thing that was recently constructed.

When I lived in Philadelphia and worked for PennDOT District 6, I frequently traveled between there and Harrisburg. When I would get bored with the PA Turnpike, I'd use PA 283, US 30, and US 202 as an alternate on the return trip just for variety. The congestion on the non-freeway portion of US 30 between Lancaster and Coatesville would add so much time to the trip that after just a few times, I gave it up. That was in the 2000s. It's worse today. The PA 41 intersection is better, but that non-freeway stretch backs up along its entire length.

[jp the roadgeek]

Something tells me connecting the two US 30 freeway sections would involve reviving a modified form of the Goat Path expressway.  US 30 from the end of the freeway portion to PA 41 can be a nightmare from May-December with Dutch Wonderland, the shopping outlets, American Music Theater, and Millers. 

[sbeaver44]

Something tells me connecting the two US 30 freeway sections would involve reviving a modified form of the Goat Path expressway.  US 30 from the end of the freeway portion to PA 41 can be a nightmare from May-December with Dutch Wonderland, the shopping outlets, American Music Theater, and Millers.

Yes...we go to Bethany Beach every year from Harrisburg.  I started taking PA 741 and PA 272/MD 272 to I-95 to get to DE 1 now.  (Of course, I shunpike with MD/DE 279).  It might be longer timewise but it's way less frustrating.

I used to do 283-30-41-7. 

Nexus 6P

[Beltway]

When I lived in Philadelphia and worked for PennDOT District 6, I frequently traveled between there and Harrisburg. When I would get bored with the PA Turnpike, I'd use PA 283, US 30, and US 202 as an alternate on the return trip just for variety. The congestion on the non-freeway portion of US 30 between Lancaster and Coatesville would add so much time to the trip that after just a few times, I gave it up. That was in the 2000s. It's worse today. The PA 41 intersection is better, but that non-freeway stretch backs up along its entire length.

A few times we used US-322 as a fairly low traffic alternative to the Turnpike.
That was in the 1970s... wonder how it is today?

[sbeaver44]

When I lived in Philadelphia and worked for PennDOT District 6, I frequently traveled between there and Harrisburg. When I would get bored with the PA Turnpike, I'd use PA 283, US 30, and US 202 as an alternate on the return trip just for variety. The congestion on the non-freeway portion of US 30 between Lancaster and Coatesville would add so much time to the trip that after just a few times, I gave it up. That was in the 2000s. It's worse today. The PA 41 intersection is better, but that non-freeway stretch backs up along its entire length.

A few times we used US-322 as a fairly low traffic alternative to the Turnpike.
That was in the 1970s... wonder how it is today?

In some areas, not bad.  But near Hershey and Ephrata it can get trafficky.

Nexus 6P

[noelbotevera]

When I lived in Philadelphia and worked for PennDOT District 6, I frequently traveled between there and Harrisburg. When I would get bored with the PA Turnpike, I'd use PA 283, US 30, and US 202 as an alternate on the return trip just for variety. The congestion on the non-freeway portion of US 30 between Lancaster and Coatesville would add so much time to the trip that after just a few times, I gave it up. That was in the 2000s. It's worse today. The PA 41 intersection is better, but that non-freeway stretch backs up along its entire length.

A few times we used US-322 as a fairly low traffic alternative to the Turnpike.
That was in the 1970s... wonder how it is today?

In some areas, not bad.  But near Hershey and Ephrata it can get trafficky.

Nexus 6P

I can attest to that. During summer seasons, when people go to Hersheypark, that section can become congested. Typically it gets heavier around the late morning/early afternoon (around 9 AM to 11 AM) since that's when Hersheypark opens. I'm not sure WHY they haven't upgraded the section of US 322 between the Eisenhower Interchange and US 422, because there's enough room to put at least a RIRO in for the at-grade intersections.

[74/171FAN]

I can attest to that. During summer seasons, when people go to Hersheypark, that section can become congested. Typically it gets heavier around the late morning/early afternoon (around 9 AM to 11 AM) since that's when Hersheypark opens. I'm not sure WHY they haven't upgraded the section of US 322 between the Eisenhower Interchange and US 422, because there's enough room to put at least a RIRO in for the at-grade intersections.

It would be a lot more complicated than that for the two signals.

The first light EB at Mushroom Hill Rd connects to a shopping center that includes Wal-Mart and Sam's Club.  (though there is a ramp WB that directly connects to Sam's Club before the intersection)  Also there are other businesses on the south side of US 322 here. 

The second light at Chambers Hill Rd and Grayson Rd is a multiple-way intersection that causes the real congestion of the two.  Grayson Rd connects to Milroy Rd, which becomes Nyes Rd that connects to Jonestown Rd in Paxtonia, which connects to US 22 and I-81 at Exit 72.

PENNDOT's website shows a planned improvement to the latter intersection, but I know nothing about an interchange being placed here.

[noelbotevera]

The first light EB at Mushroom Hill Rd connects to a shopping center that includes Wal-Mart and Sam's Club.  (though there is a ramp WB that directly connects to Sam's Club before the intersection)  Also there are other businesses on the south side of US 322 here. 

Trying not to get into Fictional, my proposal is to use a SPUI. I'm not an engineer, so I'm not sure if depressing US 322 or elevating Mushroom Hill, but the only real effects I can see is that the Dunkin Donuts and propane company would have to be demolished (to make room for the bottom right ramp), the bottom third of the Weis and Walmart would have to be demolished (taking away the tobacco store and the Aldi respectively) to make room for the top two ramps, and the bottom left ramp is clear land.

The second light at Chambers Hill Rd and Grayson Rd is a multiple-way intersection that causes the real congestion of the two.  Grayson Rd connects to Milroy Rd, which becomes Nyes Rd that connects to Jonestown Rd in Paxtonia, which connects to US 22 and I-81 at Exit 72.

This is tougher... I'd say a modified SPUI - connect Grayson/Hilton (or Pine) to South 82nd/Chambers Hill as the bridge. However, there's less stuff to demolish - SW side is maybe 2 homes, SE and NW sides are clear, and NE would have to require a direct exit to
Pine Street, since it's impossible to build a ramp to the intersection.

I'd also cut off every road (aside from the two aforementioned interchanges), since those roads are accessible by Grayson Road (a parallel road). The only RIRO I'd leave in is the one to the water treatment plant.

[KEVIN_224]

It looks like I-84 in northeastern Pennsylvania still has quite a long way to go. I know they had to redo much of the roadbed underneath the interstate east of here. This was looking west. I only know the mile markers were in the 30s. Possibly MM 36 to MM 33? 

[jcn]

When I lived in Philadelphia and worked for PennDOT District 6, I frequently traveled between there and Harrisburg. When I would get bored with the PA Turnpike, I'd use PA 283, US 30, and US 202 as an alternate on the return trip just for variety. The congestion on the non-freeway portion of US 30 between Lancaster and Coatesville would add so much time to the trip that after just a few times, I gave it up. That was in the 2000s. It's worse today. The PA 41 intersection is better, but that non-freeway stretch backs up along its entire length.

A few times we used US-322 as a fairly low traffic alternative to the Turnpike.
That was in the 1970s... wonder how it is today?

In some areas, not bad.  But near Hershey and Ephrata it can get trafficky.

Nexus 6P

If you think that's bad, US-322 in Delaware County between US-1 and I-95 is horrible.  Luckily, a major construction has just begun to help ease that stretch. 

[jeffandnicole]

When I lived in Philadelphia and worked for PennDOT District 6, I frequently traveled between there and Harrisburg. When I would get bored with the PA Turnpike, I'd use PA 283, US 30, and US 202 as an alternate on the return trip just for variety. The congestion on the non-freeway portion of US 30 between Lancaster and Coatesville would add so much time to the trip that after just a few times, I gave it up. That was in the 2000s. It's worse today. The PA 41 intersection is better, but that non-freeway stretch backs up along its entire length.

A few times we used US-322 as a fairly low traffic alternative to the Turnpike.
That was in the 1970s... wonder how it is today?

In some areas, not bad.  But near Hershey and Ephrata it can get trafficky.

Nexus 6P

If you think that's bad, US-322 in Delaware County between US-1 and I-95 is horrible.  Luckily, a major construction has just begun to help ease that stretch. 

Just a 6 year project with no improvements with the merge onto 95.

[roadgeek01]

I have a question regarding the US-322/US-422 interchange in Hershey. I noticed that while viewing said interchange on Google maps, I noticed a ramp stub.  It would be nice to have a explanation for that.  I have a link here: https://www.google.com/maps/@40.2674124,-76.6833245,19z/data=!3m1!1e3

[davewiecking]

Old topo maps (viewed via historicaerials.com) suggest that this is leftover asphalt from when W. Governor Rd connected with E. Main St., prior to the existing interchange being constructed in the late 60's.

[Buffaboy]

The button copy signs outside of Breezewood on I-70 are pretty stunning.

[Roadsguy]

I noticed some interesting things about the old signs on US 422/I-376 around New Castle in the old Street View, particularly at current Exit 12.

As late as 2009, you still had the original text-only button copy signs, with centered exit tabs as well. Interestingly, even after Toll 60 (today I-376) was built, these signs were never updated to refer to 60 as continuing south past this interchange; it's only referred to as US 422. Some signs feature blank spaces that would presumably have held "PA 60 South" and "Pittsburgh". One sign that used shields even had a blank keystone shield. Presumably it was this way until all the signs were replaced with the redesignation to I-376.

Also of note is that all of these old signs on then-60 feature exit tabs. Were they anticipating the 60 corridor becoming I-376 or some other Interstate even way back then, or were non-Interstate expressways often given blank exit tabs on these old signs back then?

[route17fan]

Also of note is that all of these old signs on then-60 feature exit tabs. Were they anticipating the 60 corridor becoming I-376 or some other Interstate even way back then, or were non-Interstate expressways often given blank exit tabs on these old signs back then?

US 219 in Bradford and US 220 in Williamsport and west of Williamsport had blank exit tabs as well. I'm afraid I do not know about then-future plans, but quite a few expressways had them back then.

[PHLBOS]

If you think that's bad, US-322 in Delaware County between US-1 and I-95 is horrible.  Luckily, a major construction has just begun to help ease that stretch. 

Just a 6 year project with no improvements with the merge onto 95.

The proposed I-95/US 322 interchange reconfiguration (I've seen an overall plan view of such for such) is a separate project.

[jeffandnicole]

If you think that's bad, US-322 in Delaware County between US-1 and I-95 is horrible.  Luckily, a major construction has just begun to help ease that stretch. 

Just a 6 year project with no improvements with the merge onto 95.

The proposed I-95/US 322 interchange reconfiguration (I've seen an overall plan view of such for such) is a separate project.

Yep. But without a proposed date for that project, this project just funnels more traffic into the short left merge area.

Did they decide on a preferred alternative for that 322/95 project?  Last time I saw anything, there were about a half-dozen alternatives they were considering.

[PHLBOS]

If you think that's bad, US-322 in Delaware County between US-1 and I-95 is horrible.  Luckily, a major construction has just begun to help ease that stretch. 

Just a 6 year project with no improvements with the merge onto 95.

The proposed I-95/US 322 interchange reconfiguration (I've seen an overall plan view of such for such) is a separate project.

Yep. But without a proposed date for that project, this project just funnels more traffic into the short left merge area.

It is my understanding that the 322 project's eastern limits end somewhere between the Cherry Tree Road intersection and the PA 452 interchange; where 322 transitions from a 4-lane divided highway to a 2-lane undivided roadway.  As long as developers don't go bonkers along the impacted corridor immediately post-construction; the eastbound traffic along the existing divided stretch of 322 to I-95 should not be impacted.  The primary objective of the 322 project is to relieve the traffic flow & choke points.

Did they decide on a preferred alternative for that 322/95 project?  Last time I saw anything, there were about a half-dozen alternatives they were considering.

The plan I saw, from an engineering consultant, shows the reconfigured interchange as an elaborate trumpet w/full movements (the current interchange doe not have direct access to US 322 West from I-95 North).