More US 31 upgrades between Indy and South Bend

[silverback1065]

I agree that INDOT should drop the practice of removing signage from roads that get turned over to local control. They've set a precedent by signing the new Cline Ave bridge as IN 912 even though it's not state-owned.

Also, if we're talking about INDOT ditching lightly traveled roads, 111 south of 211 should be at the top of the list.

The East End Crossing and the Indiana Toll Road are also operated by private consortiums and are part of the state highway system.

SR 111 has one point with an AADT of 52. It is a strange area. SR 166 at the south terminus has an AADT of 47.

So at the far south end of 111, right at the Ohio River, there is what I would describe as a "gated compound" of a half dozen or so houses, and all I can figure is that someone who does or used to live there has some clout because there's no other reason that segment of road should be a state highway.

July 2021 GMSV shows 111 and 211 ending at each other now...
https://goo.gl/maps/TjMQRRJwAi73z9Lw9

interesting. now 111 goes from 211 up to 64 and it gets weird once it's in New Albany, not exactly clear what it's routing is up there. it appears SB it starts right off 64 using 5th st then turns right at main. NB it looks like it turns left from main on state then left on spring to 64. found an article about the transfer, it happened in 2020 no idea what the details were, article is behind a paywall  if anyone has access, please post.

[NWI_Irish96]

I agree that INDOT should drop the practice of removing signage from roads that get turned over to local control. They've set a precedent by signing the new Cline Ave bridge as IN 912 even though it's not state-owned.

Also, if we're talking about INDOT ditching lightly traveled roads, 111 south of 211 should be at the top of the list.

The East End Crossing and the Indiana Toll Road are also operated by private consortiums and are part of the state highway system.

SR 111 has one point with an AADT of 52. It is a strange area. SR 166 at the south terminus has an AADT of 47.

So at the far south end of 111, right at the Ohio River, there is what I would describe as a "gated compound" of a half dozen or so houses, and all I can figure is that someone who does or used to live there has some clout because there's no other reason that segment of road should be a state highway.

July 2021 GMSV shows 111 and 211 ending at each other now...
https://goo.gl/maps/TjMQRRJwAi73z9Lw9

Indeed it does. I submitted this change and the change to 28 to the travelmapping admin for Indiana.

[NWI_Irish96]

I agree that INDOT should drop the practice of removing signage from roads that get turned over to local control. They've set a precedent by signing the new Cline Ave bridge as IN 912 even though it's not state-owned.

Also, if we're talking about INDOT ditching lightly traveled roads, 111 south of 211 should be at the top of the list.

The East End Crossing and the Indiana Toll Road are also operated by private consortiums and are part of the state highway system.

SR 111 has one point with an AADT of 52. It is a strange area. SR 166 at the south terminus has an AADT of 47.

So at the far south end of 111, right at the Ohio River, there is what I would describe as a "gated compound" of a half dozen or so houses, and all I can figure is that someone who does or used to live there has some clout because there's no other reason that segment of road should be a state highway.

July 2021 GMSV shows 111 and 211 ending at each other now...
https://goo.gl/maps/TjMQRRJwAi73z9Lw9

interesting. now 111 goes from 211 up to 64 and it gets weird once it's in New Albany, not exactly clear what it's routing is up there. it appears SB it starts right off 64 using 5th st then turns right at main. NB it looks like it turns left from main on state then left on spring to 64. found an article about the transfer, it happened in 2020 no idea what the details were, article is behind a paywall  if anyone has access, please post.

Yes, that's what it is now since the segment of 111 from downtown New Albany out to 60 via Grant Line Rd got decommissioned around 2012.

[silverback1065]

i wonder if the reason why 111 went down there was because they were going to build a bridge but changed their mind. or maybe there used to be a ferry. 

[NWI_Irish96]

i wonder if the reason why 111 went down there was because they were going to build a bridge but changed their mind. or maybe there used to be a ferry. 

So I went down there once in order to clinch 111. Right at the end along the river there is a small "gated compound" of a half dozen or so houses. I don't know if maybe someone there had political pull or whatever and got that road designated a state highway.

There's nothing on the other side of the river to suggest that a bridge or ferry was ever a factor.

[seicer]

It connected to Lock and Dam No. 43 at New Boston.

[Mapmikey]

It connected to Lock and Dam No. 43 at New Boston.

Sometime between 1937-50 the south end of the original route, IN 133, was moved from the intersection in New Boston the short distance to the dam.

[mukade]

it's official 28 is gone. but the article i saw in the kokomo tribune made it sound 28 might be signed on the county roads.

That article had a quite a bit of interesting information, but it also seemed to have some errors. For example, it says SR 28 will be relinquished to local control from CR 560W to SR 19, but then it says  local truck traffic would be able to drive on SR 28 through the city limits. I assume they mean Jefferson St.

Some sort of signage will direct truck traffic down CR 560W or US 31 (it does not specify) and SR 19 to Division Rd. It also doesn't say how that truck route will be signed.

But the most interesting part to me was that the city and county seemed to welcome the change in these specific ways:
- "It was the city administration that initially came to INDOT with the proposal of the state agency relinquishing Indiana 28"
- the local governments use the words "it's a great opportunity"
- the city will have the freedom to do what it wants with Jefferson St in terms of redevelopment and revitalization
- moving the truck traffic to Division Rd will allow for a better downtown experience
- even though not guaranteed, it will make it more likely that the state will build the US 31/Division Rd interchange

Additionally, they get these perks:
- the state will reconstruct the rerouted SR 19 on the east side of town adding curbs and gutters
- the local governments plan to take advantage of matching grant programs for road and improvements projects to make the ~$9M transferred from INDOT to go further
- INDOT will continue plowing for most of the county's portion of old SR 28 "for the indefinite future"

Usually it seems the local government feels like they're getting something dumped on them, but this clearly was not the case in Tipton. Personally, I think it is a great deal for them.

I am still not a huge fan of all these gaps, but most people use navigation anyway. Two of my three kids have no idea what street names or highway numbers are. I am resigned to this reality.

[monty]

Unless you're a "through"  commercial truck on SR 28, there really isn't much to not like about the Tipton deal. The "local"  trucks permitted through the city are likely farm rigs. Even a commercial vehicle detouring to Division Road isn't a great big issue. About four miles added but avoids the slow speeds and stoplights in town on a good roadway. If you're a commercial or farm truck entering Tipton along SR 19 from the south, you can now use what was the locally controlled 19 bypass that prohibited all trucks and avoid downtown. And the big local win is cooperation with INDOT that may lead to a Division Road US 31 interchange. Perhaps the cash may be used to contribute to said interchange if need be.

[monty]

it's official 28 is gone. but the article i saw in the kokomo tribune made it sound 28 might be signed on the county roads.

To clarify... Decommissioned SR 28 from CR 560W (just east of the US 31 interchange at the Tipton Transmission plant) through downtown Tipton to the east junction with SR 19, where SR 28 resumes its normal routing towards Elwood. This is about 4.5 miles in length.

[Great Lakes Roads]

https://www.kokomotribune.com/news/miami-co-asks-indot-to-accelerate-us-31-construction/article_18ba2238-52bf-11ec-b9dc-3f5de2ce6731.html

Miami County wants INDOT to accelerate on new interchanges on US 31 at SR 18, 800 S, and SR 218 West. It also wants overpasses at 900 S in Miami County and 600 N in Howard County.

[mukade]

Those requests from Miami County are pretty sensible, but they also need an overpass at Division Rd (Blair Pike Rd). What do they have to lose? The state also needs to get the SR 10 interchange in Argos built.

[abqtraveler]

it's official 28 is gone. but the article i saw in the kokomo tribune made it sound 28 might be signed on the county roads.

To clarify... Decommissioned SR 28 from CR 560W (just east of the US 31 interchange at the Tipton Transmission plant) through downtown Tipton to the east junction with SR 19, where SR 28 resumes its normal routing towards Elwood. This is about 4.5 miles in length.

Well, SR-28 through Tipton isn't necessarily going to go away. According to the article at the link below, INDOT is rerouting SR-28 to create a bypass of Tipton's town center. When all said and done, SR-28 will still be there, but will not go through the middle of Tipton.

https://www.wishtv.com/news/i-team-8/indot-to-reroute-state-road-28-around-tipton/

[silverback1065]

it's official 28 is gone. but the article i saw in the kokomo tribune made it sound 28 might be signed on the county roads.

To clarify... Decommissioned SR 28 from CR 560W (just east of the US 31 interchange at the Tipton Transmission plant) through downtown Tipton to the east junction with SR 19, where SR 28 resumes its normal routing towards Elwood. This is about 4.5 miles in length.

Well, SR-28 through Tipton isn't necessarily going to go away. According to the article at the link below, INDOT is rerouting SR-28 to create a bypass of Tipton's town center. When all said and done, SR-28 will still be there, but will not go through the middle of Tipton.

https://www.wishtv.com/news/i-team-8/indot-to-reroute-state-road-28-around-tipton/

Good! But they should just kill 28 from 31 to 19, have it go up 31 and onto division at a new interchange. No need to take the 560 road.

[mukade]

Well, SR-28 through Tipton isn't necessarily going to go away. According to the article at the link below, INDOT is rerouting SR-28 to create a bypass of Tipton's town center. When all said and done, SR-28 will still be there, but will not go through the middle of Tipton.

https://www.wishtv.com/news/i-team-8/indot-to-reroute-state-road-28-around-tipton/

I don't think that is true. First, why would the state give the local governments $9M if it is a swap? Second, two of the local politicians said the funding is inadequate given the fact Division Rd (a county road) would see an increase in heavy semi-truck traffic. That was in the KT article. So the way it reads to me, what was SR 28 thru Tipton will simply be Jefferson St and Division Rd will be a bypass route for trucks that will be maintained by Tipton County.

[monty]

Hmm. Either Wish tv or the Kokomo Tribune is wrong. I think it may be Wish. The "bypass"  is in regard to SR 19. That is what INDOT is taking control of - what the city and county now own (that is locally called "the 19 bypass" ) to re-route SR 19 away from downtown over to the east side of town to the current stoplight at SR 28 & 19.

SR 28 Truck traffic will be diverted to Division Road. There isn't any new road building going in this deal. A few already noted planned street improvements to the new SR 19 segment near Tipton High School (Park Road) and signage on current - old SR 28 to redirect through trucks. I don't believe INDOT plans to take over Division Road. That's inconsistent with all of the other releases. The majority of downtown truck traffic originates via SR 28.

It'd be very cool if the state would sign this section of Division Road "Truck 28"  even though it is a county maintained road. Even better to leave up the SR 28 signs from US 31 through Tipton on that soon-to-be local road.

[hockeyjohn]

It’d be very cool if the state would sign this section of Division Road “Truck 28” even though it is a county maintained road. Even better to leave up the SR 28 signs from US 31 through Tipton on that soon-to-be local road.

Understanding that some rely solely on navigation devices and do not pay attention to route numbers, others do not and I wish  Indiana would develop an approach on these local turnbacks to maintain signing continuity.    An example could be simply putting a "TO" banner on the existing sign posts after ensuring the appropriate truck route is marked (if indeed trucks are prohibited on the former state maintained roadway).   Another approach would be to use the pentagonal blue/gold sign with the name of the government entity (county, city, etc.) - similar to situations in Florida where a state route becomes a county route (and in a few cases resumes being a state route again or vice versa).   This doesn't have to occur where disconnected segments are far apart (as is often the case in Indiana), but I'd recommend it in cases like Tipton (SR 28), Kokomo (SR 22), Frankfort (SR 38), Franklin (SR 44), and Lafayette (SR 25 and 26).

[silverback1065]

It'd be very cool if the state would sign this section of Division Road "Truck 28"  even though it is a county maintained road. Even better to leave up the SR 28 signs from US 31 through Tipton on that soon-to-be local road.

Understanding that some rely solely on navigation devices and do not pay attention to route numbers, others do not and I wish  Indiana would develop an approach on these local turnbacks to maintain signing continuity.    An example could be simply putting a "TO" banner on the existing sign posts after ensuring the appropriate truck route is marked (if indeed trucks are prohibited on the former state maintained roadway).   Another approach would be to use the pentagonal blue/gold sign with the name of the government entity (county, city, etc.) - similar to situations in Florida where a state route becomes a county route (and in a few cases resumes being a state route again or vice versa).   This doesn't have to occur where disconnected segments are far apart (as is often the case in Indiana), but I'd recommend for cases like Tipton (SR 28), Kokomo (SR 22), Frankfort (SR 38), Franklin (SR 44), and Lafayette (SR 26).

38 used to be signed in frankfort. no idea why they stopped. also franklin and SR 44 seems to be exactly what will happen with 28 and tipton. a gap with a truck bypass the state doesnt own.

[monty]

After reading the Nov 30 Tipton Tribune article, I want to share a few added points about the SR 28 decommission & SR 19 re-routing & US 31 impacts.
"INDOT will install all truck route signage along Ind 19, Ind 28, US 31 and at necessary intersections directing all through trucks to utilize Division Road."
INDOT will upgrade the signals at the junction of 28 & 19 on the eastern edge of Tipton to provide left turning operations.
INDOT was planning a major Jefferson St upgrade to accommodate the growing heavy truck traffic on SR 28. This project will become null now. 
INDOT improvements to Park Road and Ash St to alter the current city - county streets to new SR 19 state highway standards in an urban roadway design standard with a 26' curbed roadway.
Increased truck traffic on Division Road increases the chance for a US 31 & Division Road interchange.

[NWI_Irish96]

It'd be very cool if the state would sign this section of Division Road "Truck 28"  even though it is a county maintained road. Even better to leave up the SR 28 signs from US 31 through Tipton on that soon-to-be local road.

Understanding that some rely solely on navigation devices and do not pay attention to route numbers, others do not and I wish  Indiana would develop an approach on these local turnbacks to maintain signing continuity.    An example could be simply putting a "TO" banner on the existing sign posts after ensuring the appropriate truck route is marked (if indeed trucks are prohibited on the former state maintained roadway).   Another approach would be to use the pentagonal blue/gold sign with the name of the government entity (county, city, etc.) - similar to situations in Florida where a state route becomes a county route (and in a few cases resumes being a state route again or vice versa).   This doesn't have to occur where disconnected segments are far apart (as is often the case in Indiana), but I'd recommend for cases like Tipton (SR 28), Kokomo (SR 22), Frankfort (SR 38), Franklin (SR 44), and Lafayette (SR 26).

38 used to be signed in frankfort. no idea why they stopped. also franklin and SR 44 seems to be exactly what will happen with 28 and tipton. a gap with a truck bypass the state doesnt own.

Signing 38 concurrently with 421 implies that following 38 is the fastest way to get to Lafayette when it really isn't.

[mukade]

The 2022-2026 Draft STIP was released this past week, and it includes US 31 interchanges at SR 10 and business US 31 going into Peru. These are also in the 2020-2024 STIP. The 2020-2024 STIP also has an item for the the US 31/SR 18 interchange, but I do not see that in the 2022-2026 document. I guess that means it has been pushed back.

There are also these new items in the new draft STIP:

• 
  "Access Control at Division Rd, 1.92 miles N of SR 28" estimated at $21M
• "Access Control from 3.0 miles N of SR 38 to SR 931" also estimated at $21M
• "Access Control US 31 Indy to South Bend - Corridor Access Control - Limiting Access" across multiple districts for $12M
• New bridge over the Elkhart Western Railroad in Marshall County

The INDOT letting schedule already has items for the interchange at 276th St (February letting) and the new 226th St overpass over US 31 (July letting). Contracts have been awarded for the 236th St interchange and the new overpass eliminating the railroad crossing in Tipton.

[monty]

"Access Control at Division Rd, 1.92 miles N of SR 28" estimated at $21M
Will $21M be enough to build a full interchange?
Or is “access control” simply a method like RIRO?

[mukade]

I am pretty sure $21M is not enough for an interchange, but it sounds like there is a $54M bucket of money. Not that it should or would all be used for one interchange, but there is probably more than $21M that could be.

[NWI_Irish96]

The section between Plymouth and Peru would be fine without being upgraded to freeway.  Less traffic than the rest of the highway, at least it always seems that way, and very few high volume intersections.  I would hate to see money going to converting the Plymouth-Peru stretch before money in committed to six-laning the rest of I-65 and I-70.

I would agree except for I know many people who go to Lafayette for college from South Bend and it would be nice if that segment was freeway so you could get to the hoosier heartland highway without railroads and stoplights. (as us 24 has none of those from 31-i69)

I've always used 31->25 to get between northern Indiana and Lafayette, with a shortcut through Logansport via Miami and Cicott streets. Not sure that a freeway upgrade on 31 will suddenly make 31->24->25 faster.

[I-55]

The section between Plymouth and Peru would be fine without being upgraded to freeway.  Less traffic than the rest of the highway, at least it always seems that way, and very few high volume intersections.  I would hate to see money going to converting the Plymouth-Peru stretch before money in committed to six-laning the rest of I-65 and I-70.

I would agree except for I know many people who go to Lafayette for college from South Bend and it would be nice if that segment was freeway so you could get to the hoosier heartland highway without railroads and stoplights. (as us 24 has none of those from 31-i69)

I've always used 31->25 to get between northern Indiana and Lafayette, with a shortcut through Logansport via Miami and Cicott streets. Not sure that a freeway upgrade on 31 will suddenly make 31->24->25 faster.

Google Maps shows 25 from Rochester as only 2 minutes shorter than 31 to Peru. The 20 miles to Peru would make up about 2 minutes if the speed limit increases to 65, and if we can correct the whole 65 mph on non interstate freeways law, 70 mph cuts 3-4 minutes.