Transportation Regions

[Daniel Fiddler]

I believe that the USDOT should have 8 regions that it subdivides itself into.



What do you think?

[Scott5114]

Why?

[Max Rockatansky]

Paint me unexpectedly curious, why California as a stand alone region?

[Daniel Fiddler]

Why?

As a way to study districts.

Population density.  Growth of regions.

Plus except for the Northeast and the Great Lakes (the two 800 pound gorillas), the districts (I think) are more or less balanced.  I will have to double check to make sure.  I know South 75 and California are within 1 million of one another.

Paint me unexpectedly curious, why California as a stand alone region?

I am basing them on overall population (roughly).

[Max Rockatansky]

Why is this actually needed though?

[Daniel Fiddler]

Why is this actually needed though?

I guess it is not actually NEEDED.  I thought it made sense, although I guess it doesn't.

[Scott5114]

FHWA already has 50 state offices that could (might already do) study the sorts of things you're talking about. Actually, maybe one of our DOT employee contingent (Rothman?) could maybe shed some light on what the regional FHWA offices do, exactly. I mostly only hear about them when one of them bats down some state DOT practice that they don't like (like NY tourism signage).

Additionally, OK has quite a bit in common with TX but next to nothing in common with the other states in your "Gulf" region, both geographically and culturally. It should probably go in Central (it is somewhat similar to KS), or perhaps as part of a region with just TX and possibly NM.

[Bruce]

Washington has more in common with Montana than it does with New Mexico.

Just use the Census regions. Or Federal Reserve regions. Or literally any other government agency's regions.

[Rothman]

FHWA already has 50 state offices that could (might already do) study the sorts of things you're talking about. Actually, maybe one of our DOT employee contingent (Rothman?) could maybe shed some light on what the regional FHWA offices do, exactly. I mostly only hear about them when one of them bats down some state DOT practice that they don't like (like NY tourism signage).

Additionally, OK has quite a bit in common with TX but next to nothing in common with the other states in your "Gulf" region, both geographically and culturally. It should probably go in Central (it is somewhat similar to KS), or perhaps as part of a region with just TX and possibly NM.

FHWA Divisions' main purpose is to facilitate authorizations of federal funding and ensure compliance with federal requirements.  At least in NY, this includes smoothing application processes over for the many federal grant programs, so it isn't all punitive.

However, the Divisions all interact with their states differently.  My perception is the NY Division is somewhat pickier over interstate standards than others, contributing to the halting of the I-86 conversion.

FHWA authorizes funding for studies, either hiring consultants itself (which is handled through FHWA HQ in DC) or by funneling funding to the States (typically through Statewide Planning and Research (SPR) funding).  One may be surprised how much SPR funding States use towards studying regional or even national transportation movements (sometimes grouping themselves together to do a single study), but there is a lot of SPR funding out there and FHWA and State DOTs struggle to spend it all.

[Flint1979]

Kentucky is part of the Great Lakes? I disagree.

[hotdogPi]

His idea is that the eight regions have approximately equal population, which explains all the "why is this in this region". This is not necessary. Federal Reserve regions, federal district courts, Census Bureau regions, and the boards on this forum do not have anywhere near equal population.

[oscar]

Just use the Census regions. Or Federal Reserve regions. Or literally any other government agency's regions.

Many Federal agencies have their own regional office structures. Here's the one for the Federal agency I once worked for. That is by no means a model (for example, Colorado is in the region covered by the San Francisco office mainly because the Denver office was closed, with some of its people transferring to San Francisco). But that and other agencies' regional office structures would be worth a look, for any regionalization exercise going beyond arbitrary and fact-free line-drawing.

[vdeane]

FHWA divisions also assist the state and localities with compliance with federal regulations.  For example, FHWA attended the local MPO's ADA Working Group meetings to help the municipalities develop their transition plans.

However, the Divisions all interact with their states differently.  My perception is the NY Division is somewhat pickier over interstate standards than others, contributing to the halting of the I-86 conversion.

And the business loop 81 thing.

Kentucky is part of the Great Lakes? I disagree.

It at least avoids splitting the Louisville and Cincinnati areas.

[webny99]

Am I the only one laughing at Tennessee? 

You could at least shift Alabama into the "South" region (which it definitely is), to make Tennessee look a little less conspicuous.

[CNGL-Leudimin]

Just use the Census regions. Or Federal Reserve regions. Or literally any other government agency's regions.

I use National Weather Service county warning areas . Even though that results in a larger number of divisions.

[Scott5114]

Just use the Census regions. Or Federal Reserve regions. Or literally any other government agency's regions.

I love me some Federal Reserve districts (hello from District J!) but you can definitely tell they were drawn in the 1910s. District L is way too big, and districts D and H are kind of wonky. Were it up to me, I'd at least establish a District M to cover WA, ID, and OR (promoting the San Francisco branch in Seattle to full FRB status).

His idea is that the eight regions have approximately equal population, which explains all the "why is this in this region". This is not necessary. Federal Reserve regions, federal district courts, Census Bureau regions, and the boards on this forum do not have anywhere near equal population.

I'd say that it's even kind of harmful, since there's lots of important transportation infrastructure in the middle of nowhere where nobody lives. It might be better to try to make districts that are based on equal state highway lane miles or something like that.

[Daniel Fiddler]

I'll either redraw the districts when I get back from visiting my mother and grandmother over the weekend or scrap the idea altogether.

[hbelkins]

Might want to take a look at the NHTSA districts/regions -- but they really make used to make no sense, because Kentucky is used to be lumped in with Delaware.

https://one.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/drowsy_driving1/distracted03/NHTSA_Regions.htm

[hotdogPi]

https://one.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/drowsy_driving1/distracted03/NHTSA_Regions.htm

Why am I seeing a whole bunch of replacement characters on that webpage?

[Scott5114]

https://one.nhtsa.gov/people/injury/drowsy_driving1/distracted03/NHTSA_Regions.htm

Why am I seeing a whole bunch of replacement characters on that webpage?

Cause it was saved with the Windows-1252 character set for no good reason.

[jp the roadgeek]

Kentucky is part of the Great Lakes? I disagree.

The Little League folks seem to think so.

[Dirt Roads]

The Federal Transit Administration (FTA) is divided into 10 regions:

Region 1 (Cambridge MA):  CT, MA, ME, NH, RI, VT
Region 2 (New York City):  NJ, NY
Region 3 (Philadelphia): DE, DC, MD, PA, WV
Region 4 (Atlanta): AL, FL, GA, KY, MS, NC, TN, SC (PR, USVI)
Region 5 (Chicago): IN, IL, MI, MN, OH, WI
Region 6 (Fort Worth): AR, LA, NM, OK, TX
Region 7 (Kansas City MO):  IA, KS, MO, NE
Region 8 (Denver): CO, MT, ND, SD, UT, WY
Region 9 (San Francisco/Los Angeles):  AZ, HI, CA, NV (AS, GU, NMI)
Region 10 (Seattle):  AK, ID, OR, WA

[Flint1979]

Kentucky is part of the Great Lakes? I disagree.

The Little League folks seem to think so.

Minnesota is more part of the Great Lakes than Kentucky is.

[SkyPesos]

My regional divisions:
1) Take the regional boards regions and names on this forum
2) Get rid of "Ohio Valley" and move Southern IL, IN, OH to Midwest, KY to Southeast, WV to Mid Atlantic and Western PA to Northeast
3) Combine the other separated states by moving it with the region that the larger portion is part of.
4) Move Oklahoma to Mid-South, and Minnesota to Central States
4) The regions should then come out with something like this:
Northeast: ME, NH, VT, MA, RI, CT, NY, NJ, PA
Mid-Atlantic: DE, MD, DC, VA, WV
Southeast: NC, SC, GA, FL, AL, MS, TN, KY
Midwest: OH, IN, IL, WI, MI
Central States: MO, IA, MN, ND, SD, NE, KS
Mid-South: LA, AR, OK, TX
Mountain States: NM, CO, WY, MT, UT, AZ
Southwest: CA, NV, HI
Northwest: AK, WA, OR, ID