California

[Max Rockatansky]

I don't think any of the unbuilt Trans-Sierra corridors need to be built. It's not about the environmental cost; that would be minimal (though not negligible) in the overall impact to the region. I think it's more the economic cost of being built vs the economic benefit. I don't see much economic benefit to building any and maintaining the current Trans-Sierra corridors is costly. Some people drive CA 120 during the summer, but the economic impact is nowhere close to CA 1 between Carmel and San Simeon. Building and maintaining one more Trans-Sierra highway that would hardly be used just isn't worth the cost.

I agree.  The cost of maintaining those high altitude passes is large.  There's lots of work to do every spring as they plow the snow and fix road damage due to rockfalls, meltwater, the freeze-thaw cycle.  The easier passes were made into year-around routes, I-80 and US 50.  The Sierra passes south of Carson Pass are quite a bit higher, have shorter open seasons, take longer to drive over than just going north to I-80 or south to CA 178.

Building additional passes would be for access to timber or other resources along the way, not just to get to the other side.

Which on the Forest Service side actually would be a good thing with all the recent big fires.  A good percentage of Forest Service Roads in the Sierra Nevada Mountains were built for timber or as fire breaks.  But that's speaking more towards the Forest Service mission of resource management versus the National Park Service being environmental preservation oriented.

[roadman65]

I see LAX is adding a People Mover.
https://goo.gl/maps/MdBVpu6utsVr5neX9

In 2022 it seems being constructed, so my guess is two months later it's not yet in service.

[Ted$8roadFan]

I see LAX is adding a People Mover.
https://goo.gl/maps/MdBVpu6utsVr5neX9

In 2022 it seems being constructed, so my guess is two months later it's not yet in service.

A people mover not involving cars.....in LA that's remarkable.

[Plutonic Panda]

I see LAX is adding a People Mover.
https://goo.gl/maps/MdBVpu6utsVr5neX9

In 2022 it seems being constructed, so my guess is two months later it's not yet in service.

They're also planning a people mover in Inglewood as well. A new underground subway will built along the 405 corridor to connect LAX with the future Sepulveda pass line. Lots of mass transit projects underway or planned. The Crenshaw Line is close to opening until they shut part of it down to upgrade an at grade intersection to a bridge because they couldn't have done it right the first time.

[bing101]

https://www.dailyrepublic.com/all-dr-news/solano-news/vacaville/state-dedicates-section-of-i-505-to-kirk-hollywood-griess/
The Hollywood Freeway is not just in Los Angeles anymore. Yes I-505 in Vacaville, CA is officially called the Kirk "Hollywood" Greiss Memorial Highway.

[roadman65]

I would like to know about a guide along  CA 254 ( Avenue of the Giants) in Humboldt County that references "Shively."  someplace between Pepperwood and the northern terminus.


I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

GSV has no imagery ( even in 2020) of any such signs yet posted.  However, where is the road?  Still as of today no such bridge across the Eel River exists to reach Schively at all from Pepperwood.


Edit https://goo.gl/maps/pCXCdFEwfzrCzGzHA
I found the signs. At the south limit of Pepperwood on CA 254.  However, why do the signs exist if there is no road for it to travel on?

[Max Rockatansky]

I would like to know about a guide along  CA 254 ( Avenue of the Giants) in Humboldt County that references "Shively."  someplace between Pepperwood and the northern terminus.


I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

GSV has no imagery ( even in 2020) of any such signs yet posted.  However, where is the road?  Still as of today no such bridge across the Eel River exists to reach Schively at all from Pepperwood.

Displayed as a place on the 1935 DOH map of Humboldt County, likely wiped out by the 1955 floods:

http://www.davidrumsey.com/ll/thumbnailView.html?startUrl=%2F%2Fwww.davidrumsey.com%2Fluna%2Fservlet%2Fas%2Fsearch%3Fos%3D0%26lc%3DRUMSEY~8~1%26q%3DCalifornia%20division%20of%20highways%20Humboldt%26sort%3DPub_List_No_InitialSort%2CPub_Date%2CPub_List_No%2CSeries_No%26bs%3D10#?c=0&m=0&s=0&cv=0&r=0&xywh=2121%2C5672%2C1082%2C1772

I believe there is a low water bridge that accesses the site of Shivley.

Also, this may be of use for you regarding the history of Avenue of the Giants:

https://www.gribblenation.org/2020/10/california-state-route-254-avenue-of.html?m=1

[roadman65]

And Caltrans still signs it despite only someone using a boat can reach it.

[Max Rockatansky]

And Caltrans still signs it despite only someone using a boat can reach it.

I think most people who live there just drive across the River if it's low enough and the low bridge isn't accessible.  I did that once in Richardson Grove State Park after they pulled the bridge for the season.

Here is an example of one of the low water bridges located off Avenue of the Giants:

https://bridgehunter.com/ca/humboldt/bh89996/

I seem recall there being a low water bridge at Shivley Flat Road that pops up on aerial images now and then.  There a lots tire tracks in the River bed.

[Max Rockatansky]

I found some images of the low water bridge at the end of Shivley Flat Road:

-  The 1972 aerial photo on Historicaerials.com.
-  To the north on the current Apple Maps image. 

[pderocco]

I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

Shively Road leaves 101 just past Stafford where the highway crosses the river. That must be what the residents of Shively and Larabee use.

[Max Rockatansky]

I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

Shively Road leaves 101 just past Stafford where the highway crosses the river. That must be what the residents of Shively and Larabee use.

During wet season, those low water bridges are incredibly prevalent during dry season months on the Eel River.

[roadman65]

It's amazing how during dry seasons that they take advantage of such conditions.

Even in St. Louis, MO there is an extra street along the Mississippi River that is used when the river is low. When the river is at peak flowing, a bunch of no parking signs pop up from the river about 20 feet out from the bank.

[skluth]

It's amazing how during dry seasons that they take advantage of such conditions.

Even in St. Louis, MO there is an extra street along the Mississippi River that is used when the river is low. When the river is at peak flowing, a bunch of no parking signs pop up from the river about 20 feet out from the bank.

Leonor K Sullivan Blvd (formerly Front St) is a legacy dating back to when the Arch Grounds were the old St Louis port riverfront. I didn't live in St Louis then, but it was filled with old warehouses and flooded regularly. It's not so much that there is a street along the riverfront as the rest of the street grid along the riverbank was removed to build the Arch. It originally looked much like the area between I-70 and the river north of the Eads Bridge but more subject to flooding. In the first iteration of the Jefferson Memorial, there were several riverboats docked there. LKS Blvd was needed to access the riverboats which included a Burger King and McDonald's. Most were already gone by the time the 1993 flood got rid of all but the last couple tour boats. Today it's just a couple small tour boats with parking on the paved bank.

[pderocco]

I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

Shively Road leaves 101 just past Stafford where the highway crosses the river. That must be what the residents of Shively and Larabee use.

During wet season, those low water bridges are incredibly prevalent during dry season months on the Eel River.

Where 101 crosses the river, that's not a low water bridge. There is no river crossing on Shively Rd. It's just a small winding forest road.

[Max Rockatansky]

I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

Shively Road leaves 101 just past Stafford where the highway crosses the river. That must be what the residents of Shively and Larabee use.

During wet season, those low water bridges are incredibly prevalent during dry season months on the Eel River.

Where 101 crosses the river, that's not a low water bridge. There is no river crossing on Shively Rd. It's just a small winding forest road.

Shivley Flat Road actually.  As I already stated above, the low water bridge can be seen the following ways:

-  The 1972 aerial photo on Historicaerials.com.
-  To the north on the current Apple Maps image. 

It appears Humboldt County just uses a grading machine on the Eel River bank during the dry season and plops a portable low level struck in the River.  Richardson Grove State Park does the same thing ever summer for campground access.

[pderocco]

I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

Shively Road leaves 101 just past Stafford where the highway crosses the river. That must be what the residents of Shively and Larabee use.

During wet season, those low water bridges are incredibly prevalent during dry season months on the Eel River.

Where 101 crosses the river, that's not a low water bridge. There is no river crossing on Shively Rd. It's just a small winding forest road.

Shivley Flat Road actually.  As I already stated above, the low water bridge can be seen the following ways:

-  The 1972 aerial photo on Historicaerials.com.
-  To the north on the current Apple Maps image. 

It appears Humboldt County just uses a grading machine on the Eel River bank during the dry season and plops a portable low level struck in the River.  Richardson Grove State Park does the same thing ever summer for campground access.

I'm mostly just looking at maps. I've driven 101 there countless times, and 254 two or three, but never been to Shively. (Why?) But I clearly see that it is accessed by something called Shively Rd, which connects to 101 on the NE side of the river just NW of Stafford, and snakes down through the woods to Shively, so no low water crossing is necessary. Shively Flat Rd is just a short road within that community.

With the river low as it is, there are several visible low river crossings in Google aerial imagery, but they look like they're unmaintained, and only passable via rock crawler: Holmes Flat Rd, Vinnum Rd, McCann Rd.

[Max Rockatansky]

I went on Google Maps to find there is no roads at all leading into Shrively as the Eel River is in between the highway and the small rural community. The only access from CA Route 254 is south of Barkdull Road via Holmes and other back roads.  Yet I've never been south of Barkdull Road as I headed back to One oh One via Barkdull and only clinched CA 254 from Barkdull Road to its north end.

Shively Road leaves 101 just past Stafford where the highway crosses the river. That must be what the residents of Shively and Larabee use.

During wet season, those low water bridges are incredibly prevalent during dry season months on the Eel River.

Where 101 crosses the river, that's not a low water bridge. There is no river crossing on Shively Rd. It's just a small winding forest road.

Shivley Flat Road actually.  As I already stated above, the low water bridge can be seen the following ways:

-  The 1972 aerial photo on Historicaerials.com.
-  To the north on the current Apple Maps image. 

It appears Humboldt County just uses a grading machine on the Eel River bank during the dry season and plops a portable low level struck in the River.  Richardson Grove State Park does the same thing ever summer for campground access.

I'm mostly just looking at maps. I've driven 101 there countless times, and 254 two or three, but never been to Shively. (Why?) But I clearly see that it is accessed by something called Shively Rd, which connects to 101 on the NE side of the river just NW of Stafford, and snakes down through the woods to Shively, so no low water crossing is necessary. Shively Flat Rd is just a short road within that community.

With the river low as it is, there are several visible low river crossings in Google aerial imagery, but they look like they're unmaintained, and only passable via rock crawler: Holmes Flat Rd, Vinnum Rd, McCann Rd.

That's what I've been trying to tell you, the county and other local entities install a lot of the low water bridges during the summer months.  The most notable is the temporary span than Richardson Grove State Park installs every summer for campground access.  In the case of Shivley Flat Road it just happens to be one of the locations that gets a summer low water bridge.  There really isn't any incentive not to install the temporary spans given how low the Eel River gets given how empty the Eel River can be during the dry months. 

Also, other maps which displays the low water bridge on Shivley Flat Road is the 1951 USGS, 1964 USGS, 1974 USGS and 2012 USGS.

[roadman65]

Question about US 101.  Are there any stop lights along it between LA and SF? 

I know it's not all freeway between the two, but that doesn't mean it has to have at grades with signals.  I know that north of SF, you get expressway segments and two lane segments  there that do not have busy intersections to warrant signals.


I thought I heard someone post here a while back, that Caltrans made improvements to eliminate some of the signals making the first signal north of Greater Los Angeles further away from the big metro than what once was.

[Max Rockatansky]

Question about US 101.  Are there any stop lights along it between LA and SF? 

I know it's not all freeway between the two, but that doesn't mean it has to have at grades with signals.  I know that north of SF, you get expressway segments and two lane segments  there that do not have busy intersections to warrant signals.


I thought I heard someone post here a while back, that Caltrans made improvements to eliminate some of the signals making the first signal north of Greater Los Angeles further away from the big metro than what once was.

No stop lights for a couple decades on 101 between SF-LA.  The expressway segments are basically pushed to their absolute limits in places like Prunedale.

[J N Winkler]

Prunedale has a side road access with a hazard flasher, but there is also a concrete median barrier that prevents traffic from turning left to or from US 101.  That appears to be the closest thing to a full signalized intersection between Los Angeles and San Francisco.

[heynow415]

Question about US 101.  Are there any stop lights along it between LA and SF? 

I know it’s not all freeway between the two, but that doesn’t mean it has to have at grades with signals.  I know that north of SF, you get expressway segments and two lane segments  there that do not have busy intersections to warrant signals.


I thought I heard someone post here a while back, that Caltrans made improvements to eliminate some of the signals making the first signal north of Greater Los Angeles further away from the big metro than what once was.

The last signals on (the) 101 were in Santa Barbara, four in a row downtown, that resulted in monumental traffic jams.  They were removed ~30 years ago with completion of the freeway.  There are flashing beacons at some crossings in expressway segments but otherwise there's nothing from LA to SF.  North of SF, with completion of the Willits bypass there are no signals until Eureka.

[roadman65]

Yeah north of SF it lucked out, as now both Eureka and Crescent City are the only two places that have them.

So in essence only SF, Eureka, and Crescent City are the only three cities with stoplights for an almost 800 mile route.

[TheStranger]

Question about US 101.  Are there any stop lights along it between LA and SF? 

I know it's not all freeway between the two, but that doesn't mean it has to have at grades with signals.  I know that north of SF, you get expressway segments and two lane segments  there that do not have busy intersections to warrant signals.


I thought I heard someone post here a while back, that Caltrans made improvements to eliminate some of the signals making the first signal north of Greater Los Angeles further away from the big metro than what once was.

The last signals on (the) 101 were in Santa Barbara, four in a row downtown, that resulted in monumental traffic jams.  They were removed ~20 years ago with completion of the freeway.  There are flashing beacons at some crossings in expressway segments but otherwise there's nothing from LA to SF.  North of SF, with completion of the Willits bypass there are no signals until Eureka.

IIRC the Santa Barbara stoplight was finally replaced with full freeway upgrades around 1991-1992; when I went on a trip to Disneyland in 1992 with family, the signals were already gone in Santa Barbara from what I recall on the drive home.

---

Speaking of US 101:

in San Francisco, new overhead signs with exit numbers have been added on the northbound Bayshore Freeway between I-280 and I-80.  Vermont Street is first labeled as "Exit 433" but then later identified correctly as "Exit 433A".

On I-80 west, the new sign at the 5th Street offramp actually does NOT have an exit number - since the Harrison Street ramp just before it has a new external left exit tab, my guess is that the external tab for 5th will be added at some point.  (This replaced a sign that did have an internal exit tab from about 2009-2010)

I-280 along the Southern Freeway and the extension to the Giants ballpark still has the early-2000s overhead retroreflective signs without exit numbers.

[heynow415]

Question about US 101.  Are there any stop lights along it between LA and SF? 

I know it's not all freeway between the two, but that doesn't mean it has to have at grades with signals.  I know that north of SF, you get expressway segments and two lane segments  there that do not have busy intersections to warrant signals.


I thought I heard someone post here a while back, that Caltrans made improvements to eliminate some of the signals making the first signal north of Greater Los Angeles further away from the big metro than what once was.

The last signals on (the) 101 were in Santa Barbara, four in a row downtown, that resulted in monumental traffic jams.  They were removed ~20 years ago with completion of the freeway.  There are flashing beacons at some crossings in expressway segments but otherwise there's nothing from LA to SF.  North of SF, with completion of the Willits bypass there are no signals until Eureka.

IIRC the Santa Barbara stoplight was finally replaced with full freeway upgrades around 1991-1992; when I went on a trip to Disneyland in 1992 with family, the signals were already gone in Santa Barbara from what I recall on the drive home.

---

Speaking of US 101:

in San Francisco, new overhead signs with exit numbers have been added on the northbound Bayshore Freeway between I-280 and I-80.  Vermont Street is first labeled as "Exit 433" but then later identified correctly as "Exit 433A".

On I-80 west, the new sign at the 5th Street offramp actually does NOT have an exit number - since the Harrison Street ramp just before it has a new external left exit tab, my guess is that the external tab for 5th will be added at some point.  (This replaced a sign that did have an internal exit tab from about 2009-2010)

I-280 along the Southern Freeway and the extension to the Giants ballpark still has the early-2000s overhead retroreflective signs without exit numbers.

You're correct about the Santa Barbara signals.  I've lost track of time it was ~30 years ago.  I should remember better since I slogged through it regularly during college in the 80's and shortly after graduation was amazed at what a nice job was done both functionally and aesthetically with that new freeway segment.  If only other Caltrans project looked so good . . .