Turning left into a driveway/side street from a two-lane highway

Started by Ian, January 14, 2019, 01:10:29 AM

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Ian

In the last few years of living up in Maine, I've noticed a certain driving maneuver that is common among motorists turning left into driveways and minor side streets from rural two-lane highways. When a driver is approaching a driveway to turn left into, they will merge into the opposing lane of traffic to slow down in order to make the turn, provided there is no oncoming traffic. This is done as a courtesy, as it allows following traffic to continue past without the need for slowing down. Below I have included a very rough sketch of what I'm talking about (with the red car performing the maneuver)...



Is this practice done elsewhere? May be I just haven't been paying close enough attention in other states, but I can only recall this ever being done in Maine. I'm curious to hear what others think.
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corco

It's common, if not expected, in this part of the country (ID/MT/WY/NV) where sightlines are good.

Roadsguy

I've never seen anyone do that in central/southeast PA or any of the other states I've visited, though I don't know if I'd notice it...
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signalman

Definitely not done here in North Jersey.  Courteous drivers will hug the yellows lines, or even drive slightly over them, but not all will do this.  If a shoulder is available, it will be utilized to pass the turning vehicle.  If there's none, well the car(s) behind the turning vehicle are SOL.

Brandon

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formulanone

I've seen it performed in Florida and Midwest a lot, since there's plenty of flat and straight roads. Perhaps they've been rear-ended before?

Can't say I've seen it much in other places; the roads are much more crooked and even the slightest undulations (or a lack of level grading) make this a bit unsafe.

jeffandnicole

Just too crowded in NJ/PA to do that safely.  Growing up, my side street was just after a sudden hill in the road (a train trestle).  When safe, I would slightly go over the line to give motorists behind me room to pass on the narrow shoulder since it was a fairly blind spot, but I didn't go too far over in case someone was turning right out of my side street and didn't see me.

froggie

Not just Maine...occasionally seen elsewhere in northern New England.

catch22

Fairly common in rural Michigan.  I did this maneuver myself on Christmas day on the drive up to the in-laws in Sanilac County, turning off of M-25 onto their side road.
 

SectorZ

I can concur some people do it Maine. As an insurance adjuster, I had to adjust a 3-vehicle accident where the left turning vehicle hit someone head-on coming over a rise, sending that vehicle into one behind the left turning vehicle. Good times.

webny99

Quote from: Ian on January 14, 2019, 01:10:29 AM
provided there is no oncoming traffic.
Quote from: signalman on January 14, 2019, 07:19:53 AM
Definitely not done here in North Jersey.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on January 14, 2019, 08:05:56 AM
Just too crowded in NJ/PA to do that safely.

I'm seeing a very logical progression here!  :-D

Personally, I rarely if ever see other drivers doing this manuever. I have done it myself, though. A good rule of thumb is to do it only when there is a dashed line instead of a solid line (that is, interpret the dashed lines to literally mean "you can use this as lane for whatever purpose", not just "you can pass").

I am less likely to do this turning into an actual side-street, for two reasons: (1) There is more likely to be traffic coming out of the street, creating a point of conflict, and (2) traffic behind you is more likely to anticipate your turn. For a driveway, though, I absolutely do this, and in fact, I had even considered starting a thread about it the last few times I've done it.  :-P

hbelkins

Happens infrequently around here. I personally don't do it.


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GreenLanternCorps

Can't think of anywhere I would do this.  It seems it is only a good maneuver on rural roads with good sight lines.

TheHighwayMan3561

I do this at my home, but generally only so I can swing by the mailbox on the turn into the driveway.
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kphoger

As has been mentioned, it's common if not expected in rural areas of the High Plains and farther west.  I've even done it in suburban environments as traffic has allowed.

Common practice in Mexico, where space permits, is to pull over onto the right shoulder, stop, then wait for traffic from both directions to clear before turning left.  This maintains the fast-left/slow-right traffic pattern.  I've even seen vehicles in Mexico stop in the right lane of a divided highway in order to use a crossover where no shoulders could accommodate a stopped vehicle.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
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bzakharin

Quote from: webny99 on January 14, 2019, 09:51:56 AM
Quote from: Ian on January 14, 2019, 01:10:29 AM
provided there is no oncoming traffic.
Quote from: signalman on January 14, 2019, 07:19:53 AM
Definitely not done here in North Jersey.
Quote from: jeffandnicole on January 14, 2019, 08:05:56 AM
Just too crowded in NJ/PA to do that safely.

I'm seeing a very logical progression here!  :-D

Personally, I rarely if ever see other drivers doing this manuever. I have done it myself, though. A good rule of thumb is to do it only when there is a dashed line instead of a solid line (that is, interpret the dashed lines to literally mean "you can use this as lane for whatever purpose", not just "you can pass").

I am less likely to do this turning into an actual side-street, for two reasons: (1) There is more likely to be traffic coming out of the street, creating a point of conflict, and (2) traffic behind you is more likely to anticipate your turn. For a driveway, though, I absolutely do this, and in fact, I had even considered starting a thread about it the last few times I've done it.  :-P

Southern NJ definitely has plenty of 2-lane roads where it isn't crowded, yet I've never seen this done. What I *have* seen (and done) is using a shoulder to turn *right* into a driveway / residential road.

Buck87


jakeroot

I have seen it in rural WA and BC, and have practiced it myself on the very few occasions where I've driven in rural areas.

The more unusual "driving in oncoming lane" maneuver I see in WA is when turning left onto a road into the center lane, even if it's a left-turn-only lane. Merging via the middle is extremely common, so much so that any center lane of a road is good enough for WA drivers, even when it's for left turning traffic only (with a double solid on one side, and a white line on the other).

US 89

Quote from: jakeroot on January 14, 2019, 11:13:06 PM
The more unusual "driving in oncoming lane" maneuver I see in WA is when turning left onto a road into the center lane, even if it's a left-turn-only lane. Merging via the middle is extremely common, so much so that any center lane of a road is good enough for WA drivers, even when it's for left turning traffic only (with a double solid on one side, and a white line on the other).

I see this all the time in Utah, but usually it's just into a two-direction center left turn lane -- not sure I've seen it into a lane marked specifically for left turn traffic, but I sure wouldn't be surprised. It mostly happens on roads where finding a spot to turn left onto the road would otherwise be practically impossible, but it makes things hell for people trying to turn left off the main road.

This might be one of those things that isn't region-specific and is more of just a general aggressive driving maneuver.

jakeroot

Quote from: US 89 on January 14, 2019, 11:18:06 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on January 14, 2019, 11:13:06 PM
The more unusual "driving in oncoming lane" maneuver I see in WA is when turning left onto a road into the center lane, even if it's a left-turn-only lane. Merging via the middle is extremely common, so much so that any center lane of a road is good enough for WA drivers, even when it's for left turning traffic only (with a double solid on one side, and a white line on the other).

I see this all the time in Utah, but usually it's just into a two-direction center left turn lane -- not sure I've seen it into a lane marked specifically for left turn traffic, but I sure wouldn't be surprised. It mostly happens on roads where finding a spot to turn left onto the road would otherwise be practically impossible, but it makes things hell for people trying to turn left off the main road.

This might be one of those things that isn't region-specific and is more of just a general aggressive driving maneuver.

Oh totally, I think most areas of the US merge with the center lane (maybe a few that don't), I'm just surprised by how often I see, at least in WA, drivers turning into the oncoming left turn lane to merge. Totally cool when it's a TWLTL, but not when it's "left turn only" (though I admit to doing it all the time when turning left off this road).

I don't know if it's aggressive or just "I see center lane...I merge".

djsekani

I've seen this a few times on the two-lane roads that dominate the farmlands south of Indio and Coachella. Notably in those cases it has little to do with courtesy for vehicles behind, but more impatience with vehicles in front.

SD Mapman

This happens all the time for me...half the time there's no oncoming traffic the whole day so they're fine.
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kphoger

Quote from: US 89 on January 14, 2019, 11:18:06 PM
Quote from: jakeroot on January 14, 2019, 11:13:06 PM
The more unusual "driving in oncoming lane" maneuver I see in WA is when turning left onto a road into the center lane, even if it's a left-turn-only lane. Merging via the middle is extremely common, so much so that any center lane of a road is good enough for WA drivers, even when it's for left turning traffic only (with a double solid on one side, and a white line on the other).

I see this all the time in Utah, but usually it's just into a two-direction center left turn lane -- not sure I've seen it into a lane marked specifically for left turn traffic, but I sure wouldn't be surprised. It mostly happens on roads where finding a spot to turn left onto the road would otherwise be practically impossible, but it makes things hell for people trying to turn left off the main road.

This might be one of those things that isn't region-specific and is more of just a general aggressive driving maneuver.

I interpreted his description to mean that people treat a normal left-turn lane as a TWLTL.

In some states, a TWLTL is specifically described in statute as a place to turn either into or out of–not out of only.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
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jakeroot

Quote from: kphoger on January 15, 2019, 01:38:53 PM
I interpreted his description to mean that people treat a normal left-turn lane as a TWLTL.

Correct.

MNHighwayMan

Quote from: kphoger on January 15, 2019, 01:38:53 PM
In some states, a TWLTL is specifically described in statute as a place to turn either into or out of–not out of only.

This is news to me. Which ones?



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