Notorious Interstate Gaps

[english si]

I'm not sure how that's a gap.  Two different roads with two different numbers.

It's a gap in the network caused by an unfinished interstate. Just because the gap is between the current end of I-280 and its termination point at its parent (rather than another bit of I-280) doesn't make it any less of a gap than one in the middle of a numbered route.

And the OP asked about gaps 'in the interstate system' - even if you don't see it as a gap in I-280, it is clearly a gap in the system!

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I'd imagine that the I-69 gaps between Indianapolis and Memphis might be pretty bad when it comes to rural/non-urban gaps, but haven't yet had time to gain notoriety due to the newness of the rest of I-69 between the two cities.

[bing101]

I swore there was a huge stink over making I-238 meet with I-380 and I-380 was going to extend as CA-380 to Half Moon Bay though when the Southern Crossing was discussed.

Extend to Pacifica you mean, according to cahighways.org. Route 92 connects Half Moon Bay and I-280.

Anyway, here's a real gap in the Bay Area: I-80 and I-280 don't connect in San Francisco! Instead I-280 becomes King Street (the most direct freeway route to AT&T Park) and then the Embarcadero. Originally they were supposed to connect before the Bay Bridge, but thanks to Freeway revolts in the 60s and 70s that likely won't happen ever.

And I-280 was going to connect with I-80 with CA-480.  Also CA-480 was going to connect to I-480 to US-101 was going to connect to Doyle Drive/Presidio Parkway for a direct freeway access to the Golden Gate Bridge though.

[bing101]

https://www.cahighways.org/maps-sac-fwy.html

For Sacramento there's a map suggesting that beltline freeway was going to be extended from the I-80/CA-51 interchange to CA-99 in Elk Grove area. Then there was going to be a freeway that went from I-5 to run as a midway East/west freeway between US-50 and I-80 as LRN 102.

[sparker]

https://www.cahighways.org/maps-sac-fwy.html

For Sacramento there's a map suggesting that beltline freeway was going to be extended from the I-80/CA-51 interchange to CA-99 in Elk Grove area. Then there was going to be a freeway that went from I-5 to run as a midway East/west freeway between US-50 and I-80 as LRN 102.

The original CA 102 (it had a much different LRN number), always simply a corridor concept but never actually an adopted alignment, extended east from the present I-5/CA 99 interchange north of Sacramento paralleling Elkhorn Blvd. and Greenback Way to a point just west of Folsom (but still on the north side of the American River), and then NNE more or less along the Auburn-Folsom Road alignment through Granite Bay to I-80 near Auburn.  Once Citrus Heights and Orangevale became densely developed -- and it was clear that new freeways in Sacramento County were non-starters, the conceptual alignment was moved north in the early '90; plans were to configure CA 102 as a "relief route" for the increasingly congested I-80.  It would start at CA 99 north of I-5, head NE crossing CA 65 between Rocklin and Lincoln, parallel the western section of CA 193 for a while before turning NE again to bypass Auburn to the north (near the municipal airport), and finally terminating at I-80 near Applegate.  But once again this concept was inundated by housing near Lincoln, which has become something of a retirement mecca, with the redoubtable Del Webb/Sun City leading the way with an extensive tract SE of downtown (right where the 102 corridor was "penciled in").  It has been speculated that the new expressway corridor connecting Lincoln with CA 99 may indeed be signed as CA 102 (although funded through the regional MPO rather than Caltrans); we'll all see what happens when that facility is opened to traffic -- it actually is somewhat close to the later 102 corridor iteration.

And, for the record, the N-S connector from the stub-end of CA 244 south to CA 99 between Elk Grove and Galt was slated to be CA 143 before plans were shelved; it was to cross the American River near the west side of Rancho Cordova and skirt the former Mather AFB to the west.  That was an actual adopted route prior to 1975, with property having been bought in the Carmichael area for the ROW; but under orders from Adriana Gianturco, Caltrans director 1975-83 (and vehemently anti-automobile/freeway), the properties were sold off circa 1977, effectively killing the Sacramento eastern bypass concept.   

[Bickendan]

What, no mention of the I-10 'gap' between the Santa Monica Freeway at the East LA Interchange and the San Bernardino Freeway at US 101?

[hotdogPi]

Found another legitimate one (although minor): I-86 in New York.

[sparker]

What, no mention of the I-10 'gap' between the Santa Monica Freeway at the East LA Interchange and the San Bernardino Freeway at US 101?

If D7 would just grit their teeth and reinstate co-signage of I-10 with I-5 over that stretch like it was 50 years ago, there would be no problem (although I'm sure we board contributors constitute a large portion of those who care about such arcane shit!).  Nevertheless, the former presence of co-signage contradicts any official position that such signage is either confusing or superfluous.  But after coming around that big outside curve on I-10 from the WB San Bernardino to the SB Golden State freeway, it would be nice for traffic, particularly non-locals, to be assured that they're still on I-10! 

[silverback1065]

What, no mention of the I-10 'gap' between the Santa Monica Freeway at the East LA Interchange and the San Bernardino Freeway at US 101?

If D7 would just grit their teeth and reinstate co-signage of I-10 with I-5 over that stretch like it was 50 years ago, there would be no problem (although I'm sure we board contributors constitute a large portion of those who care about such arcane shit!).  Nevertheless, the former presence of co-signage contradicts any official position that such signage is either confusing or superfluous.  But after coming around that big outside curve on I-10 from the WB San Bernardino to the SB Golden State freeway, it would be nice for traffic, particularly non-locals, to be assured that they're still on I-10!

that makes no sense, why wouldn't they cosign them?!

[mgk920]

I-49 on the near south side of Kansas City, MO?

Mike

[Beltway]

I'm not sure how that's a gap.  Two different roads with two different numbers.

It's a gap in the network caused by an unfinished interstate. Just because the gap is between the current end of I-280 and its termination point at its parent (rather than another bit of I-280) doesn't make it any less of a gap than one in the middle of a numbered route.

Connected by a freeway already.  I suppose they could extend the I-80 signing to I-280 if they wanted.

[Bickendan]

What, no mention of the I-10 'gap' between the Santa Monica Freeway at the East LA Interchange and the San Bernardino Freeway at US 101?

If D7 would just grit their teeth and reinstate co-signage of I-10 with I-5 over that stretch like it was 50 years ago, there would be no problem (although I'm sure we board contributors constitute a large portion of those who care about such arcane shit!).  Nevertheless, the former presence of co-signage contradicts any official position that such signage is either confusing or superfluous.  But after coming around that big outside curve on I-10 from the WB San Bernardino to the SB Golden State freeway, it would be nice for traffic, particularly non-locals, to be assured that they're still on I-10!

that makes no sense, why wouldn't they cosign them?!

Wait, what? I-5 and I-10 aren't cosigned along the southernmost reach of the Golden State Freeway? I could have sworn they were as of 2008...
At any rate, I was mocking the legislative definition of I-10, which includes the westernmost reach of the San Bernardino from between the Santa Ana and Hollywood Freeways to the Golden State.

[sparker]

What, no mention of the I-10 'gap' between the Santa Monica Freeway at the East LA Interchange and the San Bernardino Freeway at US 101?

If D7 would just grit their teeth and reinstate co-signage of I-10 with I-5 over that stretch like it was 50 years ago, there would be no problem (although I'm sure we board contributors constitute a large portion of those who care about such arcane shit!).  Nevertheless, the former presence of co-signage contradicts any official position that such signage is either confusing or superfluous.  But after coming around that big outside curve on I-10 from the WB San Bernardino to the SB Golden State freeway, it would be nice for traffic, particularly non-locals, to be assured that they're still on I-10!

that makes no sense, why wouldn't they cosign them?!

Wait, what? I-5 and I-10 aren't cosigned along the southernmost reach of the Golden State Freeway? I could have sworn they were as of 2008...
At any rate, I was mocking the legislative definition of I-10, which includes the westernmost reach of the San Bernardino from between the Santa Ana and Hollywood Freeways to the Golden State.

The last time I was on that section of freeway back in 2012 the only reassurance shields were that of I-5.  If there have been additional I-10 shields erected since then,  I stand corrected.  But that I-10 "stub" between I-5 and US 101 has always been something of a legal anomaly -- Caltrans considers it a part of I-10 -- but essentially a long set of ramps from US 101 to the main I-10 lanes.  In the pre-'64 numbering system, it was defined as I-110 (and there was briefly signage for I-110 WB on I-10 WB right after the I-5/10 interchange was opened in early 1960; that lasted less than 2 years before it was removed).   

[MrAndy1369]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

[sparker]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

Actually, these are across the state line in TX on I-40 between NM and US 385. 

[Flint1979]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

I see a few on Google Maps in the western panhandle of Texas on I-40. In between Adrian and Glenrio I noticed some but didn't see much east of Adrian. Starting at exit 18 and going east I-40 has a Service Road that everything seems to end at.

I wouldn't consider this a gap though since I-40 goes all the way through. Just because a farm road intersects an Interstate that's considered a gap now?

[Bickendan]

It's the same situation as I-10 in west Texas. 

[MrAndy1369]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

I see a few on Google Maps in the western panhandle of Texas on I-40. In between Adrian and Glenrio I noticed some but didn't see much east of Adrian. Starting at exit 18 and going east I-40 has a Service Road that everything seems to end at.

I wouldn't consider this a gap though since I-40 goes all the way through. Just because a farm road intersects an Interstate that's considered a gap now?

The specific in-between towns helped. Here's an example:
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2060562,-102.9307851,3a,79y,145.4h,73.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2VJ_M5wleur69ARkvOkuBQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Definitely not interstate quality; however, it's also not that big of a deal and shouldn't impact a majority of drivers, especially as there are gates right next to the interstate.

[Flint1979]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

I see a few on Google Maps in the western panhandle of Texas on I-40. In between Adrian and Glenrio I noticed some but didn't see much east of Adrian. Starting at exit 18 and going east I-40 has a Service Road that everything seems to end at.

I wouldn't consider this a gap though since I-40 goes all the way through. Just because a farm road intersects an Interstate that's considered a gap now?

The specific in-between towns helped. Here's an example:
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2060562,-102.9307851,3a,79y,145.4h,73.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2VJ_M5wleur69ARkvOkuBQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Definitely not interstate quality; however, it's also not that big of a deal and shouldn't impact a majority of drivers, especially as there are gates right next to the interstate.

It looks to me like they are just access to ranches. I don't think anyone is going to turn off the Interstate and try to drive on one of those roads though. I guess it would be legal to turn around at those intersections.

[MrAndy1369]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

I see a few on Google Maps in the western panhandle of Texas on I-40. In between Adrian and Glenrio I noticed some but didn't see much east of Adrian. Starting at exit 18 and going east I-40 has a Service Road that everything seems to end at.

I wouldn't consider this a gap though since I-40 goes all the way through. Just because a farm road intersects an Interstate that's considered a gap now?

The specific in-between towns helped. Here's an example:
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2060562,-102.9307851,3a,79y,145.4h,73.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2VJ_M5wleur69ARkvOkuBQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Definitely not interstate quality; however, it's also not that big of a deal and shouldn't impact a majority of drivers, especially as there are gates right next to the interstate.

It looks to me like they are just access to ranches. I don't think anyone is going to turn off the Interstate and try to drive on one of those roads though. I guess it would be legal to turn around at those intersections.

I actually "crossed" the freeway and saw a much more recent Street View image, from 2016. It definitely looks more like an at-grade "intercharge" from this view: https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2057159,-102.9308724,3a,65.4y,34.26h,74.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1spRSFTWjJaE_ndk2LnbYPsg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656.

[SteveG1988]

Interstate 676 and the ben franklin bridge. 476 and i-81 will get a proper connection in the near future if the beltway project moves properly.

[Flint1979]

Technically this isn't a "gap" , but I-40 through eastern NM has at grade crossings with lots of farm roads.

Where? Can you give us specific examples? I looked at Google Maps and don't see any at-grade crossings with I-40 in eastern NM. Thanks!

I see a few on Google Maps in the western panhandle of Texas on I-40. In between Adrian and Glenrio I noticed some but didn't see much east of Adrian. Starting at exit 18 and going east I-40 has a Service Road that everything seems to end at.

I wouldn't consider this a gap though since I-40 goes all the way through. Just because a farm road intersects an Interstate that's considered a gap now?

The specific in-between towns helped. Here's an example:
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2060562,-102.9307851,3a,79y,145.4h,73.95t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s2VJ_M5wleur69ARkvOkuBQ!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Definitely not interstate quality; however, it's also not that big of a deal and shouldn't impact a majority of drivers, especially as there are gates right next to the interstate.

It looks to me like they are just access to ranches. I don't think anyone is going to turn off the Interstate and try to drive on one of those roads though. I guess it would be legal to turn around at those intersections.

I actually "crossed" the freeway and saw a much more recent Street View image, from 2016. It definitely looks more like an at-grade "intercharge" from this view: https://www.google.com/maps/@35.2057159,-102.9308724,3a,65.4y,34.26h,74.81t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1spRSFTWjJaE_ndk2LnbYPsg!2e0!7i13312!8i6656.

That's what they are. I was reading up on it and I guess since they are lacking a frontage road in that part of Texas that is why it's like that. It is indeed in violation of Interstate standards.

[formulanone]

But are they "notorious" gaps? They seem more like inconsistencies in expectation with interstate highway design. To put it other words: a roadgeek irk.

If there's not much overall traffic usage to warrant the at-grade crossings, because there's no discernible delay to through traffic, it does not cause an indirect routing, and it is not a constant hazard to other motorists, then I'd say it is not a notorious gap.

These ranch-access roads and driveways seem to have no more annoyance than a state patrol using the OFFICIAL USE ONLY U-turn spots.

[TEG24601]

I can only think of one, and it is really more of an annoyance than a gap, and that is CA-15 in San Diego.  Upgrade it to I-15, with all the needed work, and be done with it.


As for missing segments of original designs... I for one would like to see I-90's starting point as WA 99 actually constructed.  Could actually be useful with the new tunnel being completed, and provide for non-surface access to the port.

[Jardine]

Another annoyance gap and probably not quite what the topic is for, but I'll mention the I-29/I-680 interchange north of Council Bluffs Iowa as a 'gap' in I-680.

It's an outdated full clover leaf, and its further awkward from an at grade rail crossing just to the east if one doesn't ramp south to CB or loop north on I-29.

Damn, every time I go by it or thru it I just cringe.  The scale of the clover loop isn't all that big, and at times of the day the merge onto I-29 is scary from all the traffic going thru it.

Probably should start a thread for all the outdated Interstate to Interstate cloverleaf interchanges in the country . . . .

[CtrlAltDel]

Probably should start a thread for all the outdated Interstate to Interstate cloverleaf interchanges in the country .

Today is your lucky day:

https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=22527.50