Lone Traffic Signal Intersection Surrounded by Stop Sign-Controlled Intersection

[andy3175]

While traveling through San Diego, I noticed this intersection in the Clairemont community of San Diego (Mount Acadia Blvd and Mount Ararat Drive): http://goo.gl/maps/DXRNf. Interestingly, no matter what road you take leaving this four-way intersection, you will encounter a stop sign. Normally, whenever I find traffic signals, at least one of the roads leading into that signalized intersection has other signals or freeway interchanges coming into it. But this intersection happens to have stop sign controlled intersections in any direction leading to this particular traffic signalized intersection. I find this to be rather unusual, and I suspect the traffic signal was installed due to its proximity to nearby schools. But I am curious, has anyone else seen this sort of thing in other parts of the country? Is it really as unusual as I think it is (to find a signalized intersection with all approaches coming from all-way stop/two-way stop intersections)?

Regards,
Andy

[talllguy]

Here is one in my neighborhood. I have been lobbying for its removal, since it is poorly timed and so drivers go very fast (between stop signs) to make it. O'Donnell Street is a major street on paper, but in east of this light it passes through a town square were speeds are very low. I'd rather see a four way stop there to fit with the rest of the area.

[agentsteel53]

you have to go quite a ways down each branch before encountering a STOP sign; perhaps that intersection receives enough local traffic to warrant the light?

[realjd]

you have to go quite a ways down each branch before encountering a STOP sign; perhaps that intersection receives enough local traffic to warrant the light?

Is pedestrian traffic one of the warrants?

[mcdonaat]

http://goo.gl/maps/RffTY
Any way you go from this light, you hit a stop sign, within two blocks of leaving the light. No way around it.

[getemngo]

you have to go quite a ways down each branch before encountering a STOP sign; perhaps that intersection receives enough local traffic to warrant the light?

Is pedestrian traffic one of the warrants?

It is indeed!

The investigation of the need for a traffic control signal shall include an analysis of factors related to the existing operation and safety at the study location and the potential to improve these conditions, and the applicable factors contained in the following traffic signal warrants:

Warrant 1, Eight-Hour Vehicular Volume
Warrant 2, Four-Hour Vehicular Volume
Warrant 3, Peak Hour
Warrant 4, Pedestrian Volume
Warrant 5, School Crossing
Warrant 6, Coordinated Signal System
Warrant 7, Crash Experience
Warrant 8, Roadway Network
Warrant 9, Intersection Near a Grade Crossing

It has to do with the number of pedestrians versus the number of cars, as opposed to the raw pedestrian count.

[mrsman]

Castle Heights and Cattaurugus in the Beverlywood section of Los Angeles:

http://goo.gl/maps/4CJis

Here, the intersection is right next to Castle Heights Elementary School.  There is a stop sign in all directions no more than 2 blocks away.

In the old days, Castle Heights / Beverlywil was a great cut-through shortcut between Palms and Beverly Hills.  Between National and Pico there was only one traffic light (here) and three four-way stops (Beverlywood, Sawyer, and Monte Mar).  The city has since added additional traffic lights and stop signs, including one at Castle Heights / Beverwil / Kincardine so that it fits the criteria of this thread.

[mrsman]

A few more intersections in L.A. that meet the criteria.  Again, just like Castle Heights / Cattaurugus, these lights are right near public schools.

Selma and Cassil in Hollywood.

Buckingham and 29th in the West Adams district.  (Southwest of Crenshaw / Adams).

These lights came in at a time when L.A. Dot believed that certain "minor arterials" like Castle Heights, Selma, and Buckingham should not face a stop sign.  These streets used to face very few (or no) stop signs at minor intersections and signals at major intersections.  A traffic light was added in front of the school to help the students cross, since LA DOT did not want stop signs.

But then beginning in the late 80's there was a bigger emphasis on traffic calming.  L.A. basically just started putting in four-way stops all over the place.  In one fell swoop, they basically mandated four-way stops at all intersections (exempting certain large multi-lane streets) surrounding public schools.  Essentially, the two lane arterials like Castle Heights, Selma, and Buckingham became minor neighborhood streets, yet the traffic light still remains at the school, surrounded by stop signs.

Are the traffic lights still warranted, then?  Probably not.  If Buckingham can take a stop sign at 28th and 30th, why can't it also have a stop sign at 29th?  I believe that the stop sign should be replaced by a four-way stop and a crossing guard before and after school.  It would probably save the city some money.

I still can't figure out why the intersection at Rosewood and Arden in Hancock Park ever warranted a traffic light.  There's no school there.  And I don't know why Arden would ever be considered a minor arterial being one block from an arterial like Rossmore that moves pretty well.  However, there is a light at Rosewood and Arden, so it doesn't meet the thread's criteria.

[andy3175]

you have to go quite a ways down each branch before encountering a STOP sign; perhaps that intersection receives enough local traffic to warrant the light?

Is pedestrian traffic one of the warrants?

Could be enough traffic, but whenever I drive past this intersection, it has very little vehicle traffic except through traffic on Mt Acadia. I've not seen many pedestrians here at all. And I've been through this area at varying times of day (night, evening, morning, midday, etc.).

[Brandon]

Necro on this thread, but there are more of these isolated signals out there.

Here's one at Hickory and Bridge Streets in Joliet, IL.
Aerial: https://goo.gl/maps/5a5kQsCjJbK2
Street View: https://goo.gl/maps/t7ZtoREDpX32
To the north is a stop sign at Ruby Street.  To the east is a four-way stop sign at Broadway.  To the south is a four-way stop sign at Division Street.  To the west is a stop sign at Center Street.

[jay8g]

11th Ave NW and NW 46th St in Ballard, Seattle. Three approaches have an all-way stop a block away; the last one has a stop sign at a major arterial just over a block to the east. There was talk of changing the signal to an all-way stop a while ago, but nothing seems to have come of it. Strangely, it has fairly modern signal equipment by Seattle standards. I have no idea why the signal was installed in the first place, in the middle of an industrial area...