Michigan Notes

[getemngo]

I heard very few people complain about Proposal 1 because of the sales tax hike. Almost all the opposition seemed to be "This is confusing and convoluted", "It's going to take too long for the road funding to fully kick in", and "I don't trust all the money to go where they say it will go."

While I'd be happy to see the gas tax tied to inflation, the gas tax funding only transportation, and more quality control of MDOT, I voted for Proposal 1 almost solely because I felt like it's the only chance we'll get for any improvement. Beggars can't be choosers. The Michigan Legislature can't agree on a course of action for our highways, and I don't see that changing soon.

But the public isn't exactly eager to rush out and vote for "At least it's something, I guess." I don't agree with the public, but I can sympathize. And maybe the landslide will convince the Legislature that we're fed up with half-baked solutions and demand something better.

[Brandon]

Just how bad are the roads in Michigan? And what can be done to fix them?

They're not that bad.  Michigan has a lower fuel tax than Illinois, and yet the roads are in much better shape and seem to last for far longer.

[renegade]

Just how bad are the roads in Michigan? And what can be done to fix them?

They're not that bad.  Michigan has a lower fuel tax than Illinois, and yet the roads are in much better shape and seem to last for far longer.

Obviously, you do not live here.

Michigan's idea of repairing roads involves a one-half-inch thick layer of asphalt, and hope it lasts till Election Day.

Roads repaired in this manner last fall are already toast.

[Brandon]

Just how bad are the roads in Michigan? And what can be done to fix them?

They're not that bad.  Michigan has a lower fuel tax than Illinois, and yet the roads are in much better shape and seem to last for far longer.

Obviously, you do not live here.

Michigan's idea of repairing roads involves a one-half-inch thick layer of asphalt, and hope it lasts till Election Day.

Roads repaired in this manner last fall are already toast.

I've driven in Michigan very often and went to college there.  I can assure you, Illinois's roads are in worse shape.

[getemngo]

I've lived in 4 different corners of Michigan (western UP, eastern UP, metro Grand Rapids, metro Detroit) and spent a year commuting to Lansing, and I don't think Michigan's roads as a whole are awful in terms of maintenance. Haven't seen much of Illinois, but I'd rate Michigan above Pennsylvania or New York.

Our biggest financial problems are building new roads/adding capacity and replacing bridges. Keeping the pavement smooth everywhere else seems to be going acceptably — not great, but acceptably.

As an aside, the statistic that Michigan spends the least money per capita for roads in the Great Lakes area is misleading. We have the lowest percentage of roads that are state maintained in the nation, so of course we're going to spend less money.

[halork]

Here we go again! I-75 will be completely closed south of Sault Ste. Marie starting Wednesday for culvert replacement. This time, the marked detour will be M-28 east to M-129, south to M-80, west to Gaines Highway, back to I-75. All the locals and anyone familiar with the area will ignore that and take Mackinac Trail instead. I wonder why they didn't use Mackinac Trail as the official detour like they did last year to the south.   I still don't understand why they can't reroute traffic between the carriageways for projects like this. Estimated project completion: "July."

[getemngo]

It's strange that they wouldn't just do one side at a time and shift all the traffic onto the other side. I-75 in the UP has light enough traffic that a mile or two of lane closures won't really affect anything.

I wonder if Mackinac Trail isn't used as a detour because of weight limits? IIRC, it's a road that has seasonal truck restrictions, so even though it's summer, it probably wasn't built for big trucks.

[JREwing78]

It's not state-maintained, and MDOT would have to kick funds over to Chippewa and Mackinac counties for extra maintenance if they designated it the official detour route.

It's galling that they couldn't pull off all of the culvert repairs during last year's complete shutdown!

[mgk920]

A little question - how common are 'doghouse' style stop-and-go light heads in Michigan?

Mike

[getemngo]

A little question - how common are 'doghouse' style stop-and-go light heads in Michigan?

Mike

I'd say they're not too hard to find for right turn signals, especially after box spans (4 spanwires instead of one diagonal wire) were introduced a decade or so ago.

Left turn doghouses are fairly rare, but they do exist. Michigan St. in Grand Rapids has a bunch, for instance, though at least one of those intersections switched to the FYA this year.

[getemngo]

In Detroit news... MDOT is still figuring out exactly what it wants to do in terms of rebuilding I-94. A start date of 2019 and completion in September 2036?    I hope that's a typo. But then, a few years ago I saw 2030 as the completion date for US 127 between St. Johns and Ithaca, and that's the sort of project Indians does in a year and a half.

In Grand Rapids news... the city wants, among other things, for MDOT to add ramps and reconfigure the I-196/Ottawa Ave interchange. This is interesting because this portion of I-196 was reconstructed and widened just a few years ago.

[halork]

It's not state-maintained, and MDOT would have to kick funds over to Chippewa and Mackinac counties for extra maintenance if they designated it the official detour route.

It's galling that they couldn't pull off all of the culvert repairs during last year's complete shutdown!

Last year, the official detour was over Mackinac Trail, with the oversize/overweight detour to M-129. 

[mgk920]

A little question - how common are 'doghouse' style stop-and-go light heads in Michigan?

Mike

I'd say they're not too hard to find for right turn signals, especially after box spans (4 spanwires instead of one diagonal wire) were introduced a decade or so ago.

Left turn doghouses are fairly rare, but they do exist. Michigan St. in Grand Rapids has a bunch, for instance, though at least one of those intersections switched to the FYA this year.

Thanx.  I was wondering because I found one strung up where US 41 makes its 90 degree intersection turn in Menominee when I was driving around in the area yesterday.

(Streetview: https://goo.gl/maps/qSLi1 )

Mke

[getemngo]

Found some neat maps of various proposals for the original route of I-696. Keep scrolling, as there's more goodies halfway down page 1 and on page 2: I-696 Location Alternatives - What Could Have Been

[getemngo]

Stolen from rawmustard's Facebook: After 23 years the M-231 bypass is getting set to open in Ottawa County

Of course, this is half its originally planned length and a Super-2 instead of a freeway, and it's probably all we'll have for the next 20 years. Woo.

I found it interesting that its Grand River bridge will be the 7th "largest" (longest?) bridge in Michigan, that it will be only the fourth Grand River crossing in Ottawa County (after M-45, 68th Ave, and US 31), and that Ottawa County is the state's fastest growing county.

[Terry Shea]

"Well, the bridge is 3,700 feet, a little less than a quarter of a mile,"  said Tellier.  I hope the project engineers are alittle better at math than this.

[JREwing78]

Mother nature hates Labor Day Mackinac City travelers. US-31 in Emmet County has collapsed pavement due to an underground spring.

Northern Mich. U.S.-31 detour to be Labor Day headache
http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2015/09/02/mackinac-bridge-mdot-labor-day-holiday-road-detour-northern-michigan/71595162/

[peterj920]

I drove in Michigan yesterday, and noticed that many new signs are text instead of using symbols.  In Iron Mountain, I saw a "divided highway" and "divided highway ends," along with reduced speed ahead yellow warning signs without reference to the lower speed limit ahead on US 2 and US 41.  Does MDOT prefer text over symbols?  Wisconsin did for the longest time until the last 10 years where almost all warning signs are replaced with symbols. 

[JREwing78]

The reduced speed warning signs appear to simply be an attempt to not have to stock different signs for varying speeds. It's MDOT going cheap.

[getemngo]

Has our nightmare finally ended?

Deal: $1.2B road funding plan heads to Michigan Gov. Snyder's desk after legislative approval

MDOT has previously said that it needs at least $1 billion in additional funding just to keep up with maintenance. Under the latest bill, $600 million of this funding would come from a hike in the gas tax and vehicle registration fees, and the other $600 million will be siphoned from the general fund.

[renegade]

Has our nightmare finally ended?

Nope.  Snidely and his cronies have successfully kicked the can far enough down the road.  By the time this plan is fully implemented, we will have forgotten why we are paying more in fuel taxes and registration fees.  Meanwhile, nothing will get done to the roads.

My $140/year, twelve-year-old Ford pickup will soon be $190 annually.  I don't want to think about what the fuel tax increase will look like at the pump.

[halork]

M-185 in downtown Mackinac Island will be repaved next fall. An excerpt from the St. Ignace News  (behind paywall for 4 weeks):

Typically, when asphalt is poured, cars can drive on it after four hours when the surface has cooled. While the deeper asphalt may still be warm, a car's rubber tires can roll over the road and not affect the surface. But when Main Street is repaved next fall, traffic will have to wait eight hours before using the road, mainly because horse hooves could depress the asphalt.

"We're used to rubber tires, not horse shoes,"  project engineer David Rusch said at the Street Committee meeting in September. "Let's wait eight hours to be conservative."

http://www.stignacenews.com/

[mgk920]

M-185 in downtown Mackinac Island will be repaved next fall. An excerpt from the St. Ignace News  (behind paywall for 4 weeks):

Typically, when asphalt is poured, cars can drive on it after four hours when the surface has cooled. While the deeper asphalt may still be warm, a car's rubber tires can roll over the road and not affect the surface. But when Main Street is repaved next fall, traffic will have to wait eight hours before using the road, mainly because horse hooves could depress the asphalt.

"We're used to rubber tires, not horse shoes,"  project engineer David Rusch said at the Street Committee meeting in September. "Let's wait eight hours to be conservative."

http://www.stignacenews.com/

Hooves concentrate a LOT of weight into a small surface area.  It's why horses are prohibited on many public recreational trails.

Mike

[JREwing78]

MDOT's draft 5 year plan for 2016-2020 is out.

Interesting projects on the horizon:

- A reconstruction of I-94 through Jackson is scheduled for 2018, between M-60 and Sargent Rd. Given traffic counts and the list of bridges being replaced on the stretch, I can safely speculate that it would be 6-laned only between the US-127 North and US-127 South interchanges, reconstructing only the original 4 lanes east and west of there. There's preparatory work scheduled for key highways into and out of Jackson for 2016 and 2017.

- I-94 reconstruction in Detroit between Chene St (just E of I-75/I-375) and Connor Ave scheduled for 2018-2019.

- Bridge replacements on US-23 between M-14 and I-96, suggesting preparations are underway for 6-laning this stretch of freeway. Oddly, no mention of any widening or rehab of the US-23 mainline. EDIT: MDOT's current plan is to create a temporary third lane in the peak travel direction during rush hours, due to lack of funding for actual 6-laning.

- I-94 widening to 6-lanes between Portage Rd/Kilgore Rd and Sprinkle Rd in Kalamazoo.

- Two major projects on I-75 in Oakland County to either rehab or reconstruct the roadway

- Reconstruct/widen US-31 in Holland

- Reconstruction of portions of US-131 north of Grand Rapids

- Reconstruction of portions of I-475 in Flint.

[getemngo]

Decision on I-375 delayed indefinitely

A recommendation on what to do with Detroit's aging I-375 expressway, originally expected more than a year ago, has now been delayed indefinitely.

...

[MDOT spokesperson] Wallace said six options outlined two years ago remain on the table. Those include rebuilding I-375 as is as a below-grade expressway or replacing it with a surface street that would connect better with the rapidly redeveloping east riverfront district. The various options would cost from about $45 million to $80 million for design and construction.