Washington

[Alps]

Yes, clearly the irresponsible 30mph limits are totally to blame.

Nothing will change except the new speed limit signs. Mark my words.

The bright side is that now SDOT can bend around the 85th percentile rules a bit more and design streets that make sense for 25 mph.

I will concede that, yes. Streets with limits far less or far more than their design speed are likely to be ignored (eg I-5 with a 15 mph limit, or a residential street with a 60 mph limit). If we want drivers to go faster or slower, the street designs absolutely need to reflect that.

For residential streets, we need chicanes, speed tables, raised crossings, traffic circles, and narrow lanes. For arterials, you can at least narrow the lanes and reduce the number of areas with center turn lanes (i.e. 10-foot traversable medians).

Looking at a road like 23rd/24th between Montlake and Madison, I would narrow the road by half its current width: one lane each direction (two 10-foot lanes), meandering slightly to create some curves, two-way cycle track on one side, widened sidewalks, and street trees. Yeah, the capacity is reduced, but honestly, who cares? If Vision Zero is 100% about safety, capacity has absolutely no place in street design anymore.

May as well go with zero lanes in that case.

[jakeroot]

May as well go with zero lanes in that case.

I'm not a complete animal. You'd still need some public ROW for essential services.

Expanding on your thought, I think many overplay the importance of pedestrianized spaces. So many have been abject failures (Fresno, Tacoma, etc) and although there have been many successful implementations, the people were already there to inhabit the space. Less cars ≠ more pedestrians.

[compdude787]

Ugh, I hate 25 mph speed limits on arterials. I for one will not be following these new speed limits except in downtown, which is probably the only place where such slow speed limits make sense.

[stevashe]

Ugh, I hate 25 mph speed limits on arterials. I for one will not be following these new speed limits except in downtown, which is probably the only place where such slow speed limits make sense.

Well the downtown streets were already at 25 mph as of 2016 anyway. And really you can't go fast on most arterials within Seattle anyway outside of the industrial areas, not that changing the number on a sign will make much of a difference anyway.

In other news, as of this week I'm actually working as a contractor at SDOT through my company, so it'll be interesting getting more of an inside look on what's going on there.

[compdude787]

^ Sure, you can't go much faster than 30 or 35 on most arterials in Seattle, but for whatever reason, going 25 just seems painfully slow compared to 30. I do have no problem driving 25 on most residential streets in Seattle, but arterials? Kill me now.

[stevashe]

https://twitter.com/wsdot_traffic/status/1215419667457572864

SR520 was closed overnight last week to remove a damaged sign bridge west of the Montlake Blvd exit, just got a picture of the temporary sign for the wesbound Montlake Exit today:



This is what was there before, for reference: https://goo.gl/maps/d2e944zKbUuqDwun7. There was also a separate "Last exit before toll" sign just before these signs. Didn't get a good look to see if any signs for I-5 were present in the other direction unfortunately.

[kwellada]

http://www.southsoundtalk.com/2020/02/07/always-under-construction-the-origins-of-i-5/

Interesting article I just came across regarding I-5 in Tacoma: "Always under construction"

[jakeroot]

http://www.southsoundtalk.com/2020/02/07/always-under-construction-the-origins-of-i-5/

Interesting article I just came across regarding I-5 in Tacoma: "Always under construction"

Great article. Love a bit of history reading.

I get why construction in Tacoma is annoying, but I don't think there's enough credit given to what has been done. I-5 and 16 are basically unrecognizable from what they used to look like. Hell, 16 had a left turn at Center Street until the early 90s, IIRC.

[kwellada]

I get why construction in Tacoma is annoying, but I don't think there's enough credit given to what has been done. I-5 and 16 are basically unrecognizable from what they used to look like. Hell, 16 had a left turn at Center Street until the early 90s, IIRC.

I've lived in Tacoma only 3 years and I barely remember what that area looked like then!  I am fortunate, however, in that my house is in a spot where I can avoid the curve and get off the freeway at 56th or 38th going north, or Highway 7 or Portland Ave if I'm coming south.   So the project has been less of a hassle for me than most.

[jakeroot]

I get why construction in Tacoma is annoying, but I don't think there's enough credit given to what has been done. I-5 and 16 are basically unrecognizable from what they used to look like. Hell, 16 had a left turn at Center Street until the early 90s, IIRC.

I've lived in Tacoma only 3 years and I barely remember what that area looked like then!  I am fortunate, however, in that my house is in a spot where I can avoid the curve and get off the freeway at 56th or 38th going north, or Highway 7 or Portland Ave if I'm coming south.   So the project has been less of a hassle for me than most.

I too am fortunate, but only because I walk almost everywhere here near downtown. I use my car only a couple days a week at most. But everywhere has definitely changed a lot!

The Eastside really is well-connected on all sides.

[Bruce]

Just came across this while searching some Spokane newspaper archives: in the early 1960s, a few cities in Grant County wanted to have a "US 2 Alt" on the western section of what is now SR 28 from Wenatchee to Soap Lake, continuing onto SR 17 to Coluee City. The group originally wanted to reroute US 2 entirely, but settled on lobbying for an alternate designation. (Spokesman-Review, April 18, 1963)

Even the revised plan was opposed by business interests in Wenatchee and Waterville, and it was denied by the U.S. Numbering Committee. (Spokane Chronicle, July 9, 1963)

[stevashe]

Just came across this while searching some Spokane newspaper archives: in the early 1960s, a few cities in Grant County wanted to have a "US 2 Alt" on the western section of what is now SR 28 from Wenatchee to Soap Lake, continuing onto SR 17 to Coluee City. The group originally wanted to reroute US 2 entirely, but settled on lobbying for an alternate designation. (Spokesman-Review, April 18, 1963)

Even the revised plan was opposed by business interests in Wenatchee and Waterville, and it was denied by the U.S. Numbering Committee. (Spokane Chronicle, July 9, 1963)

That's an interesting find! Especially seeing as Wenatchee opposed it despite the fact that an Alt US-2 would have met back up with US-2 across the river from Wenatchee due to its routing through downtown at the time. And given US-2's current route that bypasses Wenatchee completely with the bridge across the Columbia that was built north of town, maybe they're regretting their decision as Alt US-2 could have taken over the downtown alignment instead of being left with just a state highway! 

[Bruce]

The recent rainstorms have blocked SR 706 (the road to Paradise and Mount Rainier NP) with a few landslides

https://wsdotblog.blogspot.com/2020/02/sr706-road-to-paradise-muddy-debris.html

[kkt]

The recent rainstorms have blocked SR 706 (the road to Paradise and Mount Rainier NP) with a few landslides

https://wsdotblog.blogspot.com/2020/02/sr706-road-to-paradise-muddy-debris.html

And now open again, alternating one-way traffic, during the day.

[CtrlAltDel]

The recent rainstorms have blocked SR 706 (the road to Paradise and Mount Rainier NP) with a few landslides

https://wsdotblog.blogspot.com/2020/02/sr706-road-to-paradise-muddy-debris.html

I'm amazed the power lines stayed up.

[ErmineNotyours]

Add this to the list of "This road to be extended in the future": Lacey.  "Future street connection."

[BloonsTDFan360]

^^^
If you really want more examples of that I have a few that I know of from Clark County.

https://www.google.com/maps/@45.688054,-122.6277094,3a,15y,171.82h,85.71t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1saDHcKaUWTr1aV0OsaSQDuw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@45.6876863,-122.6371158,3a,15y,81.62h,85.89t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sWvi8wW8hZf7pcPR87plpiw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@45.5966998,-122.4691818,3a,39.8y,175.2h,86.3t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s_CRBL_8Tlabhm6Q6dtI0YQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 (this is the old Sharp factory entrance on the Vancouver-Camas border)

[jakeroot]

There seems to be a ton of these in Washington State (I've posted a bunch of examples of the forum already). Yet, I can't recall seeing even one example outside WA. Some exist I'm sure, but they're still much more rare.

That last one (the old Sharp entrance) seems like a really odd one, since the road is already there. Where else would it be extended? If anything, it looks to be closed for reconstruction.

[ErmineNotyours]

Seattle's West Seattle Bridge will close at 7pm until further notice for emergency repairs: West Seattle Blog.

[jakeroot]

Seattle's West Seattle Bridge will close at 7pm until further notice for emergency repairs: West Seattle Blog.

Really great timing with the governor's new announcement about "stay-in" order.

I'll be interested to see how they will allow freight onto the Spokane Street Viaduct without allowing personal vehicles. "Trucks only" VMSs?

[jay8g]

I've been listening to the KCM radio this evening and the coordinators have been telling drivers that the West Seattle Bridge closure is expected to last at least a year. I really hope that's not actually going to happen and it's just a miscommunication between SDOT and Metro, but if it's real, this could be a very bad situation. I certainly hope that the coronavirus craziness won't last that long, at least...

[kkt]

The West Seattle Bridge was just built in 1984.  It doesn't seem like it should have severe cracking so soon.

[jakeroot]

The West Seattle Bridge was just built in 1984.  It doesn't seem like it should have severe cracking so soon.

Gets me thinking: 1984 bridge...closed for a year? Some serious shit must be going on. Kind of stuff that makes you wonder if the damn thing needs total replacement (again). Weekend closures for maintenance are one thing. Year-long closures? That's more than unusual, and not a good sign.

On the flip-side, the traffic-coordination nerd side of me is looking forward to how the Lower Bridge and West Marginal are going to handle increased traffic demands. Or, better put, how SDOT is going to manage it.

[TEG24601]

The West Seattle Bridge was just built in 1984.  It doesn't seem like it should have severe cracking so soon.

Gets me thinking: 1984 bridge...closed for a year? Some serious shit must be going on. Kind of stuff that makes you wonder if the damn thing needs total replacement (again). Weekend closures for maintenance are one thing. Year-long closures? That's more than unusual, and not a good sign.

On the flip-side, the traffic-coordination nerd side of me is looking forward to how the Lower Bridge and West Marginal are going to handle increased traffic demands. Or, better put, how SDOT is going to manage it.

A couple engineer friends of mine are amazed it ever opened in the first place, given the number of problems with the engineering and construction.  They were very surprised when it survived the Nisqually Earthquake, and not surprised by the cracking, at all.  They tell stories about how that bridge was screwed up from jump.

[jakeroot]

The West Seattle Bridge was just built in 1984.  It doesn't seem like it should have severe cracking so soon.

Gets me thinking: 1984 bridge...closed for a year? Some serious shit must be going on. Kind of stuff that makes you wonder if the damn thing needs total replacement (again). Weekend closures for maintenance are one thing. Year-long closures? That's more than unusual, and not a good sign.

On the flip-side, the traffic-coordination nerd side of me is looking forward to how the Lower Bridge and West Marginal are going to handle increased traffic demands. Or, better put, how SDOT is going to manage it.

A couple engineer friends of mine are amazed it ever opened in the first place, given the number of problems with the engineering and construction.  They were very surprised when it survived the Nisqually Earthquake, and not surprised by the cracking, at all.  They tell stories about how that bridge was screwed up from jump.

That's not terrifying at all Hopefully they're exaggerating a bit.