Poll
Question:
Should Online Mapping (Google Maps for example) Sights Have Accurate State Route Shields?
Option 1: Yes, i think they should.
Option 2: No, i think they shouldn't.
Choose Accurate Shields, Or Ovals.
Accurate spelling helps, too.
I CAN'T STAND when a business draws a map and has a us route with an interstate shield, state route with a US shield, etc.
It would be nice, but definitely not a necessity. Outside of the roadgeek community, does it really matter to anyone (the majority of their target users)? General accuracy of the rest of the mapping data should be priority. They need to work on getting the classification right before embarking on individual shields.
The maps should be listed 'for amusement only'. The shields are the least of the problems.
Here are some reasons that it would be better:
1. In Florida, and Texas, it would allow differentiation between tolled and non-tolled routes. Since they have different markers in the field, why not on the maps also?
2. In Texas, it would allow map users to actually differentiate between FM and county roads. The current system of using the rectangle for both is very annoying. Also, county roads should be marked textually if they are only marked with street name blades in the field.
3. In Tennessee, it would allow map users to differentiate between primary and secondary routes, which are also signed differently in the field.
Basically, using the one-size fits all circle/oval or rectangle does not give map users adequate information.
Reasons Against:
1. It requires using a larger shield to get the same number size as with the circle/oval.
Quote from: texaskdog on February 03, 2017, 01:14:18 PM
I CAN'T STAND when a business draws a map and has a us route with an interstate shield, state route with a US shield, etc.
Me either. Of course, most non-roadgeeks probably can't tell the difference.
Quote from: texaskdog on February 03, 2017, 01:14:18 PM
I CAN'T STAND when a business draws a map and has a us route with an interstate shield, state route with a US shield, etc.
Or ones that manage to mix them together...
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.ebayimg.com%2Fimages%2Fg%2FIOQAAOxyXzxTGiwK%2Fs-l300.jpg&hash=f364869285becb33a99bfeb3e72d05e39710b6ed)
Quote from: Brian556 on February 03, 2017, 02:48:21 PM
Here are some reasons that it would be better:
1. In Florida, and Texas, it would allow differentiation between tolled and non-tolled routes.
There are better ways of doing this with color that don't lie about the lack of tolls on SR 528 west of exit 4.
Yes, the marking of routes should be done the way Apple does them, with accurate shields.
The roadgeek in me says yes, the regular map user in me says no, the circle used to denote a state route on a map suffices for all 50 states.
I wish there was a choice for "maybe" in the poll. I guess I'll click no so I can see the results.
Yes, because what's on the map should match what a driver would see on the signs.
The ovals are fine. Most drivers don't differentiate between the type of route anyway, just the number. Besides, several state routes, like Utah's or Florida's, are a bit finicky to be really legible at the small sizes required for maps.
Quote from: Ga293 on February 03, 2017, 04:29:41 PM
The ovals are fine. Most drivers don't differentiate between the type of route anyway, just the number. Besides, several state routes, like Utah's or Florida's, are a bit finicky to be really legible at the small sizes required for maps.
Agreed, ovals are fine for online maps, and maps in general.
Though I do like how Ohio's official state map uses Ohio outlines instead of ovals
(note: the map uses geographically correct Ohio outlines, not the outline shape that's used for the official shield) Are there any other states that put their shield (or something similar to their shield) on their state maps instead of ovals?
I own an atlas that does so, but only on the city insets, not on the large-scale pages. I could go either way, but I agree that secondary state routes and county roads should not be labeled the same.
I don't have a problem with ovals used on maps at all, but I would absolutely love to see accurate state route shields being used, and I love such usage on Apple Maps. Needless to say, my vote was for accurate shields (for Yes).
The oval for state routes doesn't bother me per se, but it would be nice to have the correct shields though. I'm more concerned about certain maps having tolled and non-tolled routes the same color (ahem, Google)
Quote from: plain on February 03, 2017, 08:52:58 PM
The oval for state routes doesn't bother me per se, but it would be nice to have the correct shields though. I'm more concerned about certain maps having tolled and non-tolled routes the same color (ahem, Google)
If you zoom in enough on Google Maps, toll roads have a darker outline. (It's not perfect; there are a few places on toll roads where you can get both on and off without paying that Google still marks as having a toll.)
Having correct shields for every jurisdiction around the world would require a ton of unique shield types. I feel like the effort required isn't worth it to 99% of the users on Google Maps. Though I wish a few select roads had their own shields though (not listed as the "generic" shields on Google).
Quote from: SignGeek101 on February 03, 2017, 09:06:01 PM
Having correct shields for every jurisdiction around the world would require a ton of unique shield types. I feel like the effort required isn't worth it to 99% of the users on Google Maps. Though I wish a few select roads had their own shields though (not listed as the "generic" shields on Google).
They already have the correct design at country level. With ~100 designs around the world (complete guess; most countries have separate designs for freeways and non-freeways, but some countries have the same design or almost the same as other countries), adding another ~75 for states (more than 50 because of various state secondaries, various county designs, NJTPK, etc.) should not be too hard.
Quote from: epzik8 on February 03, 2017, 02:55:20 PM
Quote from: texaskdog on February 03, 2017, 01:14:18 PM
I CAN'T STAND when a business draws a map and has a us route with an interstate shield, state route with a US shield, etc.
Me either. Of course, most non-roadgeeks probably can't tell the difference.
I was talking with someone at work today who pointed to a US highway shield on Google Maps and referred to it as a "county road". I told him to get away from me.
Quote from: Buck87 on February 03, 2017, 05:42:34 PM
Are there any other states that put their shield (or something similar to their shield) on their state maps instead of ovals?
Michigan used ovals for some time and then switched to diamonds in 2008 or 2009. Now the numbers in the diamonds are about 2/3 the size they were in the ovals. Yeah, that's an improvement :rolleyes:.
(Diamonds were used long ago but that was when the state maps were printed larger and so the diamonds and route numbers were larger. This old fart can't read any current Michigan maps without a freaking microscope.)
Mapquest uses the state shields, and I love them for it. They have some beautiful rendering for being an online mapping tool. If only their interface (and especially their app) weren't so bulky and cumbersome.
Quote from: coatimundi on February 04, 2017, 01:49:31 AM
Mapquest uses the state shields, and I love them for it. They have some beautiful rendering for being an online mapping tool. If only their interface (and especially their app) weren't so bulky and cumbersome.
Oh wow, I haven't used Mapquest much so I've never noticed that. Now that I look at Mapquest I can see how that is so. How cool!! :awesomeface:
I can't decide. So, here's a question to help me:
If states shouldn't have accurate markers, why should countries? Why not just use, say, squares for all Interstates, Mexican federal routes, the TCH, etc.?
Once we know the rationale for differentiating at the national level, then perhaps we can extend it to the sub-national level, and see whether it's still appropriate.
Quote from: Buck87 on February 03, 2017, 05:42:34 PM
.....
Are there any other states that put their shield (or something similar to their shield) on their state maps instead of ovals?
Virginia has always done that, but then, our state shield is an easy one.
I've always thought the accurate shields in Apple Maps look pretty good.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2F8217ada4b60d8c21208d1e82608815ca_zpsdogvbyst.jpg&hash=cc3e304a0e8d2cc4cc8dbbc858a3dd648d416901) (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2F971a6b5001b26be24683b3aaffa942fb_zpsglznigr7.jpg&hash=cf69594751e252de475c1e9f3a5ae0ca260a66d0)
Quote from: 1 on February 03, 2017, 08:59:04 PM
Quote from: plain on February 03, 2017, 08:52:58 PM
The oval for state routes doesn't bother me per se, but it would be nice to have the correct shields though. I'm more concerned about certain maps having tolled and non-tolled routes the same color (ahem, Google)
If you zoom in enough on Google Maps, toll roads have a darker outline. (It's not perfect; there are a few places on toll roads where you can get both on and off without paying that Google still marks as having a toll.)
I don't see them. Some ramps have them, but not the toll roads themselves, and it's very inconsistent.
MapQuest also stopped showing toll roads when they did their redesign.
Quote from: 1995hoo on February 04, 2017, 12:12:51 PM
Quote from: Buck87 on February 03, 2017, 05:42:34 PM
.....
Are there any other states that put their shield (or something similar to their shield) on their state maps instead of ovals?
Virginia has always done that, but then, our state shield is an easy one.
I've always thought the accurate shields in Apple Maps look pretty good.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2F8217ada4b60d8c21208d1e82608815ca_zpsdogvbyst.jpg&hash=cc3e304a0e8d2cc4cc8dbbc858a3dd648d416901) (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2F971a6b5001b26be24683b3aaffa942fb_zpsglznigr7.jpg&hash=cf69594751e252de475c1e9f3a5ae0ca260a66d0)
Having seen these screenshots and just now looking at Mapquest for the first time in forever, I wish I could change my vote in this thread's poll. State shields can actually work very nicely on electronic maps.
It does not bother me either way. Keep in mind that we are getting into a lot of shields when we include the 50 U.S. states, plus the neighbors to the north in Canada, and to the south in Mexico (though I have not been enough in Mexico to know if there is much in the way of shields beyond the federal one).
Then there are county shields and state secondary system shields too.
Quote from: cpzilliacus on February 04, 2017, 08:54:51 PM
It does not bother me either way. Keep in mind that we are getting into a lot of shields when we include the 50 U.S. states, plus the neighbors to the north in Canada, and to the south in Mexico (though I have not been enough in Mexico to know if there is much in the way of shields beyond the federal one).
Then there are county shields and state secondary system shields too.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2F279a77f14b697e0b277e73ef20ac1bb0_zpsnidvpjgg.jpg&hash=733c1f03a3f0212db9e344edfcc1d160a2d9c488) (https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2Fefcb2294307fa91df5b6061c1186a22c_zps5cry7aie.jpg&hash=a017afd7426529955b98aa0d5fd2197e89915449)
Panning around New Jersey and Florida didn't reveal any county shields.
Edited: Found one panning around north of Venice.
(https://www.aaroads.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi31.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fc378%2F1995hoo%2FRoad%2520sign%2520pictures%2F4d01d71cbeb2e7daf776f625dea61150_zpscdcjycln.jpg&hash=89e155d229141d7261b6e3058cda018a9ebd3bbb)
(Edited a second time on Sunday morning to remove a carriage return I hadn't noticed when posting via iPad.)
About the only complaint I have with the marker rendering in Apple Maps concerns county roads. The app uses the blue pentagon for all of Michigan's county roads, even though many counties still use the older squares. I cut them some slack over the complexity to deal with the variation at the county level though.
Quote from: bulldog1979 on February 04, 2017, 09:22:46 PM
About the only complaint I have with the marker rendering in Apple Maps concerns county roads. The app uses the blue pentagon for all of Michigan's county roads, even though many counties still use the older squares. I cut them some slack over the complexity to deal with the variation at the county level though.
For Florida, Apple randomly uses either the county pentagon or the
state route shield (486, 807, and 809 are listed as state when all of 486 and sections of 807 and 809 should actually be county roads).
Quote from: coatimundi on February 04, 2017, 01:49:31 AM
Mapquest uses the state shields, and I love them for it. They have some beautiful rendering for being an online mapping tool. If only their interface (and especially their app) weren't so bulky and cumbersome.
...and their vector set more comprehensive. Got sick of sending them correction after correction when directions would not go past the intersection for various parks and recreational sites (e.g., Their directions were ridiculous for far too long for Smith Falls State Park in Nebraska (highest falls in the state) or the Mississippi/Missouri Confluence Park, with directions ending miles away from the parks themselves). When your business is to give directions and you can't do it, forget it.
Quote from: Duke87 on February 03, 2017, 11:09:43 PM
Quote from: epzik8 on February 03, 2017, 02:55:20 PM
Quote from: texaskdog on February 03, 2017, 01:14:18 PM
I CAN'T STAND when a business draws a map and has a us route with an interstate shield, state route with a US shield, etc.
Me either. Of course, most non-roadgeeks probably can't tell the difference.
I was talking with someone at work today who pointed to a US highway shield on Google Maps and referred to it as a "county road". I told him to get away from me.
Maybe a county road ran concurrent to it, or the dude is utterly stupid.