IN/IL: I-64 bridges over Wabash River being replaced

Started by jnewkirk77, August 19, 2024, 10:44:37 PM

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jnewkirk77

IDOT is starting the project to replace the deteriorating I-64 bridges across the Wabash River between Indiana and Illinois. Cost will be $136 million, and the project is expected to be complete in the fall of 2029.

Story from WFIE-TV, Evansville.


Rothman

That timeline seems drawn out.  Here in NY, I'd think it would be a three-season job rather than four-plus.

Wonder what is causing construction to go that long in the design of the bridge.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

edwaleni

The bridge is being replaced early because it has a foundational problem at the piers.  Mostly due to scour.

It is the same issue that caused the nearby railroad bridge to fail in 2005.

After flood changed the course of the Wabash, it stopped circulating through the Grayville Oxbow and now flows straight through, causing massive erosion on the west bank.

IDOT has been fighting a lost cause trying to keep the west pylon stable along with the west bank at the approach. Even though IDOT identified the issue over 20 years ago (back when the railroad bridge fell), due to funding issues in Illinois, they have been spending about a million every couple of years trying to stabilize the situation.

With the recent gas tax passage, IDOT immediately moved the bridge rating from fair to critical to move it up the priority list. (funny, how that happens) Plans immediately were made to replace it.

As to why it will take 4 cycles, I will have to find out, as I can only speculate at the moment.

FixThe74Sign

#3
The article says work started Monday but construction won't start until 2028. Perhaps the work this season is just the median crossovers being built, plus maybe some shoulder prep work to handle the one way traffic on one side. And then the heavy work won't start until 2028.

vdeane

This appears to be a pretty involved project.  Shifting the traffic to the EB side is what's going on now according to the article.  After that would be demolition of the WB side, construction of both sides of the new bridge in place where the existing WB side is, to be finished in 2028.  Then the year after would be the demolition of the existing EB side.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.

Rothman

Quote from: vdeane on August 20, 2024, 12:50:28 PMThis appears to be a pretty involved project.  Shifting the traffic to the EB side is what's going on now according to the article.  After that would be demolition of the WB side, construction of both sides of the new bridge in place where the existing WB side is, to be finished in 2028.  Then the year after would be the demolition of the existing EB side.

Eh, see the I-481/CSX bridge replacement in Syracuse.  Same deal, faster time.

The pier issue mentioned above is probably playing a role in the extended timeframe.
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position(s) of NYSDOT.

edwaleni

Looking at the image below you can see the following:

- Grayville Oxbow at the top (Kingdom Island)
- The center channel of the Wabash used to follow the state line
- The missing span of the railroad bridge just north of I-64
- The railroad bridge has a turn span back when the Wabash was navigible (as far as Terre Haute)
- But the channel has shifted so far to the west, the turn span is now in the trees on the east sand bar
- Also there is a geography change that is hidden less than 100 feet below the surface on the Illinois side, but not on the Indiana side, where a pre-historic rock shelf exists.
- The bridge is functionally obsolete as it has no shoulders.



As for that railroad bridge, it was built in 1881 and was supposed to be part of a rail-trail until this happened due to the 2005 flood. It cost the ACoE a ton of dough to get it removed.


edwaleni

Quote from: FixThe74Sign on August 20, 2024, 09:24:00 AMThe article says work started Monday but construction won't start until 2028. Perhaps the work this season is just the median crossovers being built, plus maybe some shoulder prep work to handle the one way traffic on one side. And then the heavy work won't start until 2028.

The cross overs in the median already exist, but I wouldn't be surprised if they are expanding the shoulders for a mile of so on each side.

Also the "work" may involve soil sampling, sediment and depth evaluations, etc.

Also not discussed very much is that this bridge resides near an active fault (Wabash Valley Fault Zone)


Stephane Dumas

Quote from: edwaleni on August 21, 2024, 01:58:52 PMAlso not discussed very much is that this bridge resides near an active fault (Wabash Valley Fault Zone)


Seeing how close the Wabash and New Madrid seismic zones are, I wonder if they could be part of the same seismic system?

jnewkirk77

Quote from: Stephane Dumas on August 21, 2024, 03:18:56 PMSeeing how close the Wabash and New Madrid seismic zones are, I wonder if they could be part of the same seismic system?

Geologists generally consider them separate, but study is ongoing. There is one school of thought that the Wabash Valley zone could be a branch of the New Madrid. Differences between the two tend to discount that somewhat, but it is possible.

Kaskaskia Engineering prepared the Structure Geotechnical Report for the bridges about 5 years ago.

edwaleni



While technically, there are no faults that run from the New Madrid zone to the Wabash Valley zone, geologists believe that they do have a relationship with each other.

Since the 1811-1812 New Madrid quakes, overall activity in the New Madrid Zone has slowed down, while activity in the Wabash has been increasing. There is a belief that some of the pressure that was released then has transferred in part to the Wabash.

A question I get a lot is why is their a fault zone in the middle of the US?

Back in the early days of the earth (Pangaea) when North America split from South America, another split started in the forming North American continent which created a north/south rift zone, not unlike the one in Africa. (Its why the Ozarks and Appalachia are split in two).  Then the split stopped, likely due to a more stronger plate movement from the west.

The New Madrid Fault Zone sits on where the farthest reach of that ancient split ended millions of years ago. Since then the rift zone it left behind has been filled in by millions of years of oceans and sediments from rivers and glacial melt. The mountains left behind still stand.

It is not unusual when there is a significant quake on the San Andreas or other major west coast fault, a follow up quake, most of them small will occur in the New Madrid zone.

I recall a 6.0 quake occurred on the San Andreas, and 2 days later the New Madrid had 2 quakes in the 3-4 range, then a quake followed in North Carolina the day after that. All part of the global relationship between the various plates as they move, shift and relieve pressure.

Georgia

#11
interesting stuff about the seismic zones, now i know why i had to hide under my desk in elementary school in east central IL growing up.

also, never thought given its size that i would see Sidell on here heh

RoadWarrior56

I think the two seismic zones must be related.  I lived in Evansville IN from age 10 in 1967 until I graduated college.  I was playing sandlot football in my back yard in the fall of '68, and I clearly felt the earthquake that hit the Evansville area and caused minor damage.  That earthquake originated in the New Madrid area, at least as I recalled.

CtrlAltDel

Quote from: edwaleni on August 21, 2024, 10:33:32 AM- The railroad bridge has a turn span back when the Wabash was navigible (as far as Terre Haute)
- But the channel has shifted so far to the west, the turn span is now in the trees on the east sand bar

Just to make sure I'm following right, what is a turn span?
I-290   I-294   I-55   (I-74)   (I-72)   I-40   I-30   US-59   US-190   TX-30   TX-6

edwaleni

Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on August 22, 2024, 06:14:59 AMI think the two seismic zones must be related.  I lived in Evansville IN from age 10 in 1967 until I graduated college.  I was playing sandlot football in my back yard in the fall of '68, and I clearly felt the earthquake that hit the Evansville area and caused minor damage.  That earthquake originated in the New Madrid area, at least as I recalled.

The 1968 Quake originated just west of Evansville.



The USGS at the time called it a New Madrid related quake. But since further research has been done on the Wabash Valley zone, they discovered the Cottage Grove fault in Illinois.

I lived in southern Illinois when this quake took place and was playing football in the neighbors backyard. I was also there for the 1972 and 1974 quakes. The 1974 quake occurred during a tornado warning and it took down all our book shelves. We thought a tornado was coming through.

While visiting in Indiana, a quake struck in the middle of the night. But it was the dogs barking around the neighborhood for at least 30 seconds before the vibration started that woke me up. Shook the house pretty good.

There are some quake specialists who are more worried about the Wabash zone than the New Madrid.

edwaleni

Quote from: CtrlAltDel on August 22, 2024, 11:00:13 AMJust to make sure I'm following right, what is a turn span?

Same as a swing span.  A bridge that turns on a round pylon so ships can pass through.

This bridge had a rope system, where when a ship was coming up/down the river they would yell or toot their horn.

The bridge tender would unlock the span and the horse/donkey would pull the rope and the span would turn.

After the boat passed, the donkey/horse would go to the other side of the tracks and pull the rope to bring the span back. The tender would relock the span. Somehow, there was a semaphore on each side of the bridge to warn trains that the bridge was open. How that operated at the time is not known.

Navigation of the Wabash ceased in 1931 when the lock at Mt Carmel was retired and the dam was blasted away, the bridge was left locked in place.

CtrlAltDel

Quote from: edwaleni on August 22, 2024, 11:30:34 AM
Quote from: CtrlAltDel on August 22, 2024, 11:00:13 AMJust to make sure I'm following right, what is a turn span?

Same as a swing span.  A bridge that turns on a round pylon so ships can pass through.

Ahhh. And that would be this one:



Which is no longer anywhere near where boats would go. Now I'm firing on all cylinders.
I-290   I-294   I-55   (I-74)   (I-72)   I-40   I-30   US-59   US-190   TX-30   TX-6

CtrlAltDel

On a side note, I'm fascinated by how this process of change happens.

Here is the area in 1959:


And you can see how things are changing by 1973:
I-290   I-294   I-55   (I-74)   (I-72)   I-40   I-30   US-59   US-190   TX-30   TX-6

jnewkirk77

Quote from: edwaleni on August 21, 2024, 01:58:52 PMThe cross overs in the median already exist, but I wouldn't be surprised if they are expanding the shoulders for a mile of so on each side.

As of yesterday, they were digging out the crossover on the IL side, down to the sub-base. With this job taking as long as it's going to, they likely want to go deeper to support heavier vehicles better.  The old one they were working on did not go nearly as deep as the road.

edwaleni

Another interesting item with regards to building bridges in this area is the fact, this part of Illinois and Indiana are rich with coal deposits starting at around 60 feet below the ground with additional seams farther down.

I remember that there was a huge coal mine north of Grayville (called the Keensburg Mine) that had been in operation since the 1920's and finally closed down in 2007.

For grins I looked up just how far south that mine ran to see how close it was to I-64, it only got as far as 2 miles north of town, but this picture only shows half of it. It was a massive operation that covered 40 sq miles on both sides (and under) the Wabash River. They would have kept going if not for the drop in coal prices.



And for what its worth, they could see many of the fault lines for this zone, the coal seams were disjointed in places.

Can you imagine driving a piling for a new bridge, right into an abandoned coal mine?

RoadWarrior56

There was a big coal mine in Lynnville, IN, which is along the I-64 corridor.  Our 8th grade class took a field trip from Evansville to visit it.  There is lots of coal throughout SW Indiana, SE Illinois and western Kentucky.

ilpt4u

Quote from: RoadWarrior56 on September 04, 2024, 06:32:31 AMThere was a big coal mine in Lynnville, IN, which is along the I-64 corridor.  Our 8th grade class took a field trip from Evansville to visit it.  There is lots of coal throughout SW Indiana, SE Illinois and western Kentucky.
Active coal mines in SE and SW Illinois, or just across Southern IL works

jnewkirk77

Quick update:

Two-way traffic is now being maintained on the EB bridge. Dismantling of the WB bridge is underway, but will likely be held up a few days for the incoming winter storm forecast to hit the Evansville Tri-State area late in the weekend into Monday.

The Skeeter Mountain welcome center is now closed since WB traffic doesn't return to the WB lanes until closer to the welcome center on-ramp.



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