“Letter county roads” north of St. Paul, MN - how did they come to be?

Started by KCRoadFan, December 06, 2024, 06:43:26 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

KCRoadFan

And why is there no "County A" in that sequence?

As someone who's often been to the Twin Cities (I have relatives there), one part of the metro that's always fascinated me is the series of east-west roads north of St. Paul that are just called "County" followed by a letter, beginning with County B and County C in Roseville and working their way north through the alphabet in various northern suburbs, eventually finishing up at County J in Circle Pines.

This has always fascinated me because those names, as far as I know, aren't official county designations, but rather are just used as street names. Confusingly enough, some of those roads *do* have official county designations - but unlike in neighboring Wisconsin, which has lettered county roads, the county road designations in Minnesota all have numbers, and the ones on the "letter county roads" are no different. For example, "County C" in Roseville (the street name) is officially designated as Ramsey County Highway 23.

Anyway, that makes me wonder: how did the "letter county road" system come to be? My guess is that at one time way back when, the letters actually *were* official county road designations, and after the county switched from letters to numbers, residents were so familiar with the letter system that the county retained the letter names as street names. In addition, why is there no "County A", and what road would be the equivalent? From what I can remember, the next major street south of County B is Larpenteur Avenue, which I believe is the northern boundary of the city of St. Paul itself, or at least runs close to it.

By the way, might anyone be able to give me any insights into how the lettered county road street names came to be? I'm curious to know!


Mapmikey

County Rd A was on today's Larpenter Ave between Hamline and County Line (with a gap)
County Rd A2 was on today's Roselawn Ave between Rice and Arcade
County Rd B2 still exists paralleling north of MN 36 from Long Lake to I-35E and also from Edgerton to Arcade
County Rd C2 still exists between MN 51 and Victoria west off Lake Owasso
County Rd G2 was on today's Tanglewood below Turtle Lake
County Rd H2 still exists in Mound Lake and also west of Eagle Lake

These are labeled on the 1948 Ramsey County map but not on the 1936 one.

They are however on this 1931 Plat map.

They are labeled with shields on this 1956 Shell Map.  This map implies there are no other county routes like they have numbered in surrounding counties but the 1936 map above shows county numbers.

I'm puzzled why only the north half has them and only on E-W roads.

MNtoOC

Since I live in Ramsey County, I refer to 96 as County Road G just for my own amusement, since it, like County Road A, is missing.

I've only ever found a passing reference from Steve Riner that they were just an old Ramsey County naming convention. See https://www.steve-riner.com/mnhighways/countyrtes.htm

froggie

Quote from: Mapmikey on December 06, 2024, 09:10:15 PMI'm puzzled why only the north half has them and only on E-W roads.

Because, for most intents, the south half of the county is the city of St. Paul, which already had a street grid established.  The north-south roads are continuations of St. Paul city streets of the same names...Lexington, Snelling, Fairview, Hamline, etc etc.

"County Road A" wasn't and isn't used in practice because of the already established Larpentur Ave along the same section line.

Mapmikey

Quote from: froggie on December 07, 2024, 12:09:19 AM
Quote from: Mapmikey on December 06, 2024, 09:10:15 PMI'm puzzled why only the north half has them and only on E-W roads.

Because, for most intents, the south half of the county is the city of St. Paul, which already had a street grid established.  The north-south roads are continuations of St. Paul city streets of the same names...Lexington, Snelling, Fairview, Hamline, etc etc.

"County Road A" wasn't and isn't used in practice because of the already established Larpentur Ave along the same section line.

This makes sense.  What makes less sense is why the county couldn't come up with real road names when they decided to go with letters.  For comparison, almost all counties in Virginia had names for nearly all their roads on the 1932 county maps.

GaryV

Quote from: Mapmikey on December 07, 2024, 03:59:35 PMWhat makes less sense is why the county couldn't come up with real road names when they decided to go with letters.  For comparison, almost all counties in Virginia had names for nearly all their roads on the 1932 county maps.

Because it was in the North West Territory and followed the range and township surveying. (Which was applied to many other areas afterwards.) They simply decided to name the roads following the mile survey lines with letters. It's no different than other counties around the Midwest that may have "Mile Roads" which are simply numbers. Or locations that have First St, Second St, etc.

Kalamazoo County Michigan is another that has letter road names. But instead of "B2" for a road halfway between B and C, K'zoo would use "BC".

Edit: Neighboring Calhoun County uses "A Drive", "B Drive" etc. And they go both north and south of the baseline. So you see "A Drive North" on a street sign.



Opinions expressed here on belong solely to the poster and do not represent or reflect the opinions or beliefs of AARoads, its creators and/or associates.