Memphis-Huntsville-Atlanta Highway

[Grzrd]

Election season is always a good time to dream about projects; candidates can talk about projects without getting too specific about the requisite money.  Alabama's Democratic gubernatorial candidate recently told a Huntsville audience that he is "committed" to the Memphis-Huntsville-Atlanta Highway:

http://www.whnt.com/news/whnt-ron-sparks-infrastructure-plan-build-roads,0,7654476.story

""I'm committed to the Memphis to Atlanta highway being back on the table, it's been taken off of the table, lets get it back on the table," said Sparks.

He says that new jobs would start showing up immediately once the road program is put together.

"We're talking about a $1.4 billion road program. There are plans that need to be started today and we need the funding to do it and that's real jobs and real programs that we can start all across Alabama immediately."

Sparks says with the nearing completion of 'Corridor X' in Birmingham, federal money will become available for other projects and there are trust fund and guarded bond funding options if the proposed measure is passed in the November election.

"There's a number of things that we can do out there but basically the biggest thing we can do is pass this Constitutional amendment and put this bond issue on top of it before we can go build roads," said Sparks."

Does anyone have any details about Constitutional amendment and related trust fund and guarded bond options that will be on Alabama's ballot in November?

[codyg1985]

For one thing, the routing of the highway in Huntsville is in question because the Army rejected a plan to route the interstate through Redstone Arsenal. Now the city of Huntsville has developed a new route that skirts the north and east boundaries of Redstone Arsenal, but basically what little money that ALDOT had allocated to building this portion of the highway (known locally as the Southern Bypass or Patriot Pkwy) was stripped away from the project due to the Army's rejection of the routing of the highway.

Another thing: between Memphis and Corinth, there really isn't a need for this highway. US 72, with the exception of the two-lane portion SE of Collierville in MS, handles the traffic pretty well. Corinth needs a freeway bypass. It would be nice to see a freeway link between the Shoals and Decatur/Huntsville. It would also be nice to see the freeway built southeast of Huntsville to I-59 and eventually to Atlanta, but I don't know how much demans there is for the route. It's mostly a political thing, as you can very well see in the article you linked to.

[Grzrd]

It would also be nice to see the freeway built southeast of Huntsville to I-59 and eventually to Atlanta, but I don't know how much demans there is for the route. It's mostly a political thing

Maybe Georgia and Alabama could perceive a demand.  I could see the two states sharing a mutual interest in developing the Huntsville to Cartersville, GA section as follows:

From Huntsville to Cartersville, keep routing as it has already been planned.

Then, in Georgia:
From Cartersville, use old proposed Outer Perimeter routing to Canton, Cumming, and Buford.
Then create a southeasterly slant to I-20 from Buford to Monroe and Madison.
Build I-3 from Savannah to Augusta/ I-20.
Multiplex I-3 with I-20 from Augusta to Madison.
Build I-3 "spur" from Augusta to I-85 along already proposed route.

Theoretical Benefits:
Huntsville: Improved viability as a distribution center between Memphis and Atlanta with improved access to Atlanta and Port of Savannah, as well as its current location near I-65.
Muscle Shoals, Decatur, Florence, Tuscumbia: lesser, but similar benefits as Huntsville.
Improved security for Redstone Arsenal (from linked article)?

Georgia:
Improved bypass of Atlanta for freight from Port of Savannah headed for Midwest and West.
Improved freight flow for Port of Savannah in general.
Basically eliminates needs for and "kills" mountain part of I-3 because junction at I-75 near Cartersville would allow freight to either go on to Huntsville, Memphis and beyond via M-H-A Highway or veer northward on I-75 to Chattanooga (then on to Knoxville, or, alternatively, to Nashville via I-24), presumably much cheaper than "mountain" route of I-3.
With commitment to SE slant from Buford to Madison/ I-20; mollify fears of those who would see this as a back-door attempt to build Outer Perimeter.
I-3 "spur" to I-85 would allow for traffic flow for Port of Savannah freight via I-85 to Greenville, S.C. and points beyond.

In Georgia, I-3 is a long way off, but the political battle lines are being drawn regarding the mountains.  Port of Savannah anticipates a need for an improved road network after 2014 Panama Canal expansion, particularly a feasible bypass of Atlanta.  It might be possible to sell the Madison-to-Cartersville link of this freight route as a lesser evil than either the Outer Perimeter or mountain part of I-3, with the added bonus of being able to be completed much more quickly for Port of Savannah's sake than I-3.

[RoadWarrior56]

Dream on folks.  You really think there will be any new major highways built in Georgia in the forseeable future, much less an new interstates?  Georgia really needed the northern Arc, but lacked the political will to get it constructed.  And NIMBY's rule in the areas of Metro Atlanta that need new roadway facilities the most.

It takes years for even a traffic signal to get upgraded in the state these days.  And GDOT is starving for funds, period.  Besides, with the impending completion of Interstate 22, Atlanta already has or soon will have an all-freeway or all-interstate connection with Memphis.  An Atlanta-Memphis connection via Huntsville would only benefit Huntsville.

[Grzrd]

GDOT is starving for funds, period.  Besides, with the impending completion of Interstate 22, Atlanta already has or soon will have an all-freeway or all-interstate connection with Memphis.  An Atlanta-Memphis connection via Huntsville would only benefit Huntsville.

The key Georgia city in the equation is Savannah, not Atlanta.  Last year, Port of Savannah supported 300,000 jobs and handled $46 billion in cargo, which represented 8% of all cargo containers shipped to and from the United States (http://www.businessweek.com/ap/financialnews/D9I01LNO0.htm).  Keeping the containers moving smoothly (and avoiding the Atlanta traffic quagmire as much as possible) is vitally important to 300,000 voters with a common interest; 300,000 voters with a common interest gets the attention of politicians, which should trickle down to GDOT.

Does GDOT "get it" re Savannah?  Although unable to fund a traffic light, GDOT has managed to both get to the position of being able to fund and finish within a few months a 15 year, $1 billion widening of I-95 (http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=129302124) (north-south interstate adjacent to Savannah; a new interstate "equivalent" compared to other states) and recently announced construction of a new $11 million I-95 intersection near Woodbine (http://romenews-tribune.com/view/full_story/9380681/article-DOT-picks-contractors-for-I-95-widening-in-Camden-Co?instance=home_news_lead_story).  Also, the GDOT director has stated that the 3.5 mile Jimmy DeLoach Connector from Port of Savannah to I-95 may well prove to be the most important 3.5 miles of road ever built in Georgia (http://expandingcapacity.transportation.org/unlocking_freight/states/GA_Unlocking_Freight_0610.pdf).  Neither I-95 nor Jimmy DeLoach Connector is anywhere near Atlanta.  GDOT has put both its money and its mouth with Savannah.

All that said, I'm not holding my breath for plan put forth earlier in thread.  BUT, I do not think it is as unrealistic as it would first appear.  Yes, it would benefit Huntsville; that would create political will for Alabama to fund it.  It also would benefit Savannah (and 300,000 jobs), and keeping, and possibly growing, those 300,000 jobs, which in turn would help overall Georgia economy.

[papermater]

No offense to Savannah, but why not focus on the Port of Mobile instead?

Alabama should be focusing on STEALING away ships that currently go to Savannah and show that Mobile is a better call, particularly for Panama Canal traffic.  This way, Alabama just needs to focus on I-65 widening and I-85 widening.

Problem solved.  Mobile > Savannah.

[Grzrd]

No offense to Savannah, but why not focus on the Port of Mobile instead?

Alabama should be focusing on STEALING away ships that currently go to Savannah and show that Mobile is a better call, particularly for Panama Canal traffic.  This way, Alabama just needs to focus on I-65 widening and I-85 widening.

Problem solved.  Mobile > Savannah.

GREAT Point.  Mobile is already on top of its game re Panama Canal.  There has been a recent memo of understanding between Panama Canal Authority and Tenn-Tom authorites re anticipated traffic increase resulting from expansion (http://www.demopolistimes.com/2010/08/31/panama-canal-pact-could-help-demopolis/).

Although it might initially sound like heresy, I would suggest that 92% of pie remaining after Savannah is a whole lotta scraps.  IMHO a super-regional approach re infrastrucure improvements in Southeast could reap great benefits; proximity to PC of Southern Gulf and Atlantic ports gives great initial advantage to these ports.  Maintenance of current and expansion of a few other highway corridors would allow distribution centers in those states to grow along with their respective ports.

Tenn-Tom, I-85 and I-65 improvements SHOULD be primary focus of Alabama.  Keep your bread-and-butter routes humming.  However, thread started with a candidate's dream of a $1.4 billion roads program for Alabama, including M-H-A Highway.  Fully recognizing that it is primarily a dream (I spent my money on "Inception"), the addition of Atlanta and Savannah spokes to Huntsville's heart would  reap great benefits for that city.

Think of Alabama and Georgia as part of a "freightball SEC" (I'll reget that in a.m.); individually seeking dominance within the group; cooperating collectively for superior performance of all.  Now if we could just get Texas to defect ...

EDIT

BTW - Super initial post.  Keep 'em coming!

SECOND EDIT

This memo from I-49 Coalition represents a current multi-state (LADOTD, AHTD, and MoDOT) effort to coordinate activities and funding requests in order to achieve both individual state goals and the goals of the collective region: http://www.interstate49.org/clients/25/media/documents/I-49%20Coalition%20Statement.pdf

[codyg1985]

Huntsville does have a pretty descent-sized air cargo operation in Huntsville where containers are offloaded from planes onto trains and trucks, so a connection to Savannah would help that. I think seeing the highway as a gateway to the Atlantic Ocean from Memphis could help to get Georgia and maybe Tennessee on board, but what about Mississippi? What's in it for them exactly?

[froggie]

federal money will become available for other projects

I want to know what he's smoking.  As long as Congress continues to chicken-away from finding new revenue sources for transportation, there WON'T be federal money coming "available for other projects".

An Atlanta-Memphis connection via Huntsville would only benefit Huntsville.

Agreed.

[Grzrd]

federal money will become available for other projects

I want to know what he's smoking.  As long as Congress continues to chicken-away from finding new revenue sources for transportation, there WON'T be federal money coming "available for other projects".

Sparks says with the nearing completion of 'Corridor X' in Birmingham, federal money will become available for other projects and there are trust fund and guarded bond funding options if the proposed measure is passed in the November election.

"There's a number of things that we can do out there but basically the biggest thing we can do is pass this Constitutional amendment and put this bond issue on top of it before we can go build roads," said Sparks."

Does anyone have any details about Constitutional amendment and related trust fund and guarded bond options that will be on Alabama's ballot in November?

I agree re federal money.  However, I was intrigued by Candidate Sparks' alternative financing  references to the trust fund and guarded bond funding.  I think my original question has been somewhat lost in the shuffle (primarily my fault).

An Atlanta-Memphis connection via Huntsville would only benefit Huntsville.

Agreed.

Atlanta's growth has been primarily as a premier national distribution center.  Georgia has done a magnificent job of constantly expanding the airport and the metro Atlanta interstate infrastructure (remember the days of GDOT's seemingly never-ending "free the freeways" projects?).  Atlanta-Memphis alone would not benefit Atlanta much, if at all.  But that was not the point of my argument; the ill-numbered I-3 proposal  grew primarily out of a recognition that Savannah freight needs a viable bypass of Atlanta traffic.  The more subtle part of that recognition is that some form of bypass would also benefit Atlanta by allowing that city to continue to efficiently achieve its mission as a national distribution center by not clogging up its freeways with freight traffic bound for other parts of the country.

I think seeing the highway as a gateway to the Atlantic Ocean from Memphis could help to get Georgia and maybe Tennessee on board, but what about Mississippi? What's in it for them exactly?

Memphis, like Atlanta, has used its airport for growth as a premier national distribution center.  With the added advantages of a central location in the country and a Mississippi River port, Memphis has branded itself as "America's Aerotropolis".  On Future I-22/US 78, Mississippi is getting downstream benefits (and jobs) through Toyota's recent announcement that it is resuming construction of its plant at Blue Springs ("The Blue Springs plant will employ around 2,000 people in addition to the 60 already there in administrative positions. Other jobs will be created in the surrounding area as suppliers for the car factory.") (http://www.thedmonline.com/article/toyota-plant-resume-construction).  I would expect similar opportunities for Corinth and other Mississippi towns along the M-H-A Highway.

EDIT

Regarding Memphis itself, I will be very interested to read TDOT's conclusions/recommendations regarding the Lamar Avenue/possible I-22 Corridor.  The congested Lamar Avenue creates a "last mile" access to Memphis Airport problem; the Memphis problem is similar to the Jimmy DeLoach Connector/ Port of Savannah "last mile" problem.  Memphis MPO and TDOT are currently planning on releasing possible alternatives in October.
Regarding Memphis and M-H-A Highway, the Bill Morris Parkway already links US 72 with I-240 and I-240's access points to Memphis Airport.

[Grzrd]

Does anyone have any details about Constitutional amendment and related trust fund and guarded bond options that will be on Alabama's ballot in November?

Huntsville Times has a little bit more detail about the alternative financing:

"Here's where Sparks said the $1.4 billion would come from: $1 billion hinges on state voters in November approving an amendment to take up to $100 million annually for 10 years from the state trust fund that is fed by royalties from offshore natural gas wells. Another $400 million would be borrowed in a bond issue backed by federal transportation dollars the state expects to receive, he said."

Also, it looks like he may envision Atlanta-Huntsville-Memphis Highway as a toll road:

"Sparks talked about reviving the southern bypass to avoid much of Redstone Arsenal and the Atlanta to Memphis highway, which would possibly be a toll road across Limestone County to I-565."

(http://blog.al.com/breaking/2010/09/sparks_wants_to_accelerate_roa.html)

[jdb1234]

Wow, Ron Sparks talking about something other than gambling?