I-49 Coming to Missouri

[ModernDayWarrior]

Missouri doesn't even have the money to maintain the roads we already have, much less build new ones. Our state legislature is too busy taking marching orders from Rex Sinquefield to ever enact a serious proposal to adequately fund MoDOT. And Missouri voters rejected out of hand a sales tax proposal that would have paid for our transportation needs back in August (I guess we have to spend our money fixing our cars due to all the potholes instead...) For the Bella Vista Bypass to ever get built, one of two things would have to happen: the Feds paying for almost all of it, or a sea change in Jefferson City. Neither one seems particularly likely to me.

[ARMOURERERIC]

Could Arkansas get away with offering to build it and toll it?

[noelbotevera]

My personal course of action would be to try and suck funding from all the uneeded projects and shift the focus to the Bella Vista Bypass and the remaining sections of Bruce Watkin Drive. I'd still allow funding for major highways such as an I-70 widening, but some unneeded projects could be on hold for now until I-49 is done. I'd then cooperate with Arkansas and then I'd have them toll their side of the deal and split money so both Missouri and Arkansas can recoup some losses.

[mvak36]

Missouri doesn't even have the money to maintain the roads we already have, much less build new ones. Our state legislature is too busy taking marching orders from Rex Sinquefield to ever enact a serious proposal to adequately fund MoDOT. And Missouri voters rejected out of hand a sales tax proposal that would have paid for our transportation needs back in August (I guess we have to spend our money fixing our cars due to all the potholes instead...) For the Bella Vista Bypass to ever get built, one of two things would have to happen: the Feds paying for almost all of it, or a sea change in Jefferson City. Neither one seems particularly likely to me.

And since next year is an election year, I'm not really holding out any hope that they get anything done.

[brycecordry]

One more thing to bear in mind is that Missouri is the sixth or seventh largest highway system in the nation. All the other states with the larger systems have either larger land area to put them in or larger populations to support them. Missouri does not have either. We need to do what Iowa did about 15 or so years ago, by spinning off many of the lettered routes and some numbered routes to the counties or local government. We should then try to reconstruct I-70 as conservatively as possible, by widening into the median and keeping as many existing overpasses as we can. The same conservative principles can be applied to new construction too, by using existing corridors as much as possible, such as my plans for MO-21, I-72, I-66, and even an extension of I-45 into Missouri.

[bjrush]

My personal course of action would be to try and suck funding from all the uneeded projects and shift the focus to the Bella Vista Bypass and the remaining sections of Bruce Watkin Drive. I'd still allow funding for major highways such as an I-70 widening, but some unneeded projects could be on hold for now until I-49 is done. I'd then cooperate with Arkansas and then I'd have them toll their side of the deal and split money so both Missouri and Arkansas can recoup some losses.

All of this is a horrible idea. Missouri made a promise to Arkansas. They can't follow through.  Arkansas will build more road until Missouri looks like even more of a joke than they already are.  Eventually the pressure will work

Feds aren't bailing them out for a mistake they made.  Don't write checks your ass can't cash.  Missouri DOT is a spineless, gutless organization full of fools.

[US71]

My personal course of action would be to try and suck funding from all the uneeded projects and shift the focus to the Bella Vista Bypass and the remaining sections of Bruce Watkin Drive. I'd still allow funding for major highways such as an I-70 widening, but some unneeded projects could be on hold for now until I-49 is done. I'd then cooperate with Arkansas and then I'd have them toll their side of the deal and split money so both Missouri and Arkansas can recoup some losses.

All of this is a horrible idea. Missouri made a promise to Arkansas. They can't follow through.  Arkansas will build more road until Missouri looks like even more of a joke than they already are.  Eventually the pressure will work

Feds aren't bailing them out for a mistake they made.  Don't write checks your ass can't cash.  Missouri DOT is a spineless, gutless organization full of fools.

It's more complicated than that.

MoDOT had the money, AHTD didn't. So MoDOT spent it elsewhere. AHTD finally found some money, but MoDOT had blown all theirs. Of course, with all the improvements on 49 north of Carthage (new Interchanges, new overpasses) I wonder how much of that could have been spent to finish 49 south of Pineville?

[Scott5114]

One more thing to bear in mind is that Missouri is the sixth or seventh largest highway system in the nation. All the other states with the larger systems have either larger land area to put them in or larger populations to support them. Missouri does not have either. We need to do what Iowa did about 15 or so years ago, by spinning off many of the lettered routes and some numbered routes to the counties or local government.

This is what needs to happen. If you spend some time with the official Missouri map you start to realize the lettered route system is insane. So many of these spur off to random patches of rural country, not even to towns. You could dump 90% of them and convert the rest to numbered routes. But that would probably be a political fight, since the counties have grown accustomed to MoDOT doing their work for them (even though in every other state, these roads would be county-controlled).

[NE2]

even though in every other state, these roads would be county-controlled

Except Texas. And Pennsylvania. And Kentucky. And those states that maintain everything.

[Bobby5280]

The spin-off of insignificant routes needs to happen anyway, regardless of the exceptions.

Both Texas and Pennsylvania have much bigger populations than Missouri. Pennsylvania is a bit limited at building up a crazy grid of state-maintained roads due to all the mountainous, woodsy terrain. Texas has a tremendous amount of state-maintained roads, but a pretty good amount of those Farm to Market roads are busy with things like oil patch activity.

Here in Oklahoma I wonder why we have so many section line roads. With the way many rural towns are drying up and dying off it makes little sense to keep maintaining so much infrastructure into those areas. The roads are one thing, but there's lot of bridges and other features that have to be maintained on these roads. The state's transportation budget goes only so far.

Various factors are forcing people to move into urban areas and making it ever more difficult for small towns to survive. Infrastructure cost inflation has been outrageously insane over the past 20 years. I have some relatives in Temple, OK. Many of the streets there are beat to shit and there's no money to fix them. Many towns like Temple no longer have any police department because they no longer have the tax base to support it. Medical services are very limited. Real estate values get driven downward and insurance rates on property & health rise. Finally, very few young people want to stay in small towns for obvious reasons.

I was hoping costs of building materials like concrete and steel would have dropped in response to the current oil industry bust, but that doesn't appear to be happening. It seems like there is very little movement being made with innovations designed to lower the costs of building streets and highways. This cost inflation is going to force state governments to make some pretty tough decisions about lesser highways in rural areas.

[Grzrd]

Just curious, how much would Missouri's state share of the Bella Vista Bypass be?

The estimated cost provided to Missouri voters in advance of the August, 2014 vote for the sales tax increase was $32.49 million:

More recent estimates provided to Missouri voters for the failed August, 2014 sales tax increase attempt were discussed in this post (the link to the document itself does not work; I have not checked to see if MoDOT has archived it elsewhere on its website):
Bella Vista Bypass: $32.49 million

This article, primarily about highway construction in NWA, quotes a MoDOT official as saying that Missouri's Bella Vista Bypass funding gap is now $33.8 million, and that the $33.8 million is in addition to $24.2 million that MoDOT has already set aside for construction of its share of the BVB:

... Dick Trammel, chairman of the Highway Commission ...
Construction is underway on a portion of the 14-mile stretch to extend I-49 around Bella Vista ....
Trammel said the two-lane road will expand to four lanes once Missouri finds funding for its six-mile section to connect the bypass to I-49 in its state.
Frank Miller, planning manager for the Missouri Department of Transportation's Southwest District, said the state has $24.2 million set aside for the project, but a $33.8 million funding gap exists.

I wonder if MoDOT will eventually be tempted to spend the $24.2 million elsewhere if the state cannot find a way to increase highway funding in the next couple of years .........

[ModernDayWarrior]

My personal course of action would be to try and suck funding from all the uneeded projects and shift the focus to the Bella Vista Bypass and the remaining sections of Bruce Watkin Drive. I'd still allow funding for major highways such as an I-70 widening, but some unneeded projects could be on hold for now until I-49 is done. I'd then cooperate with Arkansas and then I'd have them toll their side of the deal and split money so both Missouri and Arkansas can recoup some losses.

There aren't any "unneeded projects" left to cut. MoDOT's funding shortfall is so severe that they can't even keep up with all of the routine maintenance, let alone any new projects.

I personally wouldn't object to a tolled Bella Vista Project, or a tolled I-70 reconstruction for that matter, but I get the sense that tolling is completely unpalatable politically.

[Bobby5280]

Not politically palatable. That is typical of today's voting public; they think the government can magically come up with funding for infrastructure by magically shuffling around things and promise more tax cuts.

The general public has been getting a free ride for the past 15 years as cost inflation has made the gas tax funding mechanism for our streets and highways a laughable joke. The federal gasoline tax hasn't been raised in over 20 years. But it sure costs a whole lot more to build and maintain roads now than it did back in 1992. I'm not even sure if the gasoline tax was covering highway building and maintenance costs back then! Yet today's voters don't want any toll roads and don't want any hikes on fuel taxes either. Something has to give.

Maybe if states started shutting down bridges and sections of highway that have unfunded repair issues it might start to jog a few brain cells within the general public.

[ModernDayWarrior]

Maybe if states started shutting down bridges and sections of highway that have unfunded repair issues it might start to jog a few brain cells within the general public.

This has actually happened in Missouri. I can't find the link right now, but to summarize, a bridge on one of our lettered routes was recently deemed unsafe. MoDOT doesn't have the money to fix it, so they simply shut it down and made traffic detour around it.

And yet we still have no solution. Rex Sinquefield hasn't ordered his stooges in Jefferson City to do anything about it, so naturally they haven't.

[Rothman]

Maybe if states started shutting down bridges and sections of highway that have unfunded repair issues it might start to jog a few brain cells within the general public.

This has actually happened in Missouri. I can't find the link right now, but to summarize, a bridge on one of our lettered routes was recently deemed unsafe. MoDOT doesn't have the money to fix it, so they simply shut it down and made traffic detour around it.

And yet we still have no solution. Rex Sinquefield hasn't ordered his stooges in Jefferson City to do anything about it, so naturally they haven't.

Heh.  It takes closures on significant routes to shake things up.  Here in NY, we rather routinely close down rural bridges that are simply not cost-effective to rebuild without much blowback.  However, if we closed down, say a bridge on the Bronx River Parkway...

[noelbotevera]

Maybe if states started shutting down bridges and sections of highway that have unfunded repair issues it might start to jog a few brain cells within the general public.

This has actually happened in Missouri. I can't find the link right now, but to summarize, a bridge on one of our lettered routes was recently deemed unsafe. MoDOT doesn't have the money to fix it, so they simply shut it down and made traffic detour around it.

And yet we still have no solution. Rex Sinquefield hasn't ordered his stooges in Jefferson City to do anything about it, so naturally they haven't.

Heh.  It takes closures on significant routes to shake things up.  Here in NY, we rather routinely close down rural bridges that are simply not cost-effective to rebuild without much blowback.  However, if we closed down, say a bridge on the Bronx River Parkway...

No, really shake them up by closing down all Hudson River crossings.

[silverback1065]

Maybe if states started shutting down bridges and sections of highway that have unfunded repair issues it might start to jog a few brain cells within the general public.

This has actually happened in Missouri. I can't find the link right now, but to summarize, a bridge on one of our lettered routes was recently deemed unsafe. MoDOT doesn't have the money to fix it, so they simply shut it down and made traffic detour around it.

And yet we still have no solution. Rex Sinquefield hasn't ordered his stooges in Jefferson City to do anything about it, so naturally they haven't.

Heh.  It takes closures on significant routes to shake things up.  Here in NY, we rather routinely close down rural bridges that are simply not cost-effective to rebuild without much blowback.  However, if we closed down, say a bridge on the Bronx River Parkway...

No, really shake them up by closing down all Hudson River crossings.

well that would wake up just about everyone

[Rothman]

Hudson River crossings south of Patroon Island Bridge (I-90) are NYBA or Thruway or PANYNJ...

[Grzrd]

MoDOT draft STIP released. http://modot.org/plansandprojects/construction_program/STIP2016-2020/index.htm
Looks like Bella Vista Bypass has been pushed back to 2019-2020 year (see Page 11 of attached link) 
http://www.modot.org/plansandprojects/construction_program/STIP2016-2020/documents/Sec046aSWRuralPaymentsandProjects.pdf

This article, primarily about highway construction in NWA, quotes a MoDOT official as saying that Missouri's Bella Vista Bypass funding gap is now $33.8 million, and that the $33.8 million is in addition to $24.2 million that MoDOT has already set aside for construction of its share of the BVB

This article reports that MoDOT has received some unexpected good news about its funding situation that will allow it to lift a moratorium on adding new projects to its five-year plan:

The Missouri Department of Transportation said the worst-case scenario of being unable to maintain state infrastructure has been avoided, thanks to federal legislation and an unexpected bump in tax revenue ....
the department confirmed Monday its latest financial forecasts show the situation improving -- so much it can afford to maintain all of the state's roads in their current condition and keep the number of critical condition bridges from rising.
Tax revenue from fuel, licenses and vehicles came in $47 million above projections last fiscal year. In December, Congress passed the first highway authorization in more than seven years, which guarantees increased transportation funding for the next five years.
The Missouri Highways and Transportation Commission voted last week to lift a moratorium on adding projects to its five-year plan. Officials had drafted their plan with estimates that federal funds would drop from $869 million in fiscal year 2016 to $491 million in fiscal year 2021.
Instead, a new federal highway law signed by President Barack Obama provides a 5.1 percent increase in road and bridge funding distributed through a formula to states in 2016, with additional annual increases ranging from 2.1 percent to 2.4 percent through 2020. As with previous highway laws, it requires state and local governments to spend at least $1 for every $4 they receive in federal money.

If new projects can be added to the five-year plan, then I wonder if the Bella Vista Bypass can be moved up a few years in the plan (from the current projected 2020 Award Date indicated in the above link to the Draft STIP).  :



The next STIP should be interesting.

[Bobby5280]

Instead, a new federal highway law signed by President Barack Obama provides a 5.1 percent increase in road and bridge funding distributed through a formula to states in 2016, with additional annual increases ranging from 2.1 percent to 2.4 percent through 2020. As with previous highway laws, it requires state and local governments to spend at least $1 for every $4 they receive in federal money.

I'm wondering if Oklahoma will be able to take advantage of any of that funding. The oil bust is leaving Oklahoma's state budget more and more into the red. They just announced more drastic funding cuts to public education and some other services.

[Revive 755]

This article reports that MoDOT has received some unexpected good news about its funding situation that will allow it to lift a moratorium on adding new projects to its five-year plan:

I would hope MoDOT tries to stick with keeping 90% of the project maintenance related projects.  Additionally, that creative accounting mentioned in the article could backfire on MoDOT.

[SteveG1988]

It's been three years since Interstate 49 came to Missouri. How about changing the subject title to "I-49 in Missouri."

It's still coming south of Pineville

That's what she said

[apjung]

I guess the money saved from not building brand new Football stadium in St. Louis should now be put to use to improve I-49 such as rerouting it in Joplin with a flyover ramp in Carthage, finish the connection to Arkansas and converting Bruce R. Watkins Drive to a freeway.

[Darkchylde]

I guess the money saved from not building brand new Football stadium in St. Louis should now be put to use to improve I-49 such as rerouting it in Joplin with a flyover ramp in Carthage, finish the connection to Arkansas and converting Bruce R. Watkins Drive to a freeway.

The legal fight over the last one might use all of that money, considering how tooth-and-nail the nearby residents have been fighting it.

[US71]

I guess the money saved from not building brand new Football stadium in St. Louis should now be put to use to improve I-49 such as rerouting it in Joplin with a flyover ramp in Carthage, finish the connection to Arkansas and converting Bruce R. Watkins Drive to a freeway.

Missouri taxpayers are still on the hook for payng off the old one .