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Unnecessary Exits

Started by Jmiles32, February 25, 2018, 01:26:22 PM

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Eth

Quote from: mrcmc888 on February 25, 2018, 10:43:21 PM
Exits 1A and B on I-275 through Knoxville spring to mind--both are about a quarter mile from each other and serve the exact same area.  It would be better to eliminate one because neither are very heavily trafficked.

Ah, that reminds me: I-75 exits 63A-B in Tifton, GA. The traffic volume apparently isn't even high enough to warrant traffic lights at the ends of the ramps, just stop signs. Keep the C/D ramps, I guess, but two exits here are surely overkill.


Avalanchez71

I am surprised that no one mentioned I-70 at Breezewood, PA.

Mapmikey

Quote from: Beltway on February 26, 2018, 10:21:30 AM
Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 09:18:38 AM
If it were me I might close Exit 12 when the bridge US 301 uses over that ramp needs to be redone.  It is the original 1958 bridge and the driving surface looked terrible in the latest GMSV.  Surely the cost of realigning US 301 is much smaller than a new bridge.
On the other hand, the AADT for the Exit 12 ramp is 550 while the I-95 ramp to Exit 13 is only 210.  In reality the redundant ramp is the Exit 13 ramp...

Interesting, I didn't realize it would be that high.  Probably because it directly flows into NB US-301.  Maybe the original design of I-95 at VA-614 should have omitted that ramp in lieu of letting the older ramp handle that movement.  Probably wouldn't take much rehab to keep that bridge in service, given the light traffic and low truck volumes.

I was one of the construction inspectors on the I-95 project that included the interchange at VA-645, Exit 24.  We all puzzled over the design of 4 lanes divided on VA-645 in the interchange area.  VA-645 probably has less than 200 AADT.  There never has been any connecting highway planned that would account for that many lanes.  Two lanes with an island with turn lanes would have been fully adequate.  The busy interchange at VA-602, Exit 33 is built that way and handles the traffic fine.

I had an explanation all set for the Exit 12 AADT being twice as high as Exit 13 (probably easier to use Exit 12 to get to some stuff on 301 that is just past SR 614).  But the reason is more likely this, which also makes having the Exit 13 ramp absolutely worthless.  It is illegal to turn left on 614 from the Exit 13 ramp:  https://goo.gl/maps/FKjgCdL6TMw

So you can only turn right which leads immediately to 301 (now an unnecessary ramp because Exit 12 does the same thing).  You have to use Exit 12 to access SR 614 WB.  This fact is not signposted anywhere (it does appear to be legal to make a u-turn at the 614-301 intersection).

The AADT on SR 645 east of I-95 to the metropolis of Henry is all of 90 (misleading as several SRs intersect within the defined segment that have AADTs over 100 each).  West of US 301 it is 180.  Oddly, the ramps to/from I-95 at SR 645 are all more than that (as high as 460).  There is literally nothing at this interchange.

The AADT on SR 602 at Exit 33 between I-95 and US 301 is 5600(!) due to the truck stop and associated services there.  I find this area always congested when I exit here and stoplights would probably be beneficial. 

1995hoo

Quote from: dfilpus on February 26, 2018, 09:48:00 AM
Quote from: 1995hoo on February 25, 2018, 05:55:42 PM
I always thought the Trent Drive partial interchange from the Durham Freeway (NC-147) seemed unnecessary in view of the full interchange at Fulton Street just west of there. I've always assumed it was built to facilitate access to and from Duke Hospital. (I must admit that even though I think it's an unnecessary pair of ramps, I used to use it often enough because I lived in an apartment on Erwin Road just east of Anderson Street, so those ramps were the fastest way to and from Raleigh.)

https://goo.gl/maps/NvM4vPdwg6J2
For years, that exit was the end of the Durham Freeway, while the interchange with US 15/501 was being built.

Ahhh, thanks. Makes a lot more sense now.
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Flint1979

Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 09:18:38 AM
Quote from: Beltway on February 26, 2018, 07:46:12 AM
Quote from: froggie on February 26, 2018, 07:29:57 AM
Quote from: Jmiles32-I-95@US-301 Exit 12 Virginia
Concur (but see below).
Quote from: BeltwayDemolition would have its cost, perhaps at least a half million.
Reconstruction will have its cost as well...likely north of a half-million.  No harm in leaving the ramp in place now.  But when it comes time for reconstruction talk, removing it should be on the table given the presence of Exit 13 just to the north.

But when will it need reconstruction?  Periodic resurfacing every 15 years or so is all it needs.

If it were me I might close Exit 12 when the bridge US 301 uses over that ramp needs to be redone.  It is the original 1958 bridge and the driving surface looked terrible in the latest GMSV.  Surely the cost of realigning US 301 is much smaller than a new bridge.

On the other hand, the AADT for the Exit 12 ramp is 550 while the I-95 ramp to Exit 13 is only 210.  In reality the redundant ramp is the Exit 13 ramp...

If I had to pick an exit as being redundant in Virginia it would be Exit 167 on I-81 for US 11 Buchanan.  I believe VDOT does want to get rid of this exit and use nearby Exit 168 for the connection to US 11.
Seems strange that Exit 12 would see more traffic since it's only an off ramp for NB traffic and Exit 13 is a full exit.

Avalanchez71

I would say that Exit 67 off of I-65 in Franklin, TN was unnecessary; however, the area did grow and it is too difficult to shut it off now.  The exit creates a weave hazard with the heavy traffic entering in from Exit 65 and those wanting to exit 67.  The traffic moved much smoother prior to the exit opening.  There is ample access from both exit 65 and exit 69.

Flint1979

Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 12:59:10 PM
Quote from: Beltway on February 26, 2018, 10:21:30 AM
Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 09:18:38 AM
If it were me I might close Exit 12 when the bridge US 301 uses over that ramp needs to be redone.  It is the original 1958 bridge and the driving surface looked terrible in the latest GMSV.  Surely the cost of realigning US 301 is much smaller than a new bridge.
On the other hand, the AADT for the Exit 12 ramp is 550 while the I-95 ramp to Exit 13 is only 210.  In reality the redundant ramp is the Exit 13 ramp...

Interesting, I didn't realize it would be that high.  Probably because it directly flows into NB US-301.  Maybe the original design of I-95 at VA-614 should have omitted that ramp in lieu of letting the older ramp handle that movement.  Probably wouldn't take much rehab to keep that bridge in service, given the light traffic and low truck volumes.

I was one of the construction inspectors on the I-95 project that included the interchange at VA-645, Exit 24.  We all puzzled over the design of 4 lanes divided on VA-645 in the interchange area.  VA-645 probably has less than 200 AADT.  There never has been any connecting highway planned that would account for that many lanes.  Two lanes with an island with turn lanes would have been fully adequate.  The busy interchange at VA-602, Exit 33 is built that way and handles the traffic fine.

I had an explanation all set for the Exit 12 AADT being twice as high as Exit 13 (probably easier to use Exit 12 to get to some stuff on 301 that is just past SR 614).  But the reason is more likely this, which also makes having the Exit 13 ramp absolutely worthless.  It is illegal to turn left on 614 from the Exit 13 ramp:  https://goo.gl/maps/FKjgCdL6TMw

So you can only turn right which leads immediately to 301 (now an unnecessary ramp because Exit 12 does the same thing).  You have to use Exit 12 to access SR 614 WB.  This fact is not signposted anywhere (it does appear to be legal to make a u-turn at the 614-301 intersection).

The AADT on SR 645 east of I-95 to the metropolis of Henry is all of 90 (misleading as several SRs intersect within the defined segment that have AADTs over 100 each).  West of US 301 it is 180.  Oddly, the ramps to/from I-95 at SR 645 are all more than that (as high as 460).  There is literally nothing at this interchange.

The AADT on SR 602 at Exit 33 between I-95 and US 301 is 5600(!) due to the truck stop and associated services there.  I find this area always congested when I exit here and stoplights would probably be beneficial.
On GMSV SR-645 looks like a single lane road.

Beltway

#32
Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 12:59:10 PM
I had an explanation all set for the Exit 12 AADT being twice as high as Exit 13 (probably easier to use Exit 12 to get to some stuff on 301 that is just past SR 614).  But the reason is more likely this, which also makes having the Exit 13 ramp absolutely worthless.  It is illegal to turn left on 614 from the Exit 13 ramp:  https://goo.gl/maps/FKjgCdL6TMw
So you can only turn right which leads immediately to 301 (now an unnecessary ramp because Exit 12 does the same thing).  You have to use Exit 12 to access SR 614 WB.  This fact is not signposted anywhere (it does appear to be legal to make a u-turn at the 614-301 intersection).

The design would allow left turns, VDOT could remove the sign and allow it if they wanted to.

Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 12:59:10 PM
The AADT on SR 645 east of I-95 to the metropolis of Henry is all of 90 (misleading as several SRs intersect within the defined segment that have AADTs over 100 each).  West of US 301 it is 180.  Oddly, the ramps to/from I-95 at SR 645 are all more than that (as high as 460).  There is literally nothing at this interchange.

There are some farms nearby, but I know of no other businesses within 2 miles.

I would question the official figures for the ramps, however they could be driven by access to US-301 on the west side and the service road F-315 on the east side, traffic that doesn't use the 2-lane portions of VA-645 to the west and east.

Quote from: Mapmikey on February 26, 2018, 12:59:10 PM
The AADT on SR 602 at Exit 33 between I-95 and US 301 is 5600(!) due to the truck stop and associated services there.  I find this area always congested when I exit here and stoplights would probably be beneficial. 

Definitely a number of major businesses nearby.
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NWI_Irish96

I-65 in Indiana. 
I can't figure out why exit 16 was ever necessary to begin with but now it has truck stops so it has become necessary.
Exit 36 really doesn't serve any areas not already served by exits 34 and 41.
The new exit 97 doesn't seem necessary now but this is a high growth area so perhaps it will grow into necessity.
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PHLBOS

Quote from: 1 on February 25, 2018, 01:31:15 PMI nominate Exit 46 on I-95 and Exit 23C on I-495, both in Massachusetts. The first one is served by exits 44 and 50, and the second is to a group of minor streets.
SectorZ countered your nomination of I-495's Exit 23C; I will countermand your nomination of Exit 46 off I-95 southbound... mainly due to its present usage & history regarding how such came to be.

For those heading towards Boston south along I-95, Exit 46 onto US 1 South provides a shorter, smoother transition (with two lanes) than Exit 44 does.  The latter involves a longer, single-lane movement with a cloverleaf ramp.  Prior to 1988, the latter (Exit 44, formerly Exit 30) exited off just MA 128 southbound and not I-95.  From 1975 to 1988, I-95 exited off MA 128 via the US 1 interchange (Exit 44, formerly Exit 30) and followed US 1 to the current Exit 46 location.

While one can use Exit 50 further north to do the same objective without too much fuss; one encounters a lower posted speed limit sooner as well as a higher frequency of vehicles entering & exiting the various businesses along US 1.  Such is the main reason why the signage for Exit 50 (current & previous generations) does not include Boston in it for its US 1 listing.  OTOH, Exit 50 from I-95 South to US 1 South serves as a means of connecting to either MA 62 & 114.  Such would've been the case regardless of whether or not I-95 being built inside of MA 128.

The original plan for Exit 46 was to feature the opposite ramp movements of what's presently there (I-95 North to US 1 North/US 1 South to I-95 South) but the cancellation of building I-95 inside MA 128 rendered building such in that manner as unnecessary.  Since a portion of I-95 between Exit 50 and just south of the Lowell St. overpass was already constructed (during the late 60s/early 70s) and a redesigned interchange design w/MA 128 (the original design would've resembled the original Canton I-95/MA 128 cloverleaf w/a flyover ramp layout) was still years away; a temporary connection to US 1 at this location (current Exit 46) was provided.

So while the three exit ramps (50, 46 & 44) off I-95 South may appear redundant on paper; each serves a unique and specific purpose in reality.
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Jmiles32

US-64(Future I-87) has about 7 interchanges through Rocky Mount. Of those interchanges Exit 470(NC-97/Atlantic Ave.) seems the most unnecessary.

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OracleUsr

Quote from: Jmiles32 on February 25, 2018, 03:23:00 PM
Some more:
-I-70@South Street Exit 55 Maryland
https://www.google.com/maps/@39.4016504,-77.3883082,2600m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en&authuser=0
This exit is obviously meant to serve an Industrial center but with Exits 54 and 56 nearby, it's not really necessary.

-I-40@Rock Barn Road Exit 133 North Carolina
https://www.google.com/maps/@35.7239037,-81.1801695,3284m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en&authuser=0
Exit 135 and a newly built exit 132 make this interchange redundant.

It's really only there because at one time, before Spring 1977, it was the start of a gap in I-40 through the Conover/Hickory area (that's why there is a sign that says TO US 70/TO Business US 321 Conover).  I looked at some townhouses off that road one time, but it was a terrible neighborhood.
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Bickendan

Quote from: Hurricane Rex on February 26, 2018, 02:33:31 AM
OR 217:
Exit 1, Walker Road, 500 feet North of exit 2 even though if you remove it, it won't decrease access a bunch

Exit 3, Denny road, although I call for its removment due to low traffic levels, ODOT has in its plan to build a collecter road to exit 2B, Allen road (750 feet north).

Exit 7, 72nd avenue. Need to go north? Use exit 6 as its quicker. South? I-5 exit 291 is also faster. Lowes customers are the only exception.

US 26: none.

I-5: none

I-84: take your pick of 2 exits along that stretch due to low traffic levels exiting (except exit 2).

I-205: none (stretching it a little)

Thats it for Portland.
I-84 has the problem of not having enough exits, particularly westbound, from the constraints of having the UP line and the MAX line on the north flank of the freeway.

sp_redelectric

Quote from: Hurricane Rex on February 26, 2018, 02:33:31 AM
OR 217: Exit 1, Walker Road; Exit 3, Denny road; Exit 7, 72nd avenue.

I couldn't agree with you more.  These three exits (and frankly 2B, only because the southbound off-ramp is far too close to the 2A on-ramp) should be shut down ASAP...

QuoteUS 26: none.

Jackson School Road and Dersham Road/Mountaindale Road are rather unnecessary.  Very low usage...just funnel the traffic into North Plains or Banks.

Also the Wilshire Exit, which is on the Oregon 217 NB to US 26 EB ramp, is unnecessary.  At least with the last intersection project, ODOT removed that foolish entrance (I won't call it an on-ramp, because it actually had a STOP sign and was a right turn right onto the freeway!)

QuoteI-5: none

In the Portland Metro area, Haines (Atlanta Street) would definitely make my list, as well as Taylors Ferry Road NB, Corbett Avenue NB, and Barbur Boulevard SB - all three of these are off-ramps only.  But since they only help reduce, not add, traffic volumes, why not...?

Between Salem and Albany, the North Jefferson (old Oregon 99E) interchange could be easily combined with Ankeny Hill; Talbot Road is very low traffic and could use the Ankeny Hill/North Jefferson exit; and Dever-Connor is also low traffic and could be re-directed to South Jefferson/Millersburg.

QuoteI-84: take your pick of 2 exits along that stretch due to low traffic levels exiting (except exit 2).

From purely a traffic management perspective, I would eliminate the Sandy/Halsey/37th and 33rd Avenue westbound on-ramps.  They are both within two miles of the I-5 split, and traffic is notoriously backed up there nearly 24/7 (okay, that's exaggerating it, but it's bad).  Traffic destined for NB I-5 could easily get on at Broadway; however traffic headed for I-5 SB would have a difficult time altogether.  They'd either have to backtrack east, use the notorious Rose Garden onramp (just north of I-84), go into downtown and use the Harbor Drive ramp, use the Ross Island Bridge, or go east and use I-205 rather than I-5.  But, since it's Portland, and everyone in Portland hates cars/loves mass transit and bikes, it should not be a huge problem.

QuoteI-205: none (stretching it a little)

I'll bite.  82nd Drive.  Although that is really stretching it in terms of "useless" as I love using that ramp, and I'm sure the good folks of Gladstone much rather not have to drive into Oregon City and use the awful 99E ramp.

TML

In the northern suburbs of Syracuse, Exit 11 of Route 481 consists of only one exit ramp with no return on-ramp. IMO, this exit should either be eliminated or have a return on-ramp added.

plain

My nomination for Virginia would be the Douglasdale Rd exit on the Powhite Pkwy in Richmond. Seriously, why pay a toll to exit (SB) or enter (NB) when you can do it for free VERY close by via I-195 & Rosewood/Idlewood Ave  :hmmm:
Newark born, Richmond bred

Beltway

Quote from: plain on February 28, 2018, 10:25:40 PM
My nomination for Virginia would be the Douglasdale Rd exit on the Powhite Pkwy in Richmond. Seriously, why pay a toll to exit (SB) or enter (NB) when you can do it for free VERY close by via I-195 & Rosewood/Idlewood Ave  :hmmm:

It is more convenient to the immediate area, it is a half mile on city streets to those I-195 ramps.  The toll is low at 20 cents.  The City Stadium and whatever was planned at this site would have been a big enough traffic generator that all those local ramps would have been needed.
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Flint1979

Quote from: ftballfan on February 27, 2018, 09:27:27 AM
I-196 exit 72: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.9304636,-85.7315023,15.67z?hl=en-US (also a partial interchange to boot)
I-96 exit 76: https://www.google.com/maps/@42.8612986,-84.9112286,16.38z?hl=en-US
I'm not sure if I'd consider the Portland exit you mentioned as unnecessary it seems to serve the center of town pretty good.

Henry

One place I have in mind is I-290 in Chicago, along the stretch where Van Buren Street and Congress Parkway are the frontage roads. I'd eliminate the entrances and exits between Sacramento Boulevard and Ashland Avenue, as well as those at Racine Avenue to the east.

The Rapid-Fire ramps on I-90/I-94 are a more complicated matter, mainly because they serve three one-way couplets (Randolph Street/Washington Boulevard, Madison Street/Monroe Street, Adams Street/Jackson Boulevard), all of which connect the Loop to the West Side.

In the Seattle area, I-405 has an exit serving Sunset Boulevard, a connector between Park Drive and Bronson Way, both of which also have interchanges with I-405. Granted, Sunset is only a half-interchange, but I'd still eliminate the NB entrance while keeping the SB exit, since there is none at Bronson.
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Beeper1

In Rhode Island, the U-Turn ramp from I-295 NB to 295 SB, at the US-6 interchange in Johnston.    I know it was originally intended for use as a ramp to unbuilt I-84, but still having it open and maintained seems pointless, since there are interchanges about every 2 miles or so on 295 if you really need to turn around.

Flint1979

Quote from: Henry on March 01, 2018, 10:02:39 AM
One place I have in mind is I-290 in Chicago, along the stretch where Van Buren Street and Congress Parkway are the frontage roads. I'd eliminate the entrances and exits between Sacramento Boulevard and Ashland Avenue, as well as those at Racine Avenue to the east.

The Rapid-Fire ramps on I-90/I-94 are a more complicated matter, mainly because they serve three one-way couplets (Randolph Street/Washington Boulevard, Madison Street/Monroe Street, Adams Street/Jackson Boulevard), all of which connect the Loop to the West Side.

In the Seattle area, I-405 has an exit serving Sunset Boulevard, a connector between Park Drive and Bronson Way, both of which also have interchanges with I-405. Granted, Sunset is only a half-interchange, but I'd still eliminate the NB entrance while keeping the SB exit, since there is none at Bronson.
There is one exit in that stretch on the Ike that I can remember and it's the one between California and Western where you have cars getting off and getting on using the same ramp. I don't think it's really a dangerous ramp but a confusing one. And I know what you are talking about there are three exits in a row just east of there. The way I'd have it and I'd do this in Detroit downtown where I-75 goes between itself and the Lodge is have one off ramp where it starts and an on ramp where it ends and vice versa in the other direction, you can use the service drive to move parallel with the expressway. Having too many exits and on ramps in that area causes the traffic problems that occur in that area along with the Circle Interchange and the Circle messes up both expressways, the Ike and the Kennedy/Dan Ryan combo.

As far as the Rapid-Fire ramps go, without a service drive being there that'd be a difficult one to revamp and with all the one way streets I'd just leave that one the way it is.

Bickendan

#47
Quote from: sp_redelectric on February 27, 2018, 09:39:35 PM
Quote from: Hurricane Rex on February 26, 2018, 02:33:31 AM

QuoteUS 26: none.

Jackson School Road and Dersham Road/Mountaindale Road are rather unnecessary.  Very low usage...just funnel the traffic into North Plains or Banks.

Jackson School Rd gets more use than you'd think, both for downtown Hillsboro use and as access to Forest Grove.
Dersham Rd could be extraneous, but I'd rather do away with the Mountaindale Rd at-grade crossing at Tillamook Junction.

Tarkus

Regarding the US-26/Jackson School Road interchange between Hillsboro and North Plains, it might have initially seemed somewhat questionable to add it, after the nasty at-grade was done away with there, but it's proven its utility.  First off, it's actually pretty well spaced--Exit 59, with the nearest exits being Brookwood Pkwy/Helvetia Rd (Exit 61) and Glencoe Road/North Plains (Exit 57).

Google Maps actually routes traffic headed from points east on US-26 toward Forest Grove/Cornelius down Jackson School Rd to Scotch Church Rd/Zion Church Rd, as it's slightly shorter mileage-wise than Glencoe to Zion Church (though often about the same time-wise).  Additionally, it's quicker to get to Downtown Hillsboro that way than to take Glencoe--which involves a 2-mile backtrack--plus it's quicker to get to Intel's Jones Farm Campus than via Brookwood.  North Plains is also putting a ton of houses near the Jackson School/West Union intersection north of 26 as well.

Personally, frequenting that area on a near-daily basis, the route I take depends on a variety of factors, including avoiding all the lost slowpokes (half of whom have Washington plates, inexplicably) who do 45 or less on Zion Church/Cornelius-Schefflin.  My preference had been to take Scotch Church to Jackson School heading eastbound, to avoid the "ARCO brakes" at North Plains (that shared right turn lane that goes to both the ARCO station on Glencoe and the onramp to 26 EB is an accident waiting to happen), but Glencoe to Zion Church when heading westbound, as the new roundabout at Jackson School/Scotch Church/Meek inexplicably has an annoyingly tight radius for the right turn from Jackson School southbound onto Scotch Church.  Lately, I've just been doing Glencoe both ways, though.

Regarding Dersham, I have taken it a few times just to try it as an alternative to Glencoe and Jackson School, sometimes when I've been particularly frustrated with the Corn-Scheff slowpokes.  If Washington County were to do some re-alignment in the area, to get rid of some of the sharp curves and directly connect Kerkman Road with Dersham, it'd probably actually become a preferred route for 26-to-Forest Grove travel, but that's not anywhere on the radar, to my knowledge.  I suspect most of the reason the exit exists is the Pacific Fiber Products plant on Vadis Road, right past the T-intersection south of the 26 ramps on Dersham, which would be a pain in the butt to get to without that exit.

The Mountaindale at-grade absolutely needs to go, though.  It's pretty much the only thing keeping US-26 from Portland to the OR-6 junction from being Interstate-grade.

As far as OR-217 goes, that's a weaving nightmare, and I agree with many of the suggestions mentioned already.  I'm actually a little more partial to the Walker exit, as it allows one to bypass the traffic nightmare that Canyon can be sometimes, and it's the one part of the highway that ODOT actually seems to care about, adding enough lanes to mitigate the weaving issues.  Really, they ought to look long-term at trying to make OR-217 work something like the part of Arizona Loop 101 through Tempe and Chandler, with the frontage roads the whole way, but ODOT and their handlers are a joke compared to ADOT.

SteveG1988

Interstate 76.

One could argue that there are too many exits right after the bridge taking you to the sports complex, but they are needed on sporting event days to spread the traffic between South Broad St, Packer Avenue, and S Darien Street. With the Packer Ave exit being more for trucks than parking. I am not complaining about these exits, just bringing them up before someone else complains about them. I've delivered in that area in the semi, right next to Lincoln Financial Field, home of the superbowl champions known as the Eagles.

There is one exit in particular that I think humanity could do without forever along i76 in Philly that is extremely dumb and dangerous. Exit 346C. https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9274948,-75.1954556,3a,75y,336.66h,93.27t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sSRYKMLsHRvEP_OOuDI5CCw!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 An exit that is little more than just a cut in the side barrier.

The Exit itself is dangerous, and should be able to be removed without much issue. Yes it would be slightly worse if you lived along that stretch of interstate, but you can just use the one way grid to get back.
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