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Interstates and national parks

Started by NE2, February 10, 2015, 12:24:19 AM

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Brandon

Quote from: NE2 on February 10, 2015, 05:13:52 PM
National forests are much less protected than national parks.

That's because they are two entirely different entities.  National parks are administered by the National Park Service, a part of the Department of the Interior.  National forests are administered by the United States Forest Service, a part of the Department of Agriculture.  They have two different missions.
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Dougtone

Quote from: cl94 on February 10, 2015, 09:26:41 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on February 10, 2015, 05:48:12 PM
Quote from: Brandon on February 10, 2015, 04:39:48 PM
Quote from: PurdueBill on February 10, 2015, 04:32:58 PM
Quote from: Brandon on February 10, 2015, 09:52:52 AM
I-40 goes through Petrified Forest NP.

Quote from: Beeper1 on February 10, 2015, 09:12:34 AM
Does the Ohio Turnpike touch Cuyahoga Valley National Park?

It looks like the park is right up to the ROW of the Turnpike.

I-271 and I-80/Turnpike both cross high over the Towpath Trail in the CVNP and the official maps leave it somewhat unclear as to whose property you're on as you pass under both, but Riverview Road is continuously a county road inside the park on both sides of both Interstates and appears to be the one more sure link between sections of the park that both Interstates overpass--for as much of a park as it is.  CVNP is not the typical national park, but I do enjoy it.  Next time I'm on my bike on the Towpath Trail under 271 and the Turnpike I'll have to notice more carefully if there are any signs of jurisdiction changes or anything; there has never been anything I've noticed.  Turnpike property is clearly fenced and signed, so it's possible that the park is continuous more than the map makes it appear.

If there is a property tax map available, that would show who owns what for certain.

Summit County GIS shows tax parcels extending under both 80 and 271 in the park area, owner USA, so it appears that park property is underneath the bridges over the river--at least from that data source.

CVNP is somewhat similar to New York's Adirondack and Catskill Parks in that it's a protected area, but people do own property, live, and do business within the boundaries.

It's not a national park, but a good portion of I-87 is in Adirondack Park, which is larger than any other protected area in the US outside of Alaska.
I believe that I-87 borders (or runs very close to) the Catskill Park as well, at least around Kingston. I-86 will do the same once it is expanded into Delaware and Sullivan Counties.

DandyDan

The Jefferson National Expansion Memorial, home of the Gateway Arch, runs right next to I-44, I-64, and I-55, and formerly I-70, in downtown St. Louis.
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mgk920

From earlier discussions here in AA Roadsland, it was determined that the only place where an interstate highway actually passes through a national park is I-94 and Theodore Roosevelt National Park.

All of the rest (ie, Cuyahoga Valley N.P.), the highway RsOW are technically not inside of the parks, rather the parks' boundaries were specifically drawn to exclude the highways as non-park corridors that pass between separate sections of the parks.

Mike

GaryV

I-77, I-40 and I-26 all cross the Blue Ridge Parkway - admittedly without any direct connection, but it touches park land.

Natchez Trace Parkway crosses and has intersections with I-20 and I-55.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: mgk920 on February 18, 2015, 08:57:41 PM
From earlier discussions here in AA Roadsland, it was determined that the only place where an interstate highway actually passes through a national park is I-94 and Theodore Roosevelt National Park.

All of the rest (ie, Cuyahoga Valley N.P.), the highway RsOW are technically not inside of the parks, rather the parks' boundaries were specifically drawn to exclude the highways as non-park corridors that pass between separate sections of the parks.

Incorrect.

An Interstate (I-66) crosses another National Park Service asset named for Teddy, Theodore Roosevelt Island in the Potomac River.

And I-395 (Southwest Freeway) crosses Potomac Park downstream from I-66 on the D.C. side of the Potomac. 

I confirmed both of these by looking up at the areas with the online District of Columbia Geographic Information System.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

mgk920

They may be NPS properties, but they are not formal 'National Parks'.

For example, should the 'Blue Ridge Parkway' be redesignated as 'Blue Ridge National Park', then of course the list would change.

Mike

NE2

Quote from: mgk920 on February 19, 2015, 02:37:24 AM
They may be NPS properties, but they are not formal 'National Parks'.
Is there any legal difference, or is it simply what they've been named?

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/93/hr7077/text
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/106/hr4578/text
All I see from the renaming of Cuyahoga Valley NRA is that it was renamed.
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kkt

Quote from: NE2 on February 19, 2015, 02:59:48 AM
Quote from: mgk920 on February 19, 2015, 02:37:24 AM
They may be NPS properties, but they are not formal 'National Parks'.
Is there any legal difference, or is it simply what they've been named?

http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/93/hr7077/text
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/106/hr4578/text
All I see from the renaming of Cuyahoga Valley NRA is that it was renamed.

The NPS is allowed to own land that's not part of a park.  For instance, if  a park is mostly wilderness area the NPS sometimes buys nearby land for maintenance facilities, office staffs, etc.

bulldog1979

Quote from: DandyDan on February 18, 2015, 03:02:41 PM
The Jefferson National Expansion Memorial, home of the Gateway Arch, runs right next to I-44, I-64, and I-55, and formerly I-70, in downtown St. Louis.

More to the point, I-44 runs through and under part of the JNEM, as the property that connects the Old Courthouse to the Arch grounds (Kiener Plaza) is part of the park. In fact, they're building "The Park Over the Highway" above I-44 to better connect the properties as one part of the "CityArchRiver 2015" scheme.

Molandfreak

Quote from: mgk920 on February 19, 2015, 02:37:24 AM
They may be NPS properties, but they are not formal 'National Parks'.

For example, should the 'Blue Ridge Parkway' be redesignated as 'Blue Ridge National Park', then of course the list would change.
That's like one of the most particular, unnecessary statements I've ever heard...
Quote from: Max Rockatansky on December 05, 2023, 08:24:57 PM
AASHTO attributes 28.5% of highway inventory shrink to bad road fan social media posts.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: mgk920 on February 19, 2015, 02:37:24 AM
They may be NPS properties, but they are not formal 'National Parks'.

No legal difference.  If it is owned by NPS, then the rules that apply in named National Parks very nearly always apply (I know, having professionally dealt with NPS a lot).

Quote from: mgk920 on February 19, 2015, 02:37:24 AM
For example, should the 'Blue Ridge Parkway' be redesignated as 'Blue Ridge National Park', then of course the list would change.

Local anti-auto activists and NIMBYs in the Washington area have repeatedly renamed Rock Creek Park in the District of Columbia to Rock Creek National Park.  No difference (the park does extend north of D.C. for many miles as Rock Creek Park, owned not by NPS, but by the Maryland-National Capital Park and Planning Commission). 

The National Mall and the monuments and memorials along it are all under NPS ownership, and are very definitely considered national parks.
Opinions expressed here on AAROADS are strictly personal and mine alone, and do not reflect policies or positions of MWCOG, NCRTPB or their member federal, state, county and municipal governments or any other agency.

cpzilliacus

Quote from: kkt on February 19, 2015, 01:04:37 PM
The NPS is allowed to own land that's not part of a park.  For instance, if  a park is mostly wilderness area the NPS sometimes buys nearby land for maintenance facilities, office staffs, etc.

That's correct.  NPS will sometimes lease or purchase office space for park-related management to occupy.

In these cases, federal law governing national parkland does not apply.
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