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Bypasses that take longer than the routes that they are bypassing

Started by Roadgeekteen, December 28, 2018, 06:35:41 PM

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vdeane

Quote from: Dirt Roads on March 19, 2021, 09:47:01 AM
Quote from: US 89 on August 22, 2019, 11:20:24 AM
US 17 through Myrtle Beach. I hate that road with a passion during summer tourist season, and I find it hard to believe it saves any time over the business route.
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 19, 2021, 09:07:40 AM
NC 31 is the real bypass

I thought this note about NC-31 might be a huge mistake, but indeed NCDOT is working with SCDOT to extend Carolina Bays Parkway (SC-31) up to US-17 probably near Sunset Beach.  This is Project R-5876 in North Carolina (not familiar with the R-series numbers).  Given the current economic situation, this probably won't occur in my lifetime, but it would certainly be a good bypass for Myrtle Beach.  No mention of whether North Carolina might actually use the NC-31 designation, or work with South Carolina for a permanent relocation of US-17.

https://www.ncdot.gov/projects/carolina-bays-parkway/Pages/default.aspx

Looks like this has already been discussed here: https://www.aaroads.com/forum/index.php?topic=26680.msg2489325#msg2489325
Isn't that ultimately part of the I-74 corridor, barring an act of Congress to change the corridor to end in Wilmington?
Please note: All comments here represent my own personal opinion and do not reflect the official position of NYSDOT or its affiliates.


SkyPesos

Quote from: abefroman329 on December 28, 2018, 08:31:52 PM
Any circumferential highway (i.e. I-285 in Atlanta).
Not sure how many exceptions are there, but I-270 in St Louis is an example of a beltway bypass that is shorter than its parent.

StogieGuy7

Well, there's I-294 (Tri-State Tollway) which definitely takes longer to go from Waukegan to Gary, IN than following I-94 to the Skyway.....in the dead of night.  In fact, it's a lot shorter if you can get through downtown Chicago between midnight and 5:15 (maybe 5:30) am. It would cut a good 15 to 20 minutes off of an eastbound drive for me if I hit it right.  But, once the window is closed the delays go up logarithmically versus time and 294 is waaaaaaay better. 

Yes, I understand how the thread is about bypasses that take longer almost all of the time.  Just wanted to call this one out because without traffic I've made it from Gurnee to Gary in like 40 minutes via 90/94 (it's about an hour via 294); but with traffic you could be in for 3 hours or more if you make that mistake.

kphoger

Quote from: StogieGuy7 on March 19, 2021, 03:24:05 PM
Well, there's I-294 (Tri-State Tollway) which definitely takes longer to go from Waukegan to Gary, IN than following I-94 to the Skyway.....in the dead of night.  In fact, it's a lot shorter if you can get through downtown Chicago between midnight and 5:15 (maybe 5:30) am. It would cut a good 15 to 20 minutes off of an eastbound drive for me if I hit it right.  But, once the window is closed the delays go up logarithmically versus time and 294 is waaaaaaay better. 

Yes, I understand how the thread is about bypasses that take longer almost all of the time.  Just wanted to call this one out because without traffic I've made it from Gurnee to Gary in like 40 minutes via 90/94 (it's about an hour via 294); but with traffic you could be in for 3 hours or more if you make that mistake.

The last time I was in the area, we were driving from Wichita (KS) to Lakeside (MI), arriving to Chicagoland on Friday afternoon...

Quote from: kphoger on October 01, 2018, 02:20:32 PM
We had hit the south suburbs of Chicago at rush hour;  on 80/94, from the Bishop Ford to I-65, I don't think we ever went more than 25 mph.  Traffic cleared up at the I-65 junction

... Going the other direction early on Sunday morning, I never dropped below 75 mph the whole way across.
Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: StogieGuy7 on March 19, 2021, 03:24:05 PM
Well, there's I-294 (Tri-State Tollway) which definitely takes longer to go from Waukegan to Gary, IN than following I-94 to the Skyway.....in the dead of night.  In fact, it's a lot shorter if you can get through downtown Chicago between midnight and 5:15 (maybe 5:30) am. It would cut a good 15 to 20 minutes off of an eastbound drive for me if I hit it right.  But, once the window is closed the delays go up logarithmically versus time and 294 is waaaaaaay better. 

Yes, I understand how the thread is about bypasses that take longer almost all of the time.  Just wanted to call this one out because without traffic I've made it from Gurnee to Gary in like 40 minutes via 90/94 (it's about an hour via 294); but with traffic you could be in for 3 hours or more if you make that mistake.
Is the speed limit higher on I-294?
God-emperor of Alanland, king of all the goats and goat-like creatures

Current Interstate map I am making:

https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?hl=en&mid=1PEDVyNb1skhnkPkgXi8JMaaudM2zI-Y&ll=29.05778059819179%2C-82.48856825&z=5

kphoger

Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

I-55

Quote from: kphoger on March 19, 2021, 04:14:58 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 19, 2021, 04:05:30 PM
Is the speed limit higher on I-294?

This is Chicago.  Speed limits mean nothing.

Also valid in Indianapolis, Louisville, Nashville, DC, Atlanta, Birmingham, Memphis, Knoxville, Jacks-Everywhere else I've been really.
Let's Go Purdue Basketball Whoosh

sprjus4

Quote from: I-55 on March 19, 2021, 06:21:53 PM
Quote from: kphoger on March 19, 2021, 04:14:58 PM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on March 19, 2021, 04:05:30 PM
Is the speed limit higher on I-294?

This is Chicago.  Speed limits mean nothing.

Also valid in Indianapolis, Louisville, Nashville, DC, Atlanta, Birmingham, Memphis, Knoxville, Jacks-Everywhere else I've been really.
Any urban area essentially with a sizable amount of free-flow traffic.

zzcarp

Quote from: zachary_amaryllis on March 19, 2021, 09:05:42 AM
it definitely takes longer to drive e-470 around denver than it does to go through denver unless the traffic on i-25 is seriously fusterclucked... which it probably is most days.

270 to 70 to 225 and back to 25 *might* be faster, but those roads tend to be quite bottlenecked at times.

270 to 70 to 225 is 22 miles versus 17 miles via I-25 so during most times I-25 is faster (rush hour cluster not withstanding).

It's always faster around 5p to take all of E-470 and Northwest Parkway to get to my place in western Westminster even though it's nearly 60 miles versus 35 through town. The 75 mph speed limit helps, though the tolls hit the wallet pretty hard. If 225 is reasonable, I'll often use I-225 to I-70 to Peña to E-470 to avoid several toll plazas.
So many miles and so many roads

US 89

Quote from: SkyPesos on March 19, 2021, 01:02:03 PM
Quote from: abefroman329 on December 28, 2018, 08:31:52 PM
Any circumferential highway (i.e. I-285 in Atlanta).
Not sure how many exceptions are there, but I-270 in St Louis is an example of a beltway bypass that is shorter than its parent.

I-475 in Macon would be on that list as well.

TheStranger

Quote from: ftballfan on January 19, 2019, 07:30:01 PM
Quote from: bing101 on January 17, 2019, 08:21:57 AM
Quote from: TheStranger on December 29, 2018, 10:11:16 PM
In Metro Manila, EDSA was built as a bypass ring road for north-south traffic, yet from experience during most waking hours takes an hour longer to go through than simply heading straight through the City of Manila!  (This difference will be exacerbated even more when the Metro Manila Skyway extension opens next year)
EDSA appears to be poorly built as well with limited access control (there appears to be side streets intersecting directly with EDSA!)

A bit of an old post, but wanted to add some background:

EDSA has existed in some form since the 1930s-1940s, and was "Highway 54" in the 1950s before that numbering system was cast aside.  This particular ring road (circumfrential route C-4 in Metro Manila's ring road designations) was designed to try to get drivers away from the crowded streets of the city of Manila.

However, by the early 1960s, the poor planning decisions that turned EDSA from bypass into congested urban arterial had begun.  the Araneta Center district (now known as Araneta City) in Quezon City's Cubao area was first developed, centering around Araneta Coliseum where Muhummad Ali's famous Thrilla in Manila fight actually would occur in 1975 - literal months before the capital was moved back to Manila from QC.

In Mandalyuong, factories started to sprout along the EDSA corridor.

However I've read that even in the 80s it was still a viable through route.  In the late 1960s the North Luzon Expressway linked Tabang to the Balintawak Cloverleaf along EDSA in northern Quezon City, and in 1976 the South Luzon Expressway linked up to EDSA in Makati at the Magallanes Interchange.  From what I've seen on other forums, there were already plans to link the two north-south expressways through Manila, but no political will or money from the 1970s until the late 90s (with the start of the Metro Manila Skyway project).

In 1984, SM North EDSA mall opened - at the time, the largest mall in the Philippines.  The setup fronting EDSA directly would then be copied by multiple other malls along the way (SM Megamall, Robinsons Galleria) and would essentially turn a once-useable bypass route into a semi-suburban boulevard that has continued to struggle with traffic loads since. 

There is one exception to where EDSA still has some function as a limited access-type road, and that is the portion between Tramo Street in Pasay and the Pasig River at the Makati/Mandaluyong border.  There is almost full grade separation between the EDSA mainline and most cross roads, with notable exits at SLEX, Arnaiz Avenue, Ayala Avenue, Buendia Avenue/Kalayaan Avenue, and JP Rizal Extension. I've actually even created some hypothetical sign ideas for the Pasay/Makati stretch to reflect this:
https://skywaysignconcepts.blogspot.com/2021/04/edsa-signage-improvement-ideas-between.html
https://skywaysignconcepts.blogspot.com/2021/04/edsa-pasay-guadalupe-sign-ideas-route.html

Having said that, that portion of EDSA is absolutely not a bypass route at all, as the early-90s expansions to the malls in Ayala Center (Greenbelt and Glorietta) turned that into a nationally-known retail destination, and the southernmost terminus of EDSA is SM Mall of Asia in Pasay.  One could argue that that stretch of road is essentially a freeway spur from SLEX/Skyway into the urban core of Makati and the tourist areas in Pasay's portion of Bay City.
Chris Sampang

roadman65

US 90 mainline is longer than it's business route in NOLA.  However it's a freeway verses the arterial it bypasses. So the designations should be switched in reality.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

kphoger

Keep right except to pass.  Yes.  You.
Visit scenic Orleans County, NY!
Male pronouns, please.

Quote from: Philip K. DickIf you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use them.

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: roadman65 on April 13, 2021, 11:41:55 PM
US 90 mainline is longer than it's business route in NOLA.  However it's a freeway verses the arterial it bypasses. So the designations should be switched in reality.
But does it take longer?
God-emperor of Alanland, king of all the goats and goat-like creatures

Current Interstate map I am making:

https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?hl=en&mid=1PEDVyNb1skhnkPkgXi8JMaaudM2zI-Y&ll=29.05778059819179%2C-82.48856825&z=5

webny99


roadman65

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on April 14, 2021, 09:24:27 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on April 13, 2021, 11:41:55 PM
US 90 mainline is longer than it's business route in NOLA.  However it's a freeway verses the arterial it bypasses. So the designations should be switched in reality.
But does it take longer?

Would think so.
Every day is a winding road, you just got to get used to it.

Sheryl Crowe

Roadgeekteen

God-emperor of Alanland, king of all the goats and goat-like creatures

Current Interstate map I am making:

https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?hl=en&mid=1PEDVyNb1skhnkPkgXi8JMaaudM2zI-Y&ll=29.05778059819179%2C-82.48856825&z=5

webny99

Quote from: Roadgeekteen on April 14, 2021, 09:34:10 AM
Quote from: webny99 on April 14, 2021, 09:32:54 AM
Quote from: kphoger on April 14, 2021, 09:19:17 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on April 13, 2021, 11:41:55 PM
US 90 mainline is longer than it's business route in NOLA.

Isn't that pretty common?  Random example:  I-35 vs I-35-BL, Dilley, TX

And a much more egregious I-83 vs BL-83 in York PA.
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/39.9149012,-76.704398/39.9939485,-76.7350449/@40.0708314,-76.6422512,11z/data=!4m2!4m1!3e0?hl=en

remember the topic of this thread

Yes, of course the business route in York takes longer time-wise. We were replying to the specific point about US 90 mainline being longer.

Roadgeekteen

Quote from: webny99 on April 14, 2021, 09:43:23 AM
Quote from: Roadgeekteen on April 14, 2021, 09:34:10 AM
Quote from: webny99 on April 14, 2021, 09:32:54 AM
Quote from: kphoger on April 14, 2021, 09:19:17 AM
Quote from: roadman65 on April 13, 2021, 11:41:55 PM
US 90 mainline is longer than it's business route in NOLA.

Isn't that pretty common?  Random example:  I-35 vs I-35-BL, Dilley, TX

And a much more egregious I-83 vs BL-83 in York PA.
https://www.google.com/maps/dir/39.9149012,-76.704398/39.9939485,-76.7350449/@40.0708314,-76.6422512,11z/data=!4m2!4m1!3e0?hl=en

remember the topic of this thread

Yes, of course the business route takes longer in York. We were replying to the specific point about US 90 mainline being longer.
Yeah it being longer in distance is common.
God-emperor of Alanland, king of all the goats and goat-like creatures

Current Interstate map I am making:

https://www.google.com/maps/d/u/0/edit?hl=en&mid=1PEDVyNb1skhnkPkgXi8JMaaudM2zI-Y&ll=29.05778059819179%2C-82.48856825&z=5

RoadWarrior56

I could fill out a very long list of these types of "bypasses".



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