New York

[storm2k]

The governor gave the state of the state recently and released a policy book along with it.  I took a quick look, and while a lot of the plans are projects already underway, there are a few new things:
-Replace the Livingston Avenue rail bridge
-Resume the I-86 project in Sullivan and Orange Counties (basically, everything from Roscoe east)
-Reconfigure the Oakdale Merge on NY 27
-Elevate Annsville Circle (US 6/US 9/US 202) in Westchester County
-Remove the remainder of the Inner Loop
-Cover a portion of NY 33 in Buffalo
-Cover a portion of the Cross-Bronx

As part of a group which spent quite a few hours discussing 3 lines from that policy book, I wonder how much of it is a carryover from Cuomo and reflects what was going on under his rule.
As a matter of fact, LGA airtrain - a hot topic, suspended after Cuomo fall - is not even mentioned.

The LGA air train was always a Cuomo strong-arm thing to make some of his political cronies happy and do nothing useful for getting mass transit service to the airport. A reverse legged thing that hooked up to the LIRR instead of the Subway was always dumb. The JFK AirTrain was not a perfect thing, but it hooked up with both and took a mostly direct route to and from the airport. Honestly it would be nice for them to just really move the needle on getting the BMT Astoria line extended out to the airport and telling the Astoria NIMBYs where to shove it.

Yeah, Cuomo isn't what NYC need. Robert Moses, city really needs you back!

Minus the racism, I'd love to have a Moses back. I do like the Midtown Expressway but I wish he could have built it around or through the Empire State building and not have it torn down. Thankfully it wasn't. I wish we could build a tolled elevated freeway through New York like Tokyo has.

The last thing Manhattan needs is an elevated highway bisecting through the heart of it. If the tech was more there, a tunneled route across midtown from tunnel to tunnel would have served very well.

[Roadgeek Adam]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

[Rothman]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

The man of La Mancha rides again.

[cl94]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

The man of La Mancha rides again.

More realistic than some of the Robert Moses projects people are proposing in this thread.

[kalvado]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

The man of La Mancha rides again.

More realistic than some of the Robert Moses projects people are proposing in this thread.

Whatever people are proposing - "correct" LGA train, through highway, new rail, improvement of this and that - would need an astronomical amount of money and a harsh war with affected people. SO it would either be a deep compromise, or things will never happen (even with compromise, I'm afraid precious little would change in foreseeable future)

[SignBridge]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

Canning taxi service in Manhattan? What?!?!?!

[Plutonic Panda]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

I'd rather eliminate all bus and bike lanes and build an elevated viaduct over every road for freeways. Checkmate.

[SignBridge]

We don't need Robert Moses back. We also don't need more cars in NYC. We need to look at car reduction. I for one would rather start with canning the taxi service in Manhattan to open streets and increase subway usage.

I'd rather eliminate all bus and bike lanes and build an elevated viaduct over every road for freeways. Checkmate.

Well LOL they tried that a hundred-plus years ago with the trains and found it worked better with them underground....

[Roadgeek Adam]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

[froggie]

If the cab drivers in Manhattan are anything like the cab drivers in DC, then yes for the sake of ALL transpo modes get rid of them...

[Rothman]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

And how will that convenient point-to-point mode of transportation be replaced?  By crowding unreliable public trans even further?

[Roadgeek Adam]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

And how will that convenient point-to-point mode of transportation be replaced?  By crowding unreliable public trans even further?

You can open streets to streetcars or more buses. I also didn't leave out the idea of for-hires like Uber and Lyft, which usually are not as terrible drivers. The idea though is to get rid of more cars (not eliminate them) and leave private owned cars as the main ones on the road, along with trucks. With less cars on the streets, you can make delivery via trucks faster, making it healthier on the environment cause trucks won't be idling in the streets in massive traffic all the time trying to get to their destination.

[cl94]

If the cab drivers in Manhattan are anything like the cab drivers in DC, then yes for the sake of ALL transpo modes get rid of them...

Oh they are, if not worse. They went from being some of the best drivers on the road to some of the worst in the span of 30-40 years.

[kalvado]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

And how will that convenient point-to-point mode of transportation be replaced?  By crowding unreliable public trans even further?

You can open streets to streetcars or more buses. I also didn't leave out the idea of for-hires like Uber and Lyft, which usually are not as terrible drivers. The idea though is to get rid of more cars (not eliminate them) and leave private owned cars as the main ones on the road, along with trucks. With less cars on the streets, you can make delivery via trucks faster, making it healthier on the environment cause trucks won't be idling in the streets in massive traffic all the time trying to get to their destination.

So, there is a significant number of taxies, and they run with descent load factor. You suggest to replace them with Uber - OK, but do you think that would mean fewer cars? Or you assume that Uber drivers are born in a different manner compared to taxi folks? My bet taxies would just be repainted, with same cohort driving them..

[kalvado]

If the cab drivers in Manhattan are anything like the cab drivers in DC, then yes for the sake of ALL transpo modes get rid of them...

Oh they are, if not worse. They went from being some of the best drivers on the road to some of the worst in the span of 30-40 years.

Usually older people tend to recall how much better everything was back then - including sex...

[Roadgeek Adam]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

And how will that convenient point-to-point mode of transportation be replaced?  By crowding unreliable public trans even further?

You can open streets to streetcars or more buses. I also didn't leave out the idea of for-hires like Uber and Lyft, which usually are not as terrible drivers. The idea though is to get rid of more cars (not eliminate them) and leave private owned cars as the main ones on the road, along with trucks. With less cars on the streets, you can make delivery via trucks faster, making it healthier on the environment cause trucks won't be idling in the streets in massive traffic all the time trying to get to their destination.

So, there is a significant number of taxies, and they run with descent load factor. You suggest to replace them with Uber - OK, but do you think that would mean fewer cars? Or you assume that Uber drivers are born in a different manner compared to taxi folks? My bet taxies would just be repainted, with same cohort driving them..

I was assuming different manner, but regardless, again, you can outlaw that too. People will have to live without direct to home service.

[kalvado]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

And how will that convenient point-to-point mode of transportation be replaced?  By crowding unreliable public trans even further?

You can open streets to streetcars or more buses. I also didn't leave out the idea of for-hires like Uber and Lyft, which usually are not as terrible drivers. The idea though is to get rid of more cars (not eliminate them) and leave private owned cars as the main ones on the road, along with trucks. With less cars on the streets, you can make delivery via trucks faster, making it healthier on the environment cause trucks won't be idling in the streets in massive traffic all the time trying to get to their destination.

So, there is a significant number of taxies, and they run with descent load factor. You suggest to replace them with Uber - OK, but do you think that would mean fewer cars? Or you assume that Uber drivers are born in a different manner compared to taxi folks? My bet taxies would just be repainted, with same cohort driving them..

I was assuming different manner, but regardless, again, you can outlaw that too. People will have to live without direct to home service.

Outlaw it for people. Yeah... just what happened with "we, the people"....
Enlightened dictatorship seems to be the new american dream!

[1995hoo]

Anyone know where this is? It's supposedly around an hour north of New York City. (Sorry about the small thumbnail. I had trouble getting it to upload at all.)




Edited to add: OK, never mind, I think I found it–looks to be along this road seen here on Google Maps.

[empirestate]

Anyone know where this is? It's supposedly around an hour north of New York City. (Sorry about the small thumbnail. I had trouble getting it to upload at all.)




Edited to add: OK, never mind, I think I found it–looks to be along this road seen here on Google Maps.

Before I click the links, I'm thinking that's NY 301 over West Branch Reservoir in Carmel.

[D-Dey65]

Check out this Adopt-a-Highway sign on NY 22 north of NY 164. You won't believe who, or what the sponsor is:
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.4740147,-73.5806143,3a,75y,18.36h,95.29t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1stsmAwtrxoGzZYZu-9Uu-bA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656?hl=en

[TheDon102]

Bus and bike lanes are necessary in the situation we're in. We don't need more freeways in NYC. We already have too many congested roads in the city. Eliminating taxis will eliminate a lot of traffic on the streets including much of the worst drivers.

And how will that convenient point-to-point mode of transportation be replaced?  By crowding unreliable public trans even further?

You can open streets to streetcars or more buses. I also didn't leave out the idea of for-hires like Uber and Lyft, which usually are not as terrible drivers. The idea though is to get rid of more cars (not eliminate them) and leave private owned cars as the main ones on the road, along with trucks. With less cars on the streets, you can make delivery via trucks faster, making it healthier on the environment cause trucks won't be idling in the streets in massive traffic all the time trying to get to their destination.

So, there is a significant number of taxies, and they run with descent load factor. You suggest to replace them with Uber - OK, but do you think that would mean fewer cars? Or you assume that Uber drivers are born in a different manner compared to taxi folks? My bet taxies would just be repainted, with same cohort driving them..

I was assuming different manner, but regardless, again, you can outlaw that too. People will have to live without direct to home service.

how far is East Amherst from NYC? As someone who is currently living in the bronx, how about no.

[Declan127]

A reverse legged thing that hooked up to the LIRR instead of the Subway was always dumb.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the LGA AirTrain was set to hook up with the LIRR and the 7 at Mets-Willets Pt.

[D-Dey65]

A reverse legged thing that hooked up to the LIRR instead of the Subway was always dumb.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the LGA AirTrain was set to hook up with the LIRR and the 7 at Mets-Willets Pt.

You're not wrong.

Minus the racism, I'd love to have a Moses back. I do like the Midtown Expressway but I wish he could have built it around or through the Empire State building and not have it torn down. Thankfully it wasn't.

A lot more than just the Midtown Manhattan Expressway, although not everything that was being proposed. Even during the debate over construction of the AirTrainJFK, which I didn't disagree with, I still felt the Clearview Expressway should've been revived. As far as I was concerned, the Van Wyck and the AirTrain to JFK weren't enough.

[kkt]

The governor gave the state of the state recently and released a policy book along with it.  I took a quick look, and while a lot of the plans are projects already underway, there are a few new things:
-Replace the Livingston Avenue rail bridge
-Resume the I-86 project in Sullivan and Orange Counties (basically, everything from Roscoe east)
-Reconfigure the Oakdale Merge on NY 27
-Elevate Annsville Circle (US 6/US 9/US 202) in Westchester County
-Remove the remainder of the Inner Loop
-Cover a portion of NY 33 in Buffalo
-Cover a portion of the Cross-Bronx

As part of a group which spent quite a few hours discussing 3 lines from that policy book, I wonder how much of it is a carryover from Cuomo and reflects what was going on under his rule.
As a matter of fact, LGA airtrain - a hot topic, suspended after Cuomo fall - is not even mentioned.

The LGA air train was always a Cuomo strong-arm thing to make some of his political cronies happy and do nothing useful for getting mass transit service to the airport. A reverse legged thing that hooked up to the LIRR instead of the Subway was always dumb. The JFK AirTrain was not a perfect thing, but it hooked up with both and took a mostly direct route to and from the airport. Honestly it would be nice for them to just really move the needle on getting the BMT Astoria line extended out to the airport and telling the Astoria NIMBYs where to shove it.

Yeah, Cuomo isn't what NYC need. Robert Moses, city really needs you back!

Minus the racism, I'd love to have a Moses back. I do like the Midtown Expressway but I wish he could have built it around or through the Empire State building and not have it torn down. Thankfully it wasn't. I wish we could build a tolled elevated freeway through New York like Tokyo has.

The last thing Manhattan needs is an elevated highway bisecting through the heart of it. If the tech was more there, a tunneled route across midtown from tunnel to tunnel would have served very well.

Manhattan is already a swiss cheese of tunnels for the subways, intercity railroad lines, sewers, and other utility lines.  The granite is pretty friendly to tunnelling, but you've gotta leave something to hold up the streets.

[Plutonic Panda]

^^^ the best alternative is an elevated freeway. Seriously put it 30 stories high like some science fiction movie and it wouldn't impact a thing. Retrofit skyscrapers. It's money stopping us. Not it being fiction.