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Massachusetts milepost exit numbering conversion contract

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bob7374:

--- Quote from: PurdueBill on October 24, 2021, 03:12:42 PM ---Maybe they could extend 290 down to the state line along 395 and have them both mileposted starting at 0 there!  (Not gonna happen, but it's not any less silly than I-74 multiplexing with 77 in NC to end at the VA line, or how 69 disappears while running with 55, although that is "temporary".)  Then 395 could end where-ever they like leaving 290 to carry the numbers alone to its end.

--- End quote ---
Agree that that is unlikely. As for the other examples you bring up, VA has authorization to sign I-74 along I-77 to I-81, but has no incentive to do so. Perhaps when I-74 is signed along US 52 and around Winston-Salem groups seeking to encourage drivers to use the route to get between VA and SC could pressure VADOT to do so.

mrsman:

--- Quote from: bob7374 on October 25, 2021, 12:24:51 PM ---
--- Quote from: PurdueBill on October 24, 2021, 03:12:42 PM ---Maybe they could extend 290 down to the state line along 395 and have them both mileposted starting at 0 there!  (Not gonna happen, but it's not any less silly than I-74 multiplexing with 77 in NC to end at the VA line, or how 69 disappears while running with 55, although that is "temporary".)  Then 395 could end where-ever they like leaving 290 to carry the numbers alone to its end.

--- End quote ---
Agree that that is unlikely. As for the other examples you bring up, VA has authorization to sign I-74 along I-77 to I-81, but has no incentive to do so. Perhaps when I-74 is signed along US 52 and around Winston-Salem groups seeking to encourage drivers to use the route to get between VA and SC could pressure VADOT to do so.

--- End quote ---

PurdueBill's suggestion is not a bad one, and would seem to be better than what MASSDOT actually did.  I-290 and I-395 would both start at the state line, and both would have a zero milepost.  The roads continue north, and then I-395 terminates at I-90, while I-290 continues.  It is true that in both cases (this hypothetical and what MASSDOT did) we have a useless multiplex, but at least this hypothetical provides some simplicity since both roadways will have the same milepost numbers that will also match the exit numbers of the highway.

So looking at what MASSDOT actually did definitely fuels the speculation that they intend for I-395 to take over I-290.

PurdueBill:

--- Quote from: mrsman on October 25, 2021, 08:30:07 PM ---
--- Quote from: bob7374 on October 25, 2021, 12:24:51 PM ---
--- Quote from: PurdueBill on October 24, 2021, 03:12:42 PM ---Maybe they could extend 290 down to the state line along 395 and have them both mileposted starting at 0 there!  (Not gonna happen, but it's not any less silly than I-74 multiplexing with 77 in NC to end at the VA line, or how 69 disappears while running with 55, although that is "temporary".)  Then 395 could end where-ever they like leaving 290 to carry the numbers alone to its end.

--- End quote ---
Agree that that is unlikely. As for the other examples you bring up, VA has authorization to sign I-74 along I-77 to I-81, but has no incentive to do so. Perhaps when I-74 is signed along US 52 and around Winston-Salem groups seeking to encourage drivers to use the route to get between VA and SC could pressure VADOT to do so.

--- End quote ---

PurdueBill's suggestion is not a bad one, and would seem to be better than what MASSDOT actually did.  I-290 and I-395 would both start at the state line, and both would have a zero milepost.  The roads continue north, and then I-395 terminates at I-90, while I-290 continues.  It is true that in both cases (this hypothetical and what MASSDOT did) we have a useless multiplex, but at least this hypothetical provides some simplicity since both roadways will have the same milepost numbers that will also match the exit numbers of the highway.

So looking at what MASSDOT actually did definitely fuels the speculation that they intend for I-395 to take over I-290.

--- End quote ---

I also hate the idea of 190 being orphaned if 290 disappeared, with it becoming a branch off 395.  If they wanted it to remain a legit x90 while eliminating 290, they could have extended it down to 90 (silently for now, then sign it when 290 goes away, with its 0 milepoint at 90, but numbers not showing independently until it leaves 395).  Useless multiplex? Yep. Violating principle of lower-numbered route having priority in mileage/numbering? Yep. But it would technically make it a legit x90 still.  Probably simpler to just orphan it (still hate that) or renumber to an x95 (needless confusion, first renumbering exits on 190, then changing 190's number--a double whammy).  Why didn't they just leave 395 and 290 as they were?  Would have avoided all this.

I remember driving on 52 before 74 was a thing all the way down from Mt. Airy to Winston-Salem, and it was clearly the best way according to maps, triptiks, etc. and would still be with GPS and stuff regardless of the number.  If VA isn't going to sign it, 74 might as well end at 77.  It isn't like it is ever going to get all the way to Cincinnati anyway.  (I actually have done mostly 52 for Albemarle, NC to Lafayette, IN before, using Interstates where sensible but it was amazing how much 52 was involved, including all along the Ohio River in Ohio.)

jp the roadgeek:

--- Quote from: mrsman on October 25, 2021, 08:30:07 PM ---
--- Quote from: bob7374 on October 25, 2021, 12:24:51 PM ---
--- Quote from: PurdueBill on October 24, 2021, 03:12:42 PM ---Maybe they could extend 290 down to the state line along 395 and have them both mileposted starting at 0 there!  (Not gonna happen, but it's not any less silly than I-74 multiplexing with 77 in NC to end at the VA line, or how 69 disappears while running with 55, although that is "temporary".)  Then 395 could end where-ever they like leaving 290 to carry the numbers alone to its end.

--- End quote ---
Agree that that is unlikely. As for the other examples you bring up, VA has authorization to sign I-74 along I-77 to I-81, but has no incentive to do so. Perhaps when I-74 is signed along US 52 and around Winston-Salem groups seeking to encourage drivers to use the route to get between VA and SC could pressure VADOT to do so.

--- End quote ---

PurdueBill's suggestion is not a bad one, and would seem to be better than what MASSDOT actually did.  I-290 and I-395 would both start at the state line, and both would have a zero milepost.  The roads continue north, and then I-395 terminates at I-90, while I-290 continues.  It is true that in both cases (this hypothetical and what MASSDOT did) we have a useless multiplex, but at least this hypothetical provides some simplicity since both roadways will have the same milepost numbers that will also match the exit numbers of the highway.

So looking at what MASSDOT actually did definitely fuels the speculation that they intend for I-395 to take over I-290.

--- End quote ---

<cough> Extend I-290 to Plainfield, CT and have I-395 take over SR 695 <cough>

abqtraveler:

--- Quote from: jp the roadgeek on October 27, 2021, 02:30:47 PM ---
--- Quote from: mrsman on October 25, 2021, 08:30:07 PM ---
--- Quote from: bob7374 on October 25, 2021, 12:24:51 PM ---
--- Quote from: PurdueBill on October 24, 2021, 03:12:42 PM ---Maybe they could extend 290 down to the state line along 395 and have them both mileposted starting at 0 there!  (Not gonna happen, but it's not any less silly than I-74 multiplexing with 77 in NC to end at the VA line, or how 69 disappears while running with 55, although that is "temporary".)  Then 395 could end where-ever they like leaving 290 to carry the numbers alone to its end.

--- End quote ---
Agree that that is unlikely. As for the other examples you bring up, VA has authorization to sign I-74 along I-77 to I-81, but has no incentive to do so. Perhaps when I-74 is signed along US 52 and around Winston-Salem groups seeking to encourage drivers to use the route to get between VA and SC could pressure VADOT to do so.

--- End quote ---

PurdueBill's suggestion is not a bad one, and would seem to be better than what MASSDOT actually did.  I-290 and I-395 would both start at the state line, and both would have a zero milepost.  The roads continue north, and then I-395 terminates at I-90, while I-290 continues.  It is true that in both cases (this hypothetical and what MASSDOT did) we have a useless multiplex, but at least this hypothetical provides some simplicity since both roadways will have the same milepost numbers that will also match the exit numbers of the highway.

So looking at what MASSDOT actually did definitely fuels the speculation that they intend for I-395 to take over I-290.

--- End quote ---

<cough> Extend I-290 to Plainfield, CT and have I-395 take over SR 695 <cough>

--- End quote ---
I would just go back to CT and MA's original idea and extend 290 over 395 all the way down to I-95 at Waterford. Why AASHTO rejected that proposal in the first place defies logic, as it makes sense in my mind.

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