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Author Topic: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker  (Read 104335 times)

bzakharin

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #175 on: July 23, 2015, 12:46:33 PM »

Is there a toll road where the numbered interstate takes precedence over the name? I haven't lived in Maine long enough to know if "Maine Turnpike" is used instead of I-95 but that might be a contender.
I'm pretty sure the Delaware Turnpike is usually known by its numbers (95/295). If you want to go into bridges, I don't think the I-80 bridge over the Delaware River even has a name (though Wikipedia claims it's the "Delaware Water Gap Toll Bridge"). The I-95 (Millard E. Tydings Memorial Bridge) and US 40 (Thomas J. Hatem Memorial Bridge) crossings of the Susquehanna River are mostly known by route number as well if I'm not mistaken.
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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #176 on: July 23, 2015, 03:14:41 PM »

Here in southern New Jersey, one never hears the John D. Rockefeller Memorial Highway referred to by it's name; it's always called "Route 70".
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Pete from Boston

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #177 on: July 23, 2015, 03:33:53 PM »


Is there a toll road where the numbered interstate takes precedence over the name? I haven't lived in Maine long enough to know if "Maine Turnpike" is used instead of I-95 but that might be a contender.

I find increasing use among people not originally from this region of "90," or worse, "the 90."  "Mass Pike" is still far and away the dominant name, but with the way those words are being relegated to small print in a corner of a guide sign, that may not always remain the case.
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spooky

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #178 on: July 23, 2015, 04:08:22 PM »


Is there a toll road where the numbered interstate takes precedence over the name? I haven't lived in Maine long enough to know if "Maine Turnpike" is used instead of I-95 but that might be a contender.

I find increasing use among people not originally from this region of "90," or worse, "the 90."  "Mass Pike" is still far and away the dominant name, but with the way those words are being relegated to small print in a corner of a guide sign, that may not always remain the case.

I've found that older Bostonians refer to it as "the Turnpike".
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Pete from Boston

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #179 on: July 23, 2015, 04:21:55 PM »



Is there a toll road where the numbered interstate takes precedence over the name? I haven't lived in Maine long enough to know if "Maine Turnpike" is used instead of I-95 but that might be a contender.

I find increasing use among people not originally from this region of "90," or worse, "the 90."  "Mass Pike" is still far and away the dominant name, but with the way those words are being relegated to small print in a corner of a guide sign, that may not always remain the case.

I've found that older Bostonians refer to it as "the Turnpike".

My father, who sneaked on to drive it before it opened, nearly always referred to it as "the Massachusetts Turnpike" in casual conversation.
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Rothman

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #180 on: July 23, 2015, 05:09:53 PM »

People also refer to the Massachusetts Turnpike Extension as well in MA.
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bzakharin

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #181 on: July 23, 2015, 05:23:45 PM »

Here in southern New Jersey, one never hears the John D. Rockefeller Memorial Highway referred to by it's name; it's always called "Route 70".
70 is not a toll road. Also where I live it's signed "Marlton Pike" (I guess it was a toll road once upon a time), but nobody uses that name either. In fact, it only started popping up when my area started putting up the shield + road name signs at every traffic light.
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briantroutman

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #182 on: July 23, 2015, 05:40:31 PM »

Here in southern New Jersey, one never hears the John D. Rockefeller Memorial Highway referred to by it's name; it's always called "Route 70".
70 is not a toll road. Also where I live it's signed "Marlton Pike" (I guess it was a toll road once upon a time), but nobody uses that name either. In fact, it only started popping up when my area started putting up the shield + road name signs at every traffic light.

My dad grew up in part in Haddonfield, and “Marlton Pike” is one of the handful of roads he’s referred to by name.
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02 Park Ave

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #183 on: July 23, 2015, 06:10:46 PM »


Here in southern New Jersey, one never hears the John D. Rockefeller Memorial Highway referred to by it's name; it's always called "Route 70".
70 is not a toll road. Also where I live it's signed "Marlton Pike" (I guess it was a toll road once upon a time), but nobody uses that name either. In fact, it only started popping up when my area started putting up the shield + road name signs at every traffic light.

I doubt if Route 70 was ever a toll road as the "Pikes" were.

The Burlington County sector west of Medford was mostly built along the old railroad right-of-way.  The remainder was probably a WPA project.
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ixnay

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #184 on: July 23, 2015, 06:47:56 PM »

Here in southern New Jersey, one never hears the John D. Rockefeller Memorial Highway referred to by it's name; it's always called "Route 70".

What was the "original" Rockefeller's connection to the NJ Pine Barrens, through which 70 runs?  I've always wondered.

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PHLBOS

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #185 on: July 23, 2015, 07:25:23 PM »

Most, if not all, of I-84 between the Connecticut River to the New York state line, is the Yankee Division Highway, yet nobody ever calls it that.
Actually the street name for that stretch of I-84 is Yankee Expressway.  IIRC, there are one or two ground-mounted BGS' along I-84 that read such.
When I'm on I-93 between Boston to Braintree, do I call it the Southeast Expressway?  No.
Many Bay State drivers/commuters/reporters/etc. would disagree with you.  The Southeast Expressway (it's actually part of the John F. Fitzgerald Expressway network) name dates back to when the highway was first built in the late 50s; and for the first 12 years of its existence, the northern portion of it (north of MA 3A and now-MA 203/old MA 3) had no route number associated with it.  All of it became MA 3 in 1971 and it was later planned (but not yet signed) in 1972-73 to be part of the defacto-I-95 when the Southwest Expressway was canned.  It instead became an extension of I-93 in 1975 when I-95 was rerouted onto most of MA 128 when the Northeast Expressway extension was cancelled.  The often-ignored rerouted US 1 designation was added in 1989-90.

So there you have it.  Unlike Route 128; the Southeast Expressway is an example of a highway that went through several route number changes but most people wouldn't care what route number(s) it carried; they just called the highway by its name rather than the number(s). 

I recall seeing a couple of Massachusetts state highway maps from the early 1970s that had the "Southeast Expressway" notation on Route 3 south of Briantree as well.
The Universal Street Map Atlas for Eastern Massachusetts is one place where one can see the various pages of South Shore towns that MA 3 pass through and one will see SOUTHEAST EXPRESSWAY labels (in Leroy-drafted font) as well.  Typically, these maps were actually drafted years if not decades ago and only receive minor updates if a road or two are added.

Those of us Bay State old timers probably remember the old King's Castle Land (in Whitman, it closed circa 1994) commericals from the early 70s.  At the end of the TV ad. (I could not find it on YouTube); the narrator would say, "Take the Southeast Expressway to Route 3 to Route 18 and welcome to King's Castle Land.  We're open everyday in Whitman."

Another version of the commercial had dubbed directions that read, "Take Route 128 South to Route 3 South.  Then take Route 3 South to Route 18 South."

For those not in the Boston area, I-93 from Braintree to Boston is universally and without exception referred to as the Southeast Expressway (or more commonly, simply "the Expressway". In recent times (since 128 was removed), the remainder of I-93 to its end in Canton is occasionally referred to as the Southeast Expressway as well, but not as frequently.
Really?  I have never heard that stretch (Braintree to Canton) referred to as the Southeast Expressway.  It's completely incorrect (the road runs east-west with a very slight NE/SW orientation).  Whoever stated such must be a newbie. 

Also, on a different but related note, the town of Canton has recently posted small trailblazers pointing towards I-93, which originally read "To Route 93", but then the signs were edited to say "To Rt. 128"
Where abouts in Canton was this sign?  If it was located along MA 138; using TO RTE. 128 might be justified only because it's official terminus (at the I-95/93 interchange) is only located about a mile away from the I-93/MA 138 interchange.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2015, 12:49:07 PM by PHLBOS »
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roadman

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #186 on: July 24, 2015, 12:44:41 PM »

Quote
The Southeast Expressway (it's actually part of the John F. Fitzgerald Expressway network)

Not quite.  The Fitzgerald Expressway designation ran from the old Mass Ave interchange (Exit 18) to the Charles River Crossing (Exit 26), and it was a single roadway - not a network.  The only portion of the Southeast Expressway that overlapped with the Fitzgerald was between Mass Ave and the south portal of the Dewey Square Tunnel.  The individual bridges on the Expressway south of Mass Ave have their own named designations, but there has never been a single named designation (other than S.E. Expressway) given to the entire highway between Boston and Braintree.
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PHLBOS

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #187 on: July 24, 2015, 12:56:35 PM »

The only portion of the Southeast Expressway that overlapped with the Fitzgerald was between Mass Ave and the south portal of the Dewey Square Tunnel.
Some maps and (IIRC) there was an small old white sign (now long gone) that called that stretch the Pulaski Skyway.  While many have called that stretch the Southeast Expressway, it really wasn't; such would've been evident especially had the Southwest Expressway been built.

BTW, I made the needed corrections to my earlier post.  I was previously under the impression that the J.F. Fitzgerald Expressway ran from Braintree to Revere and consisted of the Southeast Expressway, Pulaski Skyway, Dewey Square/South Station Tunnel, the Central Artery, the Mystic/Tobin Bridge and the Northeast Expressway.  Old school ramp and through signage, at least from the Central Artery south, used the generic EXPRESSWAY NORTH/SOUTH notations.
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roadman

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #188 on: July 24, 2015, 01:22:23 PM »

Yes, the viaduct between Mass Ave and the Dewey Square tunnel was officially called the Pulaski Skyway (for many years, consistently rated as the worst bridge - in terms of overall condition - in the state).  But traffic reporters of the era (Joe Greene, Bill Connell) never used that name, and always referred to the highway south of the Dewey Square tunnel as the Southeast Expressway.

And I also remember those "Expressway North/South" signs as well (1962 vintage button copy on painted plywood).
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SidS1045

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #189 on: July 24, 2015, 08:47:24 PM »

with the way those words are being relegated to small print in a corner of a guide sign, that may not always remain the case.

ISTR that when those signs went up, there was an idea being floated to eliminate the Massachusetts Turnpike name.  I also recall the idea dying rather quickly.  Wondering if roadman can confirm or deny that?
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AMLNet49

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #190 on: July 26, 2015, 02:12:46 PM »


Also, on a different but related note, the town of Canton has recently posted small trailblazers pointing towards I-93, which originally read "To Route 93", but then the signs were edited to say "To Rt. 128"
Where abouts in Canton was this sign?  If it was located along MA 138; using TO RTE. 128 might be justified only because it's official terminus (at the I-95/93 interchange) is only located about a mile away from the I-93/MA 138 interchange.
The signs are near Exits 2, 3,  and 5 on I-93. Exit 2 is the only one that can be somewhat justified given that 128 is nearby, but clearly the signs are referring to I-93.

with the way those words are being relegated to small print in a corner of a guide sign, that may not always remain the case.

ISTR that when those signs went up, there was an idea being floated to eliminate the Massachusetts Turnpike name.  I also recall the idea dying rather quickly.  Wondering if roadman can confirm or deny that?
This is correct. When the Turnpike Authority was eliminated, MassDot thought about eliminating the Mass Turnpike name in favor of simply I-90. Though they decided against it, they installed Mass Pike shields on new signs instead of plain "Mass Pike" text so that it would be easy to remove them in case they do decide to eliminate the name in the future.
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PHLBOS

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #191 on: July 27, 2015, 09:00:10 AM »

The signs are near Exits 2, 3,  and 5 on I-93. Exit 2 is the only one that can be somewhat justified given that 128 is nearby, but clearly the signs are referring to I-93.
If those signs, particularly the ones near Exits 3 & 5, are on a state road (I'm aware that Exit 3 is an unnumbered road); MassDOT might have something to say about those signs.  I'm assuming these are local-fabricated installations.
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bob7374

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #192 on: July 27, 2015, 03:50:15 PM »

Here's a link to what I could find on StreetView. Has both I-93 and MA 128 shields. This is on MA 138 South about 1/2 mile north of the I-93/US 1 interchange, taken last August. Looks newer than 1989 when this would have been correct.
https://goo.gl/maps/dQS58

PHLBOS

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #193 on: July 27, 2015, 05:06:02 PM »

Here's a link to what I could find on StreetView. Has both I-93 and MA 128 shields. This is on MA 138 South about 1/2 mile north of the I-93/US 1 interchange, taken last August. Looks newer than 1989 when this would have been correct.
https://goo.gl/maps/dQS58
Judging by that odd, expirmental 128 font (popular during the early-to-mid 80s); it's either a few years older than 1989 or a local fabrication/installation if newer.
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The Nature Boy

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #194 on: July 27, 2015, 07:53:19 PM »

If they got rid of the Mass Pike name, it'd just create another "Route 128" situation.
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PHLBOS

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #195 on: July 28, 2015, 08:52:46 AM »

If they got rid of the Mass Pike name, it'd just create another "Route 128" situation.
Hardly, because (and I've state this multiple times already in this thread) Mass Pike (more specifically the Massachusetts Turnpike) will continue to be the street name for the highway (at least as long as tolls are being collected, that's another story) even though it may not be fully signed.

128, OTOH, is a route number that can be (and has been) on more than one particular stretch of road/street/highway.  Prior to the construction of the Yankee Division Highway, 128 was on a network of local roads and streets.  Prior to the late 60s, the expressway portions of 128 were on the Yankee Division Highway as well as the northern portion of the Pilgrim's Highway (current MA 3).   
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kkt

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #196 on: July 28, 2015, 12:24:21 PM »

So what Mass. needs to do is rename it the Route One Hundred Twenty Eight Beltway and they could sign it (along with I-95/I-93) and FHA would get off their case?
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PHLBOS

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #197 on: July 28, 2015, 12:56:19 PM »

So what Mass. needs to do is rename it the Route One Hundred Twenty Eight Beltway and they could sign it (along with I-95/I-93) and FHA would get off their case?
Given the stink that the Yankee Division Association raised during the mid-1980s when then-MassDPW erected some BBS' reading 128 AMERICA'S TECHNOLOGY HIGHWAY (the signs were later modified to read 128 AMERICA'S TECHNOLOGY REGION); such will not go over well with MA's National Guard's Yankee Division, the Yankee Division Association, after whom the highway was officially named circa 1948.  The blue signs in question were taken down during the mid-90s.

Wiki Account of the 26th Infantry Division
Quote
The beltway around the city of Boston, Massachusetts Route 128, is nicknamed the "Yankee Division Highway" in honor of the 26th Infantry Division.

« Last Edit: July 28, 2015, 01:03:07 PM by PHLBOS »
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The Ghostbuster

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #198 on: July 28, 2015, 07:08:57 PM »

Personally, I would refer to highways by their route number instead of their road name. The only exception is when the roads appear on a map without a route designation.
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Pete from Boston

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Re: Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker
« Reply #199 on: July 28, 2015, 09:46:17 PM »


Personally, I would refer to highways by their route number instead of their road name. The only exception is when the roads appear on a map without a route designation.

You should approach New York with great caution, then.
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