Boston Traffic Reporter/Blogger Defends Use of '128' moniker

Started by bob7374, September 14, 2012, 02:07:12 PM

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KEVIN_224

Using "128" in greater Boston is one thing. Is it better than people in greater Philadelphia calling I-76/Schuylkill Expressway the Sure-kill Expressway? :o


Beltway

Quote from: KEVIN_224 on September 18, 2012, 10:41:36 AM
Using "128" in greater Boston is one thing. Is it better than people in greater Philadelphia calling I-76/Schuylkill Expressway the Sure-kill Expressway? :o

What's wrong with calling it the Surekill Expressway?  It's not an official name, just slang.  PennDOT should have thought about it before giving it a name that sounds similar.
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jeffandnicole

I don't care if they call roads by nicknames or old names, just get the damn traffic conditions right.  If they say traffic is slow from Exit 10 - 15, and I'm sitting at a standstill at Exit 5, then the traffic report was no help to anyone.

Likewise, if traffic breezes thru Exit 10 - 15 when it was reported as slow, then the report was incorrect also, and people may have detoured to other routes unnecessarily.

Roadsguy

Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
And, it still makes a lot more sense than the damn "blue route" near Philly - which is truly meaningless.

No, not pointless. The name came from the color-coded alternatives: red, green, and blue. Guess which one they chose.
Mileage-based exit numbering implies the existence of mileage-cringe exit numbering.

southshore720

It would help if the Boston-Metro area utilized their variable message boards (like CT and RI do) to their full extent to inform you of how long the backup is going to be or if there was an accident.  There has been somewhat of an effort along I-93 in MA and southern NH by posting the miles per minute for designated exits on supplemental roadside variable message boards.  However, telling me "Click It or Ticket" when I am stuck in inexplicable traffic for 25 minutes is not really that helpful!

ATLRedSoxFan





QuoteTo this day, few in the area refer to the roadway as I-95, unless they just moved in from Atlanta.  To the natives, it will always be 128.   And that's why traffic reporters call it that.  Because everyone knows what they mean. 

And, it still makes a lot more sense than the damn "blue route" near Philly - which is truly meaningless.

Having moved to MA from Atlanta a year and a half ago, I just call it 128...It just keeps the locals from looking at you like you have two heads, even though I'd rather just call it 95...The only time you hear an interstate called what it is, when referring to 93 North and 495..Either it's the Mass Pike or (93 South) "The expressway". Every thing in MA is Route this or that, not US 1, what have you.

In Atlanta, it was what it was: 20 E-W, 75 N-S, 85 the exception, North, sometimes the Northeast Expy., and South, "The Airport connector".

Don't get me started on 285..."Top End", "West wall", etc...

I guess you could say comparble to the Central artery in Boston would be the"Downtown connector" in Atlanta..

Beltway

Quote from: Roadsguy on September 18, 2012, 02:55:51 PM
Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
And, it still makes a lot more sense than the damn "blue route" near Philly - which is truly meaningless.

No, not pointless. The name came from the color-coded alternatives: red, green, and blue. Guess which one they chose.

Irrelevant now that the highway has been entirely open since 1992.
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Ian

In my opinion, I actually don't mind the use of "128" along I-95 around Boston, nor do I mind "Blue Route" for I-476 or "The Schuylkill" (or Sure-kill, as Kevin_224 and Beltway describes) for I-76.
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Beltway

Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 06:32:00 PM
In my opinion, I actually don't mind the use of "128" along I-95 around Boston, nor do I mind "Blue Route" for I-476 or "The Schuylkill" (or Sure-kill, as Kevin_224 and Beltway describes) for I-76.

It looks better as one word ... Surekill
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Alps

Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 05:38:37 PM
Quote from: Roadsguy on September 18, 2012, 02:55:51 PM
Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
And, it still makes a lot more sense than the damn "blue route" near Philly - which is truly meaningless.

No, not pointless. The name came from the color-coded alternatives: red, green, and blue. Guess which one they chose.

Irrelevant now that the highway has been entirely open since 1992.
On the one hand, I agree. On the other hand, it's a lot easier to say than Mid-County Expressway. On the third hand, why can't it just be 476?

Ian

Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 08:07:24 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 06:32:00 PM
In my opinion, I actually don't mind the use of "128" along I-95 around Boston, nor do I mind "Blue Route" for I-476 or "The Schuylkill" (or Sure-kill, as Kevin_224 and Beltway describes) for I-76.

It looks better as one word ... Surekill

Either way, it's a silly name in my honest opinion. For the record, I've never even heard anyone call it the "Surekill" until I joined this forum...
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Beltway

Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 08:37:38 PM
Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 08:07:24 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 06:32:00 PM
In my opinion, I actually don't mind the use of "128" along I-95 around Boston, nor do I mind "Blue Route" for I-476 or "The Schuylkill" (or Sure-kill, as Kevin_224 and Beltway describes) for I-76.

It looks better as one word ... Surekill

Either way, it's a silly name in my honest opinion. For the record, I've never even heard anyone call it the "Surekill" until I joined this forum...

I lived in the area for 5 years in the 1970s ... I heard it frequently.  I doubt that it has lost any popularity since then.

"Skoo-kill" sounds too much like "Surekill".
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Ian

Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 09:32:00 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 08:37:38 PM
Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 08:07:24 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 06:32:00 PM
In my opinion, I actually don't mind the use of "128" along I-95 around Boston, nor do I mind "Blue Route" for I-476 or "The Schuylkill" (or Sure-kill, as Kevin_224 and Beltway describes) for I-76.

It looks better as one word ... Surekill

Either way, it's a silly name in my honest opinion. For the record, I've never even heard anyone call it the "Surekill" until I joined this forum...

I lived in the area for 5 years in the 1970s ... I heard it frequently.  I doubt that it has lost any popularity since then.

"Skoo-kill" sounds too much like "Surekill".

I do understand where you're coming from. Not sure why, but I've never heard anyone call it that. I guess I'll be paying more attention to see if it's still a Philadelphia custom to call it the Surekill...
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NE2

Sounds even more like school kill. In this post-Columbine world we need to avoid such offensive phrases. Therefore the only valid name will be the "Skook".
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Dougtone

Quote from: southshore720 on September 14, 2012, 02:36:51 PM
:banghead:  This seems like a losing battle.  No wonder New York uses names for a good number of their expwys and pkwys...doesn't matter what you name it numerically, people will always refer to it by the correct name!  In this day and age of GPS (which will refer to the correct route numbers), I think that the local traffic reporters/media do have a responsibility to stay consistent.

Good post Bob...glad you wrote into that blog!

As New York goes (well, more so around downstate New York), there are a number of parkways which don't have a numerical designation beyond a reference route number.

StogieGuy7

Quote from: Roadsguy on September 18, 2012, 02:55:51 PM
Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
And, it still makes a lot more sense than the damn "blue route" near Philly - which is truly meaningless.

No, not pointless. The name came from the color-coded alternatives: red, green, and blue. Guess which one they chose.

Yeah, that makes "perfect" sense to the rest of us!  At least "128" is still partially signed as such and you can find it on maps. And it was only known as MA 128 for 30-40 years.  The "blue route" isn't called that on any map, nor is it signed in that way at all.  The name comes from such an esoteric source (proposed routings?) that I can't even believe it.

Here's an idea: how about calling it 476? 

On the other hand, I totally get the Schuylkill reference.  That's the name of the expressway, like the 'Eisenhower' or 'Stevenson' in Chicago.  I am cool with that.

Beltway

Quote from: Steve on September 18, 2012, 08:35:18 PM
Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 05:38:37 PM
Quote from: Roadsguy on September 18, 2012, 02:55:51 PM
Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
And, it still makes a lot more sense than the damn "blue route" near Philly - which is truly meaningless.

No, not pointless. The name came from the color-coded alternatives: red, green, and blue. Guess which one they chose.

Irrelevant now that the highway has been entirely open since 1992.
On the one hand, I agree. On the other hand, it's a lot easier to say than Mid-County Expressway. On the third hand, why can't it just be 476?

It is both ... I-476 and Mid-County Expressway ... it's just not signed as Mid-County Expressway anywhere nor ever has it been.
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Roadsguy

It's just a nickname that never went away. It may make no sense, but it has to have made sense back then for it to develop like that.
Mileage-based exit numbering implies the existence of mileage-cringe exit numbering.

jeffandnicole

In South Jersey, the 2 miles of I-76 is always referred to as Rt. 42...which I-76 connects to.

They will state I-676 however.  A common report is to hear "42 slow from the base of the Walt Whitman to 55. 676 slows for a mile approaching 42".

99.99% of the people understand what this all means.  The other 0.01% (yes, those percentages mean about 1 person in 10,000 on a normal weekday) probably wouldn't know what to do if the traffic reports used the exact roadways and directions anyway, which would sound like this: "I-76 Eastbound is slow from the base of the Walt Whitman Bridge Eastbound, which is also I-76 Eastbound, to Rt. 42 Southbound, where it continues slow to Rt. 55 Southbound.  I-676 Southbound is also slow for 1 mile approaching I-76 Eastbound".

Another thing to remember is timing - the entire traffic report for an entire region only has about 30 seconds (give or take) to be reported.  Whatever rolls off the tongue faster is better as well.


deathtopumpkins

I found an email I got from my university's housing office this morning kinda funny and extremely relevant to this thread - it informed me that I am not required to live on campus if I will be on co-op "outside of Route 128". This is an email going out to college students at a school with a high percentage of international students, and students from all 50 US states. Yet the 128 designation is ubiquitous enough that there is no confusion using it in an official email to students.




Quote from: southshore720 on September 18, 2012, 03:53:52 PM
It would help if the Boston-Metro area utilized their variable message boards (like CT and RI do) to their full extent to inform you of how long the backup is going to be or if there was an accident.  There has been somewhat of an effort along I-93 in MA and southern NH by posting the miles per minute for designated exits on supplemental roadside variable message boards.  However, telling me "Click It or Ticket" when I am stuck in inexplicable traffic for 25 minutes is not really that helpful!

MassDOT is heading in this direction in the near future. The current travel time program on I-93 is part of a pilot program utilizing a new system that, if it proves successful (which it seems to be so far) will be expanded to other roads in Greater Boston. When fully implemented the system should, if I understand correctly, integrate with the permanently-mounted overhead message boards. The reason it does not currently is because it is computerized whereas the permanent message boards operate on an older system that needs to be manually programmed, and the pilot program did not include an upgrade to the existing message boards.

Route 3 between Braintree and the Cape also has a similar system in place over the summer based on the success of the I-93 pilot, though the Route 3 system operates based on State Police observations and manual VMS programming rather than a computerized system like I-93's.

[disclaimer: I know the above from working for MassDOT, but I do not guarantee the above information's accuracy as I did not work directly with Highway Operations]
Disclaimer: All posts represent my personal opinions and not those of my employer.

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Quote from: Alex on September 14, 2012, 02:59:05 PM
Retaining the 128 moniker is about as useful as referring to Interstate 476 as the Blue Route. You won't find it signed anywhere, but traffic reporters have always used the nomenclature when referring to the freeway.
Apples & oranges comparison.  When the Yankee Divison Highway was originally constructed during the 1950s; it was signed as (and ultmately called/referred) Route 128.  Additionally, the pre-highway alignments of MA 128 (except for the segment now known as MA 228) were quickly stripped off the old roads when the highway was completed.

In the case of I-476/the Blue Route: while the initial plans for the highway date back to the 1920s; once the Interstate Highway Act became law in 1956, the road was designated to be a 3-di (initally as I-480, then later changed to I-476) decades before it was ultimately built and opened to traffic on Dec. 1991.  The Blue Route name originated from a color-schemed (assigned to each alignment) plan for the then-future highway.  The Blue corridor was the one that was ultimately chosen.  Due to the highway being delayed by just over 15 years (it was originally planned to be fully-built and opened by 1976); the Blue Route name ultimately stuck among Delaware Valley locals.

Quote from: KEVIN_224 on September 18, 2012, 10:41:36 AM
Using "128" in greater Boston is one thing. Is it better than people in greater Philadelphia calling I-76/Schuylkill Expressway the Sure-kill Expressway? :o
Actually I-76 is to the Schuylkill Expressway in Philly is what I-93 south of Boston is to the Southeast Expressway.

Quote from: ATLRedSoxFan on September 18, 2012, 05:03:54 PMI guess you could say comparble to the Central artery in Boston would be the"Downtown connector" in Atlanta..
The Central Artery's long gone.  Its replacement (still part of I-93) is now referred to as the O'Neill Tunnel (named after former US House Speaker Thomas "Tip" O'Neill).

Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AMYes, I get it: the former proposal for I-95 to be constructed through Canton/Milton/Mattapan was never going to happen, so a section of MA 128 needed to be badged as I-95 to keep the roadway continuous.  And the southern end should never have been badged as I-93, which is then marked with the opposite cardinal direction as the I-95 portion was.  To the average commuter, that smacks of idiocy.
Actually, it was then-Gov. Sargent's canning of the I-95/Northeast Expressway alignment through Saugus & Lynn (one can still see traces of the would-be road near the US 1/MA 60 interchange in Revere) that prompted the designating of the Peabody-Canton section of 128 as I-95. 

Had only the Southwest Expressway been canned but the Northeast Expressway extension been built; I-95 south of Boston would've ran along the Southeast Expressway and the Braintree-Canton section of 128.  From Canton to Peabody (and to Gloucester); 128 would have just remained as just 128.

As far as the extension of the I-93 designation south of Boston (O'Neill Tunnel (old Central Artery) / Southeast Expressway / Yankee Division Highway (old 128)) is concerned; the reasoning behind that due to the normal FHWA practice of having a mainline 2-di Interstate terminate at another through Interstate where possible.

Quote from: StogieGuy7 on September 18, 2012, 10:37:12 AM
You all need to remember that Boston is a metropolitan area of steady habits.   People there - despite their progressive political proclivities - are VERY resistant to change.  In this case, I don't blame them.    When you say '128', people know what you mean.  Even weather reports refer to it (as in: snow outside of 128) and let's not forget the "128 technology corridor" that is even familiar to techies in Palo Alto and Austin.  Face it, this is a much deeper concept than mere MassHighway badging.  To this day, few in the area refer to the roadway as I-95, unless they just moved in from Atlanta.  To the natives, it will always be 128.   And that's why traffic reporters call it that.  Because everyone knows what they mean.
As one who witnessed the change from the get-go, as a child; I agree w/you up to a point.

When the I-95/93 designations first appeared circa 1975; the northern I-95 connection in Peabody (Exit 45/29) was still only on paper.  Prior to 1982, BGS signage directing those to I-95 North via the US 1 interchange (then-Exit 30, now-Exit 44) and visa-versa was scant at best and didn't help the I-95 redesignation along 128 cause one iota.

IMHO, once that interchange was finally completed in 1988 (along with the revised exit numbers); the Commonwealth should've further encouraged/pushed the I-95 & I-93 designations more aggressively.

That said, they should at least cease and desist on calling the I-93 section from Canton to Braintree 128 since all signs (even trailblazers) were pulled decades ago and I-93 (& US 1) use opposite cardinals.  Its worth noting that prior to the late-60s; MA 128 ran beyond Braintree via MA 3 until the MA 228 interchange; the latter was also known as MA 128 back then.

So 128 has been truncated before; it can be truncated again.

Quote from: Beltway on September 15, 2012, 08:20:42 PMIs there any MA-128 designation on any part of the beltway?
The Peabody-to-Gloucester segment, east of I-95 is still designated and signed as MA 128.

Quote from: deathtopumpkins on September 20, 2012, 01:00:45 PM
I found an email I got from my university's housing office this morning kinda funny and extremely relevant to this thread - it informed me that I am not required to live on campus if I will be on co-op "outside of Route 128". This is an email going out to college students at a school with a high percentage of international students, and students from all 50 US states. Yet the 128 designation is ubiquitous enough that there is no confusion using it in an official email to students.
During her speech at the GOP Convention in Tampa last month; former-Secreatry of State Condoleezza Rice made a Route 128 reference with regards to the high-tech firm build-up in Greater Boston area so it's not just a local reference.
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qguy

Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 09:40:26 PM
Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 09:32:00 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 08:37:38 PM
Quote from: Beltway on September 18, 2012, 08:07:24 PM
Quote from: PennDOTFan on September 18, 2012, 06:32:00 PM
In my opinion, I actually don't mind the use of "128" along I-95 around Boston, nor do I mind "Blue Route" for I-476 or "The Schuylkill" (or Sure-kill, as Kevin_224 and Beltway describes) for I-76.
It looks better as one word ... Surekill
Either way, it's a silly name in my honest opinion. For the record, I've never even heard anyone call it the "Surekill" until I joined this forum...
I lived in the area for 5 years in the 1970s ... I heard it frequently.  I doubt that it has lost any popularity since then.
I do understand where you're coming from. Not sure why, but I've never heard anyone call it that. I guess I'll be paying more attention to see if it's still a Philadelphia custom to call it the Surekill...

I've lived in Philly since 1989. "Surekill" is still a popular moniker. It's just a local slang, usually expressed after someone has completed a harrowing drive on it, made all the worse because it took three times longer than it should've because it's only two furcockamamy lanes in each direction.

The usage may go something like, "The surekill really gave me agita today!"

People have been using that term since the 1950s when it was built, but in reality the highway is much safer now than it used to be. When it was first built the lanes were only separated by a mountable curb, not a barrier. Head-on collisions were a real problem. (A W-beam center barrier was eventually constructed. Now, of course, it has a Jersey barrier up the center.)

When people want to be really perjorative, they say "Surekill Distressway" (in addition to all the curse words).

Beltway

Quote from: qguy on September 20, 2012, 04:50:37 PM
I've lived in Philly since 1989. "Surekill" is still a popular moniker. It's just a local slang, usually expressed after someone has completed a harrowing drive on it, made all the worse because it took three times longer than it should've because it's only two furcockamamy lanes in each direction.

PennDOT would say it is 4 lanes each way!  True for the section between City Avenue and Montgomery Drive ... :-)

Quote
The usage may go something like, "The surekill really gave me agita today!"

People have been using that term since the 1950s when it was built, but in reality the highway is much safer now than it used to be. When it was first built the lanes were only separated by a mountable curb, not a barrier. Head-on collisions were a real problem. (A W-beam center barrier was eventually constructed. Now, of course, it has a Jersey barrier up the center.)

The W-beam guardrail median barrier was there when I first drove it in 1972.  The concrete barrier was built during the rebuild in the 1980s.

Quote
When people want to be really perjorative, they say "Surekill Distressway" (in addition to all the curse words).

Even more so, "Surekill Parkinglot"
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agentsteel53

Quote from: KEVIN_224 on September 18, 2012, 10:41:36 AM
Schuylkill

here I thought it was pronounced "Sky-kill".  but that's because I'm analogizing it with senator Schuyler Colfax, who is definitely a "skyler".
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bob7374

Thanks for all the replies. Anyone send a comment/message to Ms. Davis?

Possibly some progress to report. In today's post under upcoming traffic closures she lists a ramp closing from MA 24 to '128 South/I-93 North' on Thursday. Not entirely correct, but getting closer.



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