North Carolina

[Mapmikey]

These projects will come alive?

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/FeasibilityStudiesDocuments/R-4441_Feasibility-Study_Report_2003.pdf

What's the basis for believing this is back on the table now?

Guessing cost and # of residence/business relocations needed has gone up a fair amount in 18 years...

[sprjus4]

Inevitably the project will eventually happen, particularly as more and more of the US-74 corridor gets improved and it ends up being the last gap between Charlotte and Wilmington, and even Asheville and Wilmington... but agreed on the point a new study would need to be produced given its age.

[sparker]

Inevitably the project will eventually happen, particularly as more and more of the US-74 corridor gets improved and it ends up being the last gap between Charlotte and Wilmington, and even Asheville and Wilmington... but agreed on the point a new study would need to be produced given its age.

The 2003 study that was cited still depicted I-73 as using US 1 south of Rockingham rather than the later revision east to NC 38; and the Rockingham bypass itself was relocated from these now 18-year-old projections.  Also not considered: whether the town bypasses would be tolled as per the facility around Monroe.  I'm in agreement that the project will eventually be addressed; but the study parameters, particularly regarding tolling, will require a follow-up study (even presuming the basic alignment carries over from 2003).  What the existence of the older study indicates is that NDCOT has standing plans for this and other arterial routes within the state, which shows that agency support won't be the sticking point when proposals similar to this are addressed -- funding identification and subsequent ROW issues would likely remain front & center as the principal developmental obstacles, as with virtually all DOT's. 

[sprjus4]

^

Interestingly enough, it also shows I-74 splitting off near Chadbourne, west of Whiteville, taking a more direct shot towards Myrtle Beach than the current proposal to beeline towards Wilmington, then take a 90 degree turn south at Bolton and form a backwards "C" .

However, I think we all know at this rate I-74 is eventually going to either end up in Wilmington or removed all together. They need to begin planning to upgrade / relocate the US-74 corridor east of Bolton to at least I-140 or the existing US-74 freeway inside the beltway to interstate standards.

[tolbs17]

^

Interestingly enough, it also shows I-74 splitting off near Chadbourne, west of Whiteville, taking a more direct shot towards Myrtle Beach than the current proposal to beeline towards Wilmington, then take a 90 degree turn south at Bolton and form a backwards "C" .

However, I think we all know at this rate I-74 is eventually going to either end up in Wilmington or removed all together. They need to begin planning to upgrade / relocate the US-74 corridor east of Bolton to at least I-140 or the existing US-74 freeway inside the beltway to interstate standards.

Just have it end in Wilmington. Does the extra highway parallel NC 211 still needed?

[sprjus4]

^

Interestingly enough, it also shows I-74 splitting off near Chadbourne, west of Whiteville, taking a more direct shot towards Myrtle Beach than the current proposal to beeline towards Wilmington, then take a 90 degree turn south at Bolton and form a backwards "C" .

However, I think we all know at this rate I-74 is eventually going to either end up in Wilmington or removed all together. They need to begin planning to upgrade / relocate the US-74 corridor east of Bolton to at least I-140 or the existing US-74 freeway inside the beltway to interstate standards.

Just have it end in Wilmington. Does the extra highway parallel NC 211 still needed?

No, it's not needed. I agree, it should go to Wilmington and terminate where the freeway ends in Downtown Wilmington. Though, at the very least, to I-140 or US-17.

Additionally, US-17 should be upgraded between the proposed Carolina Bays Pkwy extension's northern terminus in Shallote up to I-140. Not sure that section of US-17 should necessarily warrant an interstate designation being standalone. The traffic volumes simply warrant at minimum a four lane freeway design between Wilmington and Myrtle Beach.

[tolbs17]

^

Interestingly enough, it also shows I-74 splitting off near Chadbourne, west of Whiteville, taking a more direct shot towards Myrtle Beach than the current proposal to beeline towards Wilmington, then take a 90 degree turn south at Bolton and form a backwards "C" .

However, I think we all know at this rate I-74 is eventually going to either end up in Wilmington or removed all together. They need to begin planning to upgrade / relocate the US-74 corridor east of Bolton to at least I-140 or the existing US-74 freeway inside the beltway to interstate standards.

Just have it end in Wilmington. Does the extra highway parallel NC 211 still needed?

No, it's not needed. I agree, it should go to Wilmington and terminate where the freeway ends in Downtown Wilmington. Though, at the very least, to I-140 or US-17.

Additionally, US-17 should be upgraded between the proposed Carolina Bays Pkwy extension's northern terminus in Shallote up to I-140. Not sure that section of US-17 should necessarily warrant an interstate designation being standalone. The traffic volumes simply warrant at minimum a four lane freeway design between Wilmington and Myrtle Beach.

Yeah, it should be done, now. That's a high priority, especially for summer traffic. Could I-140 be extended to Myrtle Beach until I-99 is signed?

[sparker]

Could I-140 be extended to Myrtle Beach until I-99 is signed?

Didn't realize we were in Fictional!  AFAIK, there's never been any mention outside those threads about a I-99 on the Carolina Coast!  Yeah, it's likely that somewhere down the line NCDOT will propose a US 17 upgrade to Interstate status throughout the state -- but at this time any numerical designation would be speculative at best. 

[Finrod]

Could I-140 be extended to Myrtle Beach until I-99 is signed?

Didn't realize we were in Fictional!  AFAIK, there's never been any mention outside those threads about a I-99 on the Carolina Coast!  Yeah, it's likely that somewhere down the line NCDOT will propose a US 17 upgrade to Interstate status throughout the state -- but at this time any numerical designation would be speculative at best.

Well, only I-97 or I-99 would fit the grid, unless some Californian proposes I-101.

[cowboy_wilhelm]

These projects will come alive?

https://connect.ncdot.gov/projects/planning/FeasibilityStudiesDocuments/R-4441_Feasibility-Study_Report_2003.pdf

The traffic forecast on the last page is incredibly off. I seem to recall this started to become a big point of contention with NCDOT projects about 20 or years ago? Basically their traffic forecast methodology was linear interpolation and drawing a straight line. The extension of I-26 through Madison County and the number of lanes needed for the I-26 connector/I-240 widening in Asheville comes to mind. This is probably why so many middle of nowhere places have ended up with bypasses, 4 and 5 lanes, etc.

[RoadPelican]

The latest info I have read on the I-74 corridor is that the eastern half of the Wadesboro bypass from current US 74 to US 52 is slated to begin construction in 2027 with a completion date of 2030.  The western half is currently unfunded and is not even listed in the 2020-2029 STIP.

[cowboy_wilhelm]

The latest info I have read on the I-74 corridor is that the eastern half of the Wadesboro bypass from current US 74 to US 52 is slated to begin construction in 2027 with a completion date of 2030.  The western half is currently unfunded and is not even listed in the 2020-2029 STIP.

The Wadesboro bypass is technically outside of the "I-74" corridor. I wish they'd drop both I-73 and I-74, but I won't bother ranting about that. I'm sure the Wadesboro bypass will eventually be built, but at this rate I honestly don't think the rest of U.S. 74 between the Monroe bypass and Rockingham will ever be upgraded beyond superstreet status.

What is surprising is that the improvements between Hamlet and Laurinburg are still unfunded, which IS part of the corridor. How many decades has it been since they've proposed all these "future interstate" improvements?

[sprjus4]

^

I don't see any reason to eliminate I-73, but agreed with I-74.

US-74 should be its own unified corridor between I-26 and Wilmington. The state intends to eventually upgraded to remainder to interstate standards, but there's no official designation planned west of Rockingham (besides the I-485 and I-85 overlap for through traffic), then obviously I-74 east of Rockingham. IMO, an I-3x would be appropriate all the way through.

Replace I-74 between I-77 and I-73 with an I-x73 or I-x77.

[Mapmikey]

Could I-140 be extended to Myrtle Beach until I-99 is signed?

Didn't realize we were in Fictional!  AFAIK, there's never been any mention outside those threads about a I-99 on the Carolina Coast!  Yeah, it's likely that somewhere down the line NCDOT will propose a US 17 upgrade to Interstate status throughout the state -- but at this time any numerical designation would be speculative at best. 

Actually this has been formally studied, including using I-99 as the designation: http://www.virginiadot.org/projects/resources/I-99_Final_Report_-_VDOT_website.pdf

Seems like North Carolina has changed its stance on US 17 and its improvements since 2006.

[sprjus4]

It's been studied, but it's not necessarily been approved or formally discussed within North Carolina circles. It was more Virginia asking, hey are you interested if we do this, and they said maybe. I'm sure they'd be all over it if it was official, but internally hasn't developed any corridor. I'm surprised it hasn't happened yet, IMO.

As of this rate, the only part of US-17 that is apart of any future interstate corridor would be I-87 north of Williamston. Nothing else officially planned.

[sparker]

Could I-140 be extended to Myrtle Beach until I-99 is signed?

Didn't realize we were in Fictional!  AFAIK, there's never been any mention outside those threads about a I-99 on the Carolina Coast!  Yeah, it's likely that somewhere down the line NCDOT will propose a US 17 upgrade to Interstate status throughout the state -- but at this time any numerical designation would be speculative at best. 

Actually this has been formally studied, including using I-99 as the designation: http://www.virginiadot.org/projects/resources/I-99_Final_Report_-_VDOT_website.pdf

Seems like North Carolina has changed its stance on US 17 and its improvements since 2006.

The corridor that became the pending I-87, including the portion of US 17 from Williamston north to the VA state line, had been around as an official entity since 1991, when it was designated within the first batch of High Priority Corridors as part of that year's ISTEA act.  The section of 17 south from there, while currently being developed in a more or less "piecemeal" fashion -- to varying standards -- has yet to be considered as a whole project, at least in terms of joining the other in-state future Interstate corridors designated so far.  If and when that occurs is yet TBD. 

Nevertheless, it seems Interstate status for that original 1991 corridor (HPC #13) was being considered within NCDOT from the beginning; construction of US 64 as a freeway had proceeded east to Tarboro at the time of the ISTEA passage -- but not to Interstate standards (lack of shoulders among other deficiencies).  But the section from Tarboro east to US 17, and the Williamston bypass, were constructed to Interstate standards.  One supposes that they reasoned that they could simply upgrade the previous construction when push came to shove regarding the actual field signage of the route -- similarly to what MS did with I-22 within that state. 

[tolbs17]

I-74 won't be extended. But I do agree it needs to go since it's way out of the grid. But I think we can talk about doing that once the northern beltway is complete. This will end up being our longest 3-digit interstate.

For Charlotte and Wilmington, why can't we use I-30? That number was proposed before.

[sparker]

I-74 won't be extended. But I do agree it needs to go since it's way out of the grid. But I think we can talk about doing that once the northern beltway is complete. This will end up being our longest 3-digit interstate.

For Charlotte and Wilmington, why can't we use I-30? That number was proposed before.

Because (a) it's already in use in TX/AR and (b) there are plenty of even designations between 28 and 38 -- in fact, all of them save 30 -- that could be used for that corridor.  And there's no NC 36 at present; so it's likely that if a singular Interstate corridor were to be proposed/adopted for US 74, that number would be at the top of the list as a designation for such, even if I-74 were to persist and such a designation ended at Rockingham.  No need to hijack/replicate an existing number just because it ends in "0" (that's so 1957!). 

[tolbs17]

I-74 won't be extended. But I do agree it needs to go since it's way out of the grid. But I think we can talk about doing that once the northern beltway is complete. This will end up being our longest 3-digit interstate.

For Charlotte and Wilmington, why can't we use I-30? That number was proposed before.

Because (a) it's already in use in TX/AR and (b) there are plenty of even designations between 28 and 38 -- in fact, all of them save 30 -- that could be used for that corridor.  And there's no NC 36 at present; so it's likely that if a singular Interstate corridor were to be proposed/adopted for US 74, that number would be at the top of the list as a designation for such, even if I-74 were to persist and such a designation ended at Rockingham.  No need to hijack/replicate an existing number just because it ends in "0" (that's so 1957!).

So, I-36 it is!

[Strider]

The latest info I have read on the I-74 corridor is that the eastern half of the Wadesboro bypass from current US 74 to US 52 is slated to begin construction in 2027 with a completion date of 2030.  The western half is currently unfunded and is not even listed in the 2020-2029 STIP.

The Wadesboro bypass is technically outside of the "I-74" corridor. I wish they'd drop both I-73 and I-74, but I won't bother ranting about that. I'm sure the Wadesboro bypass will eventually be built, but at this rate I honestly don't think the rest of U.S. 74 between the Monroe bypass and Rockingham will ever be upgraded beyond superstreet status.

What is surprising is that the improvements between Hamlet and Laurinburg are still unfunded, which IS part of the corridor. How many decades has it been since they've proposed all these "future interstate" improvements?

I-73, no since I-73 was first proposed before I-74 ever came up (malmeroads.net on I-73/I-74 has history on them if you're interested). I-74 should be replaced with I-xx or I-x73.

And because NCDOT spent most of its money on the EASTERN section of NC. that's why the section between Hamlet and Laurinburg is still unfunded. Look at I-26/I-240 improvements get delayed again and again, and so is the I-885 East End Connector in Durham and spent money on usless and unnecessary I-87 among other things. and then boom... Map Act lawsuit against them, flooding from hurricane and lack of funding showed up.

[sprjus4]

And because NCDOT spent most of its money on the EASTERN section of NC. that's why the section between Hamlet and Laurinburg is still unfunded.

US-74 is a limited access highway with right of way reserved for future interchanges on its eastern segments, they've merely been spending $5 - $10 million for each individual interchanges in piecemeal fashion over the last decade to complete the gaps and provide a continuous freeway for a long distance. The Hamlet to Laurinburg stretch is a small segment and entirely non limited access. A couple hundred million at minimum. Not saying it's not needed, but there's more incentive to spend a few million for each interchange on the eastern segment and eventually have a hundred of miles of continuous freeway.

I-87 among other things.

Technically, no funding has of yet been allocated to upgrade any portion of US-64 or US-17 to interstate standards outside of routine resurfacing projects.

The state plans to complete US-64 first, IMO they would get more bang for their buck upgrading US-17 first because it would at least expand the percentage of the route that is freeway.

I see value in having a limited access connection between Hampton Roads, I-95, and Raleigh.

[cowboy_wilhelm]

I guess I-73 can work, especially if it ever makes it to Myrtle Beach. It just seems silly to have all of these primary interstate route designations for relatively short intrastate highways.

If/when U.S. 74 receives a 2di or 3di designation, the exit numbers should work out pretty well from a memory/learning perspective, at least from I-26 to I-85. Just drop the first two digits. Exit 161 becomes Exit 1, Exit 163 becomes Exit 3, etc.

[sprjus4]

I guess I-73 can work, especially if it ever makes it to Myrtle Beach. It just seems silly to have all of these primary interstate route designations for relatively short intrastate highways.

I-73 is a continuous interstate highway for over 100 miles from north of Greensboro to Rockingham.

Likely, it'll ultimately get constructed from Roanoke at I-81 to Myrtle Beach. There's zero chance it's going further north. It'll be a stretch if Virginia or South Carolina ever build it, but at least the efforts to get it built are still very alive in those states.

[tolbs17]

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6136486,-77.6606846,3a,31.4y,147.62h,85.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3wNbslBQkXzIhYiAB5SX_Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Divided highway begins. Doesn't make sense.

[sprjus4]

https://www.google.com/maps/@35.6136486,-77.6606846,3a,31.4y,147.62h,85.62t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s3wNbslBQkXzIhYiAB5SX_Q!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Divided highway begins. Doesn't make sense.

I think they used the wrong sign...